: The '92-'04 Seville and the CTS Put Cadillac Back On the Map



orconn
05-31-09, 05:49 PM
The '92-'04 Sevilles put Cadillac back on the map .... whether you like the car or not. The CTS established a new nitch for the brand. Does Cadillac really have anything coming down the tube to keep the momentum going? An American luxury sedan would be nice.

ryannel2003
05-31-09, 06:07 PM
The '92 Seville put Cadillac back on the map for style and overall design... the '98 Seville put Cadillac back on the map when it came to technology.

orconn
05-31-09, 06:12 PM
The '92 Seville put Cadillac back on the map for style and overall design... the '98 Seville put Cadillac back on the map when it came to technology.

Oh, I don't know, the Northstar engine, suspension and steering advances on the early nineties Sevilles were pretty technologically advanced for their day!

ryannel2003
05-31-09, 06:17 PM
This is true, but the '98 Seville's had the adaptive seating, the newly introduced CVRSS suspension system, massaging seats, the electronic gauges, performance algorithm shifting, the late '02-'03 STS with Magneride, and the pretty advanced G-body structure underneath. I think Cadillac showcased the '98 as more of a technical luxury sedan whereas the '92 was more of something that showcased a new style of Cadillac's to come.

Both improved Cadillac's bottom line, and most auto rags were impressed with both cars when they were introduced. I still prefer my '00 STS to the newest of Cadillac's cars, with the only exception being the XLR-V.

Rodya234
05-31-09, 06:32 PM
I still prefer my '00 STS to the newest of Cadillac's cars, with the only exception being the XLR-V.

Even this one? :lol: : http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/images/jalopnik/2008/08/2009_Cadillac_CTS-V_burnout.JPG

I'm still hoping for a RWD DT7. If that means the CTS is the flagship (which it already is) for a few years, so be it. A RWD full-size is what Cadillac needs. They already have a platform, a drivetrain, and most of the other goodies. Shouldn't be too costly to develop.

ryannel2003
05-31-09, 06:34 PM
I've driven a CTS-V and loved it, but I still prefer the sleeker lines of the 90's era Seville's. Thats why I love the XLR-V so much; it's so clean and button downed looking with a gorgeous shape.

I love the new Cadillac's, just not as much as my Seville.

Rodya234
05-31-09, 06:43 PM
^I feel the same way about the 2000 on Cadillacs. My friend has a black 2002 SLS, and its an awesome car, but it lacks the acres of chrome, the hard lines, the verticle taillights, the hood ornament, and the other old-school features that my Deville has.

His SLS is like a black bullet, my Deville is like a chromed Bismarck, and that's just the way I like it. :D


Pic related: there's nothing else in the world like having one of these:
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/369/sspx0404.jpg (http://img189.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sspx0404.jpg)

Playdrv4me
05-31-09, 08:35 PM
The Escalade was THE vehicle that was single-handedly most responsible for finally bringing Cadillac out of its dying demographic and thus stimulating new sales growth. While you could make a similar argument for the CTS, it did not hold a candle to the Escalade in this respect. GM also makes MUCH more bank out of every single Escalade that it sells versus any of the car-lines.

The Seville was the car that put Cadillac back on the radar, and the CTS became their bread and butter 3 Series fighter.

V-Eight
05-31-09, 08:49 PM
The Escalade was THE vehicle that was single-handedly most responsible for finally bringing Cadillac out of its dying demographic and thus stimulating new sales growth. While you could make a similar argument for the CTS, it did not hold a candle to the Escalade in this respect. GM also makes MUCH more bank out of every single Escalade that it sells versus any of the car-lines.

Is that because they already had a platform for it?

orconn
05-31-09, 08:53 PM
The Escalade was THE vehicle that was single-handedly most responsible for finally bringing Cadillac out of its dying demographic and thus stimulating new sales growth. While you could make a similar argument for the CTS, it did not hold a candle to the Escalade in this respect. GM also makes MUCH more bank out of every single Escalade that it sells versus any of the car-lines.

The Seville was the car that put Cadillac back on the radar, and the CTS became their bread and butter 3 Series fighter.

I have too agree with you about the Escalade. Although, I think it confirms the low level of American taste, not to mention the lack of automotive accummen, when a gussied up "truck du compagne" becomes a prestige and fashion statement. Cadillac debased what was left of their "class" by catering to Pimps and aspiring Pimps of this world. Let's face it if you want to haul horses or boats or other toys a GMC would more than suffice. Same goes for other chores of the working classes and for that matter the little ladys who find it necessary to armor themselves and their one child seat from the horrors of today's traffic.

Rodya234
05-31-09, 09:02 PM
I think Cadillac would sky-rocket their brand distinction if they made, oh say, a couple thousand of these: http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/03images/det_cadillac16_1.jpg

V-Eight
05-31-09, 09:06 PM
Front end is ugly as shit, but that had like 1000HP didn't it?

orconn
05-31-09, 09:06 PM
I think Cadillac would sky-rocket their brand distinction if they made, oh say, a couple thousand of these: http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/03images/det_cadillac16_1.jpg

I couldn't agree more! Viva Cadillac!

Playdrv4me
05-31-09, 09:09 PM
Is that because they already had a platform for it?

That and the fact that the cost of BUILDING trucks relative to the MSRP is much more of a spread than with cars. Sure there are more materials overall, but not enough to justify the price increase on the sticker really.

V-Eight
05-31-09, 09:11 PM
They've really cheaped out on their new trucks as well. Not sure about the Escalade, but I know the markup on 1/2 tons is pretty ridiculous compared to production costs.

Playdrv4me
05-31-09, 09:16 PM
I have too agree with you about the Escalade. Although, I think it confirms the low level of American taste, not to mention the lack of automotive accummen, when a gussied up "truck du compagne" becomes a prestige and fashion statement. Cadillac debased what was left of their "class" by catering to Pimps and aspiring Pimps of this world. Let's face it if you want to haul horses or boats or other toys a GMC would more than suffice. Same goes for other chores of the working classes and for that matter the little ladys who find it necessary to armor themselves and their one child seat from the horrors of today's traffic.

I agree with you to a point. Yes the work of an Escalade can absolutely be done by a Yukon or Tahoe, but the truth is I think the Escalade; knowingly or not, really came in and filled the void left by the departed Fleetwood. The Fleetwood was the last traditional luxo barge American "dripping in chrome" Cadillac and the Escalade introduced a modern re-interpretation of that theme. I think this is why the Escalade was so successful at stimulating young AND old buyers alike. The older crowd was looking to replace their Fleetwoods and the younger set of Pimps you mentioned needed a style-mobile. It should also go without saying that there is no other Cadillac that allows you to get in and spread out like the Escalade does.

Really though, when you sit inside and drive an Escalade and then sit in a Tahoe there are quite a few apparent differences in the treatment of materials and overall feel of the truck. The Escalade makes you feel like you're driving on a cloud much like that old Fleetwood. This is why it appeals to yet ANOTHER set of buyers... the "Cowboy Cadillac" crowd. Escalades were as much of a hit with those towing Horses to the weekly 4H meeting as those taking their Jetskis to the lake. It really is a vehicle that appeals to everyone... for better or worse. If it generates more revenue for the engineering and development of other Cadillacs I don't see anything wrong with it.

I have to say that even though the Range Rover was probably my favorite vehicle I ever owned... the IDEAL driveway by FAR would be an E46 BMW 3 Series Coupe and a Cadillac Escalade. You've got just about every need and desire covered right there.

V-Eight
05-31-09, 09:36 PM
....and lets face it, Cadillacs have always been the pimp-mobile of choice

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-31-09, 09:38 PM
I think Cadillac would sky-rocket their brand distinction if they made, oh say, a couple thousand of these: http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/03images/det_cadillac16_1.jpg

That's a nice dream, but considering the GM of today, that's about as likely as the spontaneous return of Oldsmobile.

hueterm
05-31-09, 10:49 PM
That's a nice dream, but considering the GM of today, that's about as likely as the spontaneous return of Oldsmobile.


Chmn. Gen. Mao-bama will see to that....

Jesda
05-31-09, 10:52 PM
The 92+ Seville sold very well and helped Cadillac maintain its position through the 90s as America's #1 luxury car brand. The 2002 Escalade changed everything. For me, it was the XLR. I drool over the XLR more than any Italian, German, or British exotic.

dirt_cheap_fleetwood
05-31-09, 11:04 PM
^I feel the same way about the 2000 on Cadillacs. My friend has a black 2002 SLS, and its an awesome car, but it lacks the acres of chrome, the hard lines, the verticle taillights, the hood ornament, and the other old-school features that my Deville has.

His SLS is like a black bullet, my Deville is like a chromed Bismarck, and that's just the way I like it. :D


Pic related: there's nothing else in the world like having one of these:
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/369/sspx0404.jpg (http://img189.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sspx0404.jpg)

Mines bigger. :D


http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn17/Saber2580/My%20Cars/1990%20Brougham/IMG_0322.jpg

billc83
05-31-09, 11:12 PM
....and lets face it, Cadillacs have always been the pimp-mobile of choice

Interestingly enough, Cadillac's reputation as being a "pimp-mobile" go back further than Escalades in late 90s rap videos or even a fully-loaded drop-top Eldorado riding through the hood in the 70s.

It actually stems back to the 30s, when Joe Louis (boxing's heavyweight champion at the time, and African-American) allegedly could not walk into a Cadillac dealership and buy one. One of his white friends had to buy it for him. Cadillac's president gave a speech about advertising and catering to black customers, and sales increased dramatically. Just a tidbit of off-topic Crest and Wreath Knowledge for ya...

BACK TO THE TOPIC AT HAND:

The Eighties were really hard on Cadillac, and basically dropped the brand from a first tier to second tier luxury automaker. Between the horrible Olds diesel, the Cimarron, and the downsized cars of '85 all led to this. This destroyed a LOT of brand equity that is not easily won back.

I think the 1992 STS (and redesigned Eldorado), original Escalade, and original CTS are all owed a bit of gratitude for reviving Cadillac's image.

EDIT: And I agree with Jesda about the XLR. Though it was overpriced to begin with. But, thankfully for you and me, resale values are really bad, and we can pick one up in a few years for a fraction of the $76,000+ MSRP!

Rodya234
05-31-09, 11:20 PM
You can pick up XLR-V's on ebay for 1/4 of what they cost. Go go go!

billc83
05-31-09, 11:24 PM
Cheapest I've seen in my area (http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/ctd/1191580540.html)

2006 XLR-V, 44,178 miles, $36,225.

Rodya234
05-31-09, 11:31 PM
If you watch ebay like a hawk, they have some going for like $25-30k sometimes. Most of the ones on there now are between 30-40k.

Playdrv4me
06-01-09, 12:12 AM
When did XLR-Vs get so cheap!!!!!!!!!! WTFWTFWTFWTFWTFWTFWTFWTF!!!!!!!!!!!

I've seen 2004 REGULAR XLRs in the mid to high 20s lately and thought THAT was cheap. But 36k for a V?!?!?!?!? SOMEONE BUY THAT, NOW!

orconn
06-01-09, 12:20 AM
$76,000.00 is really not too much for an exclusive luxury car ......... just look at the other cars in that segment. Sometimes I think we want "world class" prestige but at a price we can afford. A lower price kind of undermines the exclusivity quotient of "luxury."

orconn
06-01-09, 12:40 AM
I will grant you that there have been Cadillac "Pimpmobiles" around for several decades, but before the Escalade one had to visit an aftermarket supplier to give your Cad the special pimpmobile appearance. With the advent of the Escalade you could by your pimpmobile directly from Cadillac!

Playdrv4me
06-01-09, 01:56 AM
I will grant you that there have been Cadillac "Pimpmobiles" around for several decades, but before the Escalade one had to visit an aftermarket supplier to give your Cad the special pimpmobile appearance. With the advent of the Escalade you could by your pimpmobile directly from Cadillac!

How do you mean? My truck has 17" Chrome wheels, a few chrome door handles and a couple of badges. That is standard fare for any Caddy isn't it?

The oversized bling wheels are dealer options, and the new factory 22s aren't even all that blingy, and you can get 20s on the Tahoe anyway. Certainly Vogue wheels, tires and $1000.00 Gold trim packages have been a mainstay of any Cadillac dealer since the beginning of time.

Aron9000
06-01-09, 02:44 AM
I really miss the swagger the old RWD Cadillacs had. The new DTS is nice, but its just way too boring for my tastes. I wish it had more pressed creases like the new CTS.