: Demise of the STS-V



KARL DAHLEN
05-08-09, 11:05 AM
Add Cadillac STS-V to the list of high performance General Motors cars that won make be making an appearance for the 2010 model year. In addition to the discontinuation of the STS-V and a host of SS-badged Chevrolets, the Pontiac lineup loses its highest-power G6 for 2010, the last year in existence for the lame-duck brand.

The STS-Vs deletion from dealer order books marks the only notable change to Cadillacs largest rear-wheel-drive sedan for 2010. Despite an impressive 469 horsepower from its supercharged 4.4-liter V8, the $80,000 STS-V was never a sales success. Cadillacís CTS-V will carry on the torch as the automakerís high-performance model for 2010 since the XLR has been dropped entirely

megeebee
05-08-09, 07:47 PM
This doesn't suprise me. They never did sell in any numbers, and those that did were discounted heavily. They were way overpriced compared to the well entrenched, and often more powerfull and luxurious competition. The fact is that it lost even more money than the lesser STS models, which never made a profit either.

The CTS V will be the standard bearer for Cadillac, and the USA, in that market. And that's a good thing.

I usupect that the STS line as a whole will "go-the-way-of-all-flesh" soon. Once CTS wagon production begins (and later the coupe), the factory won't need the STS to keep them busy. Sales of the STS are all but non-existant now.

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DTS_BOI
05-09-09, 11:14 PM
A DTS - STS REPLACEMENT is on the way. This is why the V-model is being discontinued... SHORTLY thereafter, the DTS and STS will be replaced entirely by a single model, and a cheaper entry level caddy will slot below the CTS. It is rumored that the G8 frame will provide rear drive vehicles for Caddy, Buick, and possibly even the new Impala SS. Buick and Caddy will definately get the suspension. The Impala is still under "review".....

megeebee
05-11-09, 06:18 PM
A DTS - STS REPLACEMENT is on the way. This is why the V-model is being discontinued... SHORTLY thereafter, the DTS and STS will be replaced entirely by a single model, and a cheaper entry level caddy will slot below the CTS. It is rumored that the G8 frame will provide rear drive vehicles for Caddy, Buick, and possibly even the new Impala SS. Buick and Caddy will definately get the suspension. The Impala is still under "review".....


Yes, there is a replacement on the way, but not the one you think. And it's much further away than you think.

The platfrom on which the G8 is built, known as "Zeta" at GM, will have no new products built on it after the Camaro. The G8 is dead when Pontiac folds up in a year or so. There is no further work being done on this platform for the US.

The replacement for the STS and DTS is going to be a FWD/ AWD sedan based on the corporate "Epsilon II" platform. Check this out:

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f15/cadillac-epsilon-sedan-coming-my12-78522/

It will be 2012-2013 before we see this new car. The current DTS may well soldier on for 2 more years. I wonder just where they plan to build them, though. The plant currently used for Lucerne/ DTS production is slated to be converted to build small cars on the "Delta II" platform including the Chevy VOLT in the next year or so.

The STS will, as GM has announced, die after the 2010 model year, if not before. In any case, I believe production of it will likely end by the first of the year.

There will be no RWD Impala, either. The replacement of the current car will also be a FWD "Epsilon II" development.

The entry level Cadillac is planned on a smaller, lighter RWD platform under development called "Alpha". It is this platform that will be enlarged to eventually replace the current CTS's "Sigma" platform (If GM survives, and that's a big "IF"). It's design is complete. The only thing holding it up is..................you guessed it........................money.

Or, as many have stated, the entry level Cadillac will be a production version of the CONVERJ concept, sharing "Delta II" underpinnings with the VOLT.

The Zeta platform (G8/ Camaro) is too heavy and cannot be adapted to hybrid powertrains. The Sigma platform too (CTS) is simply too heavy and too expensive to be profitable for the corporation. The CTS will see a mid-cycle refresh for 2011. It's replacement for 2014 will (again, if GM survives) be a stretched version of the "Alpha" platform.



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DTS_BOI
05-15-09, 11:46 AM
I dont know why you keep saying "If GM survives".... Even if the company enters bankrupcy, it will indeed "survive". Do you honestly think GM will disappear into thin air one day?

In regards to your information, thank you for sharing. I have never heard of this before. I do however have more conflicting information to your synapsis..

According to Motortrend.com (Visit the site and read the article on Caddy) GM is indeed building the converj concept, based on the volt platform. The STS/DTS replacement will NOT BE FRONT WHEEL DRIVE. The CTS will grow larger in size, and a smaller Caddy will slot below it. This smaller Caddy was once under development to be RWD, however GM has now changed it's mind and the small Caddy will be FWD and AWD with smaller turbo engines. They also add that those who have seen the new car in person SWEAR that it is absolutely gorgeous....

The 2011/2012 Caddy line up will include - Larger CTS, Un-named Smaller Caddy, Electric Caddy Converj, Escalade and SRX. The STS/DTS will be discontinued without any replacement. The Larger CTS will fill the role.

I DO NOT LIKE THIS IDEA AT ALL... I absolutely hate it. However, this is the latest Caddy infor according to Motortrend.com as of May 2009..

By the way, according to Motortrend.com a rumor has leaked that Pontiac was indeed going to make a Firebird/Trans AM BEFORE they were put on the chopping block.... Damn! I would have loved to see that...

megeebee
05-15-09, 02:58 PM
I dont know why you keep saying "If GM survives".... Even if the company enters bankrupcy, it will indeed "survive". Do you honestly think GM will disappear into thin air one day?

In regards to your information, thank you for sharing. I have never heard of this before. I do however have more conflicting information to your synapsis..

According to Motortrend.com (Visit the site and read the article on Caddy) GM is indeed building the converj concept, based on the volt platform. The STS/DTS replacement will NOT BE FRONT WHEEL DRIVE. The CTS will grow larger in size, and a smaller Caddy will slot below it. This smaller Caddy was once under development to be RWD, however GM has now changed it's mind and the small Caddy will be FWD and AWD with smaller turbo engines. They also add that those who have seen the new car in person SWEAR that it is absolutely gorgeous....

The 2011/2012 Caddy line up will include - Larger CTS, Un-named Smaller Caddy, Electric Caddy Converj, Escalade and SRX. The STS/DTS will be discontinued without any replacement. The Larger CTS will fill the role.

I DO NOT LIKE THIS IDEA AT ALL... I absolutely hate it. However, this is the latest Caddy infor according to Motortrend.com as of May 2009..

By the way, according to Motortrend.com a rumor has leaked that Pontiac was indeed going to make a Firebird/Trans AM BEFORE they were put on the chopping block.... Damn! I would have loved to see that...

Motor Trend does not have the best record of accuracy in these matters. But in fairness, things can change rather quickly these days. The models they may have been shown may well have been planned at the time, but cancelled or changed by GM afterward.
The fact is that development of the small RWD platform has been halted due to lack of money. The Converj, as seperate model, is being actively developed but not yet approved for production. It was intended as a one-off to show how a Voltec driven Cadillac might look. But since the public reaction was so positive (it is a BEAUTIFUL little coupe), production development and consideration has begun. But it is too early to say it's "coming", and even if it were, it would not arrive by 2011.

The STS/ DTS will both indeed die, but they will be replaced by a single, FWD/AWD car built off the LWB (long wheelbase) Epsilon II platform shared with the the Buick La Crosse. This will appear in 2012 approximately. There will not be a "larger" CTS anytime soon.

I urge you to look at www.gminsidenews.com (http://www.gminsidenews.com) for more current information.

And GM itself: This is from April 9th: http://cadillac.gmblogs.com/2009/04/16/update-on-the-converj/


Hereís the reality: The status of the Converj has not changed, it is still a concept. Itís being studied, and that process continues. Weíre really pleased that Converj has received a positive reaction. Itís great to see enthusiasm for the technical and design statement this concept makes. Weíre gathering consumer reaction to it, and going through the many steps it takes to assess this kind of a very advanced concept. And, simply, that process is not complete.

As for GM, It is not outside the realm of possibility for it to disappear. I think every effort will be made to avoid that fate, though.

amgqmp1
05-22-09, 07:35 PM
Add Cadillac STS-V to the list of high performance General Motors cars that won make be making an appearance for the 2010 model year.

'Tis a shame...the V series is great marketing, and great product...just not in the hands of a megacorp.

dhemrick
05-22-09, 09:42 PM
'Tis a shame...the V series is great marketing, and great product...just not in the hands of a megacorp.

I think GM missed a huge marketing "halo effect" with the V series. They are really awesome cars and they started out being promoted so well. Remember the Super Bowl commercials from 2005?

But then all of a sudden the advertising stopped. So many people are completely unaware of what the V series is, and how much of a cool factor it brought to Cadillac.

Even if people weren't in the market for a V series, I firmly believe that Cadillac would have sold more regular models had they promoted the V series more due to the halo effect.

WillySTS
05-22-09, 09:53 PM
Huh, seems like every car I buy goes out of production...
my 1988 Mazda 323 GTX was dubbed..."A poor mans Quattro"...was produced '88/'89 - 1500 units
my 1991 454SS pickup, under 20,000 were made however 13,000 in 1990.There were only 973 '91's
my 2002 TransAm Firehawk - 3001 were made over the course of 11 years, 1501 in 2002
and now my 2007 STS-V...

Don't let me pick another car to buy, it'll go out of production too!

dhemrick
05-22-09, 10:33 PM
Huh, seems like every car I buy goes out of production...
my 1988 Mazda 323 GTX was dubbed..."A poor mans Quattro"...was produced '88/'89 - 1500 units
my 1991 454SS pickup, under 20,000 were made however 13,000 in 1990.There were only 973 '91's
my 2002 TransAm Firehawk - 3001 were made over the course of 11 years, 1501 in 2002
and now my 2007 STS-V...

Don't let me pick another car to buy, it'll go out of production too!

WillySTS, you have good taste in cars!

Personally, I don't want a car that eveyrone else has. When people see me on the road, they know "oh yeah... that's Dale."

I had a 1997 Dodge Ram SS/T in red (pretty rare truck), and then a red 2002 Eldorado collectors series number 666 of 1596 made of which only one third were red and only a few of that third had sunroofs like mine. When I bought my STS-V, I had to have the red interior because, of course, it's the rarest interior and welll, it's RED.

Be proud that you have uncommon taste. Otherwise, you could be driving a gold Camry. BLEH!!!

K STS
05-22-09, 10:43 PM
I agree. One of the main reasons I got my STS is because NO ONE ELSE HAS ONE. I could have gotten a nice 5 series for the price, but who wants that?

silverws6ta
05-23-09, 02:47 AM
I agree. One of the main reasons I got my STS is because NO ONE ELSE HAS ONE. I could have gotten a nice 5 series for the price, but who wants that?

Live in the Greenville/Spartanburg SC area with the BMW plant just 10-15 miles away from my house and you will *really* understand... Even more amazing are POS tract built homes :rant2: (aka slab built :alchi: - I will never EVER own a home that doesn't have a crawl space) with new Bimmers sitting around since they work there.. Of course I'm going WTF?!? :bigroll: :suspect: Only vehicle sitting outside of my 2 acre lot is the SSEi.. The V and WS6 rest comfortably in my garage!

silverws6ta
05-23-09, 02:55 AM
WillySTS, you have good taste in cars!

Personally, I don't want a car that eveyrone else has. When people see me on the road, they know "oh yeah... that's Dale."

I had a 1997 Dodge Ram SS/T in red (pretty rare truck), ...

Be proud that you have uncommon taste. Otherwise, you could be driving a gold Camry. BLEH!!!

Speaking of the infamous MOpar (Mo' parts on the road .. than left on the car :hide:) I was talking to the Caddy service manager today regarding those future Fiat's.. Sad part for Chrysler.. If MB couldn't pull you out of a slump.. nobody can.. but the more honest truth.. They never caught on to the mistakes of the '80s whereas GM and Ford did (with the excepton GM is still paying retired janitors 100k a year.. again WTF -- I have to work for my salary) The new trucks had a great LOOK but all their cars look alike -- and the powertrain is still SH!T like it has been for 20 years... I cringe when I spot a 300C, or Magnum, or Charger -- because 75% of them are V6's with 20"+ chrome wheels.. I jest at the fact at the shortage of wheel bearings.. :p