: Mass transit still sucks. Gas prices not that bad!



Jesda
05-26-08, 09:17 AM
I'm starting a new job on Tuesday at a company downtown. My commute would be 42 miles a day round trip, and while I've driven further for a lot less money gas was only $1.60 when I did.

At four days a week, my gasoline would cost $26-$33 a week assuming I get between 20 and 25 mpg. Not bad.

Mass transit which combines the MetroBus and MetroLink lightrail systems is $2.25 one way, which totals only $36 per week.

Here's the catch:
1. I'd have to wake up at 5:30am to get ready and eat breakfast to catch the bus at 6:27am.
2. I'd have to walk .19 miles to the bus stop.
3. I'd have to walk half a mile after getting off the train to get to my office. That would take 15 minutes.

If I drove, it would take 45 minutes one way (would be 25-30 minutes if not for the interstate being shut down for construction). I'd leave the house at 7:30, so I'd have to wake up at 6:30.

For the ride home, driving would save 35 minutes.

Mass transit total savings: $96/mo
Mass transit time lost: 32 hours per month from waking up early and getting home late.
Savings per hour of time lost: $3/hr. My time is worth much more than $3 per hour. Therefore, its still better to drive to work at $3.80 a gallon.


http://www.q45.org/gallery2/d/5968-2/DCP_2963.JPG
^A bit nicer than the bus.

Jesda
05-26-08, 09:49 AM
Actually, looking at it again (correcting my errors), and taking discounts into consideration:
It would be about $50 per month to take the bus and train.

ejguillot
05-26-08, 10:51 AM
If you count the time spent walking as exercise time, is it still wasted? :duck:

Night Wolf
05-26-08, 11:48 AM
I work about 8 miles from my house, one-eay.... so 16ish miles round trip. I work 4 days a week.

If I just drive to work and back, without going out for lunch (which is equal to a trip home and back because my small town is where all the nearest places to eat are) and then I don't really drive anywhere on my days off and just stay at the house and get thigns cleaned up here, a tank of gas in the Zu will last me over a month, as it has in the past..... so in effect, I can nearly spend as much, or as little as I want in gas.... stinks tho, cause I enjoy driving so much. Zu gets about 20-22mpg town, while it plays a role, the way I drive and A/C useage don't effect the MPG figures nearly as much as say the Town Car, which will literally make a night and day difference. I was surpsied a bit after I got the engine running again, I put 100+ miles of high-rpm, WOT runs.... there is an awesome driving road near my house, so I was holding out shifts, leaving it in lower gears and running it wide open anytime I wasn't on the brakes... out of the 250miles on thr trip odo, 100 of those were in that type of driving and it still averged 19mpg. Highway driving is where it suffers, at 65-70ish it'll only get 24-25mpg, I think at that point wind reistance has more to play then anything else.

Lets see, at 16 miles RT, times 4 days/week times 4 weeks/month, that is about 256 miles, the Zu holds 22 gallons, but I never run the tanks fully empty, so by the time i fill up it usualy takes 18-19gallons, still tho, on the trip odo, that would be about 350-400 miles of town driving, so if I decide not to go anywhere, a tank of gas will last me a month of going to work plus an extra 100-150 miles of various driving. At $3.90 for regular and 19 gallons that is about $75.... which would be a months worth of gas, if I could only keep myself from driving when I don't need to.

Although right now the Zu needs premium, else it pings like crazy. Computer is throwing codes for O2 sensor, which I replaced 1.5yrs ago, but it was left out and got rained on, so once I replace that (again) if that dosen't cure the problem, I take it the chipped #4 piston is causing a hot spot in the cylinder causing pre-ignition... so in that cause, with the other options of going thru all the work and money of fully rebuilding my engine, or replacing the engine, I'll gladly put premium, or mid-grade (which I haven't tried yet) in it.

Compare that to 1 round trip to Clearwater and back with the Town Car, it takes 1 tank of gas each way, plus however much I decide to drive around down there at.

Alright, I'm done..... friends invited me over for a cookout and I made the macaroni salad using our familes recipe... came out nearly almost like mom makes it.... which is a winner to me :)

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-26-08, 01:29 PM
Mass transit is fine, if only used to go to sporting events/shows during peak usage hours. Otherwise, from what I've seen, if you use it during slow times, you'll see some "interesting" people on board.

To go down to Minneapolis, I'll generally always use the light rail, but that's only because the parking situation downtown is so foul, and if I'm gonna go downtown, chances are I'll be drinking a fair amount of alcohol, and I don't wanna drive after a few, so let someone else do the driving!

orconn
05-26-08, 03:48 PM
Smart move, Chad! I have only been to Minneapolis a couple of times and was impressed with the Downtown Skyway. I was only going between hotels and high rise office buildings, but assume it would be great for getting around downtown in general.

Mass transportation can work great if it's convenient for the user. Unfortunately, most of us live in places that were planned or expanded the use of the personal car. Buses can be made to substitute but will be uneconomical to operate until ridership numbers bring their volume of use up to at least breakeven levels.

Most of the drawbacks to public transportation can be corrected over time and with general public usage. However,the isolation that driving one's self has allowed us, I believe has made us less aware of the need and more reluctant to comply with courtesy requirements of public transportation and less tolerant of mixing with those from different backgrounds.

I know I would have considered using the bus to get from my home to downtown L.A. after the 1980 energy crisis; as the early morning ride (6:00AM) ride wasn't unenjoyable, as others who worked on NYC time and cooks and kitchen help and other early risers were the main riders. Going home mid-afternoon was a whole nother story with the "boomboxers," vocal mentally ill, and others whose behavior commandeered the buses environment and made it unpleasant for everyone. We can learn to use public transportation again so it is tolerable for everyone ........... just go to Disneyland if you think it can't be done!

By the way Jesda, keep driving the BMW, you're already paying the overhead, you might as well enjoy the Bimmer while you got it!

Caddyshack100
05-26-08, 04:03 PM
It has been said that Mass Transit is for people who do not appreciate a car, or to put the other way, people will appreciate their car much more after they take mass transit. I would pay 10 dollars a gallon to drive rather than take mass transit. I took mass transit for 15 years while living in Toronto. North America is not Europe with its cow paths turned into roads and extremely high taxes on fuel people here will not tolerate living in close quarters to each other, this is one reason that public transit is not a success, name one bus service you can smoke on?, Can you eat on it? Do you have control of the seat beside you? NO, is this a control issue, yes, as the man said, 'I hope that everyone takes public transit, it means there will be more room on the road for me and my car.' lol

ewill3rd
05-26-08, 10:52 PM
I was reminded over the weekend of how powerful my disdain is for public transportation.

My son wanted to go see the Lincoln Monument and/or the Arlington National Cemetary for Memorial day.
If I drive there it takes about 10-15 minutes plus parking. The problem is this weekend is a HUGE weekend for the mall and the cemetary because of rolling thunder and the thousands and thousands of motorcycles, buses, cars, trucks and the like that will take up more than the available parking. We decided to take Metro.
All the metro stations in have no or limited parking but are too far to walk to, so I had to drive AWAY from my destination to find a metro station with parking, then we missed the train because we had to buy farecards.
Then we had to wait for a train, then ride several stations and transfer. All the station elevators were broken, the transfer train was running late due to an earlier rail problem and the train that is supposed to run every ten minutes took almost 20, then we had to fight our way onto a full car to go one more stop that was 2 minutes by rail. All in all it took almost 2 hours to get less than 4 miles. Not to mention it was $3.70 for EACH of us.

I have had nothing but bad luck on Metro, I hate it. Something is always wrong. Last time we went to the national zoo... another parking nightmare... one of the trains was practically on fire and we had to wait almost an hour for a replacement one, then we had to fight to get on it and even worse, I literally had to fight to get off! All the retards were blocking the door and I had to push through them then the door tried to crush me.
I started screaming and pushing the door open and all the people around me started to freak out :histeric:

I hate, hate, hate public transit. Too bad my son can't ride a motorcycle yet. Those are easy to park almost anywhere and my wife already rides.

hueterm
05-26-08, 11:25 PM
OMG -- don't get me started on the DC subways...

In college, me and a group of cheap ass friends almost didn't make it out of somewhere in the depths of DC hell alive looking for a subway b/c they didn't want to pay cab fare. We could see the station on the other side of this interstate, so we started over this pedestrian bridge that looked like it went to the station. Well, we made it half way across, and the bridge just ended, half way over the interstate w/just some chain link fence to keep you from going off into the roadway.

I then freaked out while doing an about face on the bridge, long enough to persuade them to take the nearest cab, which I paid for. It then took us to said subway station, where we then got to see all kinds of human degradation: we saw at least 2 or 3 complete lunatics on the train, plus a uri****** pen** in the station.

I was so glad to get out of there. A couple of years later, I was watching some movie set in DC and they showed the distinct roof pattern of the subway stations and had a flashback......like repressed memory syndrome...

Anyway, Jesda re: Metrolink -- if you could easily drive to a park and ride stop (just say NO to the bus...) and were working in a bldg downtown that was right on top of a Metrolink stop, then maybe....at least until 40 is done. However, if you've got to ride the bus and walk forever downtown -- no way. Not for that minimal extra cost.

dkozloski
05-26-08, 11:30 PM
I used to enjoy riding Greyhound between cities when I was in the service but I'd rather eat worms than ride a city bus to anywhere.

orconn
05-26-08, 11:54 PM
When it comes to the D.C. mass transit system I agree it is terrible; but I don't know which is worse because the traffic is terrible also and parking is either non-existent or so high cost it spoils the fun and makes you wince even if it's a business expense. Washington, D.C. is the worst I have experienced (I hear Boston is even worse, but fortunately I have had no experience with Boston) and I lived in Los Angeles for 30 years!

The only solution I could come up with was get the hell out of there. But then I had that option as I am retired and so is my wife.

Playdrv4me
05-27-08, 12:48 AM
I'm starting a new job on Tuesday at a company downtown. My commute would be 42 miles a day round trip, and while I've driven further for a lot less money gas was only $1.60 when I did.

At four days a week, my gasoline would cost $26-$33 a week assuming I get between 20 and 25 mpg. Not bad.

Mass transit which combines the MetroBus and MetroLink lightrail systems is $2.25 one way, which totals only $36 per week.

Here's the catch:
1. I'd have to wake up at 5:30am to get ready and eat breakfast to catch the bus at 6:27am.
2. I'd have to walk .19 miles to the bus stop.
3. I'd have to walk half a mile after getting off the train to get to my office. That would take 15 minutes.

If I drove, it would take 45 minutes one way (would be 25-30 minutes if not for the interstate being shut down for construction). I'd leave the house at 7:30, so I'd have to wake up at 6:30.

For the ride home, driving would save 35 minutes.

Mass transit total savings: $96/mo
Mass transit time lost: 32 hours per month from waking up early and getting home late.
Savings per hour of time lost: $3/hr. My time is worth much more than $3 per hour. Therefore, its still better to drive to work at $3.80 a gallon.


http://www.q45.org/gallery2/d/5968-2/DCP_2963.JPG
^A bit nicer than the bus.

Dayumn, where'd u get that SICK whip!

;)

Jesda
05-27-08, 12:51 AM
Dayumn, where'd u get that SICK whip!

;)

It is not sick! It is in fact pretty healthy.

CadillacGurl
05-27-08, 01:36 AM
The Chicago EL is how I get around... :)

Playdrv4me
05-27-08, 01:52 AM
The Chicago EL is how I get around... :)

I've heard that is one of the FEW that actually works WELL since it was designed that way from the beginning.

I remember watching a House Hunters episode where item 1 or 2 on the couple's wishlist was being within walking distance from the EL, even it meant dealing with a little bit of noise from the train itself.

77CDV
05-27-08, 02:38 AM
Since getting my licence at 16, I have used public transportation only as a last resort. Each time, I remember why I was over the moon to get my driver's licence in the first place. Screw gas prices. The day I have to give up my freedom to go where I want when I want in my own way at my own pace inthe conveyance of my choice is the day it's time to check out of Hotel Earth.

ewill3rd
05-27-08, 07:43 AM
The San Francisco area BART system is just as whack as the DC Metro system if you ask me.
Haven't been on any others.
I haven't yet met a city bus that I liked. In fact I don't know if I have ever been on a regular one.
They use Metro buses to shuttle folks to the Andrews air show which I recently did.
You don't pay and you don't have to figure out their crazy system and switch over and over to get where you need to.

The worst part about BART is that it is twice as expensive as any other subway system I have ridden on, as a minimum. Usually it is probably 3 times higher.
If I had a group of 3 or 4 people it was cheaper to pay the bridge toll, pay for parking, gas, my car payment, insurance, tires, oil and filter, and whatever else you can think of to operate a car than it would be to take BART to the city. If it was a busy weekend like Fleet Week I would take my motorcycle and split lanes all the way to the city, then get the heck out of there.
I'd take family on off days and weekdays over there and find a place to park.
Lots of good memories, NONE of them on the train with some hippie freakazoid who doesn't own a bar of soap from Berkeley who's been riding his bike all day.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-27-08, 01:03 PM
uGUq1atLTB8&feature=related

What happens in mass transit stays on mass transit.

Krashed989
05-27-08, 04:52 PM
My time is worth much more than $3 per hour. Therefore, its still better to drive to work at $3.80 a gallon.

$3.80 a gallon???? I'm Jealous! :crying:

Gas here is now $4.16 a gallon and expected to go up $0.35 in the next 2 weeks.

Jesda
05-27-08, 07:39 PM
It went down a bit. $3.72 today. :)

gary88
05-27-08, 07:44 PM
The El is great, but all the weirdos come out at night.

MauiV
05-27-08, 08:12 PM
Light rail that is done well (Denver) can be a God send. When I lived in Houston they talkied and talked about ti but it never materialized and IMO no city in this country needs it more .

Driving in Houston a a 45+ minute trip regardless of destination. The Hardy Toll road is the best $2 I have ever spent.

dkozloski
05-27-08, 08:59 PM
I can't imagine paying a toll to drive on a road that my taxes built. Who the hell talked you into laying down for that one. I'd have to do that with six paper bags over my head in case the first five broke.

MauiV
05-27-08, 09:14 PM
The Harris County Toll Road Authority owns 83 miles of road throughout Houston, and were started with $900 million in bonds is 1984.

The Texas Turnpike Authority refused to offer state and federal monies so the county manned up and made it happen. Houston encompasses roughly 600 sq miles and a population of 2.15 million. It isnt a mass county with a low population like Jax, OKC and Anchorage. It has no light rail so there is a bit of traffic on the Interstates.

Sit on I-45 at 5pm on a Friday afternoon in August in South Texas and I guarantee you will find $2 the next day.

dkozloski
05-27-08, 09:40 PM
The Harris County Toll Road Authority owns 83 miles of road throughout Houston, and were started with $900 million in bonds is 1984.

The Texas Turnpike Authority refused to offer state and federal monies so the county manned up and made it happen. Houston encompasses roughly 600 sq miles and a population of 2.15 million. It isnt a mass county with a low population like Jax, OKC and Anchorage. It has no light rail so there is a bit of traffic on the Interstates.

Sit on I-45 at 5pm on a Friday afternoon in August in South Texas and I guarantee you will find $2 the next day.
Ain't no way in hell I'd live anywhere with that many people. It's bad enough living in a state with 1 square mile per person. To each his own.

dwight.j.carter
05-27-08, 09:47 PM
I think the gas prices are not that bad either. It's just more that I am pissed that I have to spend the extra money on it when i could be buying other things lol. Hopefully someday it will die down so I can spend money on something other than gas.

ahahnu
05-27-08, 09:52 PM
For two years I worked in NYC. Here was my travel experience:
10 minutes to train station and park.
1 hour on the train
then I could either take a subway to a block away or walk to 23 blocks to my building. Well after watching people cough into their hand and grab the rail again, or watch people arise from their sleep (bums) to allow people to sit on their bed, I chose to walk. Sun, rain, snow wind whatever.
The whole thing took about 2 hours.
The worst was coming home, after jogging the mile plus to the station to try and make the train, miss it by 5 or less minutes and have to wait an hour for the next one. The worst was sprinting the last bit to see it pull off. Or NYC subways are notorous for failing in the rain. Too many extra facets you have to depend on with Mass transit. Give me V, give me liberty.

hueterm
05-27-08, 10:17 PM
For two years I worked in NYC. Here was my travel experience:
10 minutes to train station and park.
1 hour on the train
then I could either take a subway to a block away or walk to 23 blocks to my building. Well after watching people cough into their hand and grab the rail again, or watch people arise from their sleep (bums) to allow people to sit on their bed, I chose to walk. Sun, rain, snow wind whatever.
The whole thing took about 2 hours.
The worst was coming home, after jogging the mile plus to the station to try and make the train, miss it by 5 or less minutes and have to wait an hour for the next one. The worst was sprinting the last bit to see it pull off. Or NYC subways are notorous for failing in the rain. Too many extra facets you have to depend on with Mass transit. Give me V, give me liberty.

That sounds like the 9th ring of hell....

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-27-08, 10:32 PM
I can't imagine paying a toll to drive on a road that my taxes built. Who the hell talked you into laying down for that one. I'd have to do that with six paper bags over my head in case the first five broke.


I agree, especially if you've ever been through Illinois.

Playdrv4me
05-27-08, 11:52 PM
Im with DK, I refuse fawking toll roads at all possible costs. I hate them, just absolutely hate them, but in Houston you need every break you can get.

ewill3rd
05-28-08, 07:33 AM
I'll use one if it makes sense to get me where I am going in a timely manner.
I don't use them often.

I used to use toll bridges in CA, no choice out there. Sad part is the tolls were established to pay for the bridges, but now the government has them paid for a few times over but now they are used to getting the revenue so they keep charging tolls. In one way, they are upgrading and replacing the bridges but....
Of course they doubled most of the tolls in just the last few years.
:D

MauiV
05-28-08, 10:35 AM
Some genius here finally decided to pull the tolls off the Parkways here once they discovered they were generating (guess from memory) $13 million annually but cost $16 million to operate.

Duh.

They were definatly used here because they were much shorter cutoffs between Interstates and the only alternative was a state highway in the best case. I hate roads with stop signs and traffic signals.

CadillacGurl
05-28-08, 10:48 AM
The El is great, but all the weirdos come out at night.

True but its not that bad at 4:30AM when I have to take the red line (brown line doesn't start operating until 5AM) to Roosevelt so I can get on the orange line to Midway. There's at least 3 CTA people in each car which is interesting. Makes me feel safe.

But at like midnight you got the drunkards on the red line pissing on the doors, I hate the smell of piss. Hence why I normally avoid the red line (plus no cell phone signal!) The only thing I like about the redline is that it gets you to the depaul campuses in 15 minutes or less :bouncy: unlike the brown where there's construction mayhem...

Playdrv4me
05-28-08, 08:38 PM
Wow... Well this thread couldn't have been more well timed...

2 Commuter trains collide in Boston Story: http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g3Ckg1yqjwg9kEpnJeo6DpwuqzUAD90UU6S80

MauiV
05-28-08, 09:00 PM
Wow... Well this thread couldn't have been more well timed...

2 Commuter trains collide in Boston Story: http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g3Ckg1yqjwg9kEpnJeo6DpwuqzUAD90UU6S80


Chicago el derails,14 injured... http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080528/ap_on_re_us/train_derailment

Playdrv4me
05-28-08, 09:05 PM
Holy shit what are the odds of that?!!!! TWO derailments in one day less than 3 hours apart in completely different parts of the country!

Jesda, you jinxed our transit system.

gdwriter
05-29-08, 01:16 AM
Jesda, you jinxed our transit system.Bad Jesda! Bad! Bad!

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-29-08, 12:50 PM
Oh Gary! Good to see you back again. What was the cause of your vacation from CF and AIM?

gdwriter
05-29-08, 05:00 PM
Oh Gary! Good to see you back again. What was the cause of your vacation from CF and AIM?Yep. Didn't have a cellular modem to access the Internet on the train, and had some trouble connecting at my sister's house.

In the week I was gone, gas prices shot up more than .20. Mass transit is not an option for me (I will say I've had good experiences using the light rail line in Portland), but since a neighbor also works at OSU, I may try to car pool with him a couple of days a week.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
05-29-08, 08:22 PM
Oh, so that's why you didn't take the train from Grand Forks to Minneapolis to visit me! :p

ewill3rd
05-30-08, 08:07 AM
I used to live right by the train tracks between Emerado and Grand Forks!
Don't remember seeing many passenger trains running down those tracks. Lots of grain cars.

gdwriter
05-30-08, 12:34 PM
Oh, so that's why you didn't take the train from Grand Forks to Minneapolis to visit me! :pNo time on this trip. However, I have to make the trip again in August for my middle niece's confirmation. I'm taking the red-eye out of Portland and have a 3.5 hour layout at MSP. It's on a Friday, so come out to the airport, and I'll buy you breakfast.