http://autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carnews&loc_code=index&content_code=06803524

Any thoughts?

How is this going to get Lincoln ahead? They are using the same plat form from another car and putting the Lincoln name on it.

Ford Taurus = Mercury Sable (the Sables get uglier every year)

Ford Escort = Mercury Tracer (Still ugly, discontinued)

Ford Expedition = Lincoln Navigator (hmm)

Ford Explorer = Lincoln Aviator

Ford Crown Vic = Lincoln Town car

Lincoln and Mercury really dont sell that many cars, most of the dealers are "Lincoln / Mercury" lots, they sell both brands on the lot. I dont know why they just dont consolidate lines and drop either Mercury or Lincoln. It is to much competition between each car.

-Byron

I don't think Lincoln is throwing in the towel, Ford is trying to compete as best they can. They don't have as much cash to invest as GM and they seem to be investing most all of it in the Ford brand.

I thought the Crown Vic was the Mercury Grand Marquis? Is the Expedition really that close to the Navigator? If it is, I may have to give it a closer look. The GM at the local Ford Dealership is a friend of mine.

And another thing, I don't recall ever seeing a Mercury dealer without Lincolns too, and vice-versa.

But as far as Ford throwing in the towel, there will always be a Lincoln/Mercury. If Ford is being a little less imaginative with the variety of their designs, I'd say that's par for the course, and how they've managed to stay in business all these years.

In Canada, Mercury bit the dust about 4 years. Mercury dealer were turned to Ford dealers

They need to consolidate by scrapping the Taurus, the Mystique, Contour, and the Sable.

They used to sell a Mercury F-150 in Canada. No joke.

There are no stand alone Lincoln dealerships. There are, however a few hundred Mercury & Ford dealerships without Lincoln in certain areas. I know of one in N.J. that I sometimes pass. It's weird to look in & see a Grand Marquis sitting next to a Thunderbird on the floor.

Take alook at my post on the general forums....about the American luxury needing to be changed.

How is this going to get Lincoln ahead? They are using the same plat form from another car and putting the Lincoln name on it.

Ford Taurus = Mercury Sable (the Sables get uglier every year)

Ford Escort = Mercury Tracer (Still ugly, discontinued)

Ford Expedition = Lincoln Navigator (hmm)

Ford Explorer = Lincoln Aviator

Ford Crown Vic = Lincoln Town car

Lincoln and Mercury really dont sell that many cars, most of the dealers are "Lincoln / Mercury" lots, they sell both brands on the lot. I dont know why they just dont consolidate lines and drop either Mercury or Lincoln. It is to much competition between each car.

-Byron
who cares? many car companies do that...look at GM...they use the same platforms for many differnt cars. shit even the Rolls Royce Silver Seraph and the Bentley Arnage were on the same basic platform.

Lincoln in my opinion is a very successful company. Lincoln needs to separate from Mercury and run solo without Mercury standing in their shadow. Lincoln needs to bring back their old successful cars and by those I mean the Mark Series and the Continental. The Town Car needs a full cosmetic overhaul so it no longer even resembles the Crown Victoria and the Grand Marquis. Also drop the price on it a little. The Mark Series needs to come back as a full size luxury coupe with a big brawny V8 just like it was during it's 50 years worth of success. The Continental took a dive for the worst in the late 80's when they went V6 and FWD. The Continental needs to be their flagship car again and ride RWD with a nice powerful engine, V8 please. Why drop the LS? It was great competition for the CTS. Also the Aviator needs to go. If someone wants a Lincoln, they're gonna want a big car. All I see an Aviator as being is a small Navigator, not needed. As for Mercury that's a whole different clean up, but have them stay away from Lincoln. Ford's luxury line should have nothing to do with Mercury at all. Parking a Town Car next to a Sable in a dealer lot makes the Town Car look bad. My first car was a 1989 Lincoln Mark VII and that was one hell of a car. That to me was a real Lincoln and they need to come back to where they were.

They need to consolidate by scrapping the Taurus, the Mystique, Contour, and the Sable.
They have scrapped the Mercury Sable, the Contour/Mystique was discontinued awhile ago, I heard they had nothing but problems.

who cares? many car companies do that...look at GM...they use the same platforms for many differnt cars. shit even the Rolls Royce Silver Seraph and the Bentley Arnage were on the same basic platform.
Let me explain something :

Ford Crown Victoria = Lincoln Towncar = Mercury Grand Marquis

They are all basically the same car with modifications, they may share the same platform, but its obvious Lincoln is getting dull. They are competing with each other, people are probably so confused as to what car they should buy they just walk away and find another car.

Do you recall when Ford recalled the Crown Victoria's fuel tank mounting, or something? When a car rear ended one of these Crown Vics, some how the tank would bust open and burst into flames, some times the doors would buckle, and people have been burned alive because they couldnt get out in time. Well, Ford finally did a recall, BUT they only did the recall for the Crown Vic "Police Interceptors", because they thought the risk for a standard Crown Victoria getting into an accident was dismal, compared to the "Police interceptors".

Do you remember the Lincoln Blackwood? Lincoln sold 3,000 of those trucks, before they stopped selling them because no one wanted to buy one. These trucks retailed for about $50,000 bucks a piece.

I think its time for Ford to consolidate some lines, or start fresh on the drawing block. I think its obvious that taking a Ford Explorer and renaming it Lincoln Aviator is not helping Lincoln out, they are not re-inventing them selves.

By the way:

Ford Explorer = Mercury Mountainier = Lincoln Aviator

Ford Expedition = Lincoln Navigator

Now, the Lincoln Navigator is a well respected SUV, I will give Lincoln that.

But, its time for fresh ideas, not making over another Ford product into a Lincoln! :drinker

Oh dont forget, the main idea of the article is to "Freshen up the Lincoln line", so that is why it 'matters' and the folks at Lincoln should care.

GM is doing it, yes, but they are having sucess at doing it. I dont think Lincoln is having that sucess... :yawn:

I dont call a Saab..Buick..Chevy...GMC...Olds....truck really successful or GM "doing It"....Ford does a great job with there platform sharing and you will see even better in the coming years.....sure the sable/taurus is a pos...and alot of other ones too....but what about the Cavalier/Sunfire..Suburb/YukonXL/Escalade..so on so on. Ford has those for sales...the CrownVic is the cop car and taxi...the Grand Marquis is the retired persons car in Florida and the Rental Car and the Town car is the retired person who has a little more money....there is a big difference between the Town Car and the other ones....not so with the Crown/Marquis though.

Lincoln is playing it smart in the years to come....Cadillac is taking a Gamble (which is good too) but Lincoln will become the American Lexus...(Not Buick like GM thinks)...with FWD/AWD cars like the upcoming Zephyr and Continental (Which will handle great for there drivetrain choice) (look at mazda 6) and the interiors will be the greatest amoung the American companies...Lincoln is getting better and better. Then they will have the new Aviator...improved Towncar with at least 300hp.....and when you think of it this way: They will be having the Capability of V6 engines up to 310Hp...not V8's but V6's with Torque in the 280-290 range I believe.....and CVT/6sp auto transmissions. The Future of Lincoln is well secured....I just hope Ford doesnt take more then 2 yrs to make the 275hp Duratec 35 to a 300-3xxhp Duratec 40. And all the new lincolns are being designed with Hybrid technology in mind.....Just like Lexus.....with these gas prices in the next 5-10 yrs hopefully Caddy/Mercedes/BMW dont get hit really hard with those Twin Turboed V12's and Large V8's w/superchargers.

I have always wondered why we still need Mercury myself. Either buy a C/V or a Towncar. While the platforms are the same (Panther) there is a world of difference in the ride and appointments of the two. As for the Expedition=Navigator, it shares the same chassis, but like the C/V=T/C there ARE differences. The most obvious is the engine in the Navigator. As far as I can tell, you cannot get the 32V DOHC 5.4 in the Expedition. Also drive both SUVs and the Navigator definitely rides smoother.

well the expy and navi will soon both have the same engine.....3V 5.4L

Ford has those for sales...the CrownVic is the cop car and taxi...the Grand Marquis is the retired persons car in Florida and the Rental Car and the Town car is the retired person who has a little more money....


LMAO...sorry, but i couldnt help but bust out laughin when i read this. lol :thumbsup:

Every review I read says the Town Car/Grand Marquis/Crown Vic all "ride" exactly the same... Is this not true?

Every review I read says the Town Car/Grand Marquis/Crown Vic all "ride" exactly the same... Is this not true?
the towncar has air shocks in the rear, the grand marquis i dont htink so, and the crown vic dosnt for sure, i dont see how they would ride the same.

Does this belong in Cadillac Versus???? SAL???

CaddyMan it is funny yet true....lol

They all drive different to a certain level....I consider the Crown/Marquis the same car...but on the LSE you can get rear air shocks on the Marquis too.....but on to the towncar. Its got alot of different chassis reinforcements compared to the others....and the interior as a whole is fairly different too, you cant get a navigation with the others but you can in the Town Car and you cant get the others in Stretched form either....I actually agree on keeping them all.

1.CrownVic for Fleetsales....Vinyl or high strength cloth
2.GrandMarquis......Soft Cloth/leather seats...chrome....nicer wheels....more wood.
3.Towncar.....Different styleing like now....better leather like now...more wood like now..stronger quieter chassis like now...air ride like now.....and the only other thing unlike now that I would like to see is a stronger engine...which the segment really demands....if you count out the Old folks...the current engines main competion is the 4.9l 12 yr old caddy engine.....I wanna see the new 3V 4.6 w/315hp and 310tq in the freshened up towncar next.....which I think we will.

But then it will be across the board.....so I think they should offer it as an option on the other two cars and standard on the Towncar....that way the buyers know they get more for their money and not just a GrandMarquis....overall I think the journalists just dont like American Cars period...but Caddy is changing that now and Chrysler...(notsoamerican) :rolleyes:

From the August 2004 issue of Automobile:

Stayin' Alive
Lincoln Mercury reinvents itself. Again.

"Now that Oldsmobile and Plymouth have hit the skids, there's a chill wind blowing under the doors of some Detroit car companies. That's why Lincoln Mercury wants everyone to know that it is still selling lots of cars and trucks and plans to sell more.

This fall, the Mercury Montego, a version of the Ford Five Hundred sedan, arrives. Next year, Mercury gets the Mariner SUV, a pricier version of the Escape, and a hybrid Mariner will appear as a 2007 model.

That's not much to reshape a company that still depends on the aged Grand Marquis for a substantial portion of it's sales. Mercury says the Montego and Mariner will help attract younger owners, but that's like hearing that your great-aunt is making plans to appear on American Idol.

There's also news from Lincoln. The four-door Mark LT pickup (previewed by the Detroit auto show concept) debuts next spring. The front-wheel-drive Zephyr is due for 2006 (awd will follow, along with a Mercury badged version), and the all-new Aviator crossover will appear as a 2007 model. Meanwhile, concept cars for the next Detroit show will signal plans to reintroduce the Continental and replace the geriatric Town Car.

All this is a far cry from the days when Lincoln Mercury moved to California to join the Premier Automotive Group.
Mercury aspired to performance, while Lincoln vowed to create a new interpretation of American Luxury. Now, Lincoln Mercury is back in Detroit, and the disappointing Mercury Marauder has vanished, along with the disappointing Lincoln concept cars (there were a lot of them, weren't there?). Once you cut through the marketing spin, it appears the company is wrapping it's arms around it's traditional owner body and sliding back into the past, when it made little more than Fords with extra chrome trim.

Lincoln Mercury always has had trouble with it's identity, wobbling among luxury, performance, and tradition. It will introduce no fewer than eleven new models in the next four years, but we're less sure than ever about what kind of company it really wants to be." ~Michael Jordan

from The Car Connection

LINCOLN CHANGES DIRECTION, WON'T CHASE CADDY
"We don't have to be Cadillac," James Padilla, President of Ford Motor Co. North American Operations, in an interview after a press conference at the Chicago Auto Show. Padilla said the number-two automaker has launched an extensive review of future product plans for Lincoln, which has long been considered Ford's answer to Cadillac. But Padilla said Ford has had second thoughts about following Cadillac upscale. "We're looking at how we can get more synergy with Ford products," Padilla said. Lincoln will keep its sport-utility vehicles and continue to sell entry-level luxury cars and other luxury models that utilize the brand's traditional strengths as an American luxury brand but it won't follow Cadillac "north" with pricier models beyond roughly the $40,000 to $50,000 range. One sign of the change is that Ford has already killed plans for building a high-performance Lincoln LS with help from McLaren to compete with Cadillac's new V-Series CTS. Ford, however, also will look at building different kinds of vehicles for Lincoln. One candidate for future development is the Lincoln Navicross, which could utilize the platform developed for the Ford Freestyle activity vehicle, Padilla said. "But we haven't decided that yet." -Joe Szczesny

While going FWD, I think the new Lincoln lineup is going to remind me of the first Cadillac Northstar cars. All FWD and not exactly performance-oriented (still comfortable, fairly soft-riding, etc). The Zephyr would be like an STS, the Continental would be like the DeVille, and whatever replaces the Town Car would be like the Fleetwood that Cadillac stopped making...

Im actually looking foward to the new lincolns....if they can utalize high horse power V6's in the 275-300hp range...they have nothing to loose over the V8 crowd. Any V6 making 200hp or more is fantastic...but when it starts getting near 300hp.....man....we wont see many V8s around.

I wonder if Lincoln is trying to pick up the traditional customers that Cadillac is slowly leaving behind for younger blood. Otherwise Buick would get a slight boost from frightened Cadillac owners who can't handle Art & Science.

Infiniti had Lincoln's dilemma in the mid to late 90s, when first-generation Q45 sales tumbled, J30 sales declined gradually, and the only products carrying the brand were rebadged generic Nissans: the QX4 (gussied up Pathfinder with more advanced AWD) and G20 (fancy version of europe's Nissan Primera).

The "new" Q45 in 1997 was just an older Nissan Cima from Japan with a smaller and less powerful 4.1L engine. It was faster than the 96 Q45 partly due to weight reductions (and in 1996 VVT was removed for emissions and OBD II was introduced). But it was softer and more traditional inside and out. But in no way did it compare to the 90-95 Q45 that defined the brand.

The 2002 Q45 was supposed to be a huge hit, but is mostly a flop. It focused on gizmos instead of intuitive luxury -- in glaring contrast to the brand's launch -- creating more confusion for consumers and muddying the brand's image, virtues, and selling points.

So the French took over and revived the brand from the bottom-up. G35 and FX series are knockouts, and the replacement M45 in 2005 and replacement Q45 in 06 or 07 should be even more incredible.

If you want to sell luxury cars and compete at the upper crust, you have to have products first. Otherwise anyone can rebadge a vehicle and add some chrome and leather like Acura and Mercury have. (Check out the Acura EL in Canada... a luxury Civic.)

The concept cars have to hit showrooms or else Lincoln and Mercury will go the way of Oldsmobile. The elderly Lincoln customers who are frightened by the new Cadillac dont exactly contribute to a long term business plan.

-Jesda

I think you're right about Lincoln taking Cadillacs old customers... That makes plenty of sense. I think Buick would like to be in that situation, but they don't have the name and history that Lincoln does...

Otherwise. The Infiniti J30 was a Nissan Altima.. The G20 was a Nissan Sentra... The interiors were much nicer inside...

Lincoln needs to bring back their old successful cars and by those I mean the Mark Series and the Continental.

I heard somewhere that they are supposed to be bringing these back. i hope lincoln isnt throwing in the towel, beside Cadillac they are one of the best car companies around. and who will be worthy enough to compete with Cadillac then?

Lincoln can and WILL take over the traditional Cadillac buyers.....down the line they will be introducing some very nice looking cars with luxurius interiors...not sporty ala Cadillac.....but truely luxurius.

Truely luxurious... heh.. That could be their new slogan...

I think you're right about Lincoln taking Cadillacs old customers... That makes plenty of sense. I think Buick would like to be in that situation, but they don't have the name and history that Lincoln does...

Otherwise. The Infiniti J30 was a Nissan Altima.. The G20 was a Nissan Sentra... The interiors were much nicer inside...

The Infiniti J30 is a four-door Nissan ZX with tanklike construction (quite heavy for its size, at over 3800 lbs). The J30 is also RWD, and uses the entire drivetrain from the Nissan 300ZX sports car. The Altima, however, is a FWD commuter car that sort of sits halfway between compact and midsize -- and it got ugly in the mid 90s with its tall boxy body. The only thing the J30 and Altima ever had in common basically, was that the J looked like the first Altima. Everything else was entirely different.

The G20, while a spirited, attractive car, is simply a rebadged version of europe's Nissan Primera (not the same as Sentra, which is more downmarket and cheaper in overall build quality and performance). A slow but good-handling FWD car. Not exactly luxurious, but at least it was cheap in the mid 20s back in the day.

The current Q45 is Japan's Nissan Cima. The original Q45 was based on the Nissan President, which at the time was Nissan's flagship. It came in two wheelbases, and in the US we got the short wheelbase version with better handling. In 1997, the Q45 went from being based on the Nissan President to a rebadged Nissan Cima. Think of it as going one small step down in luxury and performance.

But one thing to bear in mind, is that rebadging cars that are otherwise only available overseas makes little difference to the brand perception of most Americans. Taking your little sister's Honda Civic and selling it as an Acura EL, or taking Officer Bob's Crown Vic and calling it a Grand Marquis isnt so subtle. Sharing and rebadging are fine to a degree... Oldsmobile (in the 80s) and Mercury took it to an extreme, and people just werent buying it. Selling the Crown Vic as a high end luxury car in Hong Kong, however, might work.

-Jesda

Correction regarding Oldsmobile: People bought it at the time (making it one of the top selling brands in the 80s), but badge engineering muddied the brand and killed it in the 90s.

mercury does for ford what buick does for gm. its middle line you do not want to drive a chevy cant afford a cadillac so you settle with a new buick. same with ford. ther are many cadillac buick gmc dealers in town but i agree mercury shold seperate so that lincoln in exclusivley lincoln. like many big caddi dealerships are only exclusivly caddillac dealerships even their used car lots are only cadillacs.

mercury does for ford what buick does for gm. its middle line you do not want to drive a chevy cant afford a cadillac so you settle with a new buick. same with ford. ther are many cadillac buick gmc dealers in town but i agree mercury shold seperate so that lincoln in exclusivley lincoln. like many big caddi dealerships are only exclusivly caddillac dealerships even their used car lots are only cadillacs.

Mercury doesnt bring in near enough revenue to even be alowed to consider a seperate franchise.........they need INDIVIDUAL products.

Lincoln can and WILL take over the traditional Cadillac buyers....

We'll have to see what happens to the DeVilles before we can make an assumption like that.

That was assuming that they will do the deville the way of Art & Science......but then again all the traditionalists were buying fleetwoods and sevilles too.....with this new styling they may think it is too flashy.

My friend has a 99 Crown Vic LX and that thing can not possibly ride any softer, if it did it would be dangerous, so I guess their is some truth to thinking all three ride the same.

If Mercury is to survive and thrive, it needs a more clearly defined identity. All Mercurys are are fancied up Fords. Ford should position it as a performance luxury brand and Lincoln as the traditional luxury brand. This way they can work both sides of the luxury car market by attracting young and old buyers without competing with each other.

99 was before the major chassis reinforcements.

If Mercury is to survive and thrive, it needs a more clearly defined identity. All Mercurys are are fancied up Fords. Ford should position it as a performance luxury brand and Lincoln as the traditional luxury brand. This way they can work both sides of the luxury car market by attracting young and old buyers without competing with each other.

Ford already has it's divisions set to work both ends of the luxury car market. Lincoln for it's 'pure' luxury and Jaguar for Luxury-Sport. Mercury is, and has always been an economy luxury brand. Think of it as Ford's Oldsmobile (and hopefully it shares the same fate).

Lincoln/Mercury does not control its destiny, as Ford goes, so goes LM. As a long time Ford-LM supporter (customer), this is how I see it.

The other side:
·Other American manufacturers have the Viper, the “can you say HEMI”, and the Corvette. Ford has a pony car just reaching it’s potential with a 25 year plus chassis.
·Pontiac comes out with a GTO with power, road hugging ability, and good looks. Ford kills it’s SHO just as it was achieving its next level. Ford currently sells, would you believe, a Taurus with 50/60’s technology rear drum brakes. We notice!
·Cadillac comes up with one visceral car after another (XLR, CTS(V), etc)… Ford has an LS Lincoln with an anemic and detuned Jaguar motor.

FORD, some thoughts:
·If Ford imagines itself as primarily a truck company, then you are writing your epitaph.
·You promised to compete with BMW and the worlds best with the LS in 2000 and by 2006 your leaving your LS customers high and dry.
·You have raised your current subsidiaries from the grave at the expenses of the parent company. If Ford's vision is to be the “Yugo” of the world, then expect one of your subsidiaries to own you one day.
·Stop making very limited production cars, only the Jay Leno’s of the world will be buying the Ford GT. I’m convinced your are not making a profit from these cars, so selling a few to people who will keep them in a garage doesn’t make a lot of corporate sense.
·Your current financial woes are what you are reaping for the blasé products you produce, just as GM suffered in the early 90’s.
·“Bold”, “Daring”, and “Inspired” you are not.

PS: After 30 + years of buying Ford products, my last three cars have been a Z06, CTS-V, and a Lemans Commemorative Corvette. I hope they get the message.
:cool:

If any of you live in Central or South Florida you know that most of the snowbirds or retirees tend to purchase the Mercury Marquis simply because the offer the size and ride of a Lincoln without the cost.

Yeah, I see that.. I live in West Palm Beach and a lot of the retirees drive Mercury Grand Marquis.. In many of the reviews I read, they've got a similar feel as well.. To the serious enthusiast, I'm sure that's not true. But to the average driver - I'm sure it is...

Yeah, I see that.. I live in West Palm Beach and a lot of the retirees drive Mercury Grand Marquis.. In many of the reviews I read, they've got a similar feel as well.. To the serious enthusiast, I'm sure that's not true. But to the average driver - I'm sure it is...

True True.......Very same cars but at the same time they are very different....I can notice it..

1000 POST BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.......and Im here to stay.

If what Gothicaleigh posted about Ford pulling Lincoln out of PAG is true, that is just absurd. Lincoln was really turning itself around with the recent updates to the LS, the awesome technology and refinement of the new Navigator, and the plushness of the 2003 and up Lincoln Town Car, I was really expecting great things from Lincoln, and Im still hoping to see some coming down the line. When the Ford family took the company back from that Nasser idiot, they began to turn the rusted out wheels of change back in the right direction, but they will need to keep the change alive and kicking if they are to stay competitive. Unfortunately, I have to agree with some here who say its time for Mercury to go, for petes sake there is no American brand left that so CLEARLY defines badge engineering as Mercury. The half-assed attempt at the Marauder was absolutely laughable, and if you dig deeper, you find that it was really only once again a rehashed version of the Crown Vic Sport model which was also introduced as a fat sedan with some speed.

The 2003 Lincoln Town Car however does deserve some praise. For those who like classic BIG RWD American luxury, no other car so well defines it as the Town Car. It blends a wonderfully smooth ride, with such amenities as a big fat genuine wood trimmed steering wheel, Xenon lights, extended length models (like BMW and Mercedes), high quality stereo systems, park distance sensors and other gadgets. In comparison, the Mercury Grand Marquis and Crown Vic are really an afterthought, EXCEPT for when it comes to Police use, something the Crown Vic seemed destined for from the beginning. It really makes those Impala cruisers seem like toys.

Lincoln is on its way up......granted way SLOWER then Cadillac.......yet they dont have the billions given to them either......It will be many more years for Lincoln to play catch up with any company.....but they are on a tariffic start...........and Ill still take a new towncar anyday.

Yea, I had to come to the Townie's defense... It was unfairly getting tossed in there with the CV and Marquis, which I promise you are two totally different animals than the Town Car despite riding on the same chassis. Its one of the best applications of platform sharing I know of, because it FEELS like a different car when youre behind the wheel.

Wasnt the Bonnville and one of the Caddy's sharing platform at one time????

I think the Towncar is a different animal too..........

Yep, the Bonnie actually rides on the same platform/chassis as the 98+ Seville, this is why it was really a no-brainer to throw the Northstar into the GXP,they didnt really have to change anything.

Actually, now that I think about it... the current Deville, the Aurora, and I BELIEVE the Park Avenue all share(d) the basic components of the platform, but the Bonnie and the Seville are practically identical.

One other consideration about the Crown Vic and the Marquis... one point I really havent seen made here, is that one reason for their immense popularity despite their age, is the fact that you really CANT touch any other V8 powered sedan for their price range easily. I just saw a commercial giving away 2004 Grand Marquis' for 17,763. That is absurd considering the sheer amount of car and engine that you get for that price, even in the base model. I still hate Mercury, but I have to admit if im looking for a cheap, safe V8 car for my business or to recommend to my grandparents, the GMarq would be it. The closest you can come with GM is the Malibu (blah) or the Impala (blah).

Down here is South Florida you can get a base GS for $14,999 then add dealer installed leather....(better then the factory stuff) and walk out the door for $15,999.

Thats nuts!!! I guess thats why the "All American Driveway" is probably mostly made up of Grand Marquis' and F150's!. Though the Crown Vic doesnt really seem to get much if any attention on Ford commercials and at the dealer lots.

Thats the creat thing about the two (Vic,Marquis) they require no advertisments to sell the amount they do..................you see maybe one a year for a Marquis and those are run by the local dealers.

Thats nuts!!! I guess thats why the "All American Driveway" is probably mostly made up of Grand Marquis' and F150's!. Though the Crown Vic doesnt really seem to get much if any attention on Ford commercials and at the dealer lots.


The Buick Le Sabre outsells the Mercury, been that way since about '92!

Thats the creat thing about the two (Vic,Marquis) they require no advertisments to sell the amount they do..................you see maybe one a year for a Marquis and those are run by the local dealers.

I see ads for them here in Michigan all the time. The latest one on TV brags about the size of it's trunk. There is something wrong when the best thing about a car is the trunk.

Now that I think about it, the recent Town Car ads are the same way... the main thing that they show off is it's power-operated trunk-lid...

Man, Id say somethings wrong when the frieken LE SABRE is outselling the V8 powered LARGER car that doesnt have an association with the name Buick!!

Honestly, the Grand Marquis is about 9 millionth on the list of cars I would drive, but the buick would slot about 400 places below it.

I think things like trunk space and power accessories are simply the kind of things youre left with when youve got one vehicle thats otherwise quite bland, and will probably only be used for just that, hauling people and things... and on the Power trunk closer, the older folks really appreciate those little touches. Remember less and less cars are coming with such gizmos these days since there a hassle when they break and most people would consider them a waste.

The Buick Le Sabre outsells the Mercury, been that way since about '92!

Not in Florida though......

La Sabre actually sells for less at times down here too...Ive seen them go for 12,999 down here........Florida is the best car market.........04' Grand Prixs go for $8,000.

Not in Florida though......

La Sabre actually sells for less at times down here too...Ive seen them go for 12,999 down here........Florida is the best car market.........04' Grand Prixs go for $8,000.

You should be able to get some 'real deals' on cars in the Tampa area in a couple of weeks!

You should be able to get some 'real deals' on cars in the Tampa area in a couple of weeks!

Haha..."Hail Damage special"............"Tree smashed Special"