I took my 3.6 di cts to the dealer today to have the sooty tailpipes looked at and they said there was nothing they can do. My service advisor told me I should be using premium gas instead of regular. I told him the owners manual calls for regular but he says that it's a high performance engine and to get the best performance to use premium. Has anybody else been told this and does using premium solve the sooty tailpipe problem?

as the manual calls for regular gas, the motor is tuned for regular gas and using premium is likely to result in nothing more than wasted money. I think it is irresponsible for them to tell you that.

This problem is universal to our CTS. I think that everyone has the same problem. In my experience, using Premium does absolutely nothing except drain your wallet faster. I tried it for two full tanks and I experienced absolutely no gain in power or fuel economy. It also made no difference in the soot problem either. I think your service is way out in left field on this one IMHO. Remember this engine was designed to run on Regular, not Premium! Running Premium over time can actually be detrimental to the engine.
If you are not sure, try running it yourself and see what you think.
Good luck, and let us know!

Here's the official word. If your service advisor wants to argue with Tim Cyrus, chief engineer for GM's high-feature V-6 and Northstar premium V-8, I think he will lose.


I do not have an unusal amount of carbon. I use Top Tier gasoline. Regular.
http://www.toptiergas.com/




THE STORY BEHIND WARD'S 10 BEST ENGINES
By Gary Witzenburg
Ward's AutoWorld, Mar 1, 2008 12:00 PM
The Ward's 10 Best Engines competition celebrates 14 years of recognizing outstanding powertrain development. In the second of our 2008 series, Ward's looks at the design philosophy behind GM's 3.6L high-feature V-6 in the Cadillac CTS.

Regular Fuel, Spectacular Engine

New engine designed to burn regular from the get-go. Hybrid version coming.

In just a few short years, gasoline direct fuel injection has gone from being rare, cutting-edge technology to almost commonplace.

Long used to improve the efficiency and performance of diesel engines, it now is almost a requirement on premium and turbocharged high-performance gasoline powertrains. Direct injection is employed on no less than six of this year's Ward's 10 Best Engines.

But General Motors Corp. added a couple of new twists when it began development of its all- aluminum DOHC 24-valve, dual-VVT “high-feature” V-6 available in the '08 Cadillac CTS.

It was designed to run on regular, instead of premium fuel, and it incorporates fuel injectors with a unique design to isolate and minimize the noise high-pressure injection systems are prone to create.

The new engine was designed to burn regular fuel from the start, says Tim Cyrus, chief engineer for GM's high-feature V-6 and Northstar premium V-8.

“The development team did not waiver; the focus was detailed combustion development,” Cyrus says.

However, the focus on regular fuel did lengthen development time, because more iterations of ports, pistons and injection components were required. The extra time appears well spent now, as many competitive (and some lesser) engines still require premium.

As its name implies, direct injection sprays fuel directly into each cylinder, instead of into the intake manifold ports. As the fuel mixes with air and vaporizes in the cylinder, the air/fuel mixture is cooled, which improves combustion efficiency and enables a higher compression ratio (11.3:1 vs. 10.2:1) in the port-injected 3.6L.

In the version used in the CTS, DIG boosts peak power by 41 eager horses from 263 to 304 hp and peak torque from 253 lb.-ft. (343 Nm) to 273 lb.-ft. (370 Nm), compared with the standard port-injected version.

DIG also can be controlled to create a richer mixture around the spark plug during cold starts, making it easier to ignite. This smoothes the combustion event and reduces cold-start hydrocarbon emissions by about 25%.

But DIG has had its issues — primarily injector noise and (in earlier applications) intolerance of certain impurities and additives in gasoline. As the first auto makers that brought the concept to the U.S. learned, less-than-perfect gas progressively could plug the injectors. Because this was good for neither customer satisfaction nor warranty cost, these early adopters temporarily backed away from introducing the technology to the U.S. and other markets with questionable fuel quality.

Now GM, Audi AG, BMW AG, Mazda Motor Corp., Toyota Motor Corp. and others have resolved the plugging issue and — as this spectacular V-6 illustrates — are winning the war on noise as well.

One key to the latter is GM's industry-first and U.S-market exclusive isolated injector system.

“That's where this engine differentiates itself from the competition,” GM's Cyrus says. “It differs from the rest of its family by its cylinder heads and injectors, high-pressure fuel pump and considerable noise treatment. Because the pump and injectors are under extremely high pressures, a lot of ticking noises can be telegraphed through the engine block.”

“It's all about isolating the fuel-injection system. We are the only ones right now with injectors that are isolated instead of rigid-mounted into the cylinder head. Each injector sits down in a pocket on what looks like a little lip seal with a metallic spring and an elastomer, and that also serves as a secondary seal.” Nearly a decade ago, GM decided to step up to its urgent need for an all-new, high-tech V-6 architecture. A small project center was formed in February 1999 at GM Powertrain in Warren, MI. Cyrus came on board that September as chief engineer.

“We brought in people from Australia, because we knew we were going to manufacture and sell it there,” he says. “Sweden, because we knew we were going to be there, and Germany and the U.S. Bob Jacques, our design-systems engineer and the base-engine designer, led the team until I got there.

“From the beginning, we had the vision it would be a world engine that would package in all GM architectures and would be turbocharged (in versions such as the 2.8L Saab engine) and direct injected. The design comprehended all of those elements up front. It would go into production in 2003, and we would bring out a turbocharged version and the DI not long after that.”

“For North America, the noise was our biggest concern, and when we decided to roll it into the Cadillac, we knew it had to be very, very quiet,” Cyrus says. “Because direct injection in diesels is essentially the same technology, people assumed these things were going to sound like diesels. Some competitors already had rolled out direct-injection engines, and you could hear them coming: ‘tick-tick-tick-tick-tick.’

“We took the approach the DI had to be as quiet as, or quieter than, the MPFI. My counterparts at the platform also stepped up. They wanted the advantages of this technology in fuel economy and performance. So they worked to make the vehicle quieter, in case we were not so successful in quieting the engine.”

As a result, the DIG engine is quieter than the MPFI, he says.

The second major concern was injector plugging.

“We ran fleets here in the U.S., where we know we have lousy fuel, and abroad, including China, where we also have lousy fuel. And we ended up in very good shape, thanks to design features from our injector supplier, Bosch (Robert Bosch GmbH) and geometric features in the combustion chamber.”

Beyond its four cams, 24 valves and variable timing (aka cam phasing) on both intake and exhaust valves, GM's high-tech, high-feature DIG V-6 boasts cast-aluminum pistons with floating wrist pins, polymer-coated skirts and lubricating/cooling oil squirters; a forged steel crankshaft; sinter-forged connecting rods and a structural cast-aluminum oil pan with steel baffles.

GM intends to produce some 200,000 DIG vehicles globally this year, and one in six GM vehicles should have it by 2010, including some in much lower price ranges.

“There is a lot of pull from customers already,” Cyrus says. The extra cost of the DIG technology is primarily related to the higher-pressure injectors, with bigger coils to open them, and an extra mechanical fuel pump.

As Corporate Average Fuel Economy rules increase to 35 mpg (6.7 L/100 km) in the next dozen years, Cyrus says there is significant room for improvement, beginning with the next-generation DIG V-6 due in 2010.

“The beauty of combining four cam phasers with direct injection is that it can get you both performance and fuel economy,” he says.

“We will continue to work the combustion process and the injection system to improve both. And we can downsize the engine with more (turbo) boost to get more power out of smaller displacement with better fuel economy. You'll probably also see this high-feature DI V-6 with hybrid machinery on it,” Cyrus adds, noting GM's 2-mode hybrid system.

Since GM has suspended development of the next-generation premium V-8 that would have replaced its able but aging Northstar V-8, the DIG high-feature V-6 could be a suitable substitute down the road.

“We expected to sell quite a few V-8s and smaller numbers of V-6s, but sales have gone the other way around, probably 80% V-6 and 20% V-8 in the STS. For the time being, we'll continue to offer both and let the customer decide.”

for non di what should u be running?

for non di what should u be running?

Regular

for non di what should u be running?

what the owners manual says

just stating the obvious here - with the cost of gas rising (and not coming down anytime soon), i wouldn't be the LEAST BIT SURPRISED to learn that some of the less reputable, less commercial type gas stations water down their gas to get more out of THEIR money.

i probably would be surprised if a sunoco or a mobil or a valero or an exxon did it but hey - business people need to eat too...why not ya know?

point is - if you're experiencing pinging and/or bad acceleration or performance, try another gas station.....just a thought

Here's a fun point about the sooty tailpipes no one has brought up yet- the CTS doesn't put any more soot out the exhaust than other cars, but due to the design of the exhaust tip, you see it more.

I know what you're thinking: Tony's crazy, right? Not really. Most every car out there has a polished lip on the exhaust tip, but the inner area of the tip is either raw or black. The soot gathers in there like crazy, but you can't see it due to the design of the tip.

2008 CTS Exhaust tip:

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn208/Cadillac_Tony/2008cts-2.jpg

E&G Tip for 2007 CTS (notice that only the ring around the outsude is polished)

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn208/Cadillac_Tony/tip.jpg

Lexus IS-F tips (again, a raw inner tip that won't show the soot)

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn208/Cadillac_Tony/tiplfa.jpg


FYI, the Corsa exhaust tips on my CTS-V get sooty as heck, and it's got a 5.7L V8, not a DI V6. Exhaust soot isn't unique to this engine, it's just more noticeable since the inside of the tips are finished and visible. If anyone still thinks I'm nuts, go out to your other car (not your CTS), run your finger around the inside of the tip and see if it comes out dirty.

Oh, and to answer the original question: Run regular unless your driving climate causes the engine to ping under hard throttle, then step up in Octane until it stops. 99% of driving conditions require nothing more than regular.

I pretty much use Chevron in all my cars - all use regular except for my Z06. No sooty pipes yet !

Carter

Your service manager is the type of person who gives dealers a bad name. I've known for many, many years that running higher grade octanes in an engine not designed for it can not only waste money, but actually perform worse. One of the primary characteristics of the readily available high octane fuels is that they burn slower. Do google searches on the subject and you'll come up with lots of information on the subject.

And I agree with Tony - all exhausts are sooty. My LS3 Corvette does the same thing. I wipe mine out every week with a mix of Zaino quick detailer - I think it is the Z6, mixed 50/50 with water, and a paper towel. This seems to keep it from building up quite as much - although it still does.

Also, Ethanol is often used as a blending agent to boost octane in the "higher octane grades" since it has a very high octane rating itself but it also is lower in BTU content per gallon so your MPG will likely drop slightly. Of course the more extreme case is the vehicles capable of using E85 where the mileage is dramatically less when that blend is used.

My owners manual (car built late Oct '07) recommends 89 octane for the DI engines (although 87 was declared acceptable it indicates better performance would be gained by running 89) and 87 for the VVT engines. I specifically looked it up and specifically asked the service department to verify when I took possession of the car (The actually recommendation is based on a vin code and I had the dealer verify the vin code)

My owners manual (car built late Oct '07) recommends 89 octane for the DI engines (although 87 was declared acceptable it indicates better performance would be gained by running 89) and 87 for the VVT engines. I specifically looked it up and specifically asked the service department to verify when I took possession of the car (The actually recommendation is based on a vin code and I had the dealer verify the vin code)

that's because the VIN code 8th digit is the engine: 7 is port-injected and V is direct-injected.
the octane descriptions on page 5-5 are pretty clear, use 87 unless you really need to use 89. the port-injected version is slightly more sensitive to detonation under load (that's an advantage to DI).

that's because the VIN code 8th digit is the engine: 7 is port-injected and V is direct-injected.
the octane descriptions on page 5-5 are pretty clear, use 87 unless you really need to use 89. the port-injected version is slightly more sensitive to detonation under load (that's an advantage to DI).

If that is indeed true than I was misanformed on the VIN code in the shop. Since I carry both a 7 and V on my code I requested clarification on which one was the engine code. I was told the 7 applied in this case.

GM went to a lot of trouble to develop an engine that makes as much as others the same size, and more than many, without using boost and without requiring premium. you are driving leading-edge technology. be proud to put in regular gas at the pump. most other vehicles in this class besides gm cannot.
premium is a complete waste of money. it does nothing to improve performance. stick to top tier 87 or 89 and don't worry.
rg