: Bone stock car, Dyno Hit 568 hp With 2.55 pulley and custom airbox with tune.



wait4me
02-19-09, 10:02 AM
Well guys, im uploading the videos now. Ill have pricing soon also. Probably around monday of next week. It is a simple install swap.

It is exactly where most customers would want to stop as far as gains go. It is MUCH better. So, you can have more power than a zr1 corvette in its stock form....

With the mod you HAVE to do the air box. It will suck the inlet shut on accelleration. Ill post the dyno sheets in this thread also so you can go thru them all.

The max for the STOCK airbox is 500hp and 500 ft of torque, it flatlines all the way accross it looks like.



As for other mods, there will be more comming next week.

Intercooler add ons,
scan tools,
Flashing handhelds,
Boost options,
Adjustable boost controllers,
Blower snout pulleys,
CRANK pulleys, 0 to 10 more psi over stock with both pulleys changed.
And a gauge that goes into your stock location on the Clock under the radio that is a scantool and custom gauge set all in one.

Razorecko
02-19-09, 10:36 AM
^ How much extra boost is it running now with the 2.55 ?? Dyno slip/chart ??

musclesbmf
02-19-09, 10:49 AM
More info, more info, more info....
tell us about this new airbox... What was the size of the stock blower pulley? What about your exhaust that you are desinging...

Oh, the waiting game sucks... :bonkers:

LV_V
02-19-09, 01:13 PM
Thanks for making my keyboard full of saliva...

qictrk
02-19-09, 04:37 PM
I already have the tune, do you have to retune the ECM for the pulley change? The ECM tune i bought from you seems to be working great. I'm sure the pulley change will be like wise. Your right about going any higher on the hp. Don't want to have parts start to break, and i don't want to hear about, if they're not breaking, your not going fast enough. I've already been though that route with another vehicle i once had. Cecil............:cool2:

poor-sha
02-19-09, 05:51 PM
I assume we're talking rwhp? If so what was the stock value on the same dyno? Was this an auto or manual?

RapidRob
02-19-09, 06:19 PM
Details? Details? How does that airbox look from the outside? Same as OEM?

Don't want any warranty problems ... !

Rob

Mystical_Ice
02-19-09, 07:54 PM
good lord. 550+RWHP on that car. it must be AMAZING

LV_V
02-19-09, 08:01 PM
Details? Details? How does that airbox look from the outside? Same as OEM?

Don't want any warranty problems ... !

Rob

If you don't want to worry about any warranty problems STAY AWAY FROM A BLOWER PULLEY MOD. :thumbsup:

RapidRob
02-19-09, 10:04 PM
^^ Yeah I have to agree with you about that, especially because this motor was not designed/built for a higher boost than it already has. It may work great for awhile, but how long is, "awhile"???

Rob

CTSV_510
02-19-09, 10:38 PM
:drool:

Luna.
02-20-09, 01:27 AM
I already have the tune, do you have to retune the ECM for the pulley change? The ECM tune i bought from you seems to be working great. I'm sure the pulley change will be like wise. Your right about going any higher on the hp. Don't want to have parts start to break, and i don't want to hear about, if they're not breaking, your not going fast enough. I've already been though that route with another vehicle i once had. Cecil............:cool2:

Absolutely, you'll want a tune. The A/F ratios will go wild with a pulley change.

I'll do this mod IN A SECOND if I can be reasonably assured that reliability won't go to sh*t...

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 06:20 AM
Thanks for making my keyboard full of saliva...
Mine is covered in a white, milky substance too...

CadV
02-20-09, 08:28 AM
I don't think he is talking about a new airbox. I think he is saying you have to mod the stock one.

demorgan59
02-20-09, 09:13 AM
Ever increasing boost = 75 then 125 then 150 shot of nitrous = crack. It never ends well.

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 09:31 AM
Ever increasing boost = 75 then 125 then 150 shot of nitrous = crack. It never ends well.I can wait...and reap all the benefits...

musclesbmf
02-20-09, 10:00 AM
I don't think he is talking about a new airbox. I think he is saying you have to mod the stock one.

Personally I think he is talking about a whole newly designed cold air intake probably with a high cfm conical filter and a smooth 4 inch metal inlet. Even with the air box mod, when increasing boost, I just don't see how the stock piece can flow enough. I thought he said in a post that the stock box maxes at 500hp and tq.

Just give us more details already... I hate waiting and speculating. :bouncy:

LV_V
02-20-09, 12:00 PM
Mine is covered in a white, milky substance too...
So we DO have something in common :cloud9:

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 12:15 PM
So we DO have something in common :cloud9:
Hey now. No circle jerks... :grouphug:

ChasJr
02-20-09, 01:34 PM
^^ Yeah I have to agree with you about that, especially because this motor was not designed/built for a higher boost than it already has. It may work great for awhile, but how long is, "awhile"???

Rob

What do you base that statement on..The ZR1 has been making around 540 Rwhp stock and has been brought up to over six with mods so why would this be pushing the limit..Give me an answer based on facts please not opinions..:cool:

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 01:37 PM
What do you base that statement on..The ZR1 has been making around 540 Rwhp stock and has been brought up to over six with mods so why would this be pushing the limit..Give me an answer based on facts please not opinions..:cool:
They don't have the same motor. The ZR1 has forged internals as the V does not...

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 01:37 PM
Fact, not opinion. :cool2:

urbanski
02-20-09, 01:49 PM
will w4m charge $450 for a k&n and a steel tube?

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 01:56 PM
Tiff, splain.

Kevin@Lingenfelter
02-20-09, 03:18 PM
Here is the dyno sheet guys! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

http://www.lingenfelter.com/images/2009 CTS-V Dyno_1000.jpg

urbanski
02-20-09, 03:53 PM
that's w4m's car?

urbanski
02-20-09, 03:53 PM
Tiff, splain.

sup..

FreddyG
02-20-09, 04:13 PM
WOW! Nice work Jesse! :cheers:

The nice looking thing about that dyno graph is that the power band keeps the same power under the curve, there's just more of it!

That car has to be a BEAST and I can't wait to see the vids! :yup:

haterinc
02-20-09, 04:22 PM
so that says 557hp, was there another run that got up to 568? not that 557 isn't amazing, just eagerly curious... and this is just airbox and pulley mods?

i can only sit and wait for the headers, intake, exhaust, and intercooler stuff to catch up... i could see 600hp with a stretch

Kevin@Lingenfelter
02-20-09, 04:27 PM
so that says 557hp, was there another run that got up to 568? not that 557 isn't amazing, just eagerly curious... and this is just airbox and pulley mods?

i can only sit and wait for the headers, intake, exhaust, and intercooler stuff to catch up... i could see 600hp with a stretch

The best run was 568! This was the last run with a more conservative tune!

GM-4-LIFE
02-20-09, 04:48 PM
Count me in for both the pulley and the airbox.

I have access to a local dyno tuner that is pretty damn good on tuning the LSX motors.

Will you guys be including a new belt and a new bolt kit for the pulley?

SG

BacDoc
02-20-09, 05:02 PM
I'm so confused. Who did what with who now?

Razorecko
02-20-09, 05:13 PM
The best run was 568! This was the last run with a more conservative tune!

How much boost went up w/ the new 2.55 pulley ? And was this done w/ a manual cts-v ?????

RapidRob
02-20-09, 06:12 PM
What do you base that statement on..The ZR1 has been making around 540 Rwhp stock and has been brought up to over six with mods so why would this be pushing the limit..Give me an answer based on facts please not opinions..:cool:

Me thinks you have to get your facts straight, not me. :thepan: The v2 does not have the same motor as a ZR1. The ZR1 motor is more robust and built to run with higher stresses than the v2's LSA engine.

Rob

Razorecko
02-20-09, 06:48 PM
Yea its too bad they didnt leave the block the same internally and just put in the smaller blower on the LSA. This would have given us much more on the table to play with.

urbanski
02-20-09, 06:59 PM
I'm so confused. Who did what with who now?
:yeah:

homesite
02-20-09, 07:18 PM
Who did the mods, wait4me or Lingenfelter?

Ketzer
02-20-09, 07:38 PM
Who did the mods, wait4me or Lingenfelter?

It's possible someone could be hoe-ing out their talents to legitimate tuner shops for real money, instead of relying on a bunch of forum tire-kickers to pay what its worth. Just a guess.

thebigjimsho
02-20-09, 08:28 PM
Me thinks you have to get your facts straight, not me. :thepan: The v2 does not have the same motor as a ZR1. The ZR1 motor is more robust and built to run with higher stresses than the v2's LSA engine.

Rob
Don't worry, I already took care of Chuckie for you...

RapidRob
02-20-09, 09:53 PM
Yea its too bad they didnt leave the block the same internally and just put in the smaller blower on the LSA. This would have given us much more on the table to play with.

Good point! But I wonder what the v2 would cost with the basic ZR1 block, crank, rods, and pistons installed? The ZR1 vette costs approximately 2x the v2, but I have no idea how much of that is engine cost, and the ZR has, what, about 80+ hp more than the v2 ... :hmm:

Rob

RapidRob
02-20-09, 09:56 PM
Don't worry, I already took care of Chuckie for you...

Yeah - I just noticed that - thanks. Jeez, dude just popped up out of nowhere ... :bonkers:

Rob

62Jeff
02-20-09, 09:58 PM
Good point! But I wonder what the v2 would cost with the basic ZR1 block, crank, rods, and pistons installed? The ZR1 vette costs approximately 2x the v2, but I have no idea how much of that is engine cost, and the ZR has, what, about 80+ hp more than the v2 ... :hmm:

Rob

Not sure about the distribution of $$ in the ZR1, but the ZR1 crate motor is $21k, pricing was announced I think on Wednesday.

Wonder what a CTS-V crate motor goes for?

Edit: Looks like $14,500
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/LSA-62L-SC-556-HP-Crate-Engine-19211708-P2385C53.aspx

Razorecko
02-20-09, 09:58 PM
Good point! But I wonder what the v2 would cost with the basic ZR1 block, crank, rods, and pistons installed? The ZR1 vette costs approximately 2x the v2, but I have no idea how much of that is engine cost, and the ZR has, what, about 80+ hp more than the v2 ... :hmm:

Rob

The cost difference shouldnt be more than 4k. I'd pay that for a tough block

RapidRob
02-20-09, 10:33 PM
Not sure about the distribution of $$ in the ZR1, but the ZR1 crate motor is $21k, pricing was announced I think on Wednesday.

Wonder what a CTS-V crate motor goes for?

Edit: Looks like $14,500
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/LSA-62L-SC-556-HP-Crate-Engine-19211708-P2385C53.aspx

Hmmm - so that's $6500 diff. between ZR1 - (fully assembled including heads, etc.), and a v2 motor. Like Razor, if they offered an option in the v2 for a basic LS9 motor with the smaller blower, etc., for $4 - $6K, I might have gone for it. It sure would keep the v2 the top 4dr sedan longer, before the others catch up. In any event, 556 hp is all I need for the foreseeable future, and it's already a challenge getting that much power to hook-up from all that I've read. I may have w4m tune me up another E67, and keep my OEM E67 just for grins ... :thumbsup:

Rob

Luna.
02-21-09, 12:35 AM
Count me in for both the pulley and the airbox.

I have access to a local dyno tuner that is pretty damn good on tuning the LSX motors.

Will you guys be including a new belt and a new bolt kit for the pulley?

SG

What are your thoughts/concerns about reliability?

I'm with you in a heartbeat if reliability isn't too egregiously harmed...:bouncy:

FreddyG
02-21-09, 02:01 PM
It's possible someone could be hoe-ing out their talents to legitimate tuner shops for real money, instead of relying on a bunch of forum tire-kickers to pay what its worth. Just a guess.

Maybe Jesse doesn't have a dyno and uses LPE's. They're both in Indiana.

I can tell you that Lingenfelter can tune an FI car as well as anyone and it would surprise me if they hired Jesse because from what I know about LPE, they like to keep things in-house.

As far as Jesse, I think that he makes a Very Good living off of his tuning ability and is just Passionate about what he does! To me, he is one of the Premiere EfiLive Tuners around and doesn't charge an arm and a leg for his service! I applaud him for that because that's helping out us little Guys! :cheers:

I just wish that he'd post up the video's! :D

By the way, what size is the stock pulley on the blower and how much boost is it making?

CadV
02-21-09, 02:32 PM
Maybe Jesse doesn't have a dyno and uses LPE's. They're both in Indiana.

I can tell you that Lingenfelter can tune an FI car as well as anyone and it would surprise me if they hired Jesse because from what I know about LPE, they like to keep things in-house.

As far as Jesse, I think that he makes a Very Good living off of his tuning ability and is just Passionate about what he does! To me, he is one of the Premiere EfiLive Tuners around and doesn't charge an arm and a leg for his service! I applaud him for that because that's helping out us little Guys! :cheers:

I just wish that he'd post up the video's! :D

By the way, what size is the stock pulley on the blower and how much boost is it making?

:yeah:

Jesse is a helluvah tuner. I believe he helps EFILive.

Ketzer
02-21-09, 03:33 PM
I was completely kidding around. No offense meant to W4M or to any forum members... but, I have seen some posters who are suspect kickers:suspect:.

undertaker
02-21-09, 04:58 PM
Maybe Jesse doesn't have a dyno and uses LPE's. They're both in Indiana.

I can tell you that Lingenfelter can tune an FI car as well as anyone and it would surprise me if they hired Jesse because from what I know about LPE, they like to keep things in-house.

As far as Jesse, I think that he makes a Very Good living off of his tuning ability and is just Passionate about what he does! To me, he is one of the Premiere EfiLive Tuners around and doesn't charge an arm and a leg for his service! I applaud him for that because that's helping out us little Guys! :cheers:

I just wish that he'd post up the video's! :D

By the way, what size is the stock pulley on the blower and how much boost is it making?

I'd think thats a safe assumption. I'm pretty sure Jesse doesn't have a dyno of his own, and as such has to work around local shop's schedules when using a dyno for numerical proof for us all.

and on the topic of the motor not being able to handle more boost than factory....think of it this way, the motor was built/designed for boost. All of the manufacturers overbuild their motors to one degree or another for longetivity....even the motors meant as NA can take a healthy amount of boost (I've seen numerous stock bottom end LS1,2,3,6, and 7 motors do 600-700 rwhp, seems the LS2's and LS3's are the best of the bunch out of the box...) The issue is how the car is driven and the tune is obviously VERY critical at that point. Most people at that level realize they're on borrowed time,and are waiting for the motor to pop at any given moment, but sometimes they last sometimes they don't when pushed that hard. Given the fact this motor was built for boost....I think there is a very big area for improvement already factored in. Heck I think where Jesse has this car now is probably close to maxing out the blower more than the bottom end. Also the simple fact is detonation will take out a built bottom end just as quickly as a cast one. (just heard a great story of a guy with a heads/cam Trailblazer SS who lent it to his girlfriend for a few days, took it out with the guys, had a few got a little silly with the radio cranked.....gets in it the next morning and snap crackle pop.....she filled it with 87 and he let it rip the night before and didn't hear the destruction...)

Luna.
02-21-09, 05:11 PM
By the way, what size is the stock pulley on the blower and how much boost is it making?

:yeah:

GMX322V S/C
02-21-09, 06:35 PM
...(just heard a great story of a guy with a heads/cam Trailblazer SS who lent it to his girlfriend for a few days, took it out with the guys, had a few got a little silly with the radio cranked.....gets in it the next morning and snap crackle pop.....she filled it with 87 and he let it rip the night before and didn't hear the destruction...)Ugh! Bittersweet that she had filled it up, but...whoopsie. So I take it the LS2 doesn't have a low octane profile in the ECU? Or is there only so much it can do?

RapidRob
02-21-09, 06:40 PM
I'd think thats a safe assumption. I'm pretty sure Jesse doesn't have a dyno of his own, and as such has to work around local shop's schedules when using a dyno for numerical proof for us all.

and on the topic of the motor not being able to handle more boost than factory....think of it this way, the motor was built/designed for boost. All of the manufacturers overbuild their motors to one degree or another for longetivity....even the motors meant as NA can take a healthy amount of boost (I've seen numerous stock bottom end LS1,2,3,6, and 7 motors do 600-700 rwhp, seems the LS2's and LS3's are the best of the bunch out of the box...) The issue is how the car is driven and the tune is obviously VERY critical at that point. Most people at that level realize they're on borrowed time,and are waiting for the motor to pop at any given moment, but sometimes they last sometimes they don't when pushed that hard. Given the fact this motor was built for boost....I think there is a very big area for improvement already factored in. Heck I think where Jesse has this car now is probably close to maxing out the blower more than the bottom end. Also the simple fact is detonation will take out a built bottom end just as quickly as a cast one. (just heard a great story of a guy with a heads/cam Trailblazer SS who lent it to his girlfriend for a few days, took it out with the guys, had a few got a little silly with the radio cranked.....gets in it the next morning and snap crackle pop.....she filled it with 87 and he let it rip the night before and didn't hear the destruction...)

While I think you are probably correct that there is SOME room for tuning the LSA without too much chance of destructing the motor, the question remains, how much more stress can the engine tolerate, and how much longevity is lost by tuning it? If you compare the differences in how the LSA is built versus the LS9, those differences buy about 80 more hp in the LS9. So, I bet that if you tune, say 50 or 60 more hp into an LSA, you would be definitely be stressing it near it's limits, IMO. If it's tuned for, maybe 20-30 more hp, I'm guessing the engine could probably tolerate that OK. My .02 cents ... ;)

Rob

undertaker
02-21-09, 07:30 PM
While I think you are probably correct that there is SOME room for tuning the LSA without too much chance of destructing the motor, the question remains, how much more stress can the engine tolerate, and how much longevity is lost by tuning it? If you compare the differences in how the LSA is built versus the LS9, those differences buy about 80 more hp in the LS9. So, I bet that if you tune, say 50 or 60 more hp into an LSA, you would be definitely be stressing it near it's limits, IMO. If it's tuned for, maybe 20-30 more hp, I'm guessing the engine could probably tolerate that OK. My .02 cents ... ;)

Rob

well think of it this way........my 07 2500 6.0 (some VVT junk no flex fuel or DOD) suburban dyno'd 280's or so at the wheels stock.......when my buddies and jesse got done with it, it laid down 537/515 with about 10 pounds of boost, everything else on the truck was factory original (minus a boost a pump to get more fuel up, a 2 bar map sensor and injectors) thats been on the truck for 20K miles 8 of those towing a 24 ft enclosed trailer with either of my vettes in it. and not a problem....I don't even have methanol. there's a defininite comfort zone in adding boost or more boost to our vehicles.....I think the bottom end in the LSA's would happily handle 650 at the wheels from what I've seen with boosted applications of previous GM motors over teh past 10 years.

I definetely wouldn't have any longetivity issues at this point in the horsepower continum where this vehicle is now.....when my sub is paid off (july 2010) I'm planning on grabbing a V and its inevitable that it won't remain stock.....I can't leave anything alone, of course I'm thinking mild and full exhaust and what jesse's done here is what I'm thinking of off the bat....

I kinda have this problem.....with nothing really seeming fast enough to me anymore....even if it comes with 550 something horsepower from the dealer....almost everything I own is 500+ horsepower up to 900 horsepower (besides the crotch rocket and the ride on mower)

CadV
02-21-09, 09:55 PM
While I think you are probably correct that there is SOME room for tuning the LSA without too much chance of destructing the motor, the question remains, how much more stress can the engine tolerate, and how much longevity is lost by tuning it? If you compare the differences in how the LSA is built versus the LS9, those differences buy about 80 more hp in the LS9. So, I bet that if you tune, say 50 or 60 more hp into an LSA, you would be definitely be stressing it near it's limits, IMO. If it's tuned for, maybe 20-30 more hp, I'm guessing the engine could probably tolerate that OK. My .02 cents ... ;)

Rob

That is a low estimate IMO. Conservative would be 100hp. I bet it can take 150 and be reliable. 200 would prolly break it over time.

CadV
02-21-09, 09:56 PM
Personally I think he is talking about a whole newly designed cold air intake probably with a high cfm conical filter and a smooth 4 inch metal inlet. Even with the air box mod, when increasing boost, I just don't see how the stock piece can flow enough. I thought he said in a post that the stock box maxes at 500hp and tq.

Just give us more details already... I hate waiting and speculating. :bouncy:

Naw he is talking about customizing the stock airbox.

RapidRob
02-21-09, 10:14 PM
That is a low estimate IMO. Conservative would be 100hp. I bet it can take 150 and be reliable. 200 would prolly break it over time.

Well CadV, you and Undertaker et al, probably have me at a bit of a disadvantage here, being that my experience with GM motors is limited. But if you're correct and these motors are way over-built, that's a very good thing! I do plan on giving w4m a call once he gets some of his various kits ironed out ..

Rob

qictrk
02-21-09, 10:50 PM
I hope W4ME or some vendor is coming up with a air box replacement. I will purchase the pulleys, but not at the expense of the stock air box. It may be necessary down the road to put everything back to stock. Cecil.........

musclesbmf
02-22-09, 01:04 AM
THere i no way he is referring to the stock air box mod. Flat panels don't flow enough cfm to support that power and if you go squeeze the air intake tube you will see how soft it is and if the blower is trying to suck in more air than is being supplied, it will collapse. I believe W4M referred to that some where....
Just MHO though... time will tell.

CadV
02-22-09, 10:14 AM
THere i no way he is referring to the stock air box mod. Flat panels don't flow enough cfm to support that power and if you go squeeze the air intake tube you will see how soft it is and if the blower is trying to suck in more air than is being supplied, it will collapse. I believe W4M referred to that some where....
Just MHO though... time will tell.

Based off of Jesse's previous posts. When he commented on "It will suck the inlet shut on accelleration" I think he was referring to this:

http://i42.tinypic.com/5dqgd2.jpg

In one of his first posts on this board he tested a open filter solution and said there was no difference to a modded stock airbox. If breathing is the issue an open filter solution is the way to go. In which case I don't think he would be mentioning custom airbox.

Here is a pic of a custom airbox and I think that will handle any HP you can throw at it.

http://i40.tinypic.com/11kcpcg.jpg

BacDoc
02-22-09, 10:21 AM
I'm still confused. :sad:

CIWS
02-22-09, 10:53 AM
Yeah hopefully this week we'll get the details of the particular build - components, boost pressure, etc and get to see the video :)

TrevorD
02-22-09, 10:57 AM
I'm very interested on the boost level, too, with the smaller pulley. It's great that the engine comes with 9.1:1 static CR, but you have to remember that it's still a cast piston. It won't take the abuse like a forged piston would, but most of the forged piston sets built use a 2618 forging. These will take a ton of abuse, but they are not meant to last the 100,000+ miles. Also consider that GM built in factory oil squirters in the block to help further cool and lubricate the cylinder walls. The crank and rods are both forged in the LSA, but I'm sure the cast pistons were meant to limit the power output potential. I guess when you are willing to pay $100,000+ for a ZR1 you have "earned" the right to factory forged pistons. :) I was personally glad to see it. Besides, if I spent the money on a ZR1, I wouldn't want to know that I share the exact same engine with a Caddy that costs half the price! There are a handful of guys making 700+ RWHP with their modded ZR1's! The LSA's blower is smaller than the LS9's at 1.9L vs. 2.3L, respectively. The LS9 will have the potential for added boost, but maxing out the ability of the LSA's blower really won't be a factor unless you're planning on building an engine. If I was personally going to go through the time and cost of building an engine, I'd also spend the extra cash to install a Kenny Bell. Build an engine and start making 15+ psi of boost, and then you'll really have a BEAST.

Kudos on 550+ RWHP. That's more than enough power IMO for a true street car that's seeing daily driving duty. Besides, it's easy to ruin a car when you keep pushing and keep pushing. You hit a certain power number that kills the streetability and fun. I don't think I want a loud Aeromotive fuel pump humming in the back of my Caddy. ;)

Trevor

BacDoc
02-22-09, 11:33 AM
Yeah hopefully this week we'll get the details of the particular build - components, boost pressure, etc and get to see the video :)

I just want to know who's tune/car this was!

CadV
02-22-09, 12:58 PM
I just want to know who's tune/car this was!

It's wait4me's. I know Jesse has put Lingenfelter motors etc in his cars. I think they work together a lot.

GMX322V S/C
02-22-09, 01:57 PM
...but I'm sure the cast pistons were meant to limit the power output potential...To reduce NVH (noise, vibration, and harshness) as well as cost, actually. Same with the exhaust manifolds.

musclesbmf
02-22-09, 11:13 PM
Hey CadV, not trying to argue with you, but....
The piece n the picture that you displayed is very hard ABS plastic or whatever. That will not get sucked closed. The air tube can though. It is very soft and pliable.

You have to remember, when W4M did all those initial tests, he did each part individually. So with a stock pulley pushing 9lbs of boost, an open air element added no noticable gains. But with his pulley he is prob around 14 or 15lbs of boost, and the flat panel and stock tubing wont support that power. W4M said in one of his posts that the stock intake was good for only 500 RWHP... He has well surpassed that and the need for more air has occured. Again, time will tell.

Mark

CadV
02-22-09, 11:52 PM
Hey CadV, not trying to argue with you, but....
The piece n the picture that you displayed is very hard ABS plastic or whatever. That will not get sucked closed. The air tube can though. It is very soft and pliable.

You have to remember, when W4M did all those initial tests, he did each part individually. So with a stock pulley pushing 9lbs of boost, an open air element added no noticable gains. But with his pulley he is prob around 14 or 15lbs of boost, and the flat panel and stock tubing wont support that power. W4M said in one of his posts that the stock intake was good for only 500 RWHP... He has well surpassed that and the need for more air has occured. Again, time will tell.

Mark

Healthy discussion no biggy. I understand the point you are trying to make but the V2 air tube is pretty hard because of quite a few baffles. Do you have a V2 and taken the intake apart? Here is a thread I did on the custom airbox mod:

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-cts-v-series-forum-2009/158582-wait4me-airbox-mod-installation.html

Here is a pic of the air tube:

http://i39.tinypic.com/25kju5w.jpg

Trust me that thing will not close shut.

musclesbmf
02-22-09, 11:56 PM
Yes, I have a V... Just posted pics of it. I did the airbox mod too. The piece in our hand is very pliable. You'd be surprised how it could get sucked closed. Regardless, I wish we could get more info on this "package" because whatever it is, I love the 568 to the wheels :drool:

Mark

Ketzer
02-23-09, 08:37 AM
So what are all the extra horns and loop for? Seems like this contraption is the opposite of smooth airflow?

wait4me
02-23-09, 09:29 AM
Hi guys, just got back from the grand prix raceway. The V did awsome! I can see why it is as high as it is stance wise. You use ALL of the shock travel when you are REALLY in it. I say, the 09 v has been improved 700% from the previous model. The v1 was top heavy and bottomed out alot on harsh arcs, and just never felt i was in control. With the 09, it was just where i wanted it to be. And as far as power, it had enough to do the job.. I have 1000s of high def pictures and video of the whole weekend im putting up today.


================================================== ======================

Now for your questions. Im a hard guy to understand i guess.. I work behind the scenes for ALOT of companies. I just help them out to make thier lives easier.. Same with programming or even product ideas. I have trained about 73 shops all over the usa and mexico, well and canada, in person to get them familure with our efilive tuning software. Im also the main phone support guy in the usa for it. So when shops have problems, they call me for answers... My background is alot more than people think or know.. I just like to keep it simple like that...
Yes i know i am cheap, but i like my job, and since i like my job, i dont charge alot to do my thing. People that want to spend big money for the same thing or less is fine by me. I loose no sleep over it. ... What other companies do with my stuff is thier own thing. I dont care as long as they do it right and continue making my job fun. There are several, well 50+ shops in the us and other countries that just resell my tuned ecms. Most for 500-600 bucks. Those customers that have them think they are the greatest things. But if they would have bought them for my price of 160, they mentally would think different. . YEah i only made 160 from it, but i do soooo much volume, "On average, i ship 300 ecms a week", that is just dont matter that i sell them for so cheap.


As for the car used in the dyno, All cars i do testing for on forums are my own. I own the previledge to post and share my results. When i work on a customers car, i DONT post that info just because it is the customers fun if he wants to do it. It adds to the total excitment and getting to talk about your new tow.


As for everyone saying these motors wont handle extra power you are full of CRAP. There i said it..

So far, i have maxed out the fuel system with a wet kit of nitrous, Added 200hp and stupid amount of torque. 4 bottles worth. Not single hickup. besides new tires needed already.

Then pulled it off, and added a pulley which was a 2.5. Stock was a 3 inch. This added 3-4 lbs of boost from stock. So in this thread, it was 12-13lbs of boost.

As for durability testing of this, I can Say 10000% that i am durability testing beyond anyone else. If i didnt blow up my car engine on the dyno or on the grand prix track at nonstop rpm ranges of holding 5000-6800 rpms for the whole day, Continuous with 1000s of wot action, with speeds of 65 to 170..... Not one kr, not one lean condition, just went out, the car did its job, very well i have to say, and no issues.

I Highely doubt any of you guys that are on the street will ever ever be able to beat on your car like you would on a grandprix track.. It shows all your flaws REALLY quick.

SO, my facts, should prove to you guys that this motor can handle a few mods.. I STILL have not been able to kill my motor as planned. That should say something.....


As for the airbox peice that sucks shut, it is the elbow that he has in his hands that goes from the airbox to the throttlebody. IT sucks shut when you floor it with the 2.5 pulley.

The bottom of the airbox is also a restriction and needs to be modified.. It just cant give the engine the air it needs..

Also with all my mods, ANY TIME I POST THEM. I put the car 100% back to stock. That gives you a fair product comparison..

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 10:34 AM
Awesome info! I love the way you beat on your car and try to make it break. That is really testing the product. All good for us "little" guys.

So..... let's get some more package info (pricing, options, availability, etc).
Still very interested in the exhaust system you fabricated. What size tubing? Did you remove 2 of the 4 cats? Did you use any high flow cats?

Thanks,
Mark

wait4me
02-23-09, 11:45 AM
On the exhaust i had done, but pulled back off was, i just took 2 7/8 mandrel bent tubes and stainless pipe and ran it from the cats to the stock mufflers to get rid of the kinks. Then had to cutouts put right near the front. Cats where still intact always.

Razorecko
02-23-09, 11:59 AM
On the exhaust i had done, but pulled back off was, i just took 2 7/8 mandrel bent tubes and stainless pipe and ran it from the cats to the stock mufflers to get rid of the kinks. Then had to cutouts put right near the front. Cats where still intact always.

awesome work :thumbsup: - what are your thoughts on lowering springs now ? After using the suspension so aggresively i'm presuming that anything lower than stock would take away from heavy manuevering.

chris1268
02-23-09, 12:06 PM
I had a stock dyno done and was at 413 RWHP. Does this seem low to everyone?

Razorecko
02-23-09, 12:07 PM
Also I forgot to ask - is this on an auto V or a manual V ?

wait4me
02-23-09, 12:10 PM
Well, for the street fine, but if you are going to race probably not a good idea on the springs. The car is near perfect setup now. When you change spring rates or height, it will definatly kill performance of the car. I nearly bottomed out the shocks and came pretty close to rubbing the front tire on the sharper turns. With a spring that has 2 inches less, it would have hit for sure.

FreddyG
02-23-09, 12:51 PM
Great job Jesse! You are Officially My Hero! :2thumbs:

I didn't realize that you did so much volume as far as tuning stuff goes!

Thanks again for looking out for us "Little Guys" :cheers:

CTSV_510
02-23-09, 12:55 PM
Besides, it's easy to ruin a car when you keep pushing and keep pushing.




I STILL have not been able to kill my motor as planned.

:histeric:

Ketzer
02-23-09, 12:59 PM
I had a stock dyno done and was at 413 RWHP. Does this seem low to everyone?

The dyno is prolly more suspect than the car. Two dynos in the same room will give different readings according to the experts here.

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 12:59 PM
On the exhaust i had done, but pulled back off was, i just took 2 7/8 mandrel bent tubes and stainless pipe and ran it from the cats to the stock mufflers to get rid of the kinks. Then had to cutouts put right near the front. Cats where still intact always.

Ok, I would like to buy these pipes today. Can you bend me some (or pull them off the shelf or whatever) and tell me where and how much credit card $$ I need to send. That is no joke.

Thanks,
Mark

Ketzer
02-23-09, 01:07 PM
Ok, I would like to buy these pipes today. Can you bend me some (or pull them off the shelf or whatever) and tell me where and how much credit card $$ I need to send. That is no joke.

Thanks,
Mark

I know Mark, I was looking at that mess this morning under mine. What W4M replaced is really the only place the exhaust looks bad, and it really seems choked down in that spot.


I'd like to hear a little more detail on the pulley swap. I thought early speculation was that it was a dangerous deal. There's a tamper cap and the physical removal was a fragile situation. Has it turned out to be a simple unbolt and bolt?

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 01:19 PM
I know Mark, I was looking at that mess this morning under mine. What W4M replaced is really the only place the exhaust looks bad, and it really seems choked down in that spot.


I'd like to hear a little more detail on the pulley swap. I thought early speculation was that it was a dangerous deal. There's a tamper cap and the physical removal was a fragile situation. Has it turned out to be a simple unbolt and bolt?

Yeah, that is a weird situation under the car with the exhaust pipes. Especially towards the back where they pinched it down to put a little 1" crossover bar in place. That bar is getting removed....

As for the pulley, I'm interested as well. I remember he mentioned he will have entire snouts too, so that would be a much easier and safer swap. How about some bigger idler pullies for more belt wrap??? Also, let's get some blower porting in the works... Wat's everyone waiting on? LOL ;)

wait4me
02-23-09, 01:21 PM
The Pulley swap is pretty complicated to get the pully pressed off, and then a new one pressed on and then keyed. YOU HAVE to key the pulley or it WILL come off at high rpms. After 3 dyno pulls mine was half way off. Then we had to pull it all back off and pin the pulley..

It isnt something you can do in your house. I would say a blower snout will have to be loaned to people when they swap from the stock one to the modded one. I havent found cores yet to provide this type of service yet. I may have to just buy a few 14,500 dollar engines to have 2 loaner snouts. To ship to people as they swap from one to the other then they ship me thier stock one back.

As for the actual swap, it is pretty easy, you pull off the top blower cover, undo the intake bolts, then pull off the throttlebody, and then undo a few more bolts and then the snout comes off. Then just put on our modded one, and put the plastic damper in place and slide it back on with a little of rtv sealer onto the flat metal surface.. It is PROBABLY a 20 minute job.

I would however probably suggest the CRANK pulley mod instead as it would be easier to go back to stock.

homesite
02-23-09, 01:35 PM
What kind of power will the crank pulley mod make?

wait4me
02-23-09, 01:41 PM
More power than the 2.5 for sure. And well both combined will be crazy. :D

homesite
02-23-09, 01:49 PM
When do you think you will have some packages for us? Is the crank pulley tough to change?

wait4me
02-23-09, 02:11 PM
Crank pulley swap is simple, you just pull out the fans from the top, and then undo the bolt and pull off the balancer, then put the other one on, slip on the new belt and idler and you are good.

CadV
02-23-09, 02:44 PM
So what are all the extra horns and loop for? Seems like this contraption is the opposite of smooth airflow?

Sound dampening. Jesse tested replacing it with a smooth one and I don't think it helped much.

CadV
02-23-09, 02:46 PM
Crank pulley swap is simple, you just pull out the fans from the top, and then undo the bolt and pull off the balancer, then put the other one on, slip on the new belt and idler and you are good.

I am going with the crank because I have messed with a pulley press before and it is a pain in the ass. I need a way to go back to stock as well.

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 02:51 PM
Also, can you briefly explain what you did with your airbox besides the air box mod of cutting off the bottom of box? Did you just replace the flexy "elbow" piece or more. I know the maf is built into the airbox lid, so just curious about everything you did.

Thanks,
Mark

CadV
02-23-09, 02:57 PM
Also, can you briefly explain what you did with your airbox? Did you just replace the flexy "elbow" piece or more. I know the maf is built into the airbox lid, so just curious about everything you did.

Thanks,
Mark

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-cts-v-series-forum-2009/158582-wait4me-airbox-mod-installation.html

Luna.
02-23-09, 03:00 PM
Are the modified crankshaft pullies currently available?

I did the crankshaft pulley swap on my '05 maggie V and loved it, as BELT SLIP was a problem for me when I went to the smaller pulley (2.6" from 2.8"). This was a question I was going to ask, but if the crankshaft is easier than hell, that's an option... My only beef with the larger crankshaft pulley on my '05 was the fact that I had to go to an 8-ribbed belt, which caused other issues/challenges.

A crankshaft pulley change seems pretty easy. Swap on the new pulley, make an intake modification, tune it, and you're good to go. I LIKE that, especially if the motor will handle it.

Perhaps I missed it, but do you believe the pistons will go kaput before, say, 100,000 miles or should they easily be able to handle it? I'm thinking crankshaft mod only, NOT both for crazy power. :sneaky:

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 03:03 PM
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-cts-v-series-forum-2009/158582-wait4me-airbox-mod-installation.html

LOL... I meant besides the air box mod. He posted today that the rubber elbow in your picture gets sucked closed with 12 - 13 lbs of boost. I want to know what it was replaced with....

Thanks though.

CadV
02-23-09, 03:32 PM
LOL... I meant besides the air box mod. He posted today that the rubber elbow in your picture gets sucked closed with 12 - 13 lbs of boost. I want to know what it was replaced with....

Thanks though.

I just spoke to him and you were right. He had to replace the air tube. New air tube and the airbox mod does the trick.

wait4me
02-23-09, 03:33 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHzfCKRkUyA


there are a few more im adding in today random that will be in the wait4meperformance folder on youtube

wait4me
02-23-09, 03:35 PM
High def vid if you click on HD will show you in better detail all the vids. http://www.youtube.com/user/wait4meperformance

CadV
02-23-09, 03:40 PM
I bet the whine gets loud with the new air tube.

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 03:53 PM
I just spoke to him and you were right. He had to replace the air tube. New air tube and the airbox mod does the trick.

Wasn't trying to be right or wrong, just want to be certain about what is needed to support all this power my car will be making soon... :nyanya: Just kidding :thumbsup:

musclesbmf
02-23-09, 03:59 PM
Ok... I want that new intake tube... Looks really nice under there. I'm making my list W4M... we all need prices and time frames ;)

BacDoc
02-23-09, 04:15 PM
I want to have your babies.


Did I type that out loud?

qictrk
02-23-09, 04:37 PM
I don't like cutting up the stock air box. Am i right to assume an extra stock air box can be bought through the dealer or will you be offering a replacement? Cecil...........

Luna.
02-23-09, 06:05 PM
Does anyone know if modded crankshaft balancers are available???

GMX322V S/C
02-23-09, 11:08 PM
So what are all the extra horns and loop for? Seems like this contraption is the opposite of smooth airflow?They're side branch resonators for keeping intake noise down; on NA engines, especially smaller displacement ones, you might also see relatively large resonant chambers to help tune the intake tract for more low-end to midrange power.

CadV
03-12-09, 04:53 PM
Wasn't trying to be right or wrong, just want to be certain about what is needed to support all this power my car will be making soon... :nyanya: Just kidding :thumbsup:

Right on the air tube and wrong on the stock airbox.