: Damned Motor Mounts



Pages : [1] 2

Ranger
11-23-08, 01:49 PM
Less than a year ago I noticed a slight groan on initial acceleration. Front motor mount was replaced under warranty and the problem was solved. I'll be damned if it isn't starting to groan again. I figured the best thing to do is to fabricate some type of a torque strut to prevent the next one from going, but alas I looked and that thing is shoe horned in so tight that there is absolutely no room to put one. Why in their infinite wisdom did they ever do away with them?

ryannel2003
11-23-08, 01:54 PM
Don't feel bad, mine was replaced in June and is in need of replacement again. Shifting into reverse when the car is cold gives a slight clunk, and when accelerating you can hear the thing groaning away. I'm going to wait until sometime next year and get mine replaced. Hell, I might look into a solid motor mount.

97EldoCoupe
11-23-08, 05:05 PM
OK. I wasn't going to say anything until I had a prototype completely finished. But.....

I've got a '98 STS that I drive all the time. I use the WOT at will. I just replaced the mount in June, with a factory GM mount. There's a big mistake in the factory design. I've come up with a new design that will NEVER fail, yet isn't solid. It's stiff to handle the torque and WOT without moving too much, but still has enough cushioning to keep engine harmonics and vibrations down. It's a direct bolt in replacement. I haven't tested it yet- so far my factory replacement hasn't failed. But when it does.... I'm ready. With this mount you won't even need torque struts/dog-bones.

If I were to set up the jigs to start manufacturing some of these in my shop, how many people would be interested? Price would be $130 shipping included to anywhere in the USA or Canada, and I'll offer a 5 year free replacement warranty. And of course, I'll need a few people to test these mounts.... Anyone interested?

Ranger
11-23-08, 05:13 PM
Are you charging for the testers or is that price after they've been tested? Do you have any side by side pics. Would they be interchangeable on an '03?

97EldoCoupe
11-23-08, 05:22 PM
3 testers get the mount for $50, shipping included. Give me a couple days for pics. I'll get them posted here and on my site ASAP. Can't say for sure about the '03. I've worked on model years 1993-2001, haven't had an '03 in my shop yet. If it's the same as the 2000 and 2001 STS/SLS/DTS/DHS, then yes. I'll need someone else's input here- does the '03 have the same style mount?

Ranger
11-23-08, 05:30 PM
I think they are the same. If it will fit an '03 and is as good as you say, I think I'd be interested in being your first tester. I am still under warranty (certified) til next year sometime, but at the rate these things seem to go out I'll be doing it on my own soon anyway. I can probably have this one done under warranty and just supply the mount. Maybe Ewill knows if it will fit an '03. I'll ask him to check in.

orconn
11-23-08, 05:33 PM
If it will fit a 2003 SLS please put me on your list; would be very interested after it is tested. So keep me informed, please.

jeffrsmith
11-23-08, 05:38 PM
I would be interested in testing one out.

ryannel2003
11-23-08, 05:41 PM
I wouldn't mind testing one out either. The going rate is to replace one every year, and that is just a waste of money.

Ranger
11-23-08, 05:50 PM
Looks like you got 3 testers.

Submariner409
11-23-08, 05:58 PM
2002 STS. Count me in. 3rd front mount is starting to tear.

97EldoCoupe
11-23-08, 07:16 PM
Ranger, JeffRSmith, Ryannel2003

I'll send you all PMs with a link to the photo as soon as I have the mount finished and photographed. You get first glance- if you like what you see I'll send the mounts for $50 USD shipping included. I'm just overloaded with HG jobs right now- hope to have them ready to ship in approx. 2 wks. I'll keep everyone posted through this thread. One catch though - you three testers, have to run your cars at WOT as much as you see fit!:2thumbs:

CadillacSTS42005
11-23-08, 07:53 PM
oh lord....

Ranger
11-23-08, 09:19 PM
Well, from what I've seen it doesn't take much to make the factory mounts go bad. I do some WOT, but not an awful lot and it didn't even last a year. I'm in no rush. Mine just started so it's not in too bad of shape. Will wait for the PM.

97EldoCoupe
11-23-08, 10:57 PM
My 98 sees WOT on a regular basis. But I'm careful with the RPMs- I lent my STS to a friend while I went on vacation, and later found out that he had it at 100+MPH. Now I'm reconsidering who I lend my cars too.... You never know what they do behind the wheel. I got back and there was a layer of dust covering the black interior, he drove down a gravel road with the windows open. He was going to buy my '99 STS, but I decided it's just too much car for him.

Looks like STS up there is getting a little worried....lol

When I say WOT I mean WOT within reason, and with respect to the car. Warm engine, watch the RPMs and careful with the trans.

ryannel2003
11-23-08, 11:01 PM
See I give mine WOT constantly, go around certain bends fast enough for the PAS to kick in, and like to squeal tires quite constantly. Which is the reason why I've gotten about 8k outta my motor mount. I was planning on just replacing once a year, but this solution would be much, much nicer.

AJxtcman
11-23-08, 11:08 PM
As soon as I get the POS Mustang done I will have a new mount out also. :thumbsup:

I will have a solid mount and a mount that is well insulated. The second mount will be a direct replacement for OE.

I haven't got any pipe to make any mounts yet.:rant2:
I am hoping this will come this week.

97EldoCoupe
11-23-08, 11:30 PM
Yeah, nothing quite like the feeling of a 300 horse 32 valve V8 at WOT around a tight bend.... I get a little crazy sometimes too. on Friday I had my rear tires leave the pavement when I did 90MPH over a hill... I didn`t know the road well enough. The only difference is I`d never do that to a friend`s car. If I break it, it`s mine to break...

AJxtcman
11-23-08, 11:30 PM
See I give mine WOT constantly, go around certain bends fast enough for the PAS to kick in,


Maybe I should explain PAS better. For the most Part this is not a Down Shifting thing. It prevent the trans from up shifting. Think of using it on a slalom course.

Any 2000+ Cadillac can have PAS function enabled. To enable PAS you have to set the IPC/Cluster up for PAS. Then the IPC sent out a signal to the PCM to hold the trans in gear and prevent lift foot shifting.



When your vehicle detects a change in driving conditions, it will automatically initiate the appropriate performance shift mode. When this occurs, the gear display on the instrument panel cluster will change to indicate that the transaxle has shifted to a different gear. For example, the gear display on the cluster may indicate D, 3, 2, or 1 even though the gearshift lever is still in AUTOMATIC OVERDRIVE (Overdrive). Once the performance shift mode ends, the gear display on the instrument panel cluster will return to normal.

CadillacSTS42005
11-23-08, 11:36 PM
nothing worries me...

CadillacSTS42005
11-23-08, 11:37 PM
ive fixed my lack of hp problem permanently

AJxtcman
11-23-08, 11:45 PM
ive fixed my lack of hp problem permanently

You will be in for a huge treat

ryannel2003
11-23-08, 11:52 PM
Maybe I should explain PAS better. For the most Part this is not a Down Shifting thing. It prevent the trans from up shifting. Think of using it on a slalom course.

Any 2000+ Cadillac can have PAS function enabled. To enable PAS you have to set the IPC/Cluster up for PAS. Then the IPC sent out a signal to the PCM to hold the trans in gear and prevent lift foot shifting.

I found out for the first time a few weeks ago about the PAS kicking in. Going around a corner, I happened to look at the display and saw the gear indicator was in 2nd gear. "Damn, I finally saw the PAS work!". I have to say, it works pretty great in the car.


Yeah, nothing quite like the feeling of a 300 horse 32 valve V8 at WOT around a tight bend.... I get a little crazy sometimes too. on Friday I had my rear tires leave the pavement when I did 90MPH over a hill... I didn`t know the road well enough. The only difference is I`d never do that to a friend`s car. If I break it, it`s mine to break...

I constantly get my car up to higher speeds (on backroads with putting nobody in harms way of course). The car sings at the higher RPM's, though I wish it had a little more low end power. Above 3k RPM's, the bitch screams though.

My engine isn't 100% right now. I'm getting spark plugs put in soon and getting some more work done, and then she'll be back to the way she was out the showroom. With 63k miles of course! :thumbsup:

CadillacSTS42005
11-23-08, 11:52 PM
STS is the DD now
my track cars a 98 LS1 Z/28
open heart on her begins soon
wouldnt mind making the STS faster still
but egh im in no rush, when shit gets done im down for it

ryannel2003
11-23-08, 11:53 PM
Damn Jason, a Seville STS and Camaro Z28? You greedy bastard! ;)

CadillacSTS42005
11-24-08, 12:01 AM
forgot the 97 ETC...

sorry i got sick of the dreams
my Z is faster stock than the Cadillac
shyt load cheaper to mod
just all around made worlds more sense
i give up, when the N* is hacked or theres a more worthwhile mod for it im down
but for the meantime im sidelining it...
AJ tune, corsa and torque bypass is nice shell rip the tires pretty good,
but the Z does it oh so much better

Submariner409
11-24-08, 12:03 AM
Page 2-30, 2002 STS Owner's manual: "When your vehicle detects a change in driving conditions, it will automatically initiate the appropriate performance shift mode. When this occurs, the gear display..........", as quoted below.

Does a dealer or you, through DIC personalization, set the PAS to function or is it, as the owner's manual states, an automatic function ??

When driven to extremes my transmission enters PAS, and I have never "enabled" anything in the DIC (it isn't in there.....).

ryannel2003
11-24-08, 12:06 AM
Jeez the ETC too? Do you ever get to drive the STS-V? The one time I drove one, I was freakin shocked. So much power.

Some kid down the road has a Z28; has a really crappy sounding exhaust, but it's fast no doubt about it. I've never been a huge fan of Camaro's, though the 2010 looks dead sexy.

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 12:13 AM
Page 2-30, 2002 STS Owner's manual: "When your vehicle detects a change in driving conditions, it will automatically initiate the appropriate performance shift mode. When this occurs, the gear display..........", as quoted below.

Does a dealer or you, through DIC personalization, set the PAS to function or is it, as the owner's manual states, an automatic function ??

When driven to extremes my transmission enters PAS, and I have never "enabled" anything in the DIC (it isn't in there.....).

ANY 2000+ Deville or Seville can Have PAS enabled with the Tech II. Well the Analog dash anyway. I haven't tried others. I am thinking I could turn it on in a 98 STS also.

ryannel2003
11-24-08, 12:17 AM
I thought all Seville STS had it standard, including the '98? Or are you talking about enabling it on the dash?

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 12:19 AM
Sorry about this Ranger. Hijacking this thread that is.

ryannel2003 Guess what I am driving? It isn't a 13 second Deville this week.
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http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/PIC-0010.jpg

The engine is back in.

I need to go now and burn another tune in to it. :stirpot:

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 12:21 AM
I thought all Seville STS had it standard, including the '98? Or are you talking about enabling it on the dash?

Not true

I have posted it before. I think it was 01 or 02. It is listed under New Model Year Updates in SI

I forgot about the Dash part

When you install a new IPC or most modules you need to perform a setup proceedure. You need to enable functions. When we did the OnStar upgades we had to make sure that the Phone Option was enabled. You know the DIC says Phone ON or Off. Not all car list the Phone.

ryannel2003
11-24-08, 12:36 AM
I coulda sworn that it was standard in '98. I was reading Edmund's long term test and they were talking about how it worked well it most situations, and got confused in others. Here's where I'm talking about: http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/LongTerm/articleId=44038/pageId=701

"The Performance Algorithm Shifting program of the automatic transmission, however, did not perform flawlessly during the drive. Wardlaw said that the system worked optimally only half the time, but that when it worked correctly, the Seville's engine was revved perfectly for exiting a turn."

I'm confused now. Oh, and is a freakin beautiful Shelby.

EDIT: I think you're talking about the dash display, and I'm talking about PAS in general. The display indicator came out in 2000; mine has it.

Submariner409
11-24-08, 12:52 AM
So the 2002 Owner's Manual is incorrect in stating that, as delivered, the PAS feature is automatically entered as a function of driving conditions ???

Why would a manual state one thing, and leave the owner to ask the dealer to enable an already-set automatic function ??? The manual and Factory Service Manual state nothing about having a dealer enable the PAS function by using a Tech-II.

OnStar has absolutely nothing to do with PAS. The DIC has nothing to do with PAS. The PCM and PAS drive the DIC shift indicator, not the other way around.........

I would like the TSB or Bulletin number and procedure which requires a dealer to initially enable PAS in a late Seville/Deville platform, and I would like to see it posted in this thread.

Anyone can take a picture through a shop door. Wanna see "my Ferrari GTO" ???

ryannel2003
11-24-08, 12:59 AM
I've never heard of the dealer having to enable it either. The thing is, my car has it enabled, and I'm sure the former owner had no idea the technology even existed. I've never had the dealer touch the transmission.

I leave more confused now. :hmm:

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 02:25 AM
So the 2002 Owner's Manual is incorrect in stating that, as delivered, the PAS feature is automatically entered as a function of driving conditions ???

Why would a manual state one thing, and leave the owner to ask the dealer to enable an already-set automatic function ??? The manual and Factory Service Manual state nothing about having a dealer enable the PAS function by using a Tech-II.

OnStar has absolutely nothing to do with PAS. The DIC has nothing to do with PAS. The PCM and PAS drive the DIC shift indicator, not the other way around.........

I would like the TSB or Bulletin number and procedure which requires a dealer to initially enable PAS in a late Seville/Deville platform, and I would like to see it posted in this thread.

Anyone can take a picture through a shop door. Wanna see "my Ferrari GTO" ???

If you take a dash out of a Deville and install it in a Seville you must set it up with PAS.
If you get a Replacement dash from a dealer it will have to be setup for PAS.

I will post the Screen Shots for you! It is not what you are thinking for the 100th time We have been over this before! It is an OPTION in the IPC/dash

This would be Highline and his POS
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/PIC-0009.jpg

This the POS at home in the lot
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/PIC-0015.jpg

This is the POS head gasket test with less than 4500 mile on the car
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/SecondTest2.jpg
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/SecondTest3.jpg

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 02:29 AM
I've never heard of the dealer having to enable it either. The thing is, my car has it enabled, and I'm sure the former owner had no idea the technology even existed. I've never had the dealer touch the transmission.

I leave more confused now. :hmm:

All Seville's don't have PAS. No Deville's came with it either Correct?
No Elod's came with it ever correct?

The Eldo's can't have it because it is part of the IPC.

Do you know Devilles have Tow Haul mode?

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 02:34 AM
Document ID: 1564663 Instrument Cluster Programming/Synchronization

Important: After an instrument panel cluster (IPC) replacement, certain setup procedures must be performed in accordance with the regular productions options (RPO) of the vehicle being serviced in order for the IPC and/or DIC displays to function properly. Refer to Service Parts ID Label or to RPO Code List for more information on the location of the vehicle's RPO label and the RPO code list.

After IPC replacement, the following options if equipped may need to be set:


Language
Export ID
Tire Pressure Monitor
Optional Modules
Point Of Sale
Performance Shift


Perform the following setup procedure for the Option that needs to be set or programmed:

Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC) Options Setup


Install a scan tool
Turn On the ignition with the engine Off
With the scan tool, select Body
Select Instrument Panel Cluster
Select Special Functions
Select Set Options


With the scan tool, then select the option that needs to be setup by following the scan tool instructions.

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 02:42 AM
I have found that if you build the car (select the Year Make Model) in the Tech II as a 2003 Seville even though it could be a 2000 Deville you can get even more options to load. This is were you can enable the Coolant Temp Display in the DIC.

Maybe it isn't a 2003, but I have my IPC loaded to display ECT and it is an Analog Dash. I don't have a car, just the IPC

Submariner409
11-24-08, 10:35 AM
Post #38 clears up the original question, as it appears that PAS display is, in fact, enabled from the factory in those cars set up to use it, and very few owners would need a new DIC, so would never know the display function had been re-enabled.

AJ, does the DIC order the PCM and transmission to enter PAS, or does the DIC merely display the fact that PAS, if equipped, has engaged due to aggressive driving sensed by the PCM/transmission signals??

Ranger
11-24-08, 11:09 AM
Are you charging for the testers or is that price after they've been tested? Do you have any side by side pics. Would they be interchangeable on an '03?
I should clarify, the reason that I asked for side by side pics is that the only time I saw the mount is after it was changed. I was talking to the tech that did it and he pulled it out of the trash bin and showed me how the rubber at the bottom was separating. It was only a very brief view and I'm still a bit unclear as to how the OEM mount is assembled so I kind of wanted to see what the difference will be.

ryannel2003
11-24-08, 11:24 AM
All Seville's don't have PAS. No Deville's came with it either Correct?
No Elod's came with it ever correct?

The Eldo's can't have it because it is part of the IPC.

Do you know Devilles have Tow Haul mode?

Oh ok ok I get what you're talking about now. It was only standard on the Seville STS, and it was never offered on the Deville.

Deville's have tow haul mode? Damn, I never knew that!

I apologize for hijackng this thread Ranger.

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 02:58 PM
Post #38 clears up the original question, as it appears that PAS display is, in fact, enabled from the factory in those cars set up to use it, and very few owners would need a new DIC, so would never know the display function had been re-enabled.

AJ, does the DIC order the PCM and transmission to enter PAS, or does the DIC merely display the fact that PAS, if equipped, has engaged due to aggressive driving sensed by the PCM/transmission signals??

PAS is function is enabled by the IPC.
Think of it like A/C. The HVAC head sends out a message to the PCM that request the A/C compressor be engaged. The HVAC head doesn't turn the A/C clutch relay on.

The DIC is part of the IPC on these cars.

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/forum/HPIM3912.jpg

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/HPIM3910.jpg

AJxtcman
11-24-08, 03:02 PM
Oh ok ok I get what you're talking about now. It was only standard on the Seville STS, and it was never offered on the Deville.

Deville's have tow haul mode? Damn, I never knew that!

I apologize for hijackng this thread Ranger.

It was a question on a Semi Annual test. :histeric: Tow haul mode WTF.
The question was almost as good as the one about the Piston being bigger than the Bore. Yes it is on a Escalade

Submariner409
11-24-08, 10:24 PM
Damn, AJ............I don't need snow just yet. Let us get past the leaves and pulling the dying bean vines !!! (Got my 2 cords of oak split and laid, though....:sneaky: )

Destroyer
11-25-08, 01:17 AM
forgot the 97 ETC...

sorry i got sick of the dreams
my Z is faster stock than the Cadillac
shyt load cheaper to mod
just all around made worlds more sense
i give up, when the N* is hacked or theres a more worthwhile mod for it im down
but for the meantime im sidelining it...
AJ tune, corsa and torque bypass is nice shell rip the tires pretty good,
but the Z does it oh so much better

I've been telling you guys that forever. Luxury whatever, the musclecars deliver more smiles per hour anyday!. :thumbsup:

Destroyer
11-25-08, 01:24 AM
This would be Highline and his POS

This is the POS head gasket test with less than 4500 mile on the car
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Bert/GT500/SecondTest2.jpg
The irony of a N* man ragging on another car for blowing a head gasket is priceless!. :thepan:

CadillacSTS42005
11-25-08, 01:52 AM
I've been telling you guys that forever. Luxury whatever, the musclecars deliver more smiles per hour anyday!. :thumbsup:

howd i know even 3 pages buried youd be able to smell the blood of a N* defector....

ill be back and so will she, when theres a full hack done for the N*

shes my winter tank now...

AJxtcman
11-25-08, 08:30 PM
The irony of a N* man ragging on another car for blowing a head gasket is priceless!. :thepan:

I bet it has been a year since I have done a head gasket job. :crying:

I had Highline's car apart for updated pistons, but I don't think I have done a head gasket in close to or over a year

97EldoCoupe
11-29-08, 08:55 PM
Hang in there guys I've almost got an engine mount prototype complete. The 3 testers will be receiving PMs with a link to the photos soon. It's going to be strong and it's going to last. Still rubberized so that the engine vibes won't get past it...more throttle response and less twisting of the drivetrain. Best of all you won't have to replace it anymore.

Ranger
11-29-08, 09:14 PM
:banana::woohoo:

Renew82
11-30-08, 09:03 PM
I have a 03 STS and would be happy to buy and test one out. I would do it myself and take pictures of the install.

97EldoCoupe
11-30-08, 09:20 PM
3 testers have been chosen, however I'll send you pics anyway regular price applies... Should have the mount done by the end of the week, hopefully 5 or so ready to ship.

97EldoCoupe
12-10-08, 07:15 PM
Hang in there guys. I've been so busy working 12-16 hours per day doing HGs- as soon as I get a chance I'll finish the mount and post pics for everyone.

Ranger
12-10-08, 09:56 PM
No rush here. Mine just makes a little noise on initial torque application. Right now I'm in the middle of converting a DHS column shift to a DTS floor shift.

ryannel2003
12-10-08, 10:03 PM
Same here. Mine isn't too bad, but obviously going out.

97EldoCoupe
12-10-08, 11:22 PM
Sounds like a great project Ranger! Post Pics!!!

Ranger
12-11-08, 03:50 PM
Project is right. It is installed, but the wiring connectors do not match. I just ordered the mating one from the dealer ($15). When I get it I'll have to play detective and pull all the wires from the old connector and figure out which cavity they go in on the new one. Thank God for FSM's.

97EldoCoupe
12-11-08, 05:38 PM
That's going to be one sweet DHS when you get it done. Keep us posted, or even start a new thread with the conversion process!

Ranger
12-11-08, 10:48 PM
There is a thread in the Deville section started by agusgoldboy, but he pretty much abandoned the idea, so I just kept it going. I must admit, it IS one sweet DHS now. The column shift is the ONLY thing I did not care for. Now she's perfect. My only regret is that I did not find a console a year ago.

FrankT
12-13-08, 01:19 PM
Hang in there guys. I've been so busy working 12-16 hours per day doing HGs- as soon as I get a chance I'll finish the mount and post pics for everyone.

As soon as Ranger and the others give the thumbs up on your motor mount, I will buy one from you. I'm west of Detroit in the burb's, so I might just drive up to see you.

On another note, I linked to your web site and saw this, "home of the $1,500 N* head gasket repair" Uhmm, great price, have you done the HG's on any of our members N*?

97EldoCoupe
12-13-08, 01:22 PM
Yes I have. There are a number of members on the forums who's HG's I've done. All with great success. And if you're wondering if I stand by my work and word, read the thread I just started on the '01 DTS valvetrain noise.

codewize
12-13-08, 01:27 PM
Who's building solid mounts now?

Ranger
01-03-09, 09:32 PM
Any progress on the mounts Jake?

97EldoCoupe
01-04-09, 01:16 AM
Good. All that's left is to pour the rubber into the mounts. It's been a long delay from what I had planned- the HG jobs have piled up pretty good though!:thumbsup:

2 weeks max from now, they should be done and shipping out.

I haven't forgotten you three. :)

[NortHStaR]
01-04-09, 01:56 AM
Jake can we start a list of things you DONT do or try to do with the northstar??

Your the man, hook me up with some pics of the mounts, or post them here! I'm very interested, My rear passenger mount on the 99 DeVille is looking a tad rough.

Keep up the good work Jake :worship: :highfive:

97EldoCoupe
01-04-09, 07:04 AM
Thanks Chacen, sometimes I just wish I had the time to do everything I want to do. The new body style STS/Deville mount is first before any others because they're the most common to fail. Soon as I take pics they'll be in the hands of the three testers first and then posted in this thread.

-Jake

codewize
01-05-09, 09:01 PM
I'm certainly interested in seeing these mounts.

AlBundy
01-06-09, 09:04 PM
Interested in mounts as well.

97EldoCoupe
01-09-09, 09:28 PM
Great news! The rubber compound arrived today, so the mount will be done soon. If all goes well I'll be setting up jigs and moulds for all the N* engine and trans mounts.

Ranger
01-09-09, 09:35 PM
GREAT! Educate me a little. If this is a solid mount, where does the rubber go?

97EldoCoupe
01-09-09, 11:34 PM
It's not a solid mount - all engines sit on rubber or polyurethane to keep vibrations down to a minimum so that's what I'm designing. The problem with Cadillac's original design is that the rubber is not completely encased in steel- the constant WOT (yes a lot of us use WOT on a daily basis) literally tears the rubber apart.

Ever seen a small block Chevy mount from the mid-late 80's? And then looked at an Olds 307's mount? (I'm a big GM b-body enthusiast too) The Olds 307's break up pretty bad and they allow the engine to "give" quite a bit when you rev it up. The Chevy small block mount is rubber wrapped in a metal housing- it will absorb all of the vibration but will just compress the rubber against the steel upon giving the engine wide open throttle. This is the way I'm designing the Cadillac mount- so it doesn't "pull" the rubber apart. It will still do what it's designed to do: hold the engine in place and cancel vibration, but this one will last.

When I did the 403 Olds V8 swap on my '85 Parisienne, I custom fabbed a trans crossmember to allow for headers and true duals on each side. I still have a pic somewhere- but the trans mount was torn apart so I cut a small block Chevy engine mount in half and made a trans mount from it- it never failed.

Ranger
01-10-09, 12:05 AM
I got a quick look at the one that was replaced from the mechanic that did it, but don't remember a lot about it. I think I understand what you are saying. Maybe when you post the pics you can show a side by side (old and new)? That would go a long way without having seen one and understanding how yours will work.

97EldoCoupe
01-11-09, 02:33 PM
I told the few testers that they'd receive pics first, but decided that everyone is allowed a sneak peek. This prototype design is not far from completion- it's a two piece mount that bolts together as one. The actual production mount will be a bit more sleek and refined- this one is mostly for testing purposes right now.

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/mmount1.jpg

"The mount is fully encased in steel to prevent the rubber from tearing apart under WOT conditions. It will allow good drivetrain vibration dampening while still retaining the stiffness we all expect from a performance engine mount. The two piece mount uses cast-in-place polyurethane rubber to achieve these properties."

This part of the mount bolts to the subframe, and the other part (no pics yet) bolts to the existing mount bracket that attaches to the lower block and cylinder head.

97EldoCoupe
01-11-09, 02:38 PM
I'm still experimenting with different rubber compounds but I believe I've got the right one selected. Price will be $130 US (except for the few selected testers) shipping included to anwhere in the US or Canada. It will include all mounting hardware as well. I'll post pics of the finished product in a few days.

There will be a 5 year free replacement warranty on these mounts.

FrankT
01-12-09, 08:02 PM
Jake,

Looking and sounding good. I've had a broken front motor mount now for close to a year. I debated about the solid mount, but didn't go for it because I didn't want to deal with any NVH problems. So, in the mean time I've been driving with a light foot.

Poor little N* is probably getting carboned up and will need several WOT's after the new mount is installed.

Good Job, by the way, I'm glad to see that you addressed the NVH concerns, I think you have winner, can't wait till your done! Frank

97EldoCoupe
01-13-09, 12:28 AM
Thanks FrankT, I'm still not happy with the design- this is not the final mount- but it sort of gives you the idea.

I'll be finished soon and will keep everyone posted. I could have sold a dozen of these to my customers alone: So many with bad mounts.

STSj90
01-13-09, 07:43 PM
Nice, Cant wait till some are tested. What are the other benefits besides durability? Ive got my eye on this mount....I do A hell of alot of WOT's.

Ranger
01-13-09, 09:21 PM
Hey Jake, I'd still like to see a side by side old vs new pic to get a better understanding of it if possible seeing as I have not done one myself.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 04:57 PM
I'll take a side by side pic soon. I'm working on a customer's car with a bad motor mount right now and I'm very tempted to install it free of charge just so I can do some fitting/testing. I can't get ahold of the owner right now but I'm sure since his is broken anyway, he won't mind testing the first mount. Can't be any worse than driving with a broken one.

The polyurethane rubber compound I used for this first mount is quite stiff but still has movement- I believe it's the perfect balance between vibration absorbtion and good WOT power transfer.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 06:49 PM
GREAT NEWS!!!!! The first prototype engine mount is DONE!!!!!

In the video link below you can see the old mount and new mount side-by-side. High speed connection is recommended....it's a 15MB video.

http://www.northstarperformance.com/videos/mmount.mov

AlBundy
01-14-09, 06:52 PM
Dam, that's nice.:worship::highfive:

ryannel2003
01-14-09, 06:53 PM
Now would this be something a dealership could install with no issue at all? Mine is on the way out, and I don't want to spend lots of $$$ getting a new one that will split in another 6 months.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 07:04 PM
This new mount is compact in size, but tough. The rubber seems to have the correct amount of "give" for the engine. The old mount "tears apart" when the engine is revved up. You can see in the video how the old mount failed. Every mounts of this style fails exactly the same way.

This new mount is a two piece design, with no metal-on-metal contact- the engine is fully supported and restrained by a cast-in-place polyurethane rubber bushing that is encased in 2" square tubing. In the middle of the rubber is a thin steel sleeve that the bolt passes through to connect the two parts of the mount. With this mount installed, you can do all the WOT take-offs your right foot desires, and 5 years down the road it will still be holding together and doing it's job.

I'll be changing a couple things before final production but the style will remain the same. All hardware is top quality with locking nuts.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 07:24 PM
A dealership could install it without any problems- it installs just as easy if not easier than the old one. The question is, will they do it- it's not a GM Part... I don't know what their policies are on installing aftermarket/upgrade parts.

ryannel2003
01-14-09, 07:28 PM
That's the only issue I'm thinking of. I work at the dealership, so if I did tell them I wanted it installed I would think they could do it. Once the first few have been road tested, I'll get one. I have a feeling this is the ultimate solution though.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 07:35 PM
Thanks Ryannel. I plan to road test this customer's car anyway once it's complete and yes I usually give them WOT after I finish a HG job just to make sure everything's good to go. I guess I'll be the first tester, then three to follow.

Ranger
01-14-09, 10:22 PM
Hey Jake, I'm stuck on dial up and can't see the vid. If you have a side by side pic you can post here that would be great.

I'll let you know what the dealer says. Mine is still under warranty and I plan on taking it in and telling them I want my own mount installed. I'm sure they will not cover it if it should fail, but I'm not worried about that. I know GM's WILL fail again.

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 11:05 PM
Thanks Ranger let me know. I'll get side-by-side pics next time I go out in the shop (after the movie!:)). I have a few pics I can post right now, give me a sec...

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 11:14 PM
http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/mmount2.jpg


This is the mount sitting in place on the subframe:
http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/mmount3.jpg

Ur7x
01-14-09, 11:18 PM
Nice! What are you going to charge for that little gem?

97EldoCoupe
01-14-09, 11:31 PM
$130 US shipping included anywhere in US or Canada, 5 year free replacement warranty but should outlast the cars they'll be installed in.

97EldoCoupe
01-16-09, 10:40 AM
Here's a pic of the mounts side by side:

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/mmount5.jpg

Ur7x
01-16-09, 12:17 PM
Here's a pic of the mounts side by side:

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/mmount5.jpg

I am VERY impressed! GM should have built it like this in the FIRST place... You will be the first person I call when my OEM mount fails (again).

One word...

PATENT!

Ranger
01-16-09, 01:15 PM
OK, now I think I understand it. It has 2 pieces. It does look a lot more durable. That OEM one looks a little familiar. I wish I had studied it a little closer when the mechanic showed it to me.

97EldoCoupe
01-16-09, 01:53 PM
Thanks UR7X;Ranger;

I'll likely be having the shop that made my new drill fixture plates, make the parts for the engine mount.

I'll be firing up the car this afternoon that has this engine mount installed. If I get a chance I'll post a video of the car reving up and applying load in drive and reverse.

I have enough polyurethane rubber compount to manufacture over 100 mounts so if the test goes well with this car, and the three testers, they're going into production in a short while.

97EldoCoupe
01-16-09, 01:56 PM
Mounts for the Eldo and older STSs/Devilles will soon follow, as well as replacement trans mounts and the side mount for Olds Auroras.

STSj90
01-16-09, 02:23 PM
Thats awsome, looks like a very good design. So this mount is for what year N*powered caddies? ...This may sound dumb. But where EXACTLY is this mount? I need to check mine. Ill be getting under my car today and i figure ill just check my mount for the heck of it.

I guess this current mount you made wont fit on my caddy? IF not, Got any idea's at all when you'll be making them for my year caddy? (lol its probly in the thread somwhere. Just too lazy to look)

mtflight
01-16-09, 04:47 PM
on all FWD N* caddies, it is located in the front of the cradle, sandwiched between the engine and the cradle itself. This area is right aft of the radiator, smack in the middle.

My mount is probably on its way out. I hear a light thump if I step on the gas too fast, especially when it's cold.

AlBundy
01-16-09, 05:01 PM
My mount is probably on its way out. I hear a light thump if I step on the gas too fast, especially when it's cold.


Welcome to the club.:D

97EldoCoupe
01-16-09, 08:05 PM
The front mount for the 93-97 STS/SLS/93-02 Eldo/1994-1999 Deville will be in the works next. It'll basically be the same mount with a different bolting pattern to fit these cars. I'll probably manufacture 75 of the new style and 25 of the old style mounts all at once.

Ranger
01-16-09, 10:41 PM
Which do these fit? I'm assuming it will fit mine.

97EldoCoupe
01-16-09, 11:19 PM
The one in the pic will fit yours Ranger.

I fired up the car with the mount. It still provides a cushion of movement for the engine but I think I can sense a bit of vibration. It's so little but I'll have to lower the car down and test it out a bit more. Movement of the engine is visible but very little. This is the way I like it. Personally I like to feel a bit of response from the engine but it depends on how. I hate exhaust vibrations- I can't handle that, or speed sensitive vibrations. But to feel a direct response from the engine when I punch the gas without much movement, I'm a happy motorist.

I'll do a bit more testing and wait for feedback from the owner. He is a member of the Cadillac Forums as well. If changes need to be made, they will be made. But I believe once approved for use (by myself and the testers) this will solve our engine mount issues once and for good.

egheorghe
01-17-09, 01:27 AM
From what i've read i understand the engine would vibrate or move more than normal if the mount is bad? Since it got colder i've noticed a noise like a tap when i drive over medium bumps on the road. Does this have anything to do with the engine mount or a have a suspension problem?
How can i check if i need to replace the mount? Since i bought my car i drove about 10k.

97EldoCoupe
01-17-09, 07:14 AM
With the hood open put the car in "D" and hold the brake firmly, apply some gas. If the front of the engine lifts up a lot, and then drops when you release the gas, the mount is bad.

FrankT
01-17-09, 09:04 AM
If changes need to be made, they will be made. But I believe once approved for use (by myself and the testers) this will solve our engine mount issues once and for good.:thumbsup:

Great, can't wait. The new mount seems smaller, means easier to install, thats fine with me. A little concerned about the vibration your feeling, hopefully it wouldn't be that noticeable.

The first one's out should also fit a 99sts, right?

I also concur with Ur7x, "PATENT!"

97EldoCoupe
01-17-09, 10:45 AM
I just took the car for a test- I like to do that if they're plated & insured so I can test my work out (HGs) before returning the car to the owner.

There's no noticeable vibration when driving at all, and when stopped and idling I don't think I can feel any either- if there is any it is so minimal. WOT seems responsive! With the hood open, revving the engine doesn't move the engine very much at all. A bit but not much. If I get a chance before the owner gets here to pick it up I'll post a vid.

One thing about patents, motor mounts have already been invented, as well as the same style mount I just built. I'm sure a patent already exists. The patent would have to be issued solely on the dimensions of this new mount and I doubt they'd do that. Anybody could change the mount's dimensions by a 1/4" and they wouldn't be violating any patent protection laws, I don't think. But then I'm no lawyer either.

97EldoCoupe
01-17-09, 10:58 AM
http://www.northstarperformance.com/videos/mountrev.mov

Sounds like I need to double check the power steering fluid level....

The mount gives very little which is good- it's still mounted on rubber as it should be and will never give out again.

Ranger
02-11-09, 08:22 PM
Any progress Jake? My warranty runs out in May and I'd rather let them do it.

97EldoCoupe
02-15-09, 09:21 PM
Ranger, thanks for your patience!!!:thumbsup: The mount design is being finalized now, the jigs being set up, and if all goes well the mounts will be shipping out to the testers on Monday the 23rd of this month.

I'm working on scraping together some cash right now for probably the largest purchase of my life... I'll be offering the mounts at a discounted price until the end of March. As it stands:

$50 for the three testers
$130 regular price, shipping included
$100 - discounted price until the end of March, shipping included.

tateos
02-17-09, 07:55 PM
Nice video - looks good, Jake

joe45
02-24-09, 05:10 PM
WOW Looks good to me. If you need anymore testers let me know. If not PM me anyway because I still want one.

derone
02-24-09, 10:33 PM
ditto here, think mine's loosening up.

99Classillac
02-25-09, 08:00 PM
Each mount is $100 or a complete set?

Ranger
02-25-09, 08:57 PM
I believe that is just for the front mount. It's the one that goes.

codewize
02-26-09, 11:15 AM
Are there pics of the finished product?

Submariner409
02-26-09, 12:38 PM
Yep.......look back through a couple of Jake's threads. Several pics of in-progress and finished units.

(..........matter of fact, go back to post #94, 90, 74 in here.)

ryannel2003
02-26-09, 07:22 PM
Hope this is finished up soon, my front mount is completely shot. Looked at the price of one installed that came in today ('04 SLS with only 38k miles) and it was $375. I'm not paying that to have them constantly fail.

codewize
02-26-09, 10:43 PM
Ahh very nice. I missed all that.

So tell me, is there a reason that all these people are against AJ's version and can' wait to buy yours?

Submariner409
02-26-09, 10:45 PM
Philosophical differences in solid and slightly flexible schools of thought. Availability ???

codewize
02-27-09, 11:37 AM
OK, I'm on that band wagon. AJ's does cause some harmonics in the car. I may just have to try one of these.

orconn
02-27-09, 11:52 AM
Ranger, thanks for your patience!!!:thumbsup: The mount design is being finalized now, the jigs being set up, and if all goes well the mounts will be shipping out to the testers on Monday the 23rd of this month.

I'm working on scraping together some cash right now for probably the largest purchase of my life... I'll be offering the mounts at a discounted price until the end of March. As it stands:

$50 for the three testers
$130 regular price, shipping included
$100 - discounted price until the end of March, shipping included.

I would like to order one of your motor mounts for my 2002 Seville SLS. Please pm me with how I go about this. Thanks

Ranger
02-27-09, 12:39 PM
Orconn, they are not yet available. Should be soon. Keep an eye on this thread.

FrankT
02-28-09, 10:27 AM
Yup, me too! start it up, put in gear "clunk" step on the gas and let off "clunk".

"Damn motor mounts!"

I refuse to buy another mount at the dealer and have it last for less than a year.

I can't wait either Jake, put me down for one before the end March. I hope this is the last one I have to buy.

97EldoCoupe
03-02-09, 01:01 AM
Believe me it will be the last one you'll have to buy.

Guys I apologize. I'm dealing with a few issues right now:

#1- the municipality said I can no longer do any work in the house I currently own (bought and paid for, yet I have no rights in my own garage?!)
#2- the shop I rented, just in case this were to happen, does not have heat- the owner told me they would be hooked up and he still hasn't done it
#3- I have to have all unlicensed Cadillacs off my yard by the 10th of March. All of mine are stored in the unheated shop right now.

I'm working hard to get these issues resolved. It's 15 degrees F or around -10 celcius right now- working in there without heat is brutal. My $1400 rent payment is due tomorrow, yet I just don't feel like paying up until he delivers what he promised- the furnaces are installed but need to be connected.

I have the option to buy a country property where I can work (without any issues) and have almost got the deal finished. This one is only a 1/2 hour from Detroit, MI.

If I decide to go ahead with this, I will still be offering towing services from the Toronto area and from the Niagara Falls/NY border for the HG jobs. For anyone from Toronto/Hamilton/Kitchener/Waterloo, Northstar Performance's new home would be approx. 40 minutes farther west, and 2 minutes off the 401 highway- very easy to find.

Just please bear with me. It won't be much longer. I just have to make sure I have a heated place to work to avoid any interruption in my business.

dkozloski
03-02-09, 02:54 AM
If you need some heat get a BT-400 from Aerotech in Winnepeg. There are a dozen outfits here in Fairbanks that rent portable heaters for contractors. Some are made in Canada. Make sure it's indirect so you don't die from the CO.

greg-sls
03-02-09, 06:34 PM
What's required to change out the lower mount? Is this something that has to be done in a shop? I'm assuming the lower mount (whether AJ's or OEM) is sandwiched between the cradle and the bottom of the engine. So do you support the block and drop the cradle or lift the block for a changeout? Thanks.

97EldoCoupe
03-03-09, 07:59 PM
I've never replaced a mount without having the engine out. Lucky me :) I think raising the engine slightly with a wide, thick board and floor/bottle jack under the oil pan would suffice. Do so at your own risk- these are aluminum oil pans and you have to be careful. Remember it has to be raised enough for the stud to clear the subframe. That's a long stud on the mount. I considered making mine with a bolt from the bottom so it would be easier to install but you have to raise the engine to get the old one out anyway so it won't make it any easier.

At last 10 mounts are now in production. I have to set up something to hold the steel bushing at the correct depth inside the mount while I pour the polyurethane rubber compound inside the mount. I'm setting up a jig that will allow me to set the depth of these bushings so they're in the right place and the correct depth. I'll pour all 10 at the same time- that rubber compound is some nasty stuff to work with- pours like corn syrup and sticks like it too.

Ranger
03-03-09, 08:58 PM
that rubber compound is some nasty stuff to work with- pours like corn syrup and sticks like it too.
It it tough though? I'm sure it will be under some very strong pressure at WOT.

97EldoCoupe
03-03-09, 09:22 PM
When it cures it's tough. It has a shore hardness of A80 if I'm correct. Still flexible as a mount should be, but still stiff and strong to withstand all the WOTs your heart desires.

greg-sls
03-04-09, 11:09 AM
AJ - thanks for the tips on the change-out. It sounds risky for a "shade tree" mechanic. I doubt I would chance putting a jack on the oil pan to do it, even with a good-sized board. So it seems most of us would get the lower mount changed at a shop - and it sounds expensive. No wonder everyone is griping about the factory mounts. I hope your invention works as I've looked carefully at your prototype. As with Ranger's, my only concern would be the durability of the compound under extreme stress and weather conditions. Good luck with your concept and I hope the testers have good results too.

MCH
03-06-09, 10:44 AM
1/2 hour from Detroit thats grate when the time come to do the HG
your just a 1/2 hour tow away awsome Mike from the Metro Detroit area

Hogg
03-06-09, 02:05 PM
Jakes motor mount in my 98 STS has held up to many many WOT blasts. Including 0-150mph blasts.
There is some increased NVH characteristics compared to a stock mount. Only noticeable while at WOT, mostly in 1st gear only.
WOT launches seem to have less wheelspin than before.
There is a pronounced thud when the throttle if lifted rapidly from WOT conditions. Esp when at speed in manually selected 2nd gear, when going from full throttle to closed throttle with engine braking in effect.
Going from WOT to engine braking in manual 2nd gear causes the engine to rock on its mounts to its greatest degree. Repeated WOT to closed throttle will result in this thud everytime the throttle is closed. This may be alarming to some Cadillac owners. I beleive the mount in my car is a prototype tester, so jake may have revised the design somewhat.

During normal driving the engine mount is seemless and imperceptible.

I dont see these mounts failing.

peace
Hog

Ranger
03-06-09, 03:52 PM
NVH characteristics?

I hope the thud has been taken care of. That is not something I'd care for at all. That would indicate slack to me. If the mount is good and solid there should be very little engine movement, something else I do not want in a mount. That was the reason for my comment in post #129.

FrankT
03-06-09, 07:47 PM
I agree with Ranger, if there is a thud then there is too much slack some where. My car exibits the thud, but thats because the factory motor mount is broken. Maybe Hogg has other issues with his sts, his trans mount or rear engine mount maybe bad too. Just something to think about.

I am concerned with NVH characteristics too, thats why I didn't go with the solid mount.

Ranger
03-06-09, 10:05 PM
I'm still trying to figure out what NVH characteristics are. :confused:

greg-sls
03-07-09, 11:06 AM
Noise Vibration and Harshness. Yes, the thud is still a concern if a new OEM mount does not exhibit the same characteristics by comparison.

Robertsong
03-08-09, 03:50 PM
FUnny, I have a 4.6L 270HP '94 Concours and I had the mounts and topside wishbones replaced. I get the same groaning sound in reverse when I first start it up. Then placing in "O"(drive) same groan. After that the thing runs fine, no embarrasing groans or grunts. Is it definitely the mounts? How do they go that easy. I just learned last night that I should try WOT to get the rough running sorted out. So I am not jumping on it. Is there some other reason for blowing the mounts?
Thanks for any inputs

greg-sls
03-08-09, 04:31 PM
I'm having similar symptoms on my 97 and have been thru everything on both belt trains for the mysterious "groan" you describe. I used an auto stethoscope with a long probe to find it - no luck. That's when I stumbled on this thread and wondered if it could be the lower mounts. Both of the "dogbone" mounts are replaced, but they do not account for engine noise that transmits thru a bad lower mount(s). BTW, how much did it cost you to have the lower mounts replaced? The upper ones are a snap and had I them done in less than 1/2 hour for about $20.

Ranger
03-08-09, 09:37 PM
The engines with the dog bones rarely have the mounts go bad. It's the ones without the dog bones. I am almost positive that the groan I hear it the trans cable being pushed or pulled an inch or so through the rubber grommet in the firewall from the engine movement.

greg-sls
03-09-09, 10:59 AM
Ranger, do you happen to know what year the dog bones went away?

Ranger
03-09-09, 01:50 PM
Yours has them. I think they disappeared in '98 or '99.

JimD
03-09-09, 06:32 PM
Yours has them. I think they disappeared in '98 or '99.

1998 was the first year of the "K" platform for the Seville. Endured from '98 until '04 when the Seville name disappeared.

My '98 Seville does not have the dog bones....

greg-sls
03-09-09, 08:51 PM
Thanks Ranger and JimD. I had no idea the dogbones were eliminated! So I will assume that 97 and prior N* with dogbone struts rarely have lower mount problems.

ewill3rd
03-11-09, 09:20 AM
If you have a dogbone upper mount this job is harder.
Support the engine by using the steel plate bolted between the engine and transmission, it's tough and it won't hurt anything.
On the newer ones there are a few quick tricks to dropping the cradle and you don't have to worry about it falling out like you do on the older ones with the dog bone mounts.
Warranty time on these dropped to .8 and sometimes that is even longer than it actually takes on the post-dog bone cars.

mtflight
03-11-09, 10:46 AM
If you have a dogbone upper mount this job is harder.

eOKHY4woJrY
Here is a Youtube in which the audio was censored. This was for the side mount, not the front one, but the cradle process is pretty much the same (I think).

I'll look for the original and repost it when I have time (this time without copyrighted music :duck: )



On the newer ones there are a few quick tricks to dropping the cradle and you don't have to worry about it falling out like you do on the older ones with the dog bone mounts.
Warranty time on these dropped to .8 and sometimes that is even longer than it actually takes on the post-dog bone cars.

What are the tricks to dropping the cradle on the newer ones ('03 DHS)? I too have a front mount starting to go.

greg-sls
03-11-09, 12:36 PM
Mtflight - interesting Utube. I watched it but without the audio, it was harder to follow what this guy was trying to tell us. His Seville looked newer than mine (98 or newer) so I'm assuming it did not have the upper dogbones. Ewill3rd says the older generation with the dogbones is harder - not good news for some of us. I wonder if Ewill3rd would mind telling us what a shop usually charges for the changeout? Anyway, could you provide the original link to this Utube so we can get the audio comments?

mtflight
03-11-09, 12:41 PM
Mtflight - interesting Utube. I watched it but without the audio, it was harder to follow what this guy was trying to tell us. His Seville looked newer than mine (98 or newer) so I'm assuming it did not have the upper dogbones. Ewill3rd says the older generation with the dogbones is harder - not good news for some of us. I wonder if Ewill3rd would mind telling us what a shop usually charges for the changeout? Anyway, could you provide the original link to this Utube so we can get the audio comments?

That's a 98 Eldorado... so it has the upper dogbones (it was my car).
my local Cadillac dealership is $137 an hour x 0.8 = $109 labor (for the easier newer non-dogbone version). On my 98 ETC the quote was closer to $500 including the part.

I don't have the edited video, only the original footage which entails re-editing it (this takes a couple hours so I'm not sure when I'll be able to re-upload it).

Ranger
03-11-09, 01:06 PM
I hope Jake gets these mounts ready soon. My warranty is ticking away. After May 20th I have to do the job myself. Come oooon Jake. tick tick tick.

greg-sls
03-12-09, 11:46 AM
mtflight - thanks for the pricing info on the change-out...I was afraid of that! Nice ride you've got there - was that you in the video? So in the original Utube, why was the commentary muted? Maybe more space than Utube allows? If it takes 2 hours to upload, I could understand that.

AlBundy
03-17-09, 01:22 AM
Good to see ya back mtflight and thanks for the video.;)

mtflight
03-19-09, 11:44 AM
was that you in the video? So in the original Utube, why was the commentary muted? Maybe more space than Utube allows? If it takes 2 hours to upload, I could understand that.

I had Led Zeppelin in the background music, and they decided to mute the whole thing due to copyright.

Editing the video from scratch and uploading would take a couple of hours.

That's actually JC316 doing the work, I was just holding the camera, and provided the vehicle for "demonstration purposes" :histeric:

and thanks AlBundy!

greg-sls
03-20-09, 01:05 PM
Mtflight - I get it now...too bad about that copyright infringement. JC316 seems to know what he's doing, but without his commentary, it would be difficult to re-create the process. It looks like he put 2 jack-stands under each side and had 2 floor-jacks to lift the engine up to gain access to the mount(s). I surmise that he disconnected the dog-bones above, but did he also disconnect part of the exhaust tube? How far did he jack the engine to gain access? It looks like he put a 4x4 under the steel plate between the transmission and the engine to lift it - is that true? Maybe you and JC can list the process step by step and we the members can then use the Utube video to see what was done. I've been hearing that the mid-90s Sevilles and Eldorados have 2 lower mounts...I don't know if that's true or not...if so, where is the other one?
Also, when you finished the change-out, did you notice less engine vibration thru the car at idle? Thanks again for the video.

tateos
03-20-09, 05:11 PM
There is a steel plate or brace between the oil pan and the transaxle - that is what ewill was referring to.

When I did my front mount on my 2000, I had to loosen the rear cradle bolts, support the engine/trans, just like ewill said, with a floor jack, and use another floor jack on the front to lower the front of the cradle, after completely removing the front bolts. I actually let the front of the cradle down far enough that the jack was not even holding it up - I had to pull down on the cradle to get enough clearance to get the mount out.

Maybe this all sounds scary to some, and maybe it would have been for me too, except I had dropped the cradle completely to do my HG project on my '97, so this was a piece of cake by comparison.

Does that help?

Ranger
03-20-09, 06:27 PM
This is not sounding like fun, but if Jake doesn't come through pretty soon, looks like I may be tackling it.

greg-sls
03-20-09, 06:44 PM
Thanks Tateos, it does...but a 2000 is supposed to be different than a 97, from what I understand, there are no dog-bones on a 2000. If your second paragraph would also apply to a 97, then it would explain the process. Also is there a rear lower mount for a 97 and where is it located? It sounds like you didn't need to disconnect any part of the exhaust system to do this.

ryannel2003
03-22-09, 10:40 PM
Don't think I'm going to be able to wait much longer on these mounts. My idle is getting worse and my 60-75mph vibration continues to annoy me. Going to go ahead and drop the money to get mine done in a few weeks. When it goes again hopefully the new mounts are ready.

Ranger
03-23-09, 12:03 AM
I know Jake has some stuff going on, but has anyone heard anything from him? I'm getting close to having to do the same thing, just have the dealer replace the factory mount with anther that will only last a year.

AlBundy
03-23-09, 12:23 AM
You guys need to decide if your car can take the delayed repair or your mechanical/cautious concern?

97EldoCoupe
03-23-09, 09:20 AM
It's been a while since I posted here. Ranger I know your situation with the warranty and you are the thread starter/first tester for the mount.

To everyone in this thread: My deepest apologies for not having the mounts ready as of yet. No more empty promises- I know what has to be done and I know it has to be done now.

Update on the status of Northstar Performance's future:

-stopped renting the shop because the owner didn't get the heat hooked up in time, and he decided that he would invite himself inside without my concent or me being there. NOT going to happen with me.

-I have the downpayment set and the offer completed on a 1.67 acre property with a 55x80' shop. My mortgage broker is being a PITA- he's been slacking and I'm about ready to fire him. Turns out one of my customers who owns a '97 STS is a mortgage broker (small world!)and says he can have the mortgage all set for me in 48hours. The offer's been extended twice already because of this jackass broker so I doubt they'll do it again. I have until the end of the day today to sign for the place. And for that I have to have the financing 100% secured, or I could be sued. We'll see a bit later on.

The cars keep coming. When I complete one, two more show up at my door! This is great news- people trust my repairs and the studs are holding up- no failures yet although I may post a related issue in a separate post soon. I've had so many calls from customers saying that studs are ultimately the way to go. The installations are going smooth and I haven't had one reported failure.

Bottom line is without a place to work, I'm screwed and so is Northstar Performance. That is my #1 priority. If this place falls through, I found back-up- a shop for rent with a 2 post hoist and two bays. Not excessively large, but it will do the job and it's close to me.

Guys I know the wait is hard but trust me, it will be worth it.

97EldoCoupe
03-23-09, 09:29 AM
In response to Hogg's comment on the mount- yes it is the first prototype. The thud would have to come from some other mount somewhere because I know for a fact there was no play in that mount. I tightened the nuts well- Hogg, please have a look underneath and double check the nut torque if you wouldn't mind.

The NVH is something I will need to test on more than one car because I did not check the condition of Hogg's trans mounts- it could be that my new mount exhibits some NVH but it may not. If I'm correct the '98+ Seville has four mounts- one on each side in the wheel wells, one on the front, and one on the back. It's the front that is taking 90% of the abuse of WOT.

The three testers will have to compare my mount to the original and I will be installing one in my '98 as well. I installed a new one in May of '08 but I wouldn't be surprised if it's on it's way out too.

I was thinking about increasing the diameter of the steel tubing to allow for more polyurethane cushioning to absorb a bit more of the NVH.

ryannel2003
03-23-09, 10:52 AM
Jake no rush on the mounts if you're really busy now. I am going to go ahead and replace mine (replaced in June '08) with OEM because it has now gotten to the point where when sitting at a stoplight you can feel the engine slightly shaking and the 60-75MPH vibration is also annoying to me (not bad, but its starting to get to me). It also clunks through the gears but you get my point here. I'm so shocked that GM continued to produce this design when this car was marketed as a sports sedan in '98. I drive my car hard like it was meant to be and at the rate I'm going now I would be replacing my OEM mount every 6 months. I'm looking forward to purchasing your mount and never having to worry about it again.

Chadillac182
03-23-09, 12:49 PM
In response to Hogg's comment on the mount- yes it is the first prototype. The thud would have to come from some other mount somewhere because I know for a fact there was no play in that mount. I tightened the nuts well- Hogg, please have a look underneath and double check the nut torque if you wouldn't mind.

The NVH is something I will need to test on more than one car because I did not check the condition of Hogg's trans mounts- it could be that my new mount exhibits some NVH but it may not. If I'm correct the '98+ Seville has four mounts- one on each side in the wheel wells, one on the front, and one on the back. It's the front that is taking 90% of the abuse of WOT.

The three testers will have to compare my mount to the original and I will be installing one in my '98 as well. I installed a new one in May of '08 but I wouldn't be surprised if it's on it's way out too.

I was thinking about increasing the diameter of the steel tubing to allow for more polyurethane cushioning to absorb a bit more of the NVH.

Hey Jake - I've finally made it to the Forums! I'm the guy that usually bugs you through email (ballinbackcadillac@hotmail.com)
I had no idea you were developing mounts like this!! I just replaced the mount in my 2002 Deville with another OEM. The swap wasn't too bad.. Just removed the two front frame bolts.. with the ol' jack stand under the oil pan. Be gentle! Just make sure you have the hood open when you lower the car. Doing it this way will give you just enough clearance to Remove and Install. I'm sure I will be doing this again, so let me know when these are ready to go!! I would love to try one out.

-Chad.

greg-sls
03-25-09, 07:17 PM
Has anyone here used Rockauto's mounts? I was just looking at the lower mount for a 97 SLS there and it looks like they photographed a junkyard piece! They only offer a brand called "Anchor", which I've never heard of - apparently they refurbs.

dalamak
03-26-09, 02:28 PM
Has anyone here used Rockauto's mounts? I was just looking at the lower mount for a 97 SLS there and it looks like they photographed a junkyard piece! They only offer a brand called "Anchor", which I've never heard of - apparently they refurbs.

I've used Anhcor on my Chevy S-10, its just a generic mount

jimsbox
03-26-09, 08:41 PM
My DHS overheated a week ago and the engine appears to have rocked forward and nearly rubbed through the upper radiator hose as well as cracking the lower hose nipple on the radiator. How many motor and tranny mounts are there on this car? When would I be able to get one of the mounts and how to order and pay?

Thanks, Jim

greg-sls
03-27-09, 07:07 PM
I'm not sure how similar a 95 and and a 97 are Jim, but I think we have one lower engine mount along with the upper "dogbones". I was checking Rockauto and for a 97 there are 2 transmission mounts too. I don't know where they are or if anyone here has ever changed them out. Several posts back, there's a Utube with JC316 changing the lower mount on a 98. Unfortunately, the commentary was muted so it's hard to follow. It looks like a scary job though. As far as Jake making one of his concept mounts for the 95...he may be concentrating on newer models (post 2000) first.

jimsbox
03-28-09, 01:48 AM
Actually, I gave my 95 STS to my best friend with 285000 miles on it. This is my 2000 DHS with 270000 miles on it. It doesn't have the dog bones on it.

greg-sls
03-28-09, 12:14 PM
Jim - you might be in luck as from what I can follow here, Jake is starting his new-concept mounts for the 2000+ type designs. Maybe you can PM him and get added to the list. He has 3 selected "testers" who will try out the new design before there is a general offering on them. If you like to WOT, this new mount is supposed handle it without wearing out.

jimsbox
03-29-09, 11:06 PM
Greg, I tried to PM him but was blocked from doing it due to spam considerations, that is why I put it on this thread. I would like to get in on it before the 31st to save the $30.00.

Thanks for your reply, Jim

greg-sls
03-30-09, 12:18 PM
You might try to reach him publicly thru his thread here called
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/northstar-performance-technical-discussion/165184-hg-jobs-all-anywhere-canada-usa.html
to see if you can get on his list. It sounds like Jake is moving his business to a better location from what I can follow. I'm sure he has a lot going on for that process.

Hogg
03-30-09, 03:04 PM
Just as an update. After finally getting the car into the shop, with the hood up, I cycled the gear selector from D to N with a bit of throttle. When placed in drive, the front of the engine cocks up a good few inches, then settles back down in Neutral, and is stationary in reverse. The clunk is occuring as the engine settles back down.

Needless to say, I need to get the car on the rack so I can get under and inspect the trans and engine mounts.

I am very lucky that something really bad hasnt happened with my spirited driving style.
I am not 100% sure on the locations and orientations of the engine/trans mounts, I will know more when I get under it.

I will post back once I get a look under the car. We have a different 98 STS that we are pulling the passenger side back out. It is a Z code car with 89,000kms. It was bought for $1000 and needs about $2000 to finish. Beautiful car. It should be done in a week, when its out, my car goes in.

I originally assumed it was just the characteristics of the mount, obviously it isnt.
peace
Hog

Submariner409
03-30-09, 03:22 PM
Even with the squishy original mount the engine should roll no more than an inch, at most. "A few inches" is pending disaster - first coolant lines go, then the exhaust flex at the cat front, and so on.

Jake's idea is the best of all worlds - just enough "give" to damp most of the normal driving vibration, not enough travel to allow the engine to rock more than 1/2". Perfect.

Another way to beef up a stock mount is to use a premade truck tailgate cable - they come in all lengths with swaged eyes - and use it as a doubled "snubber" around the cradle up to a motor mount bolt on the block. Tight work, but doable. Set it so the cable loop allows only 1/2" of engine travel before the cable snubs the rotation. Same thing we used to do near the l/f motor mount on a SBC.

Hogg
03-31-09, 01:18 PM
Even with the squishy original mount the engine should roll no more than an inch, at most. "A few inches" is pending disaster - first coolant lines go, then the exhaust flex at the cat front, and so on.

Jake's idea is the best of all worlds - just enough "give" to damp most of the normal driving vibration, not enough travel to allow the engine to rock more than 1/2". Perfect.

Another way to beef up a stock mount is to use a premade truck tailgate cable - they come in all lengths with swaged eyes - and use it as a doubled "snubber" around the cradle up to a motor mount bolt on the block. Tight work, but doable. Set it so the cable loop allows only 1/2" of engine travel before the cable snubs the rotation. Same thing we used to do near the l/f motor mount on a SBC.
I agree on the "disaster' statement. CAr isnt being driven until the engine gets "nailed down".

the front of the engine raises about 2-3 inches when in drive and throttle is applied, then when the throttle is released or trans placed in neutral, the front of teh engine comes down with a clunk.

I'm interested to see what I'll find.

peace
Hog

Ranger
03-31-09, 05:04 PM
I'm interested to see what I'll find.
So are we. Please let us know.

Ranger
04-14-09, 10:12 PM
Are we any closer to seeing these mounts Jake? I'm down to 35 days of warranty left, minus shipping and scheduling a date to get it in.

97EldoCoupe
04-23-09, 07:25 PM
Ranger I apologize for my extremely late response. I will make sure you get the 2nd prototype mount before then. What date exactly does your warranty expire? I'll be sending a mount "on-the-house" (Tax write off, promotional item) as soon as can be.

-Jake

Ranger
04-23-09, 11:19 PM
May 20 is the magic date Jake. :( I'm on my own after that.

97EldoCoupe
04-24-09, 12:55 AM
There will be a mount on your doorstep by May 15th. It's waited long enough, time to get my @ss in gear with the mounts. As soon as my thumb heals a bit and I get back from my trip that's my priority.

The original concept will have to be modified slightly to provide a bit more cushioning. The movement was great but the vibes were still there just a bit more than I prefer. A bit more rubber or slightly different shore hardness. I've also considered a couple of other designs that are a quite different from the first one that Hogg has.

97EldoCoupe
04-27-09, 12:47 AM
I cancelled my flight. Too much to do right now.

I've come up with a much better mount design that I will be working on this week. The mount will resemble the factory original, a lot more polyurethane rubber to absorb the drivetrain vibrations. But inside the rubber, there will be a steel "stop" that is cushioned by rubber, that will allow only certain movement. This will prevent the mount from tearing and also keep the drivetrain from lifting too much.

The bottom line is I don't want any more NVH than what the stock mount allows, and the first mount I designed just wasn't going to cut it.

By the way this urethane rubber compound is some wonderful stuff. It is oil proof, gasoline proof, and handles heat. I put it through all of these tests over the last few days.

97EldoCoupe
04-27-09, 05:47 PM
I just placed an order with the CNC shop who cut the plates for the stud kits; they will be cutting the parts for the engine mounts. I'm expecting enough parts cut for 100 mounts, either plasma or laser cut (he's going to get back to me on that). The bases and tops of the mount will be cut from mild steel plate, .1875" thick.

I'll post the progress.

97EldoCoupe
04-27-09, 05:49 PM
Just received an email from the shop, they will be laser cut.

90devilleguy
04-29-09, 12:43 PM
Hey Jake!

Glad to hear things are getting done for these motor mounts! Please put me on what ever list you might have! I'm in dyer need of a mount!

Thanks!

dalamak
05-01-09, 12:55 PM
They should have never removed those upper dog bone mounts, On my 97 I had made a custom set of steel ones with Poly control arm bushings in them. The motor was so tight, and very little vibration.

Can someone get part numbers so we can adapt this mounts back onto the later years?>

Ranger
05-01-09, 06:03 PM
I've looked at the possibility and I can't see anywhere to bolt them to. I'd love to do it.

AlBundy
05-01-09, 06:14 PM
I just looked and I need to replace my dog bones.:rant2:

Ranger
05-01-09, 06:20 PM
Be glad you have them to replace.

ryannel2003
05-02-09, 01:25 AM
I've also recently noticed that Cadillac has now gone back to the dogbones in the '06+ DTS, which most likely explain why they are so much smoother than the pre-'05 models. Even with new motor mounts, the old Deville/Seville's seem to jerk more through the gears than the newest DTS's do.

Unfortunately, the damn K-Body/G-Body shimmy is something that even a brand new DTS still suffers from.

Ranger
05-02-09, 11:31 AM
I've also recently noticed that Cadillac has now gone back to the dogbones in the '06+ DTS
Guess they where replacing too many under warranty.

AlBundy
05-04-09, 10:18 PM
I've also recently noticed that Cadillac has now gone back to the dogbones in the '06+ DTS, which most likely explain why they are so much smoother than the pre-'05 models. Even with new motor mounts, the old Deville/Seville's seem to jerk more through the gears than the newest DTS's do.

Unfortunately, the damn K-Body/G-Body shimmy is something that even a brand new DTS still suffers from.

Glad you typed this as I was considering a 05 STS to purchase. I guess I'll continue to look for a 06.:D

JimD
05-04-09, 11:45 PM
Glad you typed this as I was considering a 05 STS to purchase. I guess I'll continue to look for a 06.:D

Consider the fact you are reading about front wheel drive model vehicles while considering the purchase of a rear wheel drive model vehicle.

Watermelons and grapes.

AlBundy
05-05-09, 05:04 PM
Consider the fact you are reading about front wheel drive model vehicles while considering the purchase of a rear wheel drive model vehicle.

Watermelons and grapes.

Your right. Read wrong.

97EldoCoupe
05-15-09, 03:16 PM
Ranger- I know you sent me your shipping address, please PM it to me once again, thanks. The mount will be out for rush delivery.

Ranger
05-15-09, 06:05 PM
PM sent. I have an appointment for Monday (if they are still in business). Warranty runs out on Wed. Not sure it'll make it on time. I might have to save it for the next time when I have to do it myself.

orconn
05-16-09, 04:32 PM
Are the motor mounts for the a 2002 SLS available for purchase now? I would like to order one for my wife's car. Please let me know.

codewize
05-16-09, 04:45 PM
I haven't been keeping up with this thread so please except my apologies. Can someone bring me up to speed as to what's available and what the cost is.

Thanks :)

Submariner409
05-16-09, 05:42 PM
Based on a post from a few days ago, the motor mount thing is on some indefinite hold........Jake would like to do a redesign to cut down more of the transmitted vibration that comes from using a mount that is too stiff.

The ideal setup would be to design a miniature shock absorber: the engine stud is welded to a perforated plate which rides in a hollow metal tube with extremely heavy silicone grease inside. The top side would have a decent coil spring also, to keep the engine at design spec, level-wise under moderate throttle application. No rubber cookies here, only a shaft seal for the engine stud. You punch the gas, the torque tries to move the engine stud up, the disc, spring and grease damp the movement to ~1/2" when the plate contacts the tube end. Solid contact. No movement.

Just like when you pull the piston of that old basketball pump to the end of its travel: it goes NO further.

Krashed989
05-16-09, 08:24 PM
Based on a post from a few days ago, the motor mount thing is on some indefinite hold........Jake would like to do a redesign to cut down more of the transmitted vibration that comes from using a mount that is too stiff.

The ideal setup would be to design a miniature shock absorber: the engine stud is welded to a perforated plate which rides in a hollow metal tube with extremely heavy silicone grease inside. The top side would have a decent coil spring also, to keep the engine at design spec, level-wise under moderate throttle application. No rubber cookies here, only a shaft seal for the engine stud. You punch the gas, the torque tries to move the engine stud up, the disc, spring and grease damp the movement to ~1/2" when the plate contacts the tube end. Solid contact. No movement.

Just like when you pull the piston of that old basketball pump to the end of its travel: it goes NO further.

You're talking about a little miniaturized MacPherson strut huh? That would be a good idea, but probably be too costly to manufacture.... Personally I like Jakes Idea. I think the square tubing might be a little too small though.

Edit: Wait... he said that he redesigned it earlier... I wonder what it looks like now. :hmm:

Ranger
05-18-09, 09:14 PM
Well, I took the car in today and they said that they would not install a non OEM mount. After inspecting it, they said that the mount was fine. I find it hard to believe. I guess I'll be saving the mount for a DIY project when it DOES go bad. They did replace a strut that was leaking as well a the steering rack that I did not know was leaking. Also got a free 4 wheel alignment. Even though I sat there 6 1/2 hrs. I guess I did OK.

dalamak
05-22-09, 06:24 PM
Well I'm gonna see if I can Fab up some Solid mount, or engine brace this week end, I can't stand ***** fotting the Car becuase the engine is jumping around.


I've got a 97 stroker Transam, with solid steel engine and trans mounts, so I don't mind vibration all that much


I'll let you know what I come up with, gonna have to bring out the welding rig for my exhaust anyways

joe45
05-26-09, 10:54 AM
After replacing my motor mount for the third time I took some light gauge cable and went around the Y shaped bracket and the cradle twice and called it good. I had to pull it tight with a vise grips at each end and then double clamped it. You can feel a vibration when accelerating hard so I might have gotten it a little too tight but its holding.

dalamak
05-26-09, 11:22 AM
Didn't get a chance to play around with it this weekend, Did springs , shocks and struts, and o work on the exhaust, and ran outta time



Well I'm gonna see if I can Fab up some Solid mount, or engine brace this week end, I can't stand ***** fotting the Car becuase the engine is jumping around.


I've got a 97 stroker Transam, with solid steel engine and trans mounts, so I don't mind vibration all that much


I'll let you know what I come up with, gonna have to bring out the welding rig for my exhaust anyways

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 12:06 AM
Well guys, a mount is on its way to Ranger, the 2nd prototype, tester model. As the thread starter, and for being as patient as he has been with me, Ranger's mount is on-the-house (no charge). There are 3 other testers, you know who you are, please all send your shipping addresses. You're all getting a mount free-of-charge as well.

Sorry to everyone else, I can only ship out so many free mounts. Once these have been tested, I will have a better idea how they perform, what changes to make, etc.

I have the jig all set up to the OEM specs and the laser cut washers just came in. Thanks to my dad for going to pick them up from the cutting shop, I didn't have time.

I'm keeping my original design but modifying it however I need to for the right results. Yes it's simple, but it's STRONG. And that's what I like. I'll have to adjust the square tubing length and rubber compound for the right NVH and rubber flex.

The days are numbered now before they'll be available to everyone who needs one, and I can't wait either because almost every HG customer with the 98+Seville/00+Deville needs one. Bad.

Shipping addresses needed please and thanks! PM me or email to info@northstarperformance.com

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 12:17 AM
If anyone is in a desperate hurry for replacement mounts, let me know now. I can ship some out before the testing phase is complete. $130.00, shipping included in Canada/USA. No guarantees on the vibration reduction capabilities, but it seemed to work pretty decent on a 1998 STS when I tested the very first mount. You will definitely not have a problem anymore with the engine lifting/dropping.

90devilleguy
06-02-09, 10:28 AM
If anyone is in a desperate hurry for replacement mounts, let me know now. I can ship some out before the testing phase is complete. $130.00, shipping included in Canada/USA. No guarantees on the vibration reduction capabilities, but it seemed to work pretty decent on a 1998 STS when I tested the very first mount. You will definitely not have a problem anymore with the engine lifting/dropping.

Hey Jake, so on your website you mention that you have 2 different hardnesses available. Are the differences major or minor apart from one another?

I'm still interested either way, i just wanted to know more about what is different between the 2.

Also, have you considered getting decals or stickers made up for the future?

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 12:49 PM
I'll be ordering the other polyurethane rubber compound later today so I can test a softer rubber- but two mounts will be available. One for more NVH reduction, and one for even less engine movement.

Eyekandyboats handles my decals, so I'll probably have him make me some.

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 03:46 PM
I finished a solid mount as well. I need this one to set up more jigs to make the polyurethane mounts anyways. If anyone wants a solid mount, this is what it looks like. Personally I'd stick with the poly mounts but this will hold that Northstar in place. Grade 8 locking hardware is included. Designed to be a direct fit for 98-04 Seville and 00-03 Deville. This will probably fit the V8 Lucernes and the Bonneville GXP. These mounts are priced at $85 US, shipping included to anywhere in Canada or the USA. Guaranteed to never break.

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/solidmount1.jpg

90devilleguy
06-02-09, 04:24 PM
I finished a solid mount as well. I need this one to set up more jigs to make the polyurethane mounts anyways. If anyone wants a solid mount, this is what it looks like. Personally I'd stick with the poly mounts but this will hold that Northstar in place. Grade 8 locking hardware is included. Designed to be a direct fit for 98-04 Seville and 00-03 Deville. This will probably fit the V8 Lucernes and the Bonneville GXP. These mounts are priced at $85 US, shipping included to anywhere in Canada or the USA. Guaranteed to never break.

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/solidmount1.jpg

WOW that's cool. did you get my PM?

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 04:30 PM
Yes I did. I'm limiting to three testers, still waiting for them to send me the shipping addresses.

AJxtcman
06-02-09, 10:38 PM
I finished a solid mount as well. I need this one to set up more jigs to make the polyurethane mounts anyways. If anyone wants a solid mount, this is what it looks like. Personally I'd stick with the poly mounts but this will hold that Northstar in place. Grade 8 locking hardware is included. Designed to be a direct fit for 98-04 Seville and 00-03 Deville. This will probably fit the V8 Lucernes and the Bonneville GXP. These mounts are priced at $85 US, shipping included to anywhere in Canada or the USA. Guaranteed to never break.

http://www.northstarperformance.com/img/solidmount1.jpg

Jake Don't sell that!

Call me and we will talk. I have a new version coming out soon.
Thanks to Edwin the first to break one of my solid mounts. I am going with a new style poly mount.
Maybe you can make them.

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 11:24 PM
AJ you and I are both needed people in the Northstar world. In no way do I want to be in competiton with you- that's not what I'm looking for. What's up? 519-550-0056 - I lost your phone number when my cell phone went down with me in the canoe. Spent a good 1/2 hour under water.

Oh and I still want one of your custom tunes for my STS.

97EldoCoupe
06-02-09, 11:26 PM
How did your mount break? A weld cracked or snapped stud? Vibration can do amazing things, that's why anything rubber will help.

codewize
06-03-09, 12:51 AM
Mine is still intact. Oh, and I sent you an email today regarding the VDR. Did you get that?


Jake Don't sell that!

Call me and we will talk. I have a new version coming out soon.
Thanks to Edwin the first to break one of my solid mounts. I am going with a new style poly mount.
Maybe you can make them.

AlBundy
06-03-09, 01:54 AM
How did your mount break? A weld cracked or snapped stud? Vibration can do amazing things, that's why anything rubber will help.


Good, progress......I like this.:alchi:

joe45
06-08-09, 09:38 AM
I can’t wait until these mounts go on sale. I took a look at my AutoZone replacement lifetime warranty mount this weekend and it’s leaking again! That’s the 3rd one and I even tied this one down with a cable!

97EldoCoupe
06-08-09, 08:34 PM
I'm still waiting to hear back from AJ.

FrankT
06-08-09, 10:02 PM
I canít wait until these mounts go on sale. I took a look at my AutoZone replacement lifetime warranty mount this weekend and itís leaking again! Thatís the 3rd one and I even tied this one down with a cable!

Thanks for posting! I was thinking about the autozone mount, but decided to pass on it. My caddy has gone through at least 3 GM motor mounts.

By the way, I have mine tied down with a cable too. It seems to be working just fine, if the cable doesn't break, I'm leaving it that way. I can then market a $4.99 motor mount repair kit! ;)

97EldoCoupe
06-11-09, 12:11 AM
I was hoping to hear back from AJ- I guess I'll continue with the mounts. Tested a 2000 Deville mount today. The geometry of the mount changed a bit from the Seville in 98-99 to the Deville in 00 (probably to 03) but the mounting, angles, length, diameter, etc.... is all the same. A '98 mount will interchange with a 2003, from my observations. That means the one I've been working on, will work on these all.

Krashed989
06-11-09, 04:33 PM
A '98 mount will interchange with a 2003, from my observations.

That's interesting... Did they change the Deville/SLS/STS motor mounts before they changed the ETC? My dad's 99 ETC has 2 studs on top and bottom (total of 4 studs like on my 94) and from what I've seen/heard the 03's only have 1 stud on top and bottom (total of 2).

97EldoCoupe
06-11-09, 11:35 PM
02 was the last year for the Eldorado. The Eldo kept the old chassis of the 97- Seville and the 99- Deville. They all used two studs on top, two studs on the bottom. Less prone to failure. I am very sure even the '02 Eldo used the old style mount. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Ranger
06-20-09, 08:59 PM
Well guys, a mount is on its way to Ranger, the 2nd prototype, tester model. As the thread starter, and for being as patient as he has been with me, Ranger's mount is on-the-house (no charge). There are 3 other testers, you know who you are, please all send your shipping addresses. You're all getting a mount free-of-charge as well.

Sorry to everyone else, I can only ship out so many free mounts. Once these have been tested, I will have a better idea how they perform, what changes to make, etc.

I have the jig all set up to the OEM specs and the laser cut washers just came in. Thanks to my dad for going to pick them up from the cutting shop, I didn't have time.

I'm keeping my original design but modifying it however I need to for the right results. Yes it's simple, but it's STRONG. And that's what I like. I'll have to adjust the square tubing length and rubber compound for the right NVH and rubber flex.

The days are numbered now before they'll be available to everyone who needs one, and I can't wait either because almost every HG customer with the 98+Seville/00+Deville needs one. Bad.

Shipping addresses needed please and thanks! PM me or email to info@northstarperformance.com

Jake, if you shipped it, it got lost.

ibm4mad
06-28-09, 04:05 AM
I followed the instructions posted in the tech tips section to change my motor mount yesterday -- 2002 Deville. The instructions posted there tell you to remove the four bolts that secure the motor mount bracket to the engine. There are two bolts that connect the bracket to the cylinder head, and then two more bolts that connect the bracket to the engine block. The ones that connect to the engine block are easy to conquer, but the ones that connect to the cylinder head are difficult to undue because of space restrictions; there is some type of thick cooling line (maybe the power steering or transmission cooler) that runs right in the area, and also the exhaust manifold. I ended up using about 8" worth of ratchet extensions plus a UV joint plus a 15mm socket to get those undone. Getting the bolts back in, however, is quite tricky. Those bolts that connect the bracket to the cylinder head are located about 11 inches higher than the top of the mount, and the mount's bracket goes in between a cooler line and the exhaust manifold. This means that you have to have REALLLY skinny hands (I'm 5'10 and weigh 130 pounds) to get your hands into that small area to get the bolts started. I barely did it, and there aren't many people out there thinner than me.

The other problem is that the bracket is huge - perhaps 11 inches -- and also curves, which makes it bulky and difficult to get out from in between the engine and the sub-frame (plus this time you have brake lines to work around), even with the subframe bolts removed. Getting the new motor mount into position is even tougher (of course more difficult than the removal) because you have so many things you need to work around, plus, once you get it into position you can't "flip" it around due to space restrictions so it must be shoved up there correctly and not backwards.

The reason I bring all this up is because on Alldata, there are two listings; the motor mount replacement and the motor mount bracket replacement. To just replace the motor mount, it says:

Raise and support the vehicle. Refer to Vehicle Lifting.
Remove the nut securing the front engine mount to the engine frame.
Remove the engine frame.
Remove the nut securing the front engine mount to the front engine mount bracket.
Remove the front engine mount.

In other words, they're telling you to disconnect the mount from that bulky old bracket so that you can get the old one out and the new one in without having to even worry about wrestling with the bracket. What they DON'T tell you of course is the most crucial piece: how to get to that bolt without removing the mount, bracket and all. It's a low clearance area and I had to use a 1 - 3/16ths inch socket to remove said bolt from the old mount. There was no way I'd be able to fit a 1 and 3/16ths inch socket (or its metric equivalent), plus a socket wrench of any size into that area. Additionally, a box-end wrench probably wouldn't work because the exhaust manifold and engine block is in the way, making the area in which you could maneuver the wrench quite small. So i'm not sure what tools they plan on you using to accomplish the mount replacement in the procedure outlined in Alldata. If anyone knows, could you post your input? This would help tremendously with anyone who needs to do this procedure in the 2000-2005 models.

joe45
07-13-09, 03:33 PM
An easy way I found to install the two 15mm bolts that go into the cylinder head is to (with the beauty cover installed) sit your ass right on top of the engine facing the front of the car and you can slide your hands right in.

97EldoCoupe
07-19-09, 01:56 PM
It's been a while since I've been on the forums. The 12-15 hour days I've been putting in doesn't leave much time for anything.

Ranger the mount was boxed and labeled and ready for shipping but I stalled, again. You probably got the UPS shipping notice a while back. Something about my design just is not right. Hogg's mount snapped. I've been trying to get ahold of him to find out what broke, and haven't gotten a response yet.

I think AJ may have the best alternative solution right now. Is he selling them already?

I've got the replacement body parts for my '98 STS thanks to another forum member- Rene from Montreal, Quebec Canada. It was a long drive getting the car but worth every mile. Now I have another spare N* engine to play around with, too. Since I have snapped a manifold bolt on my '98, I have to pull the engine to remove the bolt.

I replaced the mount on my '98 when I did the HG's with a factory replacement. I think it's still holding up well, but with my lead foot I'm amazed.

I'll be doing some modifications to the N* in my '98 while it's out. For one, I never did anything with the exhaust down-pipe (y-pipe). These are very restrictive- the factory never quite made them like they should have. Another is I'm considering installing the 2000+ roller heads and the 2000+ pistons in the '98 block. I might start a new thread on this. A few projects are simmering on the back burners for now.

But when I re-install the engine in my '98 STS the car will have a new set of dog-bones like the older style STS's, Eldos, and Devilles. Let's face it- the car needs them. 300HP and 295 ft. lbs. is just too much power for one measily mount with one stud coming out at each end. I'm not saying that a mount can't be constructed that will do the job- I might get it right yet, but If a good set of dog-bone mounts were designed, built and installed, this mount problem would be almost non-existent. A factory hydraulic mount could then be used without ever having problems again, or even a good aftermarket mount in conjuction with the dog-bones.

If I can get the output of my STS above the stock 300HP, I want something better to hold that engine down. I started designing a bolt-in-place engine cage that bolts from the strut towers to the front radiator cross-brace, where the dog bones come off of and then bolt to the engine and transmission. Clearance is a big issue and it has to look right. If I do things the way I have planned, it will look stock- like the GM engineers designed and installed this cage & dog-bones right from the factory assembly line. Also this steel cage will add the missing support between the two strut towers on the Sevilles and also add rigidity to the body. Who's with me on the dog-bones? The end-all solution to the annoying mount problem that has had me scratching my head for the last few months. If and when, NO PROMISES THIS TIME, I can get a bolt-together kit for the new body style Seville/STS's and Deville/DTS's, at a decent cost, would there be any takers? I need to know so I can see if this would be feasible. I'm doing a one-off anyways for my STS.

Ranger
07-19-09, 09:59 PM
No problem Jake. As I may have mentioned, when I had it in for warranty service, they said that the mount was still good. Not sure I am buying that, but if and when I have to replace it, I'd much rather do it with one I KNOW will hold up. Haven't heard anything about AJ's yet. I think I'll have another look at a fabricated dogbone type of brace. Like you I am convinced that it the way to go.

STSS
07-19-09, 11:07 PM
If you sold a set of dogbones that would bolt to the 98+, I'd buy a set, or two!

orconn
08-24-09, 12:36 AM
Where do we stand on the motor mounts for the 98 and later Sevilles? does anyone have a new and improved one available for purchase?

TimPic
09-09-09, 05:59 PM
I love the Shit outta you guys and this forum, and my Caddy's but the truth is we're never gonna see, a member come up with a good mod, or upgrade for these cars cause its just not marketable. Whether it be PCM, ENGINE or something as silly as a mount, everything is one off, the poly steel dog bones I made for my 97, I couldn't make and sell them, the custom Double Din dash kit for my sevilles (before metro came out with them), custom exhausts, its call stuff that people would like, but not enough, and even less would be willing to spend then money it costs for guys to fabricate them.

I wish there were a better mount, I wish there was a ECM tuner, I wish for a lot of things, but the truth is if ya want it come up with a solution, if ya can't your out of luck,

Good luck, god bless

FTT843
09-16-09, 03:04 AM
Any Leftover Mounts Laying Around?

94CaddyConcours
09-22-09, 11:13 PM
Hey Jake maybe a mount similar to the red one for CTS being offer for sale by a member in the classified section

http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt215/Den_93/DSC06517.jpg

ibm4mad
09-23-09, 12:32 AM
Mine broke again. The last one lasted THREE MONTHS!

I'm at a real loss here. I try to do WOTs periodically (per the well-discussed topics of "exercising northstars,") and yet by doing that I break motor mounts more often. My current front mount went in June 28, 2009 and today (September 22) I found out it was busted!

I'm thinking about using a chain or cable this time to tie the engine down to the crossmember so that the hydraulic mount is still isolating the engine from vibrating the car, while the chain/steel cable prevents the engine from "flying back" too much. I'm thinking that a chain, with the ends secured by a turnbuckle (so that you can tighten it up real good) might be the solution.

Ranger
09-23-09, 12:25 PM
A chain or cable won't work. I looked at it. Brake lines are in the way. Try this instead.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/northstar-performance-technical-discussion/175113-fabricated-torque-strut-2000-norhtstar.html

Submariner409
09-23-09, 02:59 PM
That red motor mount is very similar to what Jake was working on 4 months ago. Go way back in this thread for pictures.

I also crawled around under my STS and the cable thingy is just too problem-prone. Not like a longitudinal installation where there's plenty of room at the driver's side mounts.

Krashed989
09-27-09, 11:52 PM
Did anyone actually put a mount to market?

I have a design ready, but I don't want to compete with my fellow caddy enthusiasts. All I have to do is make a jig, get the materials and figure out what the cost would be. Of course I would also become an authorized vendor before selling anything on here.

Krashed989
09-29-09, 12:03 AM
Last chance... If nobody objects, I'm going to take a swing at it.

Who would be interested if I were to make one?

Krashed989
09-29-09, 04:54 AM
This or something similar will be the guts of my mount:
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c296/Krashed989/100_1642.jpg

I just need to make a jig to get it into the right position and get some polyurethane to make a mold around it.

Submariner409
09-29-09, 09:58 AM
That may work with 1/4" of slack molded into the polyurethane cookie. Before you cast the cookie around the links, use a vise to close that chain quick link, otherwise it will flex on the eyebolt curve. (Imagine pinching your thumb and forefinger together.) The bugaboo is that this idea has no lateral control over engine sideways movement.

Remember that the engine also sits on the mount when no torque is applied, so the poly cookie needs to be some pretty tough stuff to take the pressure.

Krashed989
09-29-09, 02:12 PM
...The bugaboo is that this idea has no lateral control over engine sideways movement...

Hmmm.... How much lateral control do you think it would need?

Submariner409
09-29-09, 02:29 PM
Judging by the GM mount and the orientation of the metal cups around the boot, about 1/4" to 3/8" limit to sideways/front-back motion.

There's still the transmission mounts and the front (passenger side) engine mounts, so the "front center" engine mount we're talking about still doesn't do all the torque control, so that (lateral movement) point may be of little concern. Consider that the mount in question is located in the approximate center of torque effort on the engine, so I'd guess that there's not really a lot of (related to the crankshaft) longitudinal twist there, looking at it again.

mikelawson
09-30-09, 02:31 AM
I don't like to promise things I can't back up, but I should have a prototype motor mount in by 10/15/09. I've been working with a local manufacturer and expect the end result to resemble the red mount in the pic above. I'm assuming there will be little NVH issues as I have some ideas to combat that, but first a prototype and a few testers are needed. I will need a few testers, so let me know if there are any takers and I'll get the final production costs and what I can get the testers cost down to. I'm guessing 130-150 for production and 50-60 for a tester, but those are early estimates. I don't think anyone here has to worry about competiton as a solution has yet to be found and multiple solutions are not a bad thing at all. I will get some pics of my final mount soon.

Mike.

Krashed989
09-30-09, 02:56 AM
I have no cars to test mine on either... I am going to buy one of the current replacement motor mounts and fabricate my jig to that though.

I don't think the NVH will be bad with my design but if it is I have an idea to nullify it.

ibm4mad
10-05-09, 12:52 AM
About a week ago, I replaced the front center motor mount for my 2002 Deville. This one lasted about 3 months: Late June to late September 2009. It turns out, another motor mount was broken -- the rear transmission one (the rearmost mount, rectangular in shape). I think that the poor design of the mount, combined with my lead foot, combined with added stress from the other broken mount, caused this front center mount to break in a mere 3 months.

I was ready to put up a beefed up / aftermarket one on, but no one had one available at the time, so I was forced to put another OEM one in. For what its worth (for those currently on the fence about whether or not to design one), I plan on purchasing an aftermarket mount when this one breaks, because I simply don't want to make a habit out of doing all that labor 4 times a year. I'm sure many other members feel the same way, not only the DIY owners who are sick of doing this repeatedly (like me) but also owners who are tired of footing the bill for this every so often.

Krashed989
10-05-09, 06:08 AM
I have a motor mount on order right now ($95 with shipping). I will have it by next weekend so I can use it to fabricate a jig. I need to experiment with polyurethane to get the softness right. I don't want it to be too hard because then it will transmit a lot of vibration through the subframe and might break easily, but I don't want it to be too soft because that would compromise its structural integrity. I think the cradle bushings do a lot of the vibration dampening, so vibration shouldn't be that much of a problem even with a hard mount. I'm going to see if I can find a car locally that I can test it on, if not then I will have to rely whoever purchases it. Of course the first few will be cheap. For shipping, I'm going to stick with flat rate boxes, unless otherwise specified. I don't know about prices yet, because I'm still in the design phase.

TimPic
12-12-09, 08:21 PM
can someone give me som dimensional specs on the motor mount, distance between pad to pad, and the angle on the lower bolt, I picked up some Flexane, and am going to give a shot at making a mount, if not guess I'll just have to pick one up at the auto parts store, and return it when I'm done.


also I was wondering if any one had tried drilling a tap hole in the hydraulic mount draining it cleaning it out and filling it with flexane, my only thought is the outter rubber would still probably eventually rip, and with out the inside of the mount actually being prepped and gritted, the flexan wouldn't adhere

GoFish
02-10-10, 11:54 AM
Long topic but good info. My 2000 STS needs front mount again and hopefully not any of the others. This is about the 4th time now. Am I back to AutoZone or has someone come up with a viable alternative? It does need some damping capability - I don't want a welded stick. This car wants to vibrate enough without encouraging it.

But I sure am tired of putting in these OEM mounts that seem to tear apart the first time I hit WOT. 6 months of "fun" driving and you are definitely needing the front mount replaced. Then I'm feathering it for a year or more until I'm ready to wrestle another one in. Nuisance job! Anybody know if there is a mount that really lives and works?

I also saw the topic on strut-type mount. First impression - that's a good approach. But I don't feel like doing all that fabrication. Sure wish smart engineers at Cadillac had figured this out instead.

Still hanging with this old car despite the many nuisance items like these mounts and plastic breaking all over.

Thanks for any info on a good quality front mount for this engine.

Submariner409
02-10-10, 12:43 PM
TimPic, Go back to the beginning of this thread and then also look way back in Northstar Performance threads - a year or so ago. Many, many posts and pics of several attempts at making flex and solid Northstar front mounts.

You're probably #6 to try it..............

auroradude
02-10-10, 01:43 PM
i think with the 95-99 engines its more of the oil leaking onto the mounts ruining them. at least thats what it is for mine. Ruined both trans mounts again, 2 yrs later. another $677 down the drain with install

Ranger
02-10-10, 05:44 PM
Long topic but good info. My 2000 STS needs front mount again and hopefully not any of the others. This is about the 4th time now. Am I back to AutoZone or has someone come up with a viable alternative? It does need some damping capability - I don't want a welded stick. This car wants to vibrate enough without encouraging it.

But I sure am tired of putting in these OEM mounts that seem to tear apart the first time I hit WOT. 6 months of "fun" driving and you are definitely needing the front mount replaced. Then I'm feathering it for a year or more until I'm ready to wrestle another one in. Nuisance job! Anybody know if there is a mount that really lives and works?

I also saw the topic on strut-type mount. First impression - that's a good approach. But I don't feel like doing all that fabrication. Sure wish smart engineers at Cadillac had figured this out instead.

Still hanging with this old car despite the many nuisance items like these mounts and plastic breaking all over.

Thanks for any info on a good quality front mount for this engine.
Lock the motor down and prevent the mounts from stretching with a torque strut.
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/northstar-performance-technical-discussion/175113-fabricated-torque-strut-2000-norhtstar.html

97EldoCoupe
02-10-10, 07:35 PM
I just installed a solid mount in a customers car about 2 weeks ago. There is noticeable vibration. A little bit. Barely any engine movement.

Soon I will be slowing down with head gasket replacements and get back into aftermarket developments. I gave up on this mount project because I thought AJ had a nice mount developed already- didn't he?

GoFish
02-11-10, 12:33 PM
Thanks for the info. I did see that torque strut topic, and the braces you made might be my solution. Didn't want to mess with that, but I think I'll have to as I'm not seeing any silver bullet mounts that will dampen and live for awhile. I'm also not convinced poking around here that I'll do any better trying to correctly tension a cable or two around the cradle.

This whole front mount is just a terrible design - way inadequate for the torque being applied to it. So I get that it's a difficult problem to solve at the mount itself other than just putting a solid mount there. But I don't think that's the solution, either. A top brace does seem to be a good thing to try, and I'll re-visit that topic and probably beat up/weld up some tubing this weekend when I do mounts. Ugh!

Ranger, as I recall from reading that topic the other day it seems like you did that about a year ago - has it worked as you hoped and saved your front mount as you hoped? Any other issues with radiator crossbar or anything?

Again, thanks for the info. You all are very helpful on this board.