: Automatic or Manual Transmission???



TaVern
02-10-09, 02:46 AM
On the '09 CTS-V:

Who's going for the automatic transmission, and why?

Who's going for the manual transmission, and why?

Discuss.

TaVern
02-10-09, 02:50 AM
I vote for swade.

pmsteinm
02-10-09, 10:05 AM
Manual: My wife's 335i is a manual, so there's no way I can have an automatic.

OldDrummer55
02-10-09, 10:33 AM
My wife asked for an automatic... in the spirit of Detente, I agreed.... :worship:

JFJr
02-10-09, 02:37 PM
On the '09 CTS-V:

Who's going for the automatic transmission, and why?

Who's going for the manual transmission, and why?

Discuss.

This is an excerpt from a private message that I sent in reply to a request for a critique of the manual transmission. I hope that it helps you.

To me the TR-6060 is a big improvement over the 2005 "V" transmission. The shifts from the 6060 are shorter, more precise, smoother and just "feel better." Also, the engagement of reverse is magical. I haven't experienced any occasional difficulties in engaging 1st (always at a stoplight) that happened in the 2005, but I only have 2,200 miles on my 2009, so I need more seat time. My experience tells me that the 6060 will only get more smooth and effortless as time goes by. The only negative comment I have on the 6060 is that it's not as smooth when cold, but that passes quickly and may disappear entirely in time. The combination of the 6060 and the Recaro seats makes me want to drive all the time.

thebigjimsho
02-10-09, 06:27 PM
This will be the first car that I will ponder on both types. So in the meantime, I choose swade!

RapidRob
02-10-09, 07:04 PM
Well - I'm getting the swade AND the manual. I haven't driven either yet so I can't really say much other than I feel the manual is appropriate for me in this type of performance vehicle. But both are excellent options from everything I've read. Tough decision ...

Rob

vperl
02-10-09, 08:52 PM
Got the Automatic.....

Think it has to do with a couple of cars I had many moons ago, one a 65' Barracuda with hurst shifter 273ci.
LOved the car but was tempted to show off way to much.... got thru most of college without being hauled away.
The a couple of big trucks Class B.. driving 600 miles a day up and down the mountains got real tiresome at 3am.....


Guess it just points out either how lazy I am, or that the Auto shifters are very good...... well maybe both in my case

thebigjimsho
02-10-09, 11:16 PM
If Caddy could get the 370Z shift feature in the V, I would be manual in a heartbeat.

tedcmiller
02-10-09, 11:25 PM
Automatic. After five years of shifting (2004 and 2005) I was sick of it. It is a huge pain in stop-and-go traffic and acceleration is actually better with the automatic. You lose some top end, but who cares. For those who don't know anything different, manual is fine. For those of us who switched from manual ('66 GTO) to automatic, there is little to recommend manual.

thebigjimsho
02-10-09, 11:27 PM
I never have a problem with a manual in traffic. You gotta move your right foot. What's the big deal about moving your left, too?

vperl
02-10-09, 11:44 PM
I never have a problem with a manual in traffic. You gotta move your right foot. What's the big deal about moving your left, too?
*****************************************

In my case it has something to do with walking, talking, chewing gum, and most anything else...... plus being lazy:D:D:D:D:D

thebigjimsho
02-11-09, 01:27 AM
atrophy...

vperl
02-11-09, 01:40 AM
atrophy...

*******************

hate it when I have to google a word......

bet you tourture small animals:cool:

V-Love
02-11-09, 02:36 AM
No Lift Shifts = Winner!
I think that will cover me either way.

thebigjimsho
02-11-09, 03:18 AM
big brains don't need small animals

vperl
02-11-09, 03:32 AM
If your wife was polled, she would point out who was the thinker and
everything good. :worship: be careful what you say, I will remind her at our dinner at Ruth Chris your having in my honor.

thebigjimsho
02-11-09, 07:26 PM
shall be an excellent dinner...

vperl
02-11-09, 08:10 PM
drummerBoy old guy on last legs

I know the day will be here soon, but......... not soonenough
V....


V - day

TaVern
02-12-09, 02:10 AM
big brains don't need small animals

i didn't understand any of that.

TaVern
02-12-09, 02:11 AM
If your wife was polled, she would point out who was the thinker and
everything good. :worship: be careful what you say, I will remind her at our dinner at Ruth Chris your having in my honor.

who the hell are you?!?

you gotta pay to play around my threads.

http://www.cadillacforums.com/subscribe.html

TaVern
02-12-09, 02:12 AM
drummerBoy old guy on last legs

I know the day will be here soon, but......... not soonenough
V....


V - day

yeah.

TaVern
02-12-09, 02:57 AM
As of this post, the vote is a manual transmission by 23%.

Does this make the manual transmission faster and better than the automatic transmission?

vperl
02-12-09, 03:30 AM
As of this post, the vote is a manual transmission by 23%.

Does this make the manual transmission faster and better than the automatic transmission?
***********************************

will never know, I getting the auto, and am happy


V - day soon

TaVern
02-12-09, 03:46 AM
***********************************

will never know, I getting the auto, and am happy


V - day soon

So you've committed to V-Day with your automatic '09 V?

TaVern
02-12-09, 03:51 AM
follow the stars, ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** *********************************

http://www.cadillacforums.com/subscribe.html

vperl
02-12-09, 04:03 AM
Why the hostile words. Please explain. I will attempt to improve.

TaVern
02-12-09, 04:04 AM
It was CadillacOwners.com that got you the V-day invite in the first place.

TaVern
02-12-09, 04:08 AM
Why the hostile words. Please explain. I will attempt to improve.

haha

TaVern
02-12-09, 04:12 AM
here's your chance at improving...

http://www.cadillacforums.com/subscribe.html

vperl
02-12-09, 04:26 AM
I have not a clue , you are too crypt.

urbanski
02-12-09, 06:32 AM
you should support the forum like most of us V owners do

V-Beach
02-12-09, 09:23 AM
The unofficial poll above shows that the manual is the tranny of choice, but when I search the cadillac inventory site for dealers in Sourth Florida I can find dozens of automatics and not 1 single manual. Why would GM pump out all of the auto's when it seems like there is a demand for the manual that they are not meeting? Is it a manufacturing issue that will be reversed shortly?

Cadillac Tony
02-12-09, 09:31 AM
GM is building these cars based on projections of long term demand, meaning that they're not going to throw the product mix out of balance to go after the hardcore (Recaro and Manual) crowd. It's the same reason there won't be any SS Camaros available for a while- the hardcore crowd will snap all of them up, but GM will be building less than half of Camaros in the top trim to avoid a glut when the demand dies down.

Interesting trivia: Back before the financial crisis, GM actually went to Recaro and offered them a Million dollars cash to add a third shift that would do nothing but build Recaros for the CTS-V- Recaro declined due to the fact that cost would have exceeded GM's offer.

Long term, the demand for the Recaros and manual transmission will probably be somewhere in the 20% of cars built range. It costs a small fortune to adjust the mix based on knee jerk reactions to demand, so that's what GM is going to stick with building.

I've sold 10 Automatics and 0 manuals (8 with standard seats and 2 with Recaros) so far, so their mix seems to be pretty accurate.

vperl
02-12-09, 09:41 AM
you should support the forum like most of us V owners do

************************************************** **
sounds good, do you remember anything several months ago ?

I will have to see what fairness you extend

I see no reason to be here if one gets the bums rush, but when things settle down I will revisit that gracious offer

urbanski
02-12-09, 11:24 AM
tiffany forgets nothing

V-Beach
02-12-09, 12:56 PM
GM is building these cars based on projections of long term demand, meaning that they're not going to throw the product mix out of balance to go after the hardcore (Recaro and Manual) crowd. It's the same reason there won't be any SS Camaros available for a while- the hardcore crowd will snap all of them up, but GM will be building less than half of Camaros in the top trim to avoid a glut when the demand dies down.

Interesting trivia: Back before the financial crisis, GM actually went to Recaro and offered them a Million dollars cash to add a third shift that would do nothing but build Recaros for the CTS-V- Recaro declined due to the fact that cost would have exceeded GM's offer.

Long term, the demand for the Recaros and manual transmission will probably be somewhere in the 20% of cars built range. It costs a small fortune to adjust the mix based on knee jerk reactions to demand, so that's what GM is going to stick with building.

I've sold 10 Automatics and 0 manuals (8 with standard seats and 2 with Recaros) so far, so their mix seems to be pretty accurate.

In no way what-so-ever is this a flame to you Tony, but with the current state that GM is in, I have little faith in their projections and/or ability to make sound decisions. If the hard core early adapters want something, maybe GM should rethink things and give them what they want. That puts units on the road where the "hey, what is that" crowd gets exposed to the car and than wanders into your dealership look for their own. I would ask if you have people contacting your dealership looking for cars that have manual trannys? Of the 10 autos you sold, how many were ordered cars? How many manuals has your dealership been shipped and what happened to them?
You are an asset to this site and I encourage you to keep doing what your doing!

onebadcad
02-12-09, 03:03 PM
I've sold 10 Automatics and 0 manuals (8 with standard seats and 2 with Recaros) so far, so their mix seems to be pretty accurate.

Were they all bluehairs??? I will be calling you later this year, looking for a used V, with many new car incentives of course along with )% for 72 months and some smokin' rebates, looking for the original owner to take at least a 30% hit, better have Recaros, and a manual, as if you ain't shifting, you ain't driving.
BTW, I will drive to you, but you will have to buy drinks.

Darren, AKA 'MRNICE', not to be confused with that other gangbanga.

TaVern
02-12-09, 03:35 PM
A lot of the photos of new '09's I see posted here seem to be mostly autos. It would be interesting to know what the official auto vs manual production #'s are.

jvp
02-12-09, 04:57 PM
A lot of the photos of new '09's I see posted here seem to be mostly autos. It would be interesting to know what the official auto vs manual production #'s are.

My understanding is that they planned for an 80/20 split, auto/manuals. They heard the bitching from existing (and potentially new) Cadillac customers after the first V: "We want an auto!" It appears that in their effort to make a car for the "hip" crowd, they forgot about the "hip replacement' crowd with the V1. So they fixed that for the V2.

And so far, the numbers seem to be bearing that out. Both Scott and Tony have said that the majority (if not all) of the Vs they've sold have been autos. Kinda said, in my opinion, but if it sells cars, that's a good thing for GM.

jas

poor-sha
02-12-09, 08:12 PM
I ordered a Manuell with a swade nob





Pedro offers his protection

thebigjimsho
02-13-09, 01:49 AM
This sounds exactly the same as when they went to an automatic version of the SHO in '93. The first gen and first year of the 2nd gen were manual only. Many of us purists didn't care for the influx of auto owners, but there is NO denying the auto will far outsell the manual.

Ultimately, when designing the 3rd gen SHO for '96, they went with auto only. Hopefully, Cadillac never decides to let bean counters kill off a manual, and as long as BMW sells manuals, I doubt they will.

But I guarantee Cadillac has a pretty good idea of what is going to sell. Don't forget, this website will attract more purists than casual owners...

c4ss
02-13-09, 02:34 AM
I would probably opt for the manual....but then again I heard the automatic's paddle shifters are swade :drool:

thebigjimsho
02-13-09, 03:29 AM
swade? really?

OldDrummer55
02-13-09, 09:40 AM
A lot of the photos of new '09's I see posted here seem to be mostly autos. It would be interesting to know what the official auto vs manual production #'s are.

If you are looking up numbers Tony, how many V2s have been produced so far? How rare will our cars be?

vperl
02-13-09, 09:53 AM
If you are looking up numbers Tony, how many V2s have been produced so far? How rare will our cars be?


###########################################

Medium - Rare

Razorecko
02-13-09, 10:28 AM
...the rarest combo will probally be raven black on the white/ivory interior w/ no sunroof/ manual / non-polished wheels w/ recaro's...thats my prediction.

marktanner
02-13-09, 05:24 PM
Last Saturday I visited the only dealership in the Atlanta area to have any V2's. They had a red and a blue, both auto w/o Recaros. I asked when they would get a manual in, and the sales person replied that it would be special order only, because they had a hard time selling the V1. They also had never received a manual '08 or '09 regular CTS, either, which is why I didn't buy my car from them, though they are the most convenient dealer for both my house and office. We all know know that the V2 is way ahead of the V1 in most areas, including the quality of it's manual shifter (by reports), so I think that dealership is being very gun-shy, and certainly not going after the enthusiast crowd. I find transmission feel and action to be critical to my enjoyment of the car, and I for one wouldn't buy one without testing it first. Indeed, I only bought my current 6 sp CTS after testing two of them (not easy to find, either).

With regard to the Recaros, the dealer thought they were less comfortable and too confining compared to the standard seats, and weren't planning on getting those in either. They clearly aren't aware of what many enthusiasts want, and seem unwilling to even take a chance on getting in a car that I would want without special ordering it. With this kind of attitude, I'm afraid we won't see too many V2's ever with manual transmissions, much less Recaros.

tbss08
02-13-09, 06:20 PM
Must be nice to have a dealer who even has a car. Closest one for me was 1.5 hours away and then I couldn't even get a test drive. Needless to say I won't be getting the car from them.:cool:

vperl
02-13-09, 08:13 PM
My dealers here were either wanting 20K over sticker, boy they are gunna sell a bunch.......

And one closed........ Whoops they can still sell BMS's and 10 other stores


amd the third, nice bunch of folks that have not a clue who the market is for the car, and seem OK with that...

But they are good folk, unlike the morons with the 20K over sticker and a very bad customer relations.. got the name of the sales people, plan on stopping but in summer and saying hi to them

thebigjimsho
02-13-09, 08:31 PM
manuel...

RightTurn
02-13-09, 08:35 PM
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z117/sarahw422/553px-Lol_que.jpg

thebigjimsho
02-13-09, 08:38 PM
hehehehe

RightTurn
02-13-09, 11:21 PM
:highfive:

thebigjimsho
02-13-09, 11:33 PM
:cloud9:

TaVern
02-14-09, 03:14 AM
My dealers here were either wanting 20K over sticker, boy they are gunna sell a bunch.......

And one closed........ Whoops they can still sell BMS's and 10 other stores


amd the third, nice bunch of folks that have not a clue who the market is for the car, and seem OK with that...

But they are good folk, unlike the morons with the 20K over sticker and a very bad customer relations.. got the name of the sales people, plan on stopping but in summer and saying hi to them

And your benefaction to our discussion of automatic vs. manual transmission would be?

vperl
02-14-09, 10:32 AM
thank you for the reminder, but I am unable to start new threads....

I guess i will have go through a couple dozzen thread to find the proper thred,
BTW, Automatics were pretty well, shown what they can do at the the "ring" in germany...

clubho
02-14-09, 06:27 PM
so was there any difference in performance times?

JEM
02-14-09, 06:34 PM
so was there any difference in performance times?

The publicized sub-8-minute lap was done with a slushbox, and was done completely without recourse to the manual shifting controls. The folks involved claimed the slushbox posted the better lap times, and was the easier combo to drive fast.

So far as I know no separate lap time has ever been published for the manual.

In day-to-day use so much depends on the tuning and 'polish' - whether the automatic calibration has too much delay and 'mush' built into the shifts, whether the manual clutch can tolerably be modulated in traffic, etc. Tough to say without a test drive.

JFJr
02-14-09, 07:43 PM
The publicized sub-8-minute lap was done with a slushbox, and was done completely without recourse to the manual shifting controls. The folks involved claimed the slushbox posted the better lap times, and was the easier combo to drive fast.

The truth is that John Heinricy drove the automatic at that time because he had spent a lot of time with that car before the record run, and was not prepared to do the run with the manual without spending some time with it to learn the right shift points, etc. Apparently, the opportunity for the record run on the 'Ring presented itself unexpectedly without time for him to adequately prepare with the manual for the occasion. I wouldn't infer anything more from the run than that. In any event it proved the superiority of the 2009 CTS-V!

thebigjimsho
02-15-09, 10:34 PM
A manual V pwned at Monticello against an M5. OK, maybe not pwned, but it did win...

TaVern
02-16-09, 12:20 AM
A manual V pwned at Monticello against an M5. OK, maybe not pwned, but it did win...

that's all that matters. I feel like Vin Diesel...

vperl
02-16-09, 12:46 AM
that's all that matters. I feel like Vin Diesel...



Just so you do not talk or look like him, your OK........dude



:duck::duck::duck::duck::duck:

TaVern
02-16-09, 01:03 AM
Just so you do not talk or look like him, your OK........dude

OK.......dude. I won't use foul language here, because I know you're extremely sensitive to foul language.

You have three options here:

Option A: If you wish to contribute useful information to this forum, then by all means continue posting useful information.

Option B: If you wish to spam the forums, including my thread, become a supporting member here --->http://www.cadillacforums.com/subscribe.html

Option C: Close your internet browser.

Choose wisely.

vperl
02-16-09, 01:41 AM
OK.......dude. I won't use foul language here, because I know you're extremely sensitive to foul language.

You have three options here:

Option A: If you wish to contribute useful information to this forum, then by all means continue posting useful information.

Option B: If you wish to spam the forums, including my thread, become a supporting member here --->http://www.cadillacforums.com/subscribe.html

Option C: Close your internet browser.

Choose wisely.


Sir, I am not sure why you threaten me, if the people of this
forum like the way they treat a fellow that just ordered a V, if the people in charge DO NOT WANT me here, then, it is up to them.

Sir, I do not like to be threatened, and I suspect you have a reason to act the way you do...

I have no dispect directed to you or any one else in this Forum, Sir, If the operators of this forum do as you suggest.

I guess they are doing what is right, for them.

I chose to no be threatened by you or anyone else.

America was built , on many things, but not what you want...


ThankYou so much.....

yours in fellow ship and freedom

thebigjimsho
02-16-09, 01:49 AM
TV and perl in a bitchfest. catfight?

TaVern
02-16-09, 01:50 AM
Fellow ship and freedom. Let freedom ring!!! Goddammit!!! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring! Let freedom ring!

thebigjimsho
02-16-09, 01:51 AM
let the white dove sing.

TaVern
02-16-09, 01:52 AM
sing the swde

TaVern
02-16-09, 01:53 AM
freedom!

thebigjimsho
02-16-09, 01:53 AM
bravefart!

OldDrummer55
02-16-09, 01:55 AM
A watering hole friend who owns an M3 claims the auto trans technology has improved to the point where they can shift faster and more efficiently than the manuals, thus better performance. I would guess it depends on how fast the shifts are, like the racing auto tranny I had in my Grand National. The wife didn't like to drive it as the shifts were hard.

TaVern
02-16-09, 01:55 AM
0HYuv0Q7sdQ

TaVern
02-16-09, 02:02 AM
A watering hole friend who owns an M3 claims the auto trans technology has improved to the point where they can shift faster and more efficiently than the manuals, thus better performance. I would guess it depends on how fast the shifts are, like the racing auto tranny I had in my Grand National. The wife didn't like to drive it as the shifts were hard.

vperl sent you here to save him?

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/1772335-post1.html

You're so noble. :drool:

FREEDOM!

TaVern
02-16-09, 02:03 AM
let freedom ring!

V-Love
02-16-09, 02:21 PM
Guys.....watch Andy at the end of the 1st straight he performs a no-lift at about 116 mph. http://cadillacdrivinglab.com/#/000001 Listen to the motor. If you like to drive at all, you have to get a manual. It looks like a lot more fun to me.

"that was pretty nuts, that was crazy"-Andy Pilgrim after his lap

thebigjimsho
02-17-09, 12:29 AM
and then he told me personally that the auto was faster. hmm, oh what to do???

MYV8ABMR
02-17-09, 12:33 AM
voted auto bc thats what i got and no complaints

TaVern
02-17-09, 12:34 AM
and then he told me personally that the auto was faster. hmm, oh what to do???

choose swde in it's native tongue.

darjae
02-17-09, 12:41 AM
choose swde in it's native tongue.

...Swear... I went on a wild game hunt last year in Sweden or Africa or somewhere (can't remember....) And I killed 3 swdes. You have to be careful, because they are the only animal known to be circular with a gear-shift sized "appendage" just the right size for the V. It's very easy to destroy the swde(iness?) with an illtimed shot! The best Vs have swde that is "coaxed" off of the animal with a silver tongue!-

thebigjimsho
02-17-09, 12:41 AM
I think you're thinking of the singer. drop the w...

TaVern
02-17-09, 12:45 AM
swde

V-Love
02-17-09, 02:47 AM
and then he told me personally that the auto was faster. hmm, oh what to do???

I guess he likes it slow because thats all I saw him drive in NY. I don't think auto does 191 without modification. The manual will. Manny is faster.

thebigjimsho
02-17-09, 06:06 AM
I guess he likes it slow because thats all I saw him drive in NY. I don't think auto does 191 without modification. The manual will. Manny is faster.
like you have the balls to get there...

V-Love
02-17-09, 09:30 AM
like you have the balls to get there...

YouTube - AC/DC - Big Balls

thebigjimsho
02-17-09, 07:33 PM
when are they gonna be on iTunes?

V-Love
02-18-09, 05:17 AM
When am I gonna buy a ipod? Its such an amazing little instrument.

thebigjimsho
02-18-09, 07:10 AM
:handy:

peter simov
04-23-09, 10:25 PM
If ur going to mod what would u go with

Razorecko
04-23-09, 10:38 PM
If ur going to mod what would u go with

if you're modding bet on the stick. Not only are manuals stronger but auto's tend to start goofing shifts when you speed everything up with hp.

clubho
04-27-09, 06:46 PM
The publicized sub-8-minute lap was done with a slushbox, and was done completely without recourse to the manual shifting controls. The folks involved claimed the slushbox posted the better lap times, and was the easier combo to drive fast.

So far as I know no separate lap time has ever been published for the manual.

In day-to-day use so much depends on the tuning and 'polish' - whether the automatic calibration has too much delay and 'mush' built into the shifts, whether the manual clutch can tolerably be modulated in traffic, etc. Tough to say without a test drive.

Thanks. I bought the stick.

Also, those other guys having the fight in this thread. It wasted all our time. Oh and you should at least learn to spell fellowship (it's one word).

vperl
04-27-09, 07:27 PM
My wife asked for an automatic... in the spirit of Detente, I agreed.... :worship:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Olde knows his place in the food chain very well.

darjae
04-30-09, 12:12 AM
My wife asked for an automatic... in the spirit of Detente, I agreed.... :worship:

Been there....Done That.....bought that car.....she's driven it one time (in 3 months).....