: Mercury - 1939-2012 - RIP



Lord Cadillac
06-11-08, 10:05 PM
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/06/10/we-got-nothin-supplier-says-no-more-mercury-past-2012/

Any thoughts?

First Plymouth, then Oldsmobile, now Mercury... It looks as if Pontiac is next...

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-11-08, 10:07 PM
Sheesh, but I can't say we didn't see the writing on the wall. Actually, come to think of it, I can't really think of a memorable Mercury that was made in my lifetime. :/

Playdrv4me
06-11-08, 10:18 PM
Jesda showed me this yesterday and I still say this news is nothing to take very seriously. 2012 is THREE model years away and Ford has been known to back out on ending SINGLE models at the last moment before (Excursion) when they had originally planned to kill them. At this point Ford hasn't even MADE an announcement of Mercury dying yet and people are already taking this supplier news as set in stone.

No one would like to see Mercury die and be done with more than I WOULD, but I also know Ford is extremely leary of a repeat of the fiasco that happened with Olds dealers and ALWAYS has been. This is the reason they don't commit to ANYTHING with Mercury because they have no idea what to do with it.

The only POSSIBLE way Mercury can survive (and this would dovetail with the U.S. supplier news coincedentally) is if it becomes Ford's SERIOUS outlet for the european market vehicles they want to bring over and *ONLY* if they don't simply practice badge engineering and give Ford the same model.

The only way Mercury can be KILLED on the other hand, is if Linc/Merc dealers are given a roughly equivolent amount of product via serious infusion into Lincoln (with what?) or possibly another brand, like Mazda that they can sell alongside it. Unfortunately Lincoln is not Cadillac and dealers would struggle to survive with only one brand. Lincoln/Mercury dealers are ALREADY the PIT of car salesman/showroom '70s stigma... I can only imagine if they lost half their inventory. Seriously, LM dealers are a DEPRESSING place to be.

eldorado99
06-11-08, 10:31 PM
It may be just a Crown Vic, but the Marauder was nothing to scoff at IMO...


Sheesh, but I can't say we didn't see the writing on the wall. Actually, come to think of it, I can't really think of a memorable Mercury that was made in my lifetime. :/

dkozloski
06-11-08, 10:48 PM
Mercury was the name Ford pickups were sold under for years in Canada. Dodges were sold as Fargo. Mercury cars were sold as the Monitor. Buicks were Maple Leafs.

chubbyranger
06-11-08, 10:53 PM
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First Plymouth, then Oldsmobile, now Mercury... It looks as if Pontiac is next...

Mercury has done jack chit since the 1970 Cougar Eliminator. This is a mercy kill just like the Plymouth and Olds. Has the car buying public suffered from their passing?

Playdrv4me
06-11-08, 10:59 PM
Mercury has done jack chit since the 1970 Cougar Eliminator. This is a mercy kill just like the Plymouth and Olds. Has the car buying public suffered from their passing?

Basically, you're absolutely right. Though some would have a serious bone to pick with you about Olds.

Alot of times people are against axing brands over some kind of misplaced domestic loyalty that thinks that LOTS of brands equal a healthy domestic auto industry. I am the opposite, I believe that GM, Ford and that third brand need to do what*ever* is necessary to become lean, mean car producing machines and return to profitability. If that means a few long in the tooth brands end up as casualties, then that's just the state of affairs.

blue07cts
06-12-08, 12:02 AM
I hate to see mercury (and lincoln) doing this bad. not because i am that big of fan or anything but (at least in the case of lincoln) if it were 2 die cadillac would be the only real american luxury brand left (whens the last time chrysler and premium were said in the same sentence?) besides i think fords real problem (well what got them into all it's other's in north america) is the fact that NONE of it's north american brands have any design direction, It almost seems to me that they design something they think will sell on apperance and don't give 2 $hits like anything else they sell (explian how a MKZ/zepher/w/e they call it this year have in common with a MKX? i think if they would pick a design direction and stick with it (instead of just introducing a "flavor of the month" every now and then) they may have a chance..kind of off topic but i had to rant a bit...

AMGoff
06-12-08, 12:38 AM
Sheesh, but I can't say we didn't see the writing on the wall. Actually, come to think of it, I can't really think of a memorable Mercury that was made in my lifetime. :/

While not "memorable" per se... I always felt that the Cougar was a fine automobile (except for it's final, blasphemous, compact, FWD iteration and some of the mid-70's land yachts). The original is a classic in its own right... and I still like the Fox and MN12 platform Cougars of the mid-80s to mid-90s.

It's just a shame that the "personal luxury" market went the way of the dodo. I loved the styling of those years... and while they were never really "firebreathers," the Fox Cougars (as well as the '91-'93 MNs) had the 5.0 V8 which provided decent "oomph" out of the box and could always be tuned up for some more "oomph"... and from '94 'til its end, the old gal had the Ford Modular engine which could take its own performance "enhancements."

I know some think of them as nothing more than either gussied-up T-Birds or watered-down Marks... but they were always my favorite of the trio.

Personally.. I think Mercury died after they killed off the big cat anyway.

Playdrv4me
06-12-08, 01:31 AM
While not "memorable" per se... I always felt that the Cougar was a fine automobile (except for it's final, blasphemous, compact, FWD iteration and some of the mid-70's land yachts). The original is a classic in its own right... and I still like the Fox and MN12 platform Cougars of the mid-80s to mid-90s.

It's just a shame that the "personal luxury" market went the way of the dodo. I loved the styling of those years... and while they were never really "firebreathers," the Fox Cougars (as well as the '91-'93 MNs) had the 5.0 V8 which provided decent "oomph" out of the box and could always be tuned up for some more "oomph"... and from '94 'til its end, the old gal had the Ford Modular engine which could take its own performance "enhancements."

I know some think of them as nothing more than either gussied-up T-Birds or watered-down Marks... but they were always my favorite of the trio.

Personally.. I think Mercury died after they killed off the big cat anyway.

My last experience with Mercury was 1991 and then '93. Both years that my father leased brand new Topaz GS's. Horrible cars mind you, I mean just total trash (although again in this case the Merc was far more upscale looking than the Tempo) but I was 11 years old and I still had the magic of "new car time" to look forward to when dad would go and get a car. Anyhow, back then I remember looking at what would have been the final generation of the Mercury Cougar in its various iterations... XR7, "San Antonian" custom for that market, and even the base model and thinking "THIS IS A CAR!".

That and the Mercury Capri which I kept wishing we would get but never did was my last fond memories of anything having to do with Mercury (the Capri droptop was actually an Australian car anyway). The Marauder raised my eyebrow, but not for very long.

I do have to say all of this happened at one of the SELECT few LM dealers in the world that was actually enjoyable to visit and I believe STILL is the #1 Lincoln Mercury dealer in the entire country... North Park Lincoln Mercury in San Antonio Texas. I remember they had a 3 story parking garage full of Lincolns and thoroughly modern showroom with LOTS of traffic.

hueterm
06-12-08, 05:12 AM
I definitely wasn't sorry to see Plymouth go.

Olds...I'm biased toward the Toronado and the Aurora, and a few other models over the years. However, at the end, it was really me too and probably deserved to go. The Aurora should have been rolled over to another division, though.

Mercury is where Olds was, only worse. If Ford had enough decent vehicles, and would differentiate their styling enough -- they could make it into their alternative brand. The mid-80s T-Bird/Cougar/Mark VII were a perfect example. Almost identical cars, but they looked different. Today, a GM and CV are (were) almost identical -- of course, those always were almost identical... Same w/the 500/Taurus and Montego/Sable.

Changing a grille, taillights, and fake wood for fake stainless just isn't going to cut it. They're fine enough cars, but not different enough to justify 2 dealerships. The exterior styling is going to have to be significantly different to have a chance to succeed. Make one brand rounded and one more square -- something.

However, Ford can barely handle Ford -- so to expect Mercury to be handled correctly is not likely.

Night Wolf
06-12-08, 08:09 AM
Mercury as of the last couple decades has just been slightly more plush Fords.... I'd be sad to see them go, but at the same time, are they really doing much?

I don't see Lincoln going anywhere, even if they didn't have a big hit, it's Lincoln... Fords luxury divsion, as it is now it's only Ford, Merc and Lincoln, take Mercury out of it and that doesn't leave much.

I know one thing tho, Ford really needs to get a worthy car to replace the Town Car, cause so far it looks like they are gonna loose out when they drop the Panther chassis...

CIWS
06-12-08, 08:31 AM
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/06/10/we-got-nothin-supplier-says-no-more-mercury-past-2012/

Any thoughts?

First Plymouth, then Oldsmobile, now Mercury... It looks as if Pontiac is next...


Not a great surprise. IMO American auto makers need to trim their fat. They have too many sub companies and numerous models within them. Look at their competition.


I've owned two cougars in my lifetime. They were fine cars until I traded them in.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-12-08, 10:13 AM
The only Merc's (haha) that I liked that were made in my lifetime are the XR-7 RWD Cougars and the Marauders. That's it. And I don't really even like them that much....they just get an approving nod in their direction.

Submariner409
06-12-08, 11:29 AM
I had a 67 Cougar 289 4-bbl/3-speed auto, black vinyl top. Put duals, springs, air bags, some engine toys on it. Great cat car. My mother owned a 195? Mercury Comet station wagon auto. We affectionately named it "The Vomit".

Stupidly traded my Cougar on an 80 Mustang 2-bbl auto, which was a piece of junk.

Regardless of the company or marketing decisions behind line name changes or drops, it's always sort of depressing to see yet another of the old American marques relegated to history.

It will take a while to dredge up all the old car names...DeSoto, Willys, Crosley, ..............

Jesda
06-12-08, 12:21 PM
The FWD Cougar was a hot seller and a fun little car that brought new young customers into Mercury showrooms. Five or so years ago, tons of teens, young guys, and girls were driving around in these. I can't understand why they didn't build upon and improve the car. The platform was already paid for.

I'm not sad about the loss of Mercury. It didn't have the story, heritage, and modern product offerings that Oldsmobile or even Plymouth did.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-12-08, 12:24 PM
I looked at cars like that a while back, but never really took any interest in the FWD Cougars because they didn't offer much in terms of power, performance and masculine image.

dirt_cheap_fleetwood
06-12-08, 01:59 PM
I love the new Marauders. Its a shame they only made them for a few years. My uncle also had one of the FWD cougars. It was a very nice little car that was extremely comfortable for its size.

If Ford no longer makes the Crown Vic and Mercury is soon to die, does that mean the only way to get a car with an actual frame will be to buy a Town Car? I really like the Crown Vics and Grand Marquis.

gdwriter
06-12-08, 02:31 PM
I guess Mercury's WTF? tagline "New Doors Opened" should be changed to "Old Doors Slammed Shut"

Like Plymouth and Oldsmobile, it makes sense from a business perspective to put Mercury out of its misery. But it's still sad to see another American nameplate go down the drain.

Mercury has had a few cool cars. I love the original Cougar with the electric razor-like front end and sequential taillights:

http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/mercury-cougar/images/mercury-cougar-1a.jpg

There was also something cool about McGarrett's jet-black '68 Park Lane on Hawaii Five-O:

http://www.mercuryarchive.com/1965to1968/1968ParklaneR.jpg

My grandmother had a '67 Monterey S-55 convertible in the early 70s, similar to this one:

http://www.mercuryarchive.com/1965to1968/1967MercuryS55.jpg

dkozloski
06-12-08, 03:21 PM
I could never own one of the damn things just because the local dealership pronounces the name Merkery in their TV ads.

thebigjimsho
06-12-08, 05:33 PM
The FWD Cougar was a hot seller and a fun little car that brought new young customers into Mercury showrooms. Five or so years ago, tons of teens, young guys, and girls were driving around in these. I can't understand why they didn't build upon and improve the car. The platform was already paid for.

I'm not sad about the loss of Mercury. It didn't have the story, heritage, and modern product offerings that Oldsmobile or even Plymouth did.And people still buy Toyota because they think they're getting good build quality. The little Cougar was a poorly built, heavy rattle box that had poor interior proportions and powertrains that were fail.

A friend of mine had a V6 model. He loved the looks. It rode harsher than my V with tepid handling. It was less than 2 years old and rattled 5X worse than my 12 year old SHO. And when he stepped on the gas, the pebbles on the ground were only slightly harder to decipher.

That car was a hideous, disgusting POS. Simple as that...

Submariner409
06-12-08, 06:32 PM
We stockpile things for the Seville line. For the '67 Cougar you always had a sequential turn signal motor and a headlight vacuum motor on a shelf in the garage.......

Playdrv4me
06-12-08, 07:15 PM
And people still buy Toyota because they think they're getting good build quality. The little Cougar was a poorly built, heavy rattle box that had poor interior proportions and powertrains that were fail.

A friend of mine had a V6 model. He loved the looks. It rode harsher than my V with tepid handling. It was less than 2 years old and rattled 5X worse than my 12 year old SHO. And when he stepped on the gas, the pebbles on the ground were only slightly harder to decipher.

That car was a hideous, disgusting POS. Simple as that...

If all that were not enough the headlights haze in no time flat, making the car look absolutely terrible.

orconn
06-12-08, 08:12 PM
The '67-'68 Cougars were OK and different enough to justify their existence. But to be honest the only Mercurys that truly differentiated themselves from Fords were 1957 thru 1959 models that at least were different enough in styling to stand alone. Otherwise, Mercury's were just there to give some not to unimaginative slowly upwardly mobiles a leg up on Ford owners. The General had a much better handle on this type of marketing with the Pontiac brand ....... at least the buyer wasn't afraid to let his comrades know at least he thought he was on the way up! The purchase of a Mercury was always kind of "I not good enough for a Lincoln" but "too good for a Ford" thing. So I am not sorry to see Mercury depart the marketplace, if that is what's to happen ....... was there really a Ford called a Mercury?

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-12-08, 09:00 PM
In my generation, the Mercury was "the old person's Ford".

orconn
06-12-08, 09:04 PM
Yeah, Chad, that too!

mighty_quad4
06-12-08, 10:21 PM
in the years leading up to when Olds was axed, the Bravada and Aurora were making GM money. they were not a money sink.

in the early 90s, they were producing 4 cylinder cars that were running high 14s and getting 33mpg on the hwy. the non W41 cars were running 15 flat, and had better quality [ maybe not design ] interior than most other GM cars.

now days, ppl love a small fwd car with 180-195hp and 33mpg. back in 1990, people did not "get it", and sales tanked.

Plymouth died for the same reason Mercury is probably is gonna tank, both companies are the "also ran" for the "more important" brands. ie, Ford is what the younger people buy and Mercury is what the old people buy. Mercury used to mean mid markey luxury but that fadded away at some point and became the car that old people bought because they probably couldnt afford a Lincoln or Cadillac. Plymouth was its own brand and enjoy solid sales up until the late 70s. after that they were undercut by dodge models that offered the exact same thing. Dodge used Plymouth as a scapegoat since the mid 70s and axed cars from thier line to meet the bottom line. back in 95 they only had 3 models. Ferarri, Porsche, and even TVR had more cars in thier line up. it went up to 4 in 96.

Mercury is on the same path at this time. theyve shared alot of vehicles with Ford due to badge engineering, always have and always will. the have no soul and if it wasnt for the Grand Marquis, Mercury would have died 30 years ago.

Jesda
06-12-08, 11:02 PM
I want a mid 90s Cutlass Supreme convertible. There is no 90s Mercury that I want. What a sad brand.

thebigjimsho
06-12-08, 11:26 PM
I want a mid 90s Cutlass Supreme convertible. There is no 90s Mercury that I want. What a sad brand.Except for excessive cowl shake, that was a nice vert...

lawfive
06-12-08, 11:38 PM
I had a couple of 1970 Cougars at the same time, both with 351 Cleveland engines. Fun damned car. Understeered like the dickens, though. Drove a buddy's Cobrajet Cougar; it understeered like a motherf**cker, almost as bad as a 427 Stingray.


We stockpile things for the Seville line. For the '67 Cougar you always had a sequential turn signal motor and a headlight vacuum motor on a shelf in the garage.......

LOL, same with the 1970. You got a vacuum leak and the lids wouldn't go down to cover the headlights. Looked like ass.

orconn
06-13-08, 12:00 AM
I want a mid 90s Cutlass Supreme convertible. There is no 90s Mercury that I want. What a sad brand.

Ah men, my young friend. Very few if any Mercury's stirred men's souls ....or even memories! Fords have history and even at times greatness. Remember the the Le Mans wins. The Continental Mks I, II and III's. They tried to buy a soul with Jaguar ...but bought a souless shell without Sir William Lyons. Before that they bought Ghia and managed to bleed the design brilliance from that acquisition and end up with badge engineering. Then they bought De Tomaso and let semi-brilliance be tempered by Detroit mediocrity.

Let's face it American's want a quality car with the size to meet its' carrying needs (family and domestic chores) a reasonable degree of handling, one the won't fall apart before the last payment is due (particularly the interiors), and lest face it a car whose quality whose quality stands the test of time both in beauty of design, practicality, endurance. Yes, perhaps they will cost more initially (yes we second hand buyers will benefit) but with reasonable care they should las the initial buyers ten years (I know we car enthusiasts want variety ... the used market is ours!). I hope the new Chev Malibu is a success; as a step in the right direction....... I am glad to see some of Saturn's products win praise for good basic quality.

I can only hope that Ford's management will get out of the "Truck Rut" and back into passnger car design and manufacturing. The opportunityn is there!

Jesda
06-13-08, 01:15 AM
http://a775.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/118/l_77a5b35424d852437e2b91c8a6575d26.jpg
http://a709.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/6/l_455de024e7ecf31ce525d9e103726d34.jpg

Night Wolf
06-13-08, 07:12 AM
I love the new Marauders. Its a shame they only made them for a few years. My uncle also had one of the FWD cougars. It was a very nice little car that was extremely comfortable for its size.

If Ford no longer makes the Crown Vic and Mercury is soon to die, does that mean the only way to get a car with an actual frame will be to buy a Town Car? I really like the Crown Vics and Grand Marquis.

Town Car is already set to end production... not sure if it's in the next couple of months or what, but it is.

Real frames are a thing of the past.... sad thing really...

Good news is, with the Town Car being made up until 2008, maybe the '09 model year? there will be lots and lots of prime examples left for many, many years.... I'm quite content with my '96 tho... plus there are just way too many things I like about it that the '98+ lost or dosen't have.

ewill3rd
06-13-08, 08:19 AM
I had no love for Mercury... ever. They made a couple of nice cars but we didn't speak those four letter F words like the name of their parent company in my house :lol:

I loved Olds, I so wish they were still around. The 80's were such a hit to the American car market. The only reason most of the imports made it through that period (IMHO) was because they started out as junky little four bangers to begin with, then all the greenies made the Big 3 turn our cars into junky little four bangers with no experience building them so the imports started looking better.

I had a '92 Cutlass Supreme SL with the DOHC motor and some nice options in the garnet red. Man did I love that car! I'd have it back too if I could.
My son's car seat would not fit inside :( so I had to get rid of it.
Olds made some of the finest cars on the planet if you ask me, I was surprised to see them go. Buick will be gone before Pontiac will I think, although it is a tough call to make at this time. GM has done the same thing with Buick that it did with Olds. They cut back model after model until they aren't making diddly. I was shocked to see that Buick only has 3 models this year! (I haven't paid attention)
The current market just can't handle the flood of makes and models that it used to support, especially with so much import competition these days.
The 60's and 70's markets were the best for the domestic car market, but not without flaw. I kind of miss those days but I actually prefer the technology and cleaner cars we have now over the smog and massive gas sucking engines we had back then. Even though they were "simpler" they were harder to work on. (believe it or not)

thebigjimsho
06-13-08, 09:34 AM
http://a775.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/118/l_77a5b35424d852437e2b91c8a6575d26.jpg
http://a709.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/6/l_455de024e7ecf31ce525d9e103726d34.jpgDammit people, start buying Mercurys!!!

ewill3rd
06-13-08, 09:44 AM
Do you get one of those with new Mercury?
:lol:
If so I'll think about it.
Might be hard to explain to the missus.

dirt_cheap_fleetwood
06-13-08, 10:52 AM
Town Car is already set to end production... not sure if it's in the next couple of months or what, but it is.

Real frames are a thing of the past.... sad thing really...

Good news is, with the Town Car being made up until 2008, maybe the '09 model year? there will be lots and lots of prime examples left for many, many years.... I'm quite content with my '96 tho... plus there are just way too many things I like about it that the '98+ lost or dosen't have.


Yes, I too will miss a fully-framed car. I like any Town Car made between 1981 and 1998. 1990 - 1997 were the best looking of all I think. I really like the look of the "mob mobiles".

Does anyone know the fate of the Crown Vic? They are so popular with taxi companies and as government vehicles it would seem to be a big waste to throw them out. You can go to the Ford Fleet website and order one, but a consumer like you or I can no longer buy a Crown Vic.


BTW, who is that chick that Jesda posted and why did he post a picture of her? Laugh at me if you want, but I have no idea who that is.

Playdrv4me
06-13-08, 11:14 AM
BTW, who is that chick that Jesda posted and why did he post a picture of her? Laugh at me if you want, but I have no idea who that is.

63Hm46XqlOI

ewill3rd
06-13-08, 12:31 PM
I am in the same boat and I can't see the you tube inserts at work.
Is that the chick that does their commercials?

A quick search for "mercury girl" got me some nice photos of Jill Wagner.
I am assuming that is her... looks like the same chick.
That is probably all I should say :lol:

dwight.j.carter
06-13-08, 12:38 PM
Actually I think Hummer will be next to die.

dwight.j.carter
06-13-08, 12:39 PM
Dammit people, start buying Mercurys!!!

I'll buy one for an evening alone with her. :bouncy:

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-13-08, 12:47 PM
Yeah, get rid of Hummer.

93DevilleUSMC
06-13-08, 01:36 PM
http://a775.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/118/l_77a5b35424d852437e2b91c8a6575d26.jpg
http://a709.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/6/l_455de024e7ecf31ce525d9e103726d34.jpg

Dang! My headgasket would blow if I shifted her clutch.

But going on to Mercury, I will admit that I like the Milan. It seems to be a decent enough vehicle in its own right.

Now, going beyond that, Mercury really has not offered anything truly unique since the 1980's Cougars, and even those were unique in the sense of being visual vomit-inducers as opposed to being attractive, appealing designs. The rest, you ask? Unoriginal vomit-inducers. Witness the Mercury Sables of the early 1990s.

The only true improvement I have seen in Mercury has been their advertising. They've gone from those stupid Rod Stewart commercials for the Cougar to the above girl! Unfortunately, as Chad has put it, polished crap is still crap.

American cars have generally had the tradition of being bold and inspiring, both visually and mechanically. Witness the cars of the sixties and seventies. What has Mercury offered since the 1990s? Visually uninspiring "old-person" cars. Now, I will bet that an old man has enough damn reminders per day that he is an old man, and doesn't need his re badged Ford clone with no extra options to be one of them.

Night Wolf
06-13-08, 01:59 PM
Yes, I too will miss a fully-framed car. I like any Town Car made between 1981 and 1998. 1990 - 1997 were the best looking of all I think. I really like the look of the "mob mobiles".

Does anyone know the fate of the Crown Vic? They are so popular with taxi companies and as government vehicles it would seem to be a big waste to throw them out. You can go to the Ford Fleet website and order one, but a consumer like you or I can no longer buy a Crown Vic.


BTW, who is that chick that Jesda posted and why did he post a picture of her? Laugh at me if you want, but I have no idea who that is.

Panther chassis as a whole is ending

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-13-08, 02:06 PM
Now, going beyond that, Mercury really has not offered anything truly unique since the 1980's Cougars, and even those were unique in the sense of being visual vomit-inducers as opposed to being attractive, appealing designs.

Ah yes, the 1983-88 Cougar. Home of the backwards slanting C-Pillar. :cookoo:

Here's an '83.
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/how-mercury-works-1983_cougar.jpg

Think that's bad? It only got worse, here's an '88
http://www.foxthundercats.com/cougar3.jpg




:crying::bomb::mad2::suspect::vomit::suspect:

93DevilleUSMC
06-13-08, 02:15 PM
Ah yes, the 1983-88 Cougar. Home of the backwards slanting C-Pillar. :cookoo:

Here's an '83.
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/how-mercury-works-1983_cougar.jpg

Think that's bad? It only got worse, here's an '88
http://www.foxthundercats.com/cougar3.jpg




:crying::bomb::mad2::suspect::vomit::suspect:


You know what the `88 makes me think of? A two-door hearse! Not that one has ever been built, but it looks like Mercury damn sure tried with that car.

dkozloski
06-13-08, 02:36 PM
A good friend of mine bought a Cougar when they first came out in the '60s. I car-pooled with him but wound up refusing to ride in the damn thing. It had weird valving in the front shocks and the front end just floated. It was like the steering wheel was connected to the front wheels with rubber bands. Over a road with a succession of swails, you could barely keep it between the ditches. It was essentially a Mustang with a whole lot more sheetmetal ahead of the windshield and a bad suspension.

93DevilleUSMC
06-13-08, 02:40 PM
A good friend of mine bought a Cougar when they first came out in the '60s. I car-pooled with him but wound up refusing to ride in the damn thing. It had weird valving in the front shocks and the front end just floated. It was like the steering wheel was connected to the front wheels with rubber bands. Over a road with a succession of swails, you could barely keep it between the ditches. It was essentially a Mustang with a whole lot more sheetmetal ahead of the windshield and a bad suspension.

All the Cougar has ever been anyway is a luxury Mustang.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-13-08, 02:52 PM
The Cougar has always (well, aside from the FWD versions) been a porkier Mustang. It's like Mercury almost wanted a mix between a T-Bird, Mustang and Mark series Lincoln.

dirt_cheap_fleetwood
06-13-08, 04:20 PM
I loved the Cougars. My friend's dad had a '93 XR7 with the 4.6 in it. That was a fun car to ride in. It didn't look half bad either. I still like the 1989-1996 (before the final facelift) Thunderbirds with the supercharged 6 better though.

Sandy
06-13-08, 04:26 PM
I am annoyed by the attitude herein. 95% of you are discussing what you do not like about the Mercury division, and the cars it has brought forth, during your lifetime. This is small talk! Nobody ever forced you to buy a Mercury. However, you are looking at the small picture. I have waited 4 or 5 pages for just one person the see the big picture. Nobody came forth. So, I will ~

Forget the cars. Lets look at the Division. It's a division of Ford motor Company. Ford Motor Company, although it sells it's products worldwide, and buys from vendors worldwide, it *IS* an American Corporation.
Its often been said that as goes the American Automobile industry, so goes America. Now, I would venture a guess that the majority of you are Americans. That said, and what the fall of our American Automobile Industry would bring about financially-speaking would affect every living American ! There is NO happiness, nothing good, nothing to be fond of in announcing the demise of an American Brand of an American Corporation.

Stop with the "i never liked" ..... "My brother had a ____ and it was bad, rotten, terrible......" etc, etc. There is no goodness in the demise of one of our products. Nothing good can come of it, just a larger share of foreign corporation's product.
Look, in the recent past, we have lost the following AMERICAN nameplates:
IMPERIAL (1993)
OLDSMOBILE (2007)
PLYMOUTH (2005)

Corporate-wise; AMERICAN MOTORS - 1989.

Now, think of two baseball teams. Team "A has 11 players. 11 batters, and 11 on the field, fielding.
The other team has 23 players. 23 batters get a turn and 23 in the outfield.

Who is gonna win ???? Are the cards Stacked ??

Here ARE THE teams:-

Team A:--

Cadillac; Buick, Pontiac; Chevrolet, GMC., Saturn, Lincoln; Ford, Chrysler; Dodge; Jeeep. (Mercury Excluded).

--VS --

Team B:--
BMW, Mini, Rolls Royce, Mercedes-Benz, Acura, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mitsubishi, Infiniti, Nissan, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Lexus, Scion, Toyota, Audi, Volkswagon, Bentley, Jaguar.

Now, I did not count these, because allthough "Foreign" either G.M. OR Ford does make some $$$$$$ on their sales.....

Saab, Volvo, Aston Martin, Mazda and Isuzu.

Hell of a team we have to take on, there! So, the LOSS of one of our PLAYERS is a serious loss, whether or not YOU happen to NOT admire THAT player.

Focus on the BIG picture !!

Jesda
06-13-08, 04:35 PM
Team B has a lot of pretty sweet cars.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-13-08, 04:41 PM
I admit it is sad to see "US" lose a player, but if the competition is playing a better game (in some respects), you can't really blame us can ya? But if you were going to break it down further, I'd say we're doing very well against our Japanese competition, and our German competition, and our English competition. To sum it up, the American companies still offer the most brands, atleast in our domestic market.

orconn
06-13-08, 04:50 PM
In my opinion the "Big Picture" is whether a multi-national corporation, in this case Ford Motor Company, should continue to spend its' self-admittedly meager capital on a product line that produces little in the way of bottom line profits. The opinions expressed in this thread seem to be pretty indicative of the esteem in which the Mercury Division's cars are held in the automotive marketplace. I believe Ford would do well to expend their working capital to bring new and exciting products to their remaining divisions both here and abroad.

Sandy
06-13-08, 04:50 PM
No. We are losing. We are still winning in Truck sales, so **IF** we are still wining, it's truck sales that is the reason. But in car sales.... we are losing. We have lost the wealthy, the rich, and the entry level buyer as well as the youthful 1st time buyer.

dkozloski
06-13-08, 04:51 PM
All the Cougar has ever been anyway is a luxury Mustang.
There is a huge difference between luxury and gussied up.

dkozloski
06-13-08, 04:56 PM
No. We are losing. We are still winning in Truck sales, so **IF** we are still wining, it's truck sales that is the reason. But in car sales.... we are losing. We have lost the wealthy, the rich, and the entry level buyer as well as the youthful 1st time buyer.
Ford truck sales have totally tanked. The local dealer has hundreds of trucks that went from selling like hotcakes to total pariahs in a few months. There's no way they will sell as long as they are the worst gas guzzlers on the road.

93DevilleUSMC
06-13-08, 05:01 PM
I am annoyed by the attitude herein. 95% of you are discussing what you do not like about the Mercury division, and the cars it has brought forth, during your lifetime. This is small talk! Nobody ever forced you to buy a Mercury. However, you are looking at the small picture. I have waited 4 or 5 pages for just one person the see the big picture. Nobody came forth. So, I will ~

Forget the cars. Lets look at the Division. It's a division of Ford motor Company. Ford Motor Company, although it sells it's products worldwide, and buys from vendors worldwide, it *IS* an American Corporation.
Its often been said that as goes the American Automobile industry, so goes America. Now, I would venture a guess that the majority of you are Americans. That said, and what the fall of our American Automobile Industry would bring about financially-speaking would affect every living American ! There is NO happiness, nothing good, nothing to be fond of in announcing the demise of an American Brand of an American Corporation.

Stop with the "i never liked" ..... "My brother had a ____ and it was bad, rotten, terrible......" etc, etc. There is no goodness in the demise of one of our products. Nothing good can come of it, just a larger share of foreign corporation's product.
Look, in the recent past, we have lost the following AMERICAN nameplates:
IMPERIAL (1993)
OLDSMOBILE (2007)
PLYMOUTH (2005)

Corporate-wise; AMERICAN MOTORS - 1989.

Now, think of two baseball teams. Team "A has 11 players. 11 batters, and 11 on the field, fielding.
The other team has 23 players. 23 batters get a turn and 23 in the outfield.

Who is gonna win ???? Are the cards Stacked ??

Here ARE THE teams:-

Team A:--

Cadillac; Buick, Pontiac; Chevrolet, GMC., Saturn, Lincoln; Ford, Chrysler; Dodge; Jeeep. (Mercury Excluded).

--VS --

Team B:--
BMW, Mini, Rolls Royce, Mercedes-Benz, Acura, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mitsubishi, Infiniti, Nissan, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Lexus, Scion, Toyota, Audi, Volkswagon, Bentley, Jaguar.

Now, I did not count these, because allthough "Foreign" either G.M. OR Ford does make some $$$$$$ on their sales.....

Saab, Volvo, Aston Martin, Mazda and Isuzu.

Hell of a team we have to take on, there! So, the LOSS of one of our PLAYERS is a serious loss, whether or not YOU happen to NOT admire THAT player.

Focus on the BIG picture !!


I agree with you on the team analogy here, but I see it this way: we need the team members that will pull their weight and score hits on the other team. Mercury just doesn't seem to really be scoring hits right now. If they could bring quality products out and make Mercury a quality marque again, then they should retain it in the inventory. If not, then Mercury should go, and let Ford do the extra batting and pitching, so to speak. If need be, Chrysler and GM can hold the line and even win.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-13-08, 05:01 PM
Dkoz, your point is true, but who else makes full sized trucks and sells them in the US? Toyota? Sure, but they don't get the recognition that the domestics do. And Nissan does too, but when was the last time you saw a Tundra?

For the most part, the domestic brands pretty much have a stranglehold on the domestic light duty truck market.

93DevilleUSMC
06-13-08, 05:04 PM
Dkoz, your point is true, but who else makes full sized trucks and sells them in the US? Toyota? Sure, but they don't get the recognition that the domestics do. And Nissan does too, but when was the last time you saw a Tundra?

For the most part, the domestic brands pretty much have a stranglehold on the domestic light duty truck market.

There are quite a few Tundras out here.

Chicano-Mexicano
06-13-08, 05:17 PM
I admit it is sad to see "US" lose a player, but if the competition is playing a better game (in some respects), you can't really blame us can ya?

I agree the US auto industry would not be in this situation if they had not produced crap in the late 70's and most of the 80's and this goes for every one from Cadillac to Mercury I mean lets take a look at what the great American car makers brought us from 1976 to 1989

1970's
From Ford:
Grenada/Monarch
Pinto/Bobcat
and the wonderful Lincoln Versailles
oh and lets not forget the Mustang II!

From GM:
Chevrolet Vega/Monza
Pontiac Sunbird
(GM really made crap in the 80's)

From Dodge:
The Colt (need I say more)
The Aspen

1980's

From Ford:
Again the Pinto
The Escort/Tempo
Fairmount
Festiva

Mercury:
Lynx/Tracer
Topaz


From GM:

Chevy:
Chevette/Citation/Nova
Celebrity/Caprice
Camaro
Corsica/Baretta

Pontiac:
6000


Oldsmobile:
Firenza
Cutlass Calais

Cadillac:
The Cimarron lest we forget


From Dodge:
The Colt again
The Charger
The Omni
The Shadow
Dodge 400/600/Mirada

Chrysler Laser (Dodge Charger)
Chrysler Conquest (Mitsubishi Starion)
Chrysler TC (horrible interior build quality i.e. stitching)
Chrysler Le baron (underpowered and small)

Plymouth Horizon/Sundance (Shadow)
Plymouth Reliant (it wasn't)
Plymouth Sapporo (Mitsubishi Galant Lambda)


I know I left out cars like the 1985-1991 Eldorado/Seville and so on but I was more focused on the cars that were made between 1975 and 1989 only becasue they are what helped bury the American auto industry.

Playdrv4me
06-13-08, 05:28 PM
I am annoyed by the attitude herein. 95% of you are discussing what you do not like about the Mercury division, and the cars it has brought forth, during your lifetime. This is small talk! Nobody ever forced you to buy a Mercury. However, you are looking at the small picture. I have waited 4 or 5 pages for just one person the see the big picture. Nobody came forth. So, I will ~

Forget the cars. Lets look at the Division. It's a division of Ford motor Company. Ford Motor Company, although it sells it's products worldwide, and buys from vendors worldwide, it *IS* an American Corporation.
Its often been said that as goes the American Automobile industry, so goes America. Now, I would venture a guess that the majority of you are Americans. That said, and what the fall of our American Automobile Industry would bring about financially-speaking would affect every living American ! There is NO happiness, nothing good, nothing to be fond of in announcing the demise of an American Brand of an American Corporation.

Stop with the "i never liked" ..... "My brother had a ____ and it was bad, rotten, terrible......" etc, etc. There is no goodness in the demise of one of our products. Nothing good can come of it, just a larger share of foreign corporation's product.
Look, in the recent past, we have lost the following AMERICAN nameplates:
IMPERIAL (1993)
OLDSMOBILE (2007)
PLYMOUTH (2005)

Corporate-wise; AMERICAN MOTORS - 1989.

Now, think of two baseball teams. Team "A has 11 players. 11 batters, and 11 on the field, fielding.
The other team has 23 players. 23 batters get a turn and 23 in the outfield.

Who is gonna win ???? Are the cards Stacked ??

Here ARE THE teams:-

Team A:--

Cadillac; Buick, Pontiac; Chevrolet, GMC., Saturn, Lincoln; Ford, Chrysler; Dodge; Jeeep. (Mercury Excluded).

--VS --

Team B:--
BMW, Mini, Rolls Royce, Mercedes-Benz, Acura, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mitsubishi, Infiniti, Nissan, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Lexus, Scion, Toyota, Audi, Volkswagon, Bentley, Jaguar.

Now, I did not count these, because allthough "Foreign" either G.M. OR Ford does make some $$$$$$ on their sales.....

Saab, Volvo, Aston Martin, Mazda and Isuzu.

Hell of a team we have to take on, there! So, the LOSS of one of our PLAYERS is a serious loss, whether or not YOU happen to NOT admire THAT player.

Focus on the BIG picture !!

The big picture is that the American auto industry needs to turn a damn profit again and look at new and innovative ways of doing business as truck sales plummet and people migrate from the poorly managed "ancillary" brands to foreign cars. That's it and that's all as Mr. Whistle Tips would say.

Unless Ford turns Mercury into the exclusive stateside outlet of its heavily desired european market vehicles, there is absolutely no argument that can be made for the brand. Those aren't my feelings, that's the direct result of the irreversible damage that Ford's piss poor management has done to destroy the equity in that brand.

Diluting a quality product just so you can have more of it has never resulted in anything good. And dilution of a Ford is exactly what Mercury is.

Jesda
06-13-08, 06:27 PM
It doesnt matter anymore what happens in the US auto market. Its too mature and saturated with products. The big winner will be the company that conquers China and India, and so far that's GM.

dkozloski
06-13-08, 06:30 PM
Nobody is selling pickups. Nobody is selling SUVs. They are instant dinosaurs. Long live the shitbox minis to come that soon we'll all be driving just like in Europe.

hueterm
06-13-08, 06:57 PM
I actually really liked the late '80s Cougars.... One of Mercury's better cars, IMO.

Night Wolf
06-13-08, 07:03 PM
Ah yes, the 1983-88 Cougar. Home of the backwards slanting C-Pillar. :cookoo:

Here's an '83.
http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/how-mercury-works-1983_cougar.jpg

Think that's bad? It only got worse, here's an '88
http://www.foxthundercats.com/cougar3.jpg




:crying::bomb::mad2::suspect::vomit::suspect:

So I walked out of Sears today and saw a car that made me think... hmmm, didn't Chad just post about this?.....

http://www.allcarwallpapers.com/wallpapers/previews/nissan-murano-924.jpg

But anyway, isn't the new cool thing to go retro anyway?

http://allworldcars.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/06-1972-gremlin-xlt.jpg

thebigjimsho
06-13-08, 07:54 PM
Now, think of two baseball teams. Team "A has 11 players. 11 batters, and 11 on the field, fielding.
The other team has 23 players. 23 batters get a turn and 23 in the outfield.

Who is gonna win ???? Are the cards Stacked ??

Here ARE THE teams:-

Team A:--

Cadillac; Buick, Pontiac; Chevrolet, GMC., Saturn, Lincoln; Ford, Chrysler; Dodge; Jeeep. (Mercury Excluded).

--VS --

Team B:--
BMW, Mini, Rolls Royce, Mercedes-Benz, Acura, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mitsubishi, Infiniti, Nissan, Porsche, Subaru, Suzuki, Lexus, Scion, Toyota, Audi, Volkswagon, Bentley, Jaguar.

That makes no sense, it's a bad analogy. What is the point? Scoring runs? Whether you win 2-1 or 35-4, a win is a win. And the attendance is the goal. People aren't going to buy more cars because there are more options. They buy the car when they need to. And they'll choose the best one.

Having a lot of different domestic makes hoping that a consumer will pick one is dumb. You pick the best car for you. Is a consumer going to be happier picking the best mediocre car in a large group or a great car in a small group? Losing a marque doesn't matter if it's just a gussied up version of a cheaper car...

Sandy
06-13-08, 10:10 PM
Yes, trucks are down, right now & of course it's the fuel prices. IF (big word) the prices drop back down, people still love their trucks & they will sell.

It seems many are asking for totally unique, top shelf products from Mercury. But, think about that....nobody has that. How different is a Pontiac G6 from a Buick Lucerne ? A Nissan Maxima from a Infiniti G35? A Volkswagon Passat looks like a Lucerne, except for the front end, they are identical. An Impala from a Buick LaCrosse ? How totally different ($$$$) can Ford make a Mercury?

Waaay back in the 1970s Mercury was selling alot of cars. Each was an altered Ford product. It worked back then. So, Ford probably is of the mindset that it can work again. Sandy says....probably not. Change the styling & upgrade ther interiors and raise the price.

The Toyota Avalon Limited is a vastly better car than the Lexus ES 350. The Lexus is percieved better - so it sells better. 75% of the battle is in the public's preception of the product. IMAGE is what Madison Avenue is all about.

thebigjimsho
06-13-08, 10:39 PM
I don't think Ford should ditch Mercury. But, at the same time, they need to make Mercury more than an optioned out Ford.

Chicano-Mexicano
06-13-08, 10:39 PM
IMAGE is what Madison Avenue is all about.

As I said the American auto market ruined their image in the late 70's and 80's with all the unreliable overpriced crap like Chrysler's re-badging of the 1980's Dodge Charger to make it a Chrysler Lazer, or something that strikes very close to home for every one on this form the Cimmarron a Cavalier that was given a Cadillac badge and some leather seats and that wasn't even advertised as a Cadillac in it's initial years, it was called The Cimmarron by Cadillac a fat lot of good that did it.

I mean unless GM, Ford, and Dodge wake up then well be seeing more of this brand axing. I mean it's only a matter of time before GM realizes that Pontiac or hell even Cadillac really isn't going any were with this platform sharing shit they got going on, seriously aside from some ascetic changes whats the real difference between the CTS, STS, BLS,....... I mean they all have the same grill (which Chevy is copying now), same power train choices, and they all cost about the same.

Sandy
06-13-08, 11:33 PM
For Merc to make it, Lincoln has to STOP making Jr. Edition Lincolns, such as MKZ and MKS. Bring back an avant guard Continential, keep the Town Car, but redesign it (1998-2007) and take it up-town, pricewise and then raise Merc's prices and make them totally different looking from Fords. Drop the low end cars, keep Milan, kill Sable, kill the name Grand Marquis, and bring back the Parklane as the top dog. Make it above a Buick Lucerne Super, but below a stripped DTS. Rear Wheel Drive, V-8, 6-Speed Auto, Super premium Leather, carpeting and details. As a sister car, the Milan and that's IT for the Mercury label. Perhaps a small SUV (Mariner is really selling here in NJ).

Playdrv4me
06-14-08, 01:53 AM
Yes, trucks are down, right now & of course it's the fuel prices. IF (big word) the prices drop back down, people still love their trucks & they will sell.

It seems many are asking for totally unique, top shelf products from Mercury. But, think about that....nobody has that. How different is a Pontiac G6 from a Buick Lucerne ? A Nissan Maxima from a Infiniti G35? A Volkswagon Passat looks like a Lucerne, except for the front end, they are identical. An Impala from a Buick LaCrosse ? How totally different ($$$$) can Ford make a Mercury?

Waaay back in the 1970s Mercury was selling alot of cars. Each was an altered Ford product. It worked back then. So, Ford probably is of the mindset that it can work again. Sandy says....probably not. Change the styling & upgrade ther interiors and raise the price.

The Toyota Avalon Limited is a vastly better car than the Lexus ES 350. The Lexus is percieved better - so it sells better. 75% of the battle is in the public's preception of the product. IMAGE is what Madison Avenue is all about.

But that's the problem with the domestic auto market... too many IFs in a world of WHENs. The more I think about it, the more I commend GM for stepping out on the ledge with the Volt project. If it fails then at least they tried... A spirit of INNOVATION that is dreadfully lacking at the big three. The same sorely lacking spirit of innovation that in the 80s and 90s saw ALL THREE of them going on buying sprees of foreign brands rather than fortifying their CORE products.

Ford's me too game of playing it safe, watering down their lineup, buying needless luxury toys and just staying on the side lines is what ruined Mercury and starved it of any useful product.

Ford will never be able to sufficiently differentiate a Mercury from its downmarket cousin enough to make the battle worthwhile. I'm sorry, they're just not that "with-it" nor do they particularly care about Mercury all that much. Change the styling and raise the price? The economy is in a TOUGH spot right now and young people ESPECIALLY already don't like Mercurys anyway... the manhours and toolup costs necessary to just badge engineer yet ANOTHER iteration of a MercuFord will be more wasted dollars and a deeper hole Ford has to dig itself out of. The cars you listed above have SUBSTANTIAL differences in option packages, engines, and targeted market in comparison to the MercuFords. And you know what, some of those cars, like the G6 and Lacrosse only serve to further illustrate my point about oversaturation even when they ARE more differentiated.

I really don't understand this nostalgic sentiment from people over these ill-defined and poor selling brands at the expense of the parent company as a whole. Taking this example to an extreme, the American auto market would do just fine with Ford, Lincoln, Chrysler, Dodge Trucks, Jeep, Chevrolet, Cadillac, and GMC as a truck outlet and commercial sales. Everything else is just plain fluff.

But no, we live in a litigous society with dealerships that would rather take the easy road and sue the auto makers for killing a worthless brand than work with them to redefine the brand structure and increase the overall sales and health of the corporation as a WHOLE. I must give credit to Chrysler/Cerberus on this one key point... in an AMAZINGLY short time frame of just a few years, Chrysler corporate laid down the LAW on its dealers and got them to unite brands under one roof rather than having one offs all over the planet selling individual brands at an immense overhead. This is a case in which the dealers and the company are communicating and moving rapidly toward a unified solution.

Sandy
06-14-08, 09:29 AM
I got curious. I did a search.

New Jersey has 4 Jeep-Only dealers, 6 Chrysler-Only Dealers, and too many to count Dodge-Only Dealers & 2 Dodge Truck Only Dealers. All the rest are combo platters :)

dkozloski
06-14-08, 11:26 AM
There used to be a dealer in Fairbanks that sold Dodges, Buicks, and Fords off the same showroom floor. They had another Ford dealership in Nome.

Caddyshack100
06-14-08, 08:32 PM
Ford and GM are still in the game trying to sell look alikes, GM must of hired the designer of the Nissan Murano, in order to sell the Buick Enclave and GMC Arcadia, in my opinion, these two vehicles are not going to be that much different from any of the bigger SUV's, gas wise at least, I know that people will always need space and something big, but These two may be a hit now, but their popularity will soon wane, Ford on the other hand has a much greater problem, Police Forces all over N America have put the company on notice that the Crown VIc is a vehicle that is on its last legs due to its V8 engine and thirst for fuel, the departments regret this as the troopers love the car and its tailor made for the job, however county and state bean counters may have the last say, Ford has put its ST Thomas ON, plant on notice that heavy layoffs are coming.

hueterm
06-14-08, 10:53 PM
Wait till the Chevrolet version of the Enclave comes out..... Ridiculous.

If they were noticeably different, then OK.....but other than some wood in the Buick, the interiors are the same.

I mean even the Grand Prix/Regal/Impala at least looked different from the outside and all had unique interiors....

chubbyranger
06-15-08, 08:24 AM
Axing a branded Division does not necessarily imply that we have "lost" anything more than a nameplate. The whole American branding system is a post-WW2 relic that was developed to create long-term repeat customers who could work their way up from a Chevy -> Pontiac -> Buick -> Cadillac, or Ford -> Mercury -> Lincoln, etc. That consumer model basically went out the window when import sales took off almost 30 years ago. The ricers have actually adopted a piece of that model with the Acura/Infiniti/Lexus luxo-brands but that still leaves them with only two major divisions to manage and there is lots of platform commonality across them. But it is not as obvious because the ricers put more emphasis on different sheet metal so the average consumer doesn't recognize their Lexus as a Toyota with wood trim. Whether Mercury stays or goes is immeterial; if FoMoCo can get leaner without them its for the best. It all comes down to market share in the end.

Night Wolf
06-15-08, 09:49 AM
Axing a branded Division does not necessarily imply that we have "lost" anything more than a nameplate. The whole American branding system is a post-WW2 relic that was developed to create long-term repeat customers who could work their way up from a Chevy -> Pontiac -> Buick -> Cadillac, or Ford -> Mercury -> Lincoln, etc. That consumer model basically went out the window when import sales took off almost 30 years ago. The ricers have actually adopted a piece of that model with the Acura/Infiniti/Lexus luxo-brands but that still leaves them with only two major divisions to manage and there is lots of platform commonality across them. But it is not as obvious because the ricers put more emphasis on different sheet metal so the average consumer doesn't recognize their Lexus as a Toyota with wood trim. Whether Mercury stays or goes is immeterial; if FoMoCo can get leaner without them its for the best. It all comes down to market share in the end.

True in some cases, but like a Lexus ES300, especially the 90's version looked exactly like the Camry.

In comparison, while a Grand Marquis looks exactly like a Crown Vic inside and out, the Town Car, atleast for my '90-'97 generation and the '98+ gen as well, shares no body panels with the Vic/GM, and they really don't even have the same overall shape either, inside the resemblence of the outline of the dash is there, but overall, it has a different design.

But, thats an interesting way to look at the divsisons, and to have people move up as they get older/make more money... for those that insist on buying new cars every so many years.

Destroyer
06-15-08, 05:42 PM
Sometimes things just run their course. Nobody strives to own a Mercury. I dont think the next generation of seniors will buy them anyway. Besides, they are mostly rebadged Fords anyway, this will take away from the confusion. Instead of a Marquis someone will buy a Crown Vic, big deal. Like some said, profit is everything. If Ford realizes more profit without Mercury, its all good. Last Mercury I had was an '82 Capri RS. Fun car and not stock :D:

http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z251/AstrocreepVIII/P2220067.jpg


http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z251/AstrocreepVIII/Capri22.jpg


http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z251/AstrocreepVIII/Capri23.jpg

chubbyranger
06-15-08, 08:26 PM
Sometimes things just run their course. Nobody strives to own a Mercury. I dont think the next generation of seniors will buy them anyway. Besides, they are mostly rebadged Fords anyway, this will take away from the confusion. Instead of a Marquis someone will buy a Crown Vic, big deal. Like some said, profit is everything. If Ford realizes more profit without Mercury, its all good. Last Mercury I had was an '82 Capri RS. Fun car and not stock :D:
[/IMG]

:hmm: Looks like a Mustang, drives like a Mustang, smells like a Mustang...

Playdrv4me
06-15-08, 08:29 PM
I like the monochrome GT look on that... Nice :thumbup:

Destroyer
06-15-08, 10:38 PM
:hmm: Looks like a Mustang, drives like a Mustang, smells like a Mustang...And thats cause a Capri is a Mustang chubbs. Hood, grille, fenders all around and rear lights differentiate it with a pretty cool look IMO. This one had a 306 w/GT 40 heads, 8.8 rear w/4.10 gears, B303 cam, and several other mods such as dual exhaust and flowmasters, T5 5 speed, blah, blah. Had 60k original miles and was very clean. I ran low 13's with it w/traction problems. I know it could pull 12's but I sold it before it did. :thumbsup:

Night Wolf
06-16-08, 12:14 AM
What about the 80's 2-seater FWD? Capri? Those always seemed cool...

Playdrv4me
06-16-08, 12:30 AM
What about the 80's 2-seater FWD? Capri? Those always seemed cool...

I think they were more toward the 90s, last year of production was like '93 or '94. We almost bought one of those, they were actually an Australian platform.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-16-08, 12:31 AM
The Ford EXP/ Mercury LN7?

http://www.motorbase.com/pictures/contributions/000121b/std_1984_ford_exp-1.jpg

:vomit:

Playdrv4me
06-16-08, 12:36 AM
Lest we foget the ill-fated "Merkur" which meant absolutely nothing!

I love the small text in the bottom right, a classic example of Ford clusterf***ing things up as usual...

"FORD... IMPORTED FROM GERMANY EXCLUSIVELY FOR LINCOLN-MERCURY"

WTF?!

http://www.adclassix.com/images/85merkur.jpg

Lord Cadillac
06-16-08, 11:19 AM
And thats cause a Capri is a Mustang chubbs. Hood, grille, fenders all around and rear lights differentiate it with a pretty cool look IMO. This one had a 306 w/GT 40 heads, 8.8 rear w/4.10 gears, B303 cam, and several other mods such as dual exhaust and flowmasters, T5 5 speed, blah, blah. Had 60k original miles and was very clean. I ran low 13's with it w/traction problems. I know it could pull 12's but I sold it before it did. :thumbsup:
That was a very rare and very cool car back in the 80s...

dkozloski
06-16-08, 11:34 AM
Lest we foget the ill-fated "Merkur" which meant absolutely nothing!

I love the small text in the bottom right, a classic example of Ford clusterf***ing things up as usual...

"FORD... IMPORTED FROM GERMANY EXCLUSIVELY FOR LINCOLN-MERCURY"

WTF?!

http://www.adclassix.com/images/85merkur.jpg
If you had the right Merkur it went like stink and was a very popular club racer.

AMGoff
06-16-08, 01:33 PM
I agree with Sandy on the point that it's pretty ridiculous that everyone's jumping on the Mercury Bash-Wagon. Even if 90% of it has been either crap or "polished crap," why must we only accentuate the negative?? We should all be a little sad and worried that another great American automotive nameplate is seemingly on life-support.

Just remember... any problems with Mercury fall squarely on Ford's inept shoulders.

If/When Mercury does go to the great dealership in the sky... it will be a sad day - not quite as sad as Oldsmobile (Since Olds was still coming out with great, unique models), but still bad... more akin to Plymouth, in that it was just left to stagnate towards long, painful death.

But... None of us should be happy to see Mercury go.

** BTW... I agree with a few others on the 80's "Fox" Cougars... they were nice cars and I've always had a soft-spot for them... And I even liked the formal roofline the gave the Cougar opposed to the swept roof of the T-Bird.

Playdrv4me
06-16-08, 01:58 PM
I agree with Sandy on the point that it's pretty ridiculous that everyone's jumping on the Mercury Bash-Wagon. Even if 90% of it has been either crap or "polished crap," why must we only accentuate the negative?? We should all be a little sad and worried that another great American automotive nameplate is seemingly on life-support.

Just remember... any problems with Mercury fall squarely on Ford's inept shoulders.

If/When Mercury does go to the great dealership in the sky... it will be a sad day - not quite as sad as Oldsmobile (Since Olds was still coming out with great, unique models), but still bad... more akin to Plymouth, in that it was just left to stagnate towards long, painful death.

But... None of us should be happy to see Mercury go.

** BTW... I agree with a few others on the 80's "Fox" Cougars... they were nice cars and I've always had a soft-spot for them... And I even liked the formal roofline the gave the Cougar opposed to the swept roof of the T-Bird.

Indeed I am sad that another nameplate has been ruined, but my greater point is that Ford simply doesn't have the wherewithal to right that sinking ship again, and continuing to attempt to do so only puts the company as a whole in a more precarious position than they are already in. The cards have been played and Ford doesn't have any more wiggle room to be playing around with this stuff. Their best hope is to get back to the core of Ford and Lincoln and work their way up from there. Unfortunately Mercury's excision will need to be a side-effect of this plan unless they can pull off an absolute miracle. Even if they do, there is no assurance they won't just let it fall by the wayside and we'll be having this discussion again on air tablets 10 years from now.

So indeed I will correct myself... perhaps I have nothing against the Mercury brand at all, but rather Ford's mismanagement of it to the point the brand has no equity for anyone else to take it over, and it's just a dead black cavity between the bookends of Ford and Lincoln. I'm just tired of seeing it.

93DevilleUSMC
06-16-08, 04:30 PM
I agree with Sandy on the point that it's pretty ridiculous that everyone's jumping on the Mercury Bash-Wagon. Even if 90% of it has been either crap or "polished crap," why must we only accentuate the negative?? We should all be a little sad and worried that another great American automotive nameplate is seemingly on life-support.

Just remember... any problems with Mercury fall squarely on Ford's inept shoulders.

If/When Mercury does go to the great dealership in the sky... it will be a sad day - not quite as sad as Oldsmobile (Since Olds was still coming out with great, unique models), but still bad... more akin to Plymouth, in that it was just left to stagnate towards long, painful death.

But... None of us should be happy to see Mercury go.

** BTW... I agree with a few others on the 80's "Fox" Cougars... they were nice cars and I've always had a soft-spot for them... And I even liked the formal roofline the gave the Cougar opposed to the swept roof of the T-Bird.

You're right, any problems with Mercury do belong on Ford's head. Yes, it is sad that another American nameplate is dying.

But this nameplate isn't truly doing anything, and may well end up costing Ford more to revamp than it could ever profit Ford.

Destroyer
06-16-08, 06:03 PM
That was a very rare and very cool car back in the 80s...
I always liked them. I am fighting the urge to buy this one but I'm getting weak:D: http://tampa.craigslist.org/car/721670109.html

lawfive
06-16-08, 06:25 PM
I try like hell to always buy American, but with automobiles I have to beat the shit out of my pragmatic side first before I can do it.

MauiV
06-16-08, 08:55 PM
I actually liked the 1990ish Cougar XR-7 and considered one when I was 16. That car is still a pretty decent sleeper with some SC mods.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
06-16-08, 11:00 PM
The 1989+ Cougar was a decently cool car, especially with the Supercharged 3.8L. Man, what a sleeper!

97DevilleBeige
07-26-08, 11:12 AM
Does this mean maybe Ford had a change of heart and wants to keep Mercury around longer?
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080726/AUTO01/807260344/&imw=Y

Sandy
07-26-08, 12:28 PM
I think you'll like what is in store, for Mercury.
Recall those great models Ford had across the pond ? Euro Fords?
I understand thru rumors that Mercury in name is not going away,
but the American Mercury is leaving. Mercury will be the nameplate
on a selection of European Ford cars, rebadged as MERCURY and
to fix our EPA rules & regulations.

Again, it's a rumor, a rumor with some strong background.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
07-26-08, 12:30 PM
If that happened, that would rock.

AMGoff
07-26-08, 01:26 PM
Well this is certainly an unprecedented move... an automaker actually listening to the public? Uncanny...

How long have people been saying that if they actually start bringing over some of the European models, they might just generate some sales? And especially that Mercury would be the perfect nameplate to market them under?

There might just be half a brain somewhere left in Ford after all...

I~LUV~Caddys8792
07-26-08, 02:22 PM
Well Lee Iacocca is still alive. Maybe they've been paying him for some good ideas.

AMGoff
07-26-08, 03:23 PM
Well Lee Iacocca is still alive. Maybe they've been paying him for some good ideas.

Now I wouldn't go and give Ford that much credit... this is the company that was obtuse enough to pass on the minivan after all...

Then again, there isn't a Ford at the helm of the company these days... So there might be a glimmer of hope - I've said it before and I'll say it again... Ford's biggest obstacle has been and will always be the Ford family.

93DevilleUSMC
07-28-08, 09:34 AM
Now I wouldn't go and give Ford that much credit... this is the company that was obtuse enough to pass on the minivan after all...

Then again, there isn't a Ford at the helm of the company these days... So there might be a glimmer of hope - I've said it before and I'll say it again... Ford's biggest obstacle has been and will always be the Ford family.

We have nothing to fear but Ford itself.

Lord Cadillac
07-28-08, 12:51 PM
I do believe Mercury is OFF the chopping block.. Mercury will make little Lincolns - Lincoln will make kinda big Lincolns...