View Full Version : A few questions for the Caddy Experts 4.9L


bsnider
07-14-04, 11:09 AM
Well let me start by saying these forums are unbelievably valuable to any Caddy owner....I have shared their existence with all my caddy freinds....

I am having some issues with my 92 Sedan Deville.....4.9L....I am hoping the experts here will have some thoughts and guidance to get me on the path to solving these....Here is my list....

Car has 130K
and the oil change is 48%
Codes = none....

When turning at a faster rate say like 15 20 mph the OIL preasure light comes on...for a few seconds and goes out when the car is straight again after 3 or 4 secs......The oil level is fine..And I dont really notice any difference in performance.....

The car is a PAIN to start....sometimes taking two tries.....when the remote start attempts to start the car the first try is always just a loud click...then the second it starts......However when trying from inside the car...Sometimes it takes exceptionally long to get it to run..cranking forever it seems....
this is not every time...but most of the time....It starts every morning on the second try of the auto start using the key fob....so its not terrible but no way normal....

does anyone else have a problem with the hood bouncing alot on the drivers side corner?...mine is straight and the car is not damaged but the hood bounces alot in that corner....

anyway....if you guys could help I would be ever so apreciative....
Thanks
Barry

Night Wolf
07-14-04, 01:48 PM
with the oil light problem... I dunno, if the oil level is good, maybe it is a faulty sensor? if you go around turns maybe the oil gets pushed to one side of the pan and it trips the sensor thinking there isn't any oil? (although I never had that problem)

hard starting... 130k miles.... did you change the plugs/wires? if it isn't the plugs/wires either run injector clenaer through a full tank of gas (I use Lucas) or get the fuel filter changed... in 1992 the car got platnium tipped spark plugs which said they could go 100k miles.. I change3d my plugs at 90k miles and they needed it... some of the gaps were off by a good amount, and they were worn in general (Bosch +4 are in there now) and the car did start more easy... my friends '94 Jetta (2.0 4banger) took forever to start, once i changed the plugs/wires it starts in about half the time... I would definitly get them check out....

about the hood, when you open the hood, you'll see a round rubber bumper type thing, they are the adjusters to raise/lower the hood... the one on the (driver side?) is probabally too low, so when the hood is closed, it will cause it to bounce (my '89 Olds 88 does the same thing but not bad.... I havn't got around to fixing it) all you have to do is turn it counter-clockwise(?) to raise it... depending on the car, and how old things are, you may be able to turn it by hand, or you may need plyers... either way, turn it until both the hood dons't bounce, and it isn't difficult to close (since it'll be keeping the hood a little higher)

Hope this helps :)

LacSeville
07-14-04, 06:49 PM
there are bumpstops at the corners of the hood that the hood rests on when it's closed. you probably just need to raise the rubber bumpstop up. I used pliers to grab the thread of the screw below the rubber and twisted it. don't raise it too much or you'll have a hard time shuttting the hood.

hard starting... you may either have a fuel system that's not holding pressure (leaky injectors?), or your lifters may be leaking down quite a bit over night. There is a way to do a lifter leak down test, but if you are not mechanically inclined, the i suggest you let someone else do it. The lifters are hydraulic meaning they have to be full of oil before they'll open the valves. if the intake valve can't open to let fuel in, then there'll be no start until pressure builds up.

you should have sometime in the recent past done a full tune up. cap/rotor, plugs, wires, coolant change, fuel filter, pcv, egr/TB cleaning, etc. if not, that'll need to be addressed soon, and probably would help the hard start some. let us know - Drew

90devilleguy
07-15-04, 02:08 AM
get a new starter and it will probably solve the starting problem,worked for my suburban i had.same problem long crank and sometimes no crank or 2 times to get it going.

Night Wolf
07-15-04, 04:14 PM
ummm.... if the starter is actually turning the engine over... then getting a new one will not solve the problem....

... I am stilling going along with what I said before....

90devilleguy
07-16-04, 01:23 AM
ummm.... if the starter is actually turning the engine over... then getting a new one will not solve the problem....

... I am stilling going along with what I said before....

i would try what you are saying but only after the replacement of the starter,believe me,i had the exact same problem with my suburban and i had a tune up done to it and it was good for about a week then back to the hard starts and two-time starting, seriously the first thing i would do is change the starter which i wish i had done on my suburban at first instead of spending $250 for a tune up that didn't solve my problem at the time.

s.a.cad
07-16-04, 01:51 AM
Have you had this problem all the time or did it appear after you had the remote starter installed? I have read many posts that suggest a problem bypassing the pass-key resistor in the ignition when a remote starter has been installed. If the computer is not reading the correct resistance it will not allow the fuel pump to operate so no matter much you crank you are not getting any fuel. Whoever did the installation should have installed another resistor that matches the resistor on the ignition key to disable the pass-key feature. You may want to check with the installers to be sure the job was done correctly. GOOD LUCK

Night Wolf
07-16-04, 12:00 PM
Have you had this problem all the time or did it appear after you had the remote starter installed? I have read many posts that suggest a problem bypassing the pass-key resistor in the ignition when a remote starter has been installed. If the computer is not reading the correct resistance it will not allow the fuel pump to operate so no matter much you crank you are not getting any fuel. Whoever did the installation should have installed another resistor that matches the resistor on the ignition key to disable the pass-key feature. You may want to check with the installers to be sure the job was done correctly. GOOD LUCK

That is a very good answer also.. I did not think about that before.... although the pass-key system will disable both the fuel pump and starter, which may be why it woduln't turn over at all sometimes....

.... we have some really good answers now, definitly try them out and let us know what solved the problem...

bsnider
12-04-04, 03:38 AM
late update....

replaced starter...still takes forever to get fuel going it seems....
sometimes it takes like 10 secs to start the car...even tried waiting with the key forward....The car was overheating but I solved that by replacing the radiator cap...it went bad...also there were a few minor water leaks...got the sealer compound for the radiator seems ok now...
Oil is leaking slowly from the oilpan underneath...but its two bolts on the pan that are hard to reach due to a frame rail...not sure how the hell to tighten them....I need to change the gasket I assume but Do not know how to get that pan out of that tight area.....
Car is feeling rough and gas mileage has hit the toilet....
11 mpg usually..
Fuel Injector cleaner and better gas are not helping...
I just don't know what to do anymore....
grrrr

DFBonnett
12-04-04, 08:25 AM
.......When turning at a faster rate say like 15 20 mph the OIL preasure light comes on...for a few seconds and goes out when the car is straight again after 3 or 4 secs......The oil level is fine..And I dont really notice any difference in performance.....

The car is a PAIN to start....sometimes taking two tries.........
Thanks
Barry

I'm wondering if the problems might be related. I recall reading a post about the 4.9 or 4.6, or possibly both, shutting down by disabling the fuel pump if oil pressure was dangerously low. Is it possible the OP switch is flaky and not allowing the fuel pump to operate until you crank enough to build some oil pressure? That light coming on while running seems to indicate a bad OP switch also. You might try a Caddy specific new AC Delco switch as opposed to a one size fits all aftermarket switch and see where that gets you.
Just a shot in the dark..
FWIW
YMMV
DFB

Katshot
12-04-04, 08:57 AM
The Pass-Key system is a starter-interupt system. If the starter is engaged, the Pass-Key system is not a factor in the long crank issue. I'd look into the possibility that you either actually have low oil pressure or the sensor is bad. The long crank "could" be due to a low oil pressure situation since other than the initial 2 sec. ON time the fuel pump gets at ignition ON, the fuel pump stays OFF until the oil pressure comes up.
Oh, and BTW, you mentioned the use of a radaitor sealer. Be prepared for a clogged heater core. It's a rather common issue on cars that have had radiator stop-leak used in them.

89eldorado
12-05-04, 03:18 AM
hard starting... you may either have a fuel system that's not holding pressure (leaky injectors?), or your lifters may be leaking down quite a bit over night. There is a way to do a lifter leak down test, but if you are not mechanically inclined, the i suggest you let someone else do it. The lifters are hydraulic meaning they have to be full of oil before they'll open the valves. if the intake valve can't open to let fuel in, then there'll be no start until pressure builds up.

You sure they are hydrualic? I remember pulling one from a blown '88 4.5L and it was a one piece rod, albeit bent... I think you ment the 4.6L northstar maybe, but then again I dont know if they are hydrualic as well...

HippieD9
12-07-04, 05:58 PM
Sounds more like a mechanical problem to me, maybe a plugged exhaust or cat. That would definatly cause those problems. Just FYI, I have a 92 with a 4.9 with everything replaced you could think of, and I have hard starts too.

Peace,
Darren

N0DIH
12-08-04, 09:01 PM
I would pull the oil pressure idiot light and stick on a gauge to verify oil pressure.

If you can't get to it to check, swap in 20W50 or 30 wieght oil and see if the problem is alevieated.

If you have run any type of Slick 50 or similar product, swap out the oil filter, that crap is notorious to plugging up filters and killing oil pressure.

Tom

youbetcha77
12-09-04, 03:38 PM
You sure they are hydrualic? I remember pulling one from a blown '88 4.5L and it was a one piece rod, albeit bent... I think you ment the 4.6L northstar maybe, but then again I dont know if they are hydrualic as well...
----------
I beleive you are thinking of pushrods. He is talking about lifters. Engines have used hydraulic lifters for decades now and the ones in the 4.9 are even more advanced because they are of the roller design.

Check the fuel pump relay. According to my service manual it says that when the fuel pump relay quits functioning that the fuel pump will be energized by the oil pressure sensor. So that would explain your longer crank times. It takes the oil pressure light to go out before the fuel pump kicks in. This is a failsafe design so the car will still run even if the relay has gone out. I think the oil pressure light is a whole another thing. Since your relay may be bad the light is now messing with the fuel pump. I would replace the oil pressure sending unit and replace the fuel pump relay, both are rather inexpensive I think. If you need any scanned pages from the service manual to confirm my info let me know.

Blaze

blaze@misn.com

BeelzeBob
12-09-04, 04:56 PM
Before you run off on a lot of tangents, here, you really need to do a little diagnosis on the hard starting situation. Replacing parts willy nilly will cost lots, take a long time and not likely correct the problem.

Is it not starting due to fuel or spark?? A quick way to tell is to open the hood the next time you do a cold start, squirt a few shots of starting fluid into the air cleaner/throttle body and crank. If it starts immediately with the starting fluid then it is an indication that you are not getting fuel to the engine. A simple fuel pressure gauge screwed onto the schraeder valve fitting on the fuel rail would also tell you the fuel pressure during crank which might shed some light on the mystery.

One guess is that the fuel pump relay may be failed. There fore there is no fuel pressure during crank until the oil pressure comes up and provides an alternate voltage source to the fuel pump. That would explain a long crank. Do you hear the fuel pump run when you first turn the key on in the morning?? Next time, remove the fuel cap and put your ear to the fuel filler neck and have someone turn the key to on for the first time. You should hear the fuel pump run for several seconds. If not, the fuel pump relay is not engaging and that would be the place to look.

If the engine is cranking over then it is not the starter......

If it is not cranking, then the Pass key might be a possibility but you should see a security system message I would think.

The rough running and poor fuel economy could be the fuel pressure regulator. Pull the vaccuum line off the fuel pressure regulator while the engine is idling and check for any gas seeping from the vacuum nipple on the fuel pressure regulator.

Adjust/replace the hood bumper.....

The occasional oil pressure warning light sounds like a oil pressure warning light sender. It is a simple switch screwed into the oil filter adapter just next to the oil filter on the top of the engine. Replace it with an OEM switch not an aftermarket one. The generic ones just don't work on the 4.9 and will cause false warnings when the engine is hot in the summer due to the generic switch calibration.