: Another Successful Mod (albeit potentially destructive)



fubar569
05-04-08, 08:49 PM
Today i finally accomplished what was discussed in my other thread and in previous posts about a year ago. It was tried by "96 deville man" or someone close to that name with success at that time and I just got done testing it today...

taking a cue from eldorado1 after discussing the "Granatelli Trans Tuner" device during a time long ago...96 clipped the - wire going to the transmission pressure solenoid. This defaults it to maximum line pressure giving pretty much the hardest shifts you will get without digging into the transmission itself. However, due to additional strain it places on the driveline and also possibly the convertor/pump and other parts we do not know long term effects of this mod for daily driving. Thus simply clipping the wire is not recommended. A simple switch however to cue it up on command is the way to go!

I took it one step further using an illuminated switch and a 12v DPDT relay to break the connection.

One side of the relay breaks the connection on the -wire for the transmission pressure solenoid and the other side illuminates a LED to let you know the relay is active. The switch illuminates when the relay SHOULD be getting power. if you have a bright switch and a bright LED, you have max line pressure...if not, something is fuxored and it's time to trace wires.

One thing about using the switch...once you activate the relay and jack the pressure....even if you flip the switch off so normal signal is restored you MUST TURN THE KEY TO THE OFF POSITION AND TURN THE KEY BACK ON for normal transmission operation to resume. Otherwise, all works well and exactly as planned...

oh, i also made temporary/permanent muffler eliminators for my catback today. i needed to take the glasspacks off and refinish them plus im going to the dragstrip soon to report what hopefully will be a new best time with the addl modifications i've done...

till then...well you know the drill!

Highline Cady
05-04-08, 09:43 PM
Good to see that I'm not the only one trying to break stuff. LOL

fubar569
05-04-08, 10:00 PM
Good to see that I'm not the only one trying to break stuff. LOL

trust me man...i do a pretty good job of breaking stuff...i'm trying actively to NOT break TOO much stuff with this car....but i DO want to get with AJ after i save some cash up for a 3.71 swap & tune and i hope to spray mine by the end of the year as you are trying to now...

i think my next mod is gonna be solid billet 6061-T651 aluminum dogbone mounts for the top of the motor. i have a lead on nice stock to use, and someone who could probably program and machine off a set when i am done with the first pair...i know my bushings are shot so itsa good time to contemplate this mod

Tommy Deville
05-04-08, 10:07 PM
I need to see a video of this.

fubar569
05-04-08, 10:15 PM
I need to see a video of this.

that could be arranged...in car 1/4milefilm from next trip to dragstrip? or me tripping the switch on the street then hammering the throttle till it shifts?

i'll try to get some vids as soon as i can get around to it

Highline Cady
05-04-08, 10:43 PM
Cool, the 3.71's and tune will really help, unless you're talking about gas mileage.:highfive:

illumina
05-05-08, 03:03 AM
Highline, does yours have a limited slip?

NHRATA01
05-05-08, 10:03 AM
For what it's worth, back in my younger days I had a buddy with a '95 Z28, and we jacked up the line pressure to the point it would bark the tires at every shift. Well, it was cool back then, but sure doesn't make for a comfortable ride. The side effects were he tore up a trans mount every couple months, until he replaced the stock rubber unit with a polyurethane one, and then his 4L60E crapped out in roughly a year. So I'd be careful with how often you play with that if you want your 4T80 to last.

illumina
05-07-08, 03:39 AM
Highline, does yours have a limited slip?

Well???

Highline Cady
05-07-08, 07:38 AM
Oh sorry Illuimina, been bombing around in the car after my latest mod. No it doesn't have an LSD.

illumina
05-08-08, 12:17 AM
Oh sorry Illuimina, been bombing around in the car after my latest mod. No it doesn't have an LSD.

You're good bro!

My transmission rebuild went to a 3.33 FDR with a limited slip and a higher stall converter, and yes, this is for a 4.9! But she should run very well with that setup...

Northstars beware! :P :D

Highline Cady
05-08-08, 12:34 AM
AJ just set me up with another mod, we have a little test and tuning to finish up but first I have to get the bottles re-filled.:drool: So hopped up 4.9's beware also. LOL :thumbsup:

An LSD and drag slicks might be the next mod, I don't think there is anything else left.:yup:

fubar569
05-08-08, 07:35 AM
AJ just set me up with another mod, we have a little test and tuning to finish up but first I have to get the bottles re-filled.:drool: So hopped up 4.9's beware also. LOL :thumbsup:

An LSD and drag slicks might be the next mod, I don't think there is anything else left.:yup:

a smart person would've had the LSD machined and had the gear swap done all at once. why do the same job twice? :banghead:

but it's okay...i'll prolly do the same damn thing

Highline Cady
05-08-08, 02:39 PM
Who wants to do things the easy way. LOL

fubar569
05-08-08, 02:59 PM
haha...so true so true! thats why we're modifying Northstars right?

AJxtcman
05-08-08, 03:23 PM
I have not seen a LSD for a 4T80E that I would install!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :banghead:

I would only use one type with on a car with ABS/TCS also. The only type I feel that you should uses is a Torsen type.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c9/Audi_quattro_AWD_system.jpeg/250px-Audi_quattro_AWD_system.jpeg


This will destroy a 4T80E in no time! You can not use this with ABS/TCS systems!
1992 - 2003 CADILLAC 4.6 V8 (NOTE: 4T80E 4T60)
[PGCA2632] $299.95
http://www.phantomgrip.com/catalog/images/pgu.jpg

The Phantom Grip Limited Slip conversion kits install into your non-lsd differential converting it into a proven and competitive limited slip differential that enhances your traction needs. Phantom Grips 2-way LSD will considerably improve handling in daily driven, street/strip warrior, or full race vehicle. Every Phantom Grip is constructed of only the highest-quality hand selected materials. With over 500,000 miles of vigorous professional performance testing (SCCA, drag, rally, hill climb, ice, rain, etc.), we have been able to fine tune each application through specific heat treating and rockwell testing to achieve maximum performance and reliability. Each Phantom Grip unit is assembled with pressure tested matched sets of progressive-rate springs to achieve equal load distribution to the disc plates, which dramatically enhances reliability and performance. With such a passion for perfection, we at Phantom Grip are confident that when you choose a Phantom Grip unit, you are choosing, by far, the best limited slip conversion kit on the market.

fubar569
05-08-08, 03:46 PM
i cannot for the life of me remember the company that made MARK99STS's LSD but they were around 700 at the time and were made to order. good quality stuff, but i just lost the email so i couldnt say much more other than to contact him

Highline Cady
05-08-08, 07:41 PM
I knew there was a good reason I didn't have one. AJ hasn't recommended one to me, yet. :thumbsup:

Submariner409
05-08-08, 08:10 PM
With a little bit of work you can get the same launch traction from both front wheels (FWD): fool with individual tire pressures. Harder tires have less traction (to a point) than soft (to a point) tires. Much easier to dial in with a front wheel drive because there isn't as much body torque at launch. Pick up a pair of used rims, same as your OEM but maybe not as pretty, and install track-only tires for the fun days.

AJxtcman
05-08-08, 08:14 PM
Just think about this.
An aluminum block with springs pushing it out.
NO fiction material!
The aluminum get ground up and it goes through the trans. Into the pump and then it will die!

illumina
05-09-08, 12:46 AM
Well, the LSD I had done for my 4.9 - 4T60-E was done by Engineered Performance. It has no aluminum what so ever - it has the friction plates which are steel, and then there are like five springs.

I hope that will be enough to not destroy my transmission rebuild...

AJxtcman
05-09-08, 08:11 AM
Well, the LSD I had done for my 4.9 - 4T60-E was done by Engineered Performance. It has no aluminum what so ever - it has the friction plates which are steel, and then there are like five springs.

I hope that will be enough to not destroy my transmission rebuild...

I have seen that site before, but not sure how they do it.
I think this may explain why I feel so strongly about aluminum/brass blocks.

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Trans%20Parts/ep.jpg

I still feel the a Torsen is the only type for a Car with "TCS or VSES and ABS"

Have you ever seen a GM car or truck with TCS or VSES without a Torsen or a Eaton type with a governor?

NHRATA01
05-09-08, 08:42 AM
I have seen that site before, but not sure how they do it.
I think this may explain why I feel so strongly about aluminum/brass blocks.

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd25/AJxtcman/Trans%20Parts/ep.jpg

I still feel the a Torsen is the only type for a Car with "TCS or VSES and ABS"

Have you ever seen a GM car or truck with TCS or VSES without a Torsen or a Eaton type with a governor?

TCS, yes, GM used to use an Auburn clutch type rear diff in the '98 and earlier LS1 cars before switching to a Torsen gear type diff. My T/A right now has an Eaton diff on the aftermarket 12 bolt that works fine with the TCS system. Shoot, quite a few people have even used a locker rear without issue.

EDIT: Actually I don't think I quite understood the question, so ignore my post.

AJxtcman
05-09-08, 01:14 PM
TCS, yes, GM used to use an Auburn clutch type rear diff in the '98 and earlier LS1 cars before switching to a Torsen gear type diff. My T/A right now has an Eaton diff on the aftermarket 12 bolt that works fine with the TCS system. Shoot, quite a few people have even used a locker rear without issue.

EDIT: Actually I don't think I quite understood the question, so ignore my post.

It has to do with YAW

Ok your car starts into a bad YAW rate, so the VSES attempts to apply the brake to wheel X. With a locker wheel X is attached to wheel Y and this causes more YAW and the car spins out.

fubar569
05-10-08, 04:39 AM
those 6061-T651 dogbones are (80%) done. basically due to equipment and time constraints they are basically straight bar with radiused edges and a slight profile in the mount between attachment points. The bushing/sleeve is 1/2" stainless bar center drilled with a 3/8" hole for the stock bolts. this leaves .060 or so for wear which should be plenty...

AJxtcman
05-10-08, 08:38 AM
those 6061-T651 dogbones are (80%) done. basically due to equipment and time constraints they are basically straight bar with radiused edges and a slight profile in the mount between attachment points. The bushing/sleeve is 1/2" stainless bar center drilled with a 3/8" hole for the stock bolts. this leaves .060 or so for wear which should be plenty...


STAINLESS STEEL ROD ENDS
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/eccStoreFront/product_images/240/91008051_R.jpg (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/p/1584,296_Stainless-Steel-Rod-Ends.html)

The overall width is 1.370"
The rod end width is 1.050" and the I.D. of the rod end is 1.125"
The steel sleeve O.D. is 0.750" with a 0.500" I.D.

$17.99

ROD END BUSHING KITS, 1/2"
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/eccStoreFront/product_images/900/910-08015_R.jpg (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/p/1583,296_Front-Rod-End-Bushing-Kits-1and2andquot;.html)

Fits rod ends with a 1.137" I.D. and rod end width of 1.050"
The total width of the bushing/sleeve/rod end is 1.375"
The steel sleeves have an I.D. of .500" and an O.D. of .750"
The steel sleeves have a length of 1.375"

$24.99

ROD END BUSHING KITS, 5/8"
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/eccStoreFront/product_images/900/910-08015_R.jpg (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/p/7040,296_Rear-Rod-End-Bushing-Kits-5and8andquot;.html)

Fits rod ends with a 1.137" I.D. and rod end width of 1.485"
The steel sleeve I.D. is 0.625" and O.D. is 0.815"
The steel sleeve has a length of 1.76"

$24.99


ADVENTURE SERIES EXTREME POLY BUSHINGS & HEIMS
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/eccStoreFront/product_images/700/721-1016_R.jpg (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/p/8663,296_Adventure-Series-Extreme-Poly-Bushings-and-Heims.html)

Hole diameter is 0.625"
Thread length is 3.03"
Rod end width at bolt hole eyelet (bolt sleeve width) is 2.625"
Rod end length center eye to tip of threads is 4.725"
Rod end body diameter is 2.756"

$39.95 LH & RH

SLEEVES FOR 5/8" ROD ENDS
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/eccStoreFront/product_images/900-949%208TH/916-31_R.jpg (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/p/8979,296_Sleeves-for-5and8andquot;-Rod-Ends.html)
Plain Steel Sleeve ---------- $29.99 25" to 54"
Chrome Steel Sleeve ------- $69.99 25" to 54"
Unpolished Stainless Steel -- $89.99 25" to 54"

Speedway Motors (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/)


Rod Ends, Heim Joints, Tie Rods (http://www.speedwaymotors.com/m/296_Street-Rod-Heim-Joints-Rod-Ends-and-Tie-Rods.html)

fubar569
05-10-08, 07:25 PM
looks like some quality stuff...except the part where it costs money...lol

Trickstr
06-03-09, 07:26 AM
Not that I want to bump up a year old post but I have been searching about this mod for 8 hrs now. Where is these wires located and colors? I would think it would be better to break the ground to the solenoid rather then the power?
Anyone else try doing this?
I would only use at the track, once in a great while seeing I only go once or twice a season.
Thanks

Patrick
95 STS

CadillacSTS42005
06-03-09, 10:43 AM
i cannot for the life of me remember the company that made MARK99STS's LSD but they were around 700 at the time and were made to order. good quality stuff, but i just lost the email so i couldnt say much more other than to contact him

i really want to say it was Yank...

Raze
06-03-09, 03:29 PM
i really want to say it was Yank...

Yank makes higher stall torque converters which can be used in the 4T80E. Engineered Performance, I believe, made Mark's LSD but I could be wrong...

STSS
06-03-09, 04:13 PM
Am I mistaken... doesn't the line pressure go to max when you pull it down into 1st or 2nd? Maybe this is only 98+?

Mine hits second HARD when you have it in 1st.

97EldoCoupe
06-03-09, 04:34 PM
Mine hits hard in 2nd even if I leave it in "D". A while ago I chirped both front tires at around 45 MPH when it shifted into 2nd, on dry clean road. This is with a set of General Exclaim UHP W rated tires all around.

Submariner409
06-03-09, 07:23 PM
With the stick in 2, on a WOT my 1 - 2 shift is hard. In D, normal gas pedal, merely tight.

Trickstr
06-03-09, 10:48 PM
Mine hits hard from a stop, shifting 1 to 2 laying down 30ft of rubber and little chirp 2 to 3. I was looking for the way to cheat the solenoid to go full pressure so it would also quicken the shifts, mine feels like almost a full second to pull off the change, even though I do put down rubber doing it at WOT

Anyone know where that solenoid is or where the wires run?

Raze
06-04-09, 01:32 PM
Mine hits hard from a stop, shifting 1 to 2 laying down 30ft of rubber and little chirp 2 to 3. I was looking for the way to cheat the solenoid to go full pressure so it would also quicken the shifts, mine feels like almost a full second to pull off the change, even though I do put down rubber doing it at WOT

Anyone know where that solenoid is or where the wires run?

I only believe you're laying down 30 ft of rubber if you've got undersized tires or severely overinflated your tires, or the conditions are so cold you're getting no traction, your stability control should prevent exactly this behavior. A chirp from 2-3? Again, something's suspect here...

STSS
06-04-09, 04:22 PM
:yeah:

V-Eight
06-04-09, 05:08 PM
What exactly does a higher stall change?

Submariner409
06-04-09, 05:12 PM
A higher convertor stall speed allows a higher engine rpm at launch, applying more hp/torque from up in the power band. Given the small convertor and power bands we're currently using in the 4.6 FWD series, I would save a high-stall convertor mod for a track car or engine/drivetrain swap into a kit car.

Trickstr
06-04-09, 10:58 PM
I dont think my traction control is even working. I have had a few scary moments going around a rotary in the rain the other day. I have no codes for Trac control, just history codes for ride control (right rear shock is leaking air). I have only owned this car for a month now and some thing is not right with it. The guy I got it from said it had a Shelby motor in it, thought he was full of it cause as far as I know Shelby only does Fords and a few dodges in their past. The few people I had in the car said that there is no way its a 15 sec car, it pulls like the space shuttle! Their butt dyno told me high 13's. I think it only feels that way because of the ride control is not working so when I get on it the only you see when im coming down the road is my oil pan!