: GM and aftermarket tuning:



hcvone
04-11-08, 08:02 AM
Looks like GM is getting nasty after aftermarket tuning and engine mods, this is from our Vette club Chevy service tech


aftermarket engine programs

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As Glenn stated a week ago that GM is coming out with a bulletin pertaining to aftermarket engine calibrations is true pip4386 just released 4/8/08 advising how to get info from pcm to compare to what program GM is using to take photo's etc. and that repairs to driveline will NOT be covered under new car warranty so be careful.

TSS
04-12-08, 04:27 PM
Carl, translation ? If we have a handheld tune, should we immediate reset to stock? Or is it basically too late? I, of course , always reset b4 bringing to the dealership anyway .

Dif
04-12-08, 05:02 PM
That was my thoughts too.
I remove the hand held performance program and put it back to stock before any dealer visits.
But if they do check, can they tell if a different program has ever been installed even when it's not in there any more? :bigroll:

hcvone
04-12-08, 06:12 PM
If you are going in for any warranty work where they will access the computer I would put the stock program back in, but not for anything else, it's going to kill the dyno tuning. :(

ewill3rd
04-12-08, 07:19 PM
The scenario might play out like this.

Dealer has to do transmission, differential or major engine work. The bill looks like it will be expensive and you have lots of mods. They might go in and check the CVN numbers to verify the factory programming is in place.
If the numbers don't match they will print some stuff out, email it to GM and get a warranty block put on the car.
I would only do such a thing if I suspected extreme abuse or if someone forced me to, like an AVM or a field engineer... something like that.

It takes some time to go checking all those numbers, it won't be done routinely. I suspect it will be a case by case issue on cars that dealers with a grudge don't want to have to repair anymore.

hcvone
04-13-08, 07:27 AM
Looks like I need two computers, the stock one and an aftermarket tuned one for the Z06. :(

ewill3rd
04-13-08, 08:58 AM
Oh and if I didn't mention it, the way it was explained to me is this.
The CVN number is basically a sum of the bits used in the calibration. when you change the programming you turn some bits on and some bits off. Obviously this will change the sum. The CVN number is basically the total bits, if the bits don't match then someone has been doing some switching.
Not sure how accurate that description is but the guy who explained it to me really seemed to know what he was talking about.

TSS
04-13-08, 12:39 PM
Oh and if I didn't mention it, the way it was explained to me is this.
The CVN number is basically a sum of the bits used in the calibration. when you change the programming you turn some bits on and some bits off. Obviously this will change the sum. The CVN number is basically the total bits, if the bits don't match then someone has been doing some switching.
Not sure how accurate that description is but the guy who explained it to me really seemed to know what he was talking about.

Thanks. Sorry if I am not getting this. :hmm:

If I bring the Truck in and I have already brought it back to the stock program (like the day before I bring it in), will my CVN number be okay? Or, will my CVN number still indicate I had monkeyed around before bringing it back to stock? And, if so, then basically anyone who has ever changed their program, EVER, and then returned it to stock could be SOL? :crying2:

hcvone
04-13-08, 01:17 PM
You will be fine putting the stock tuning back in, the hand held computers do not allow large changes like a LS1 Edit would, the down side is you do not get as much performance, the up side is you can not damage your engine with the hand held units because they do not allow enough change. Putting you stock tune in and driving to the dealership would be all you would have to do. :)

GM-4-LIFE
04-13-08, 01:26 PM
Anyone can abuse their vehicle and if they had aftermarket tuning, all that has to be done is return the programming back to stock and wheel it into any dealer. If the dealer checked it out, they would see the stock GM programming. That is what I think a majority of us would do knowing that the stock programming can be put back in and the aftermarket tune backed up and saved until after the car is out of the dealer for warranty repairs.

It was a matter of time before GM did something about aftermarket tuning anyway. The only problem for them is there is a simple way around it.

SG

TSS
04-13-08, 01:27 PM
You will be fine putting the stock tuning back in, the hand held computers do not allow large changes like a LS1 Edit would, the down side is you do not get as much performance, the up side is you can not damage your engine with the hand held units because they do not allow enough change. Putting you stock tune in and driving to the dealership would be all you would have to do. :)


Carl: Thanks for putting it into words a simpleton like me can understand. :o

VERY relieved......

ewill3rd
04-13-08, 04:06 PM
If you had say 2 PCMs, one with the stock cals and one with a modified "tune" and you swapped the stock one back before taking it in, you wouldn't have to worry.
As long as the numbers all match and the CVN is the same they can't complain about that.
If you have a supercharger and all kinds of other stuff strapped on there.. well that is another story.

hcvone
04-14-08, 07:42 AM
Bill, are you saying that you could tell if there is a supercharger on a truck. :D , just kidding, as always thanks for your info. :)

ewill3rd
04-14-08, 08:03 AM
... sometimes without even opening the hood! :lol:

gs430
04-16-08, 01:44 PM
I was thinking of getting a big brake kit installed.Would that void the warranty?

hcvone
04-16-08, 02:09 PM
I was thinking of getting a big brake kit installed.Would that void the warranty?

Would not on the whole truck, but would probably void the warranty on the brake system which could include the ABS and sensors, never talk to the dealer about that issue yet. :)

ewill3rd
04-17-08, 08:33 AM
As stated, an argument could be made to deny claims on related components.
It shouldn't affect warranty on anything not related... obviously big brakes won't make the radio quit working or something but if you develop brake problems... you might be on your own.

scottlma
04-17-08, 08:18 PM
Last Saturday, all of a sudden driving down the highway the brake light goes on and door chime goes nuts (brakes worked fine). Brought the truck to the dealer for repair - they claim its not covered under warranty due to the way I had wired up my V1 fuzzbuster, and charges me 125 bucks for my trouble

I didnt modify or tap into a single factory wire - simply plugged into an unused ignition controlled 12V terminal (for some wiring harness that my lade doesnt have) then snaked the wire up towards the dash. All was fine for about a month or so before this happened. They are claiming that my 12 volt wire was causing magnetic interferance with the wire from the emergency brake pedal sensor ???. I could beleive this if I had tightly wrapped the wires together, but for a piece of bell wire with 12 volts running through it to have enrgized another wire in the same vacinity - I'm having trouble beleiving it. They did at least offer to "fix" it as part of the 125 fee - and agreed that if it happened again, that it would be their problem, since they fixed it, it would no longer be a non-dealer-installed accesory. Their fix was to just let the wire hang loose (almost guaranteeing that i will catch it on my foot at some point). They did not in any way change the way i had it connected into the wiring terminal.

Thankfully I had also had them take a look at wind noise (they "adjusted drivers side door weatherstripping") and the heated wiper fluid switch (bad switch), otherwise they told me i also would have also been stuck with the bill for the loaner (rental) car.

The only good news here though was that they were at least as friendly as they could be - considdering that they were giving me expenseive bad news. The service advisor seemed almost embarassed to have to tell me that they were charging me. I am confident i would have gone balistic if they weren't.

Anyone else have an experience like this ?

hcvone
04-18-08, 08:51 AM
I just got my BMW 6 and listen to this, on the windshield they was a decal attached, it says:

The use of Non BMW approved accessories such as: alarms, phone, radio, amp, radar dector, brake dust shields, cell phones, CB's, tires, wheels and suspension parts will void warranty.

Telling you right up front, so I couse the modding has begun. ;)

simplemind
04-18-08, 10:44 AM
I just got my BMW 6 and listen to this, on the windshield they was a decal attached, it says:

The use of Non BMW approved accessories such as: alarms, phone, radio, amp, radar detector, brake dust shields, cell phones, CB's, tires, wheels and suspension parts will void warranty.

Telling you right up front, so I course the modding has begun. ;)


My '07 530 said nothing like that, so that's a new one, and frankly I don't like it. However.........

I guess I always assumed that I was taking a risk by tapping into the wiring for my Passport hardwiring, blue tooth, etc. on other vehicles. I put myself in their shoes: If someone came in with a fried electrical system (unlikely, but just for example), demanding a warranty repair, and he had wired an amp wrong, causing voltage spikes or drops across the buss that resulted in a damaged component, then I would say :violin:!

Why should I lose money because some :bonkers: damaged the vehicle?

Just a guess, now that many vehicles are using the buss system, which btw is great, it is also more sensitive to voltage/current change.

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scroitoru
04-18-08, 10:58 AM
The use of Non BMW approved accessories such as: alarms, phone, radio, amp, radar dector, brake dust shields, cell phones, CB's, tires, wheels and suspension parts will void warranty.


I did not know the BMW males radar detectors or cell phones ?! can one buy a cell phone or a radar detector from BMW as an accessory?! what kind a crap is that? :hmm:

simplemind
04-18-08, 11:06 AM
I did not know the BMW males radar detectors or cell phones ?! can one buy a cell phone or a radar detector from BMW as an accessory?! what kind a crap is that? :hmm:


I think it said "BMW Approved", not necessarily a genuine BMW accessory. I, for one, would like to see the list of approved devices!

hcvone
04-18-08, 12:34 PM
BMW does sell cell phones that fit into a pocket in the car, I think it was like $1900.00, a real bargain. I will ask about the radar dector next time I am there. ;) Really getting picky these car manufacturers

hcvone
04-18-08, 12:36 PM
My '07 530 said nothing like that, so that's a new one, and frankly I don't like it. However.........

I guess I always assumed that I was taking a risk by tapping into the wiring for my Passport hardwiring, blue tooth, etc. on other vehicles. I put myself in their shoes: If someone came in with a fried electrical system (unlikely, but just for example), demanding a warranty repair, and he had wired an amp wrong, causing voltage spikes or drops across the buss that resulted in a damaged component, then I would say :violin:!

Why should I lose money because some :bonkers: damaged the vehicle?

Just a guess, now that many vehicles are using the buss system, which btw is great, it is also more sensitive to voltage/current change.

.
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I did not take off the warning decal yet, I want people to see it because no one would believe it, it's an 08' just came in three days ago. :)

scroitoru
04-18-08, 02:26 PM
someone help me out here.
how would a cell phone, my own, that I have used for years, would void the warranty?! nuts.

The Tony Show
04-18-08, 03:08 PM
If you spliced into a data bus or multiplexed wiring then they have every right to deny warranty coverage on electrical issues. Most Dealers don't enforce it, but it's a fact.

Simplemind hit the nail on the head: You'd be reluctant to cover it if you designed and sold a complex piece of electronics, and then a customer wanted you to warranty it after splicing into the wiring.

scottlma
04-18-08, 11:55 PM
on the one hand i can see their point.... BUT - if they simply provided a place for people to safely do this (a 12 volt post with a low amperage fuse perhaps), vs. every yahoo (like me) having to take a meter and go hunting for someplace to connect in. I think i hear once that BMW and some of the other foreign automakers do this on some models. In my case, i might have understood more if it had fried something - but this was just a case of moving the wire out of the way a few inches (again, they didnt change where i connected it at all)

simplemind
04-19-08, 12:12 AM
I did not take off the warning decal yet, I want people to see it because no one would believe it, it's an 08' just came in three days ago. :)


:postpics:


If you can, post a photo! :)

hcvone
04-19-08, 06:49 AM
I took a few pixs, it's on the windshield and the glass reflection is all you see, once I take it off and out it on a background it should show up if it comes off fairly easy with a razor blade.

simplemind
04-19-08, 08:33 AM
on the one hand i can see their point.... BUT - if they simply provided a place for people to safely do this (a 12 volt post with a low amperage fuse perhaps), vs. every yahoo (like me) having to take a meter and go hunting for someplace to connect in.


Great idea......a "mini power point" in a couple of locations, like one overhead, and one at the console, would probably be less than $4 total production cost.