: Who has the latest dirt?



StealthV
04-03-08, 11:21 PM
This V2 forum is slower than a Priu$ with a full charge.

Cadillac Tony
04-04-08, 09:28 AM
It's not much, but here's a snippet from one of my communications with an engineer:


Also - I have sent an e-mail regarding the fluid spec. to the engineer tasked with development of the new cast iron rear diff. I failed to ask him while he was here at LGR, but he did say that they have tried to break this new unit and have thus far been spectacularly unsuccessful, so that is good news indeed. He was very bullish about the level of robust engineering that has gone into the part and sounds totally confident.

:)

CIWS
04-04-08, 10:18 AM
This V2 forum is slower than a Priu$ with a full charge.


You can only eat leftovers just so many times. Without new info from Cadillac, it's all crickets.



ODj-Dtx8-WA

Cadillac Tony
04-04-08, 03:09 PM
I can confirm color choices:

Exterior

-Radiant Silver
-Thunder Gray Chromaflair
-Black Raven
-Crystal Red Tintcoat
-Blue Diamond TriCoat
-White Diamond TriCoat

Interior

-Ebony with Ebony Accents (dash pad, upper door panels)
-Light Titanium with Ebony Accents
-Ebony/Light Cashmere Two Tone (Ebony seat edges with Cashmere inserts- Not available when equipped with Optional Recaro seats)

BowenCT
04-04-08, 04:11 PM
Oooooooo, yummy! I'll take mine in either, Radiant Silver or White Diamond w/ Ebony/Ebony. Debadge, tint, 1" drop......sexy!

Silver -V-
04-04-08, 05:38 PM
I walked the Dallas Auto show today. I was able to climb inot the V2 and look around. The car had the Recaro seats, metal pedals and 6 speed stick. The car is absolutely gorgeous. The 6 piston calipers in the front are huge, and the backs look like the 4 calipers from the V1 (I'm adding a photo of the rear brakes, the front 's didnt photograph well). The grill is surprisingly nicer than the V1. It is a thicker metal than the mesh in the V1, and seems to be better at allowing airflow, and easier to clean after a track day.

The alcantera steering wheel and shifter are nice, and not as "low rent" as I expected. The Seats are very supportive, but I didn't have a huge amount of headroom. The battery was unconnected, so I don't know if the seat could be lowered. If it can't be lowered, I am not sure a helmet for track day will fit very well.

The paint was a special color of "ashlava" per the sales rep, and the interior was a light platinum gray. It looks great, but may not make it into production.

Jpjr
04-04-08, 09:05 PM
GM is not managing this well, IMO, when it is so easy. Keep giving the people teasers! Why wouldn't you... keep the interest. The Prius comment was right on the money, this flame keeps burning out.

BowenCT
04-04-08, 09:29 PM
The grill is surprisingly nicer than the V1. It is a thicker metal than the mesh in the V1...

That grille is not metal, it is 100% plastic. I thought it felt pretty low-rent........I was a little disappointed in it, personally.

StealthV
04-04-08, 11:47 PM
Plastic sounds like a corporate cost reduction instead of a customer value add. :wisdom:

thebigjimsho
04-05-08, 12:20 AM
I walked the Dallas Auto show today. I was able to climb inot the V2 and look around. The car had the Recaro seats, metal pedals and 6 speed stick. The car is absolutely gorgeous. The 6 piston calipers in the front are huge, and the backs look like the 4 calipers from the V1 (I'm adding a photo of the rear brakes, the front 's didnt photograph well). The grill is surprisingly nicer than the V1. It is a thicker metal than the mesh in the V1, and seems to be better at allowing airflow, and easier to clean after a track day.

The alcantera steering wheel and shifter are nice, and not as "low rent" as I expected. The Seats are very supportive, but I didn't have a huge amount of headroom. The battery was unconnected, so I don't know if the seat could be lowered. If it can't be lowered, I am not sure a helmet for track day will fit very well.

The paint was a special color of "ashlava" per the sales rep, and the interior was a light platinum gray. It looks great, but may not make it into production.Not the same car as Detroit...

dkozloski
04-05-08, 12:45 AM
This just out. The V2 engine will be two Alloytech V6s joined together to make a V12. Power estimated at 620HP.

CVP33
04-05-08, 09:25 AM
I'll take the Blue with Cashmere interior thank you.

M5eatr
04-05-08, 10:15 AM
I was hoping for the "Tony Montana Yellow" and cashmere tiger motif interior.

V-Love
04-05-08, 08:45 PM
I was hoping for the "Tony Montana Yellow" and cashmere tiger motif interior.

I'd roll that!:alchi:

Plastic grill really sucks! I hope that gets fixed.

thebigjimsho
04-06-08, 12:13 AM
Honestly, why the F does it matter if the grill is plastic? You can't tell by looking at it and it saves weight...

BowenCT
04-06-08, 09:22 AM
'Cuz when the girls caress it......

V-Love
04-06-08, 10:45 AM
Honestly, why the F does it matter if the grill is plastic? You can't tell by looking at it and it saves weight...

Scratches, flaking, easy to put a hole in. I just think of the old discolored ones I'm used to seeing. Even when I wash it, I like the feel of the metal. Plastic grille = plastic clips and I just hate those type fasteners. My lower wind shroud came off because of those damn fasteners. No powdercoat option.
Just my .02. I don't want to piss off BigJim. It will save weight.

jasaero
04-06-08, 11:12 AM
I do not think it's been mentioned that the plastic might also have been required for airflow reason. The grid on this plastic screen looking grill seems much more open and smooth. Pretty sure air will flow way better through thos plastic one than any wire mesh. Just the rod shape of a wire mesh is not good in the first place. Plastic can be shaped to create less obstruction to the airflow.

Heli411
04-06-08, 11:21 AM
I do know one very important small detail... the HEADLINER needs to MATCH the interior color !!!

thebigjimsho
04-06-08, 02:11 PM
I do know one very important small detail... the HEADLINER needs to MATCH the interior color !!!Why?

StealthV
04-06-08, 02:26 PM
A lighter color headliner makes the cockpit feel more open, roomy, airy.

thebigjimsho
04-06-08, 05:34 PM
A lighter color headliner makes the cockpit feel more open, roomy, airy.Sactly.

Cadillac Tony
04-06-08, 06:04 PM
A lighter color headliner makes the cockpit feel more open, roomy, airy.


Sactly.


Yup.

Ebony and Titanium Interiors will have a Titanium headliner. Ebony/Cashmere Two-Tone will most likely have a Cashmere headliner.

thebigjimsho
04-06-08, 06:17 PM
Yup.

Ebony and Titanium Interiors will have a Titanium headliner. Ebony/Cashmere Two-Tone will most likely have a Cashmere headliner.Sounds beeeeautifulllllll.....where's the kitty pic?

StealthV
04-06-08, 09:05 PM
I'm a 100 miles away son, ready to strike. The schooling starts right now.

http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=40953&stc=1&d=1207530008

V-Love
04-06-08, 11:54 PM
I love that commercial. That pic scares me a little.

StealthV
04-07-08, 08:36 AM
What, don't like all the crap just tossed in there with little forethought? No worries, they'll just put a big ugly plastic cover over it. One of many reasons why it won't/can't command M5 money.

I'm lightning in a bottle.

Cadillac Tony
04-07-08, 09:26 AM
A picture of a preproduction mule with the STB installed backwards and the underhood lines not routed cleanly is not indicative of final production. Mules have all that "stuff" sticking up everywhere and not tied down so it's easy to get at and make adjustments to or take readings from.

Price and value are two different things. So it costs less than an M5- so what? When the '09 V shows up stomping M5s in the magazine comparos, we'll see how many people still think the M5 is worth $30k more.

CIWS
04-07-08, 09:59 AM
Price and value are two different things. So it costs less than an M5- so what? When the '09 V shows up stomping M5s in the magazine comparos, we'll see how many people still think the M5 is worth $30k more.

The question comes up of how long BMUU will go before they beef up the M5. Of course they won't do it without also beefing up the price, probably getting near the 100K mark.

thebigjimsho
04-07-08, 10:07 AM
The question comes up of how long BMUU will go before they beef up the M5. Of course they won't do it without also beefing up the price, probably getting near the 100K mark.They're there already...

Cadillac Tony
04-07-08, 10:53 AM
:yeah:

As I've pointed out in other threads, adding perforated leather, USB and iPod hookups, keyless access, lumbar supports, Satellite radio and premium speakers to an M5 takes the MSRP up to $92,570. Yowza.

Configured M5 (http://bmwusa.com/Standard/Content/BYO/ByoHome.aspx?enc=MvPBZ7IDDHZrFw0PUn4DOpvTeXbqwPunk VqMGJPIm8s=)

Assuming a fully loaded 2009 CTS-V stickers out for close to $70k with Recaros and everything (if it ends up being that high, which we still don't know for sure), where's the other $23k in value?

thebigjimsho
04-07-08, 12:08 PM
Aww, dammit! I was wrong. I could only configure an M5 up to $97G. Thank goodness Cadillac came along...

StealthV
04-07-08, 02:56 PM
A V isn't better because it is cheaper.

Contribute something new... :thepan:

Cadillac Tony
04-07-08, 03:22 PM
No one said it is better because it was less expensive, just that it is. I know a lot of people have had shaky service experiences with their local Dealership, but the same horror stories exist for BMW Dealers. Even if we assume that the "overall" Service experience is better with BMW Dealers (which I don't agree with, but let's pretend for minute), it's still a stretch to say that it justifies the extra $20-$30k that they command over a comparably equipped and performing domestic.

This has all been hashed out in the M3/C63 thread, but there's also OnStar, 40gb HDD, PTM, Stabilitrak, etc,etc,etc..... The new CTS is being universally hailed as having one of the best interiors on the road, and the build quality and panel fit are world class- that used to be BMWs trump card over Cadillac, but no longer. It now comes down to performance, amenities and value. Amenities are about equal (each has a few exclusives over the other), the Cadillac will provide better performance AND at a substantially lower price. The evidence is stacking up for a major victory for Cadillac.

TheRooster
04-07-08, 03:57 PM
Aww, dammit! I was wrong. I could only configure an M5 up to $97G. Thank goodness Cadillac came along...

I drove on that listed for $99,500, son. Drove it and beat the TAR out of it here in Raleigh. Got up to 155 on the freeway.


It don't matter, grocery store aisle, them plastic boats...
When it comes to Mike Wallace, the story ends with me putting him in the wall.

TheRooster
04-07-08, 03:58 PM
The question comes up of how long BMUU will go before they beef up the M5. Of course they won't do it without also beefing up the price, probably getting near the 100K mark.

I've seen spy shots of a twin turbo version on the BMUU.

thebigjimsho
04-07-08, 04:25 PM
I drove on that listed for $99,500, son. Drove it and beat the TAR out of it here in Raleigh. Got up to 155 on the freeway.

Kinda like the Jayhawks...

StealthV
04-09-08, 01:07 PM
also OnStar, 40gb HDD, PTM, Stabilitrak, etc,etc,etc.....

My BMW Assist does everything On$tar does but doesn't cost me anything for four years.

Explain the 160 GB HDD in my BMW playing mp3s.

PTM and StabilTrak are GM exclusives by name only.

Blah, blah, blah.

P.S. The twin turbo M5 is coming...Spec for spec, the only real advantage V2 has is price and I don't want to be kidnapped by K-Mart with another crappy diff and five shitty dealers as in V1.

Not saying I wouldn't drink a beer with the man but if Tony comes anywhere near me, I'm putting him in the wall.

P.S. Where's the HUD on V2?

P.S.S. At the end of the day, it comes down to the brand experience. GM and its dealer organization has some work to do to justify (command the same $ in the market) and play with the big dogs.

http://benchracing.typepad.com/bench_racing_with_steve_a/images/2007/05/11/warrenwallace6_75.png

Cadillac Tony
04-09-08, 01:30 PM
My BMW Assist does everything On$tar does but doesn't cost me anything for four years.

Your BMW assist doesn't do half the things OnStar does. Automatic advanced crash notification, email diagnostic updates, link with a Verizon cell phone account, turn by turn navigation while moving, and many others are OnStar exclusives. You can bet that it cost you plenty, too- they just don't have the courtesy of offering the option to discontinue it, but instead just jam the 4 years of service into the price of the car.

I know you've got to defend and justify your purchase now that you own one, but facts are facts.



Not saying I wouldn't drink a beer with the man but if Tony comes anywhere near me, I'm putting him in the wall.


You'd never catch me with my StealthV tune. Wait- did I just advertise for the guy who's constantly going after me on the forums? :suspect: :p

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn208/Cadillac_Tony/stealth.jpg
I've got a ton of respect for you man, but come on....

GNSCOTT
04-09-08, 01:47 PM
The M5 will be slower than the V and I can see a $115k+ TT M5. The M5 is quickly becoming an exotic car in its pricing. What makes an M5 worth close to $100k right now is still beyond me. What makes it worth $25k more over the V, espcially when they are both built to specifically be performance cars and the performance car that costs $25k less is out performing you.

StealthV
04-09-08, 08:02 PM
Seems my point is being missed again. Done beating that dead horse.

How about something new?

hAFEQ7ft0HA

Ravensblack_ESV
04-11-08, 10:33 PM
So where is the ebrake?

Albertan
04-12-08, 02:08 PM
In case any one cares, an M5 in Canada is $122,000. So much for pricing equality with the US. Also BMW makes it very difficult to import to Canada from USA. My neighbour has an X5 and M3 convertible and has been having all sorts of grief. My customs broker did paperwork for my V and it took me 10 minutes to bring it in. I do have to say when I brought the V in they were selling in Canada for $73,000.
Oh, I just noticed BMW Canada is advertising at the top of all the threads. I sure hope they have to pay BIG bucks to do it.

V-Love
04-13-08, 12:59 PM
If I was rich(where you at Koooop), I would have both in my 50 car garage.

V-Love
04-13-08, 01:04 PM
P.S.S. At the end of the day, it comes down to the brand experience. GM and its dealer organization has some work to do to justify (command the same $ in the market) and play with the big dogs.

http://benchracing.typepad.com/bench_racing_with_steve_a/images/2007/05/11/warrenwallace6_75.png

Agreed, but thank God they are workin on it. I hope they always keep price lower than the Bimmers and become hard competitors with each other. Then we all win.

verbs
04-13-08, 02:01 PM
Configured M5 (http://bmwusa.com/Standard/Content/BYO/ByoHome.aspx?enc=MvPBZ7IDDHZrFw0PUn4DOpvTeXbqwPunk VqMGJPIm8s=)

Assuming a fully loaded 2009 CTS-V stickers out for close to $70k with Recaros and everything (if it ends up being that high, which we still don't know for sure), where's the other $23k in value?

How about better resale value and better build quality? The 7 speed SMG tranny is a pretty fun too IMO, and the M5 IMO is a more fun car to drive. Doesn't that count for anything? Besides, you're comparing the price/amenities/features on the soon to be outgoing M5 to a CTS-V that hasn't even come out yet.

Wait until say 2010 or so when a new 550hp V-10 version of the M5 comes out with even more fun toys, and then get back to me.

Cadillac Tony
04-13-08, 05:42 PM
You guys kill me, really.

Build quality is basically a wash. You don't see laser braised panel joining, exposed edge of glass or <2mm interior panel gaps on an M5, but they still have always had a very well built car. The CTS is now equal in build quality.

Resale value is historically lower on American cars, but we're debating cars, not investments. If you feel it's worth spending an extra $30k at purchase time to get an extra $15k (or less) at trade time, be my guest. I'm no investment banker, but that sounds like a pretty bad return on your money.


Besides, you're comparing the price/amenities/features on the soon to be outgoing M5 to a CTS-V that hasn't even come out yet.

Wait until say 2010 or so when a new 550hp V-10 version of the M5 comes out with even more fun toys, and then get back to me.


The "something else better is coming" game can be played forever. I'm comparing the 2009 CTS-V to the 2009 M5- companies will always "one-up" each other every few years, and it's Cadillac's turn to be top dog for few.

urbanski
04-13-08, 05:50 PM
new cars themselves, no matter the make, are a bad idea. let somebody else take the depreciation hit. buy that 2 years old off lease cherry :)

thebigjimsho
04-13-08, 09:15 PM
new cars themselves, no matter the make, are a bad idea. let somebody else take the depreciation hit. buy that 2 years old off lease cherry :)Or pay even less for one that's been, shall we say, "broken in"?

RightTurn
04-13-08, 10:08 PM
No, no. :nono: The new car smell is worth the depreciation. :alchi:

HushH
04-13-08, 11:48 PM
:yeah:

StealthV
04-14-08, 12:36 AM
Figured the Cadillac salesman training material spam would start again. :duck:

ylwjacket
04-14-08, 10:06 AM
Why all the "M5 is better than V", or consequently, "V is better than M5" bashing?

It seems to me that the V will be on par, at least performance-wise, with some of the best performance sedans in the world. As for the interior, it looks great so far.

As for price vs value - who knows? Some people like broccoli, some don't. People will buy wha they like.

I would be a bit surprised if anyone is walking around saying "I can't quite afford an M5, so I'll settle for a V".

I would doubt that, in this segment, too many people are saying "I can't quite afford an M5, so I'll settle for a V". If they wanted an M5 that badly, they'd buy one 2 years old for less than the price of a new V. There's about 10 of them on ebay. There's one year old ones for about 70k.

Buy what you want and be done with it.

StealthV
04-14-08, 12:48 PM
One big plus for V2 is not laser welding, panel gaps, a 40 GB harddrive, engine power or whatever other marketing BS we're all fed.

The simple advantage is cost effective powertrain modifications from a near infinite number of aftermarket sources. And compared to V1, a plethora of aftermarket wheel options by switching to Bayerische Motoren Werke hub specs.

Hmm, perhaps I'll bolt up my M5 wheels onto the new V when it arrives. And I'll polish the guaranteed-GM orange-peel paint with pride. Can fire and brimstone be hurled all the way from a dealership in Florida? BMW wheels on a Cadillac is a sign of the apocalypse. :lildevil:

Kadonny
04-14-08, 01:22 PM
Stealth, I love you and all, but you're starting to sound like CVP33 when he lept to Mopar. The M5 is a great, great car but it sounds like to me you are dissing Caddy a bit too much. Do they have issues? Sure, they all do, but for every negative dealer experience you have had or orange peel paint issue, many have had just the opposite, including me.

Just my .02.

RightTurn
04-14-08, 06:12 PM
^^ :yeah: And personally, I can do without the obvious insults aimed at Tony. That sucks.

StealthV
04-14-08, 08:25 PM
My last thread talked about the advantages of V2, including the better 5-bolt wheels. If that rubs you guys the wrong way, stop taking anything on this forum so damn serious.

And the person you're worried about better grow thicker skin if he keeps talking about how Cadillac is the undisputed best with any debate obviously just biased BMW love.

A V2 will be in my garage before a M5.

Can we all kiss and make up now?

P.S. BMW is still the ultimate driving machine. Get over it.

CTSV_510
04-14-08, 08:57 PM
P.S. BMW is still the ultimate driving machine. Get over it.

:eek: ! :gah: !!! :rant2:



haha j/k

It's ok Stealth, some people are just sensitive. Like my girlfriend. :lol:

BMWs are in fact ultimate driving machines. I'd get one, but I don't think I could handle the ridicule from my friends.

Cadillac Tony
04-14-08, 09:04 PM
My skin's plenty thick- both the bright Florida sunshine and a decade in car business have given me an exterior bordering on rawhide. :)

I've got no problem with debate, but most of the Pro-BMW or MB comments in here border on insulting or condescending toward Cadillac such as your "that's why it will never command M5 money" remark. I take exception to shots like that for three reasons: The obvious first being that my livelihood depends on Cadillac's success, secondly because I'm an owner and enthusiast of the brand, and third because you're way off base on a lot of the remarks. Issues like build quality and Dealer service are no longer undisputed victories for the imports- in fact, Cadillac exceeds them in many of the unbiased research reports that are published yearly (Consumer Guide, JD Power, etc). All this talk about the "Premium Experience" you get owning a BMW- here's a quick Google search on "BMW Terrible Service" (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=bmw+service+terrible&btnG=Search)- oh look! They have crappy Dealers, too!

Bring an intelligent discourse with some FACTS or up to date opinon and we can have a nice chat. Listening to people spouting falsities about how much greater a car is just because of the badge on the hood or how the magically wonderful the Service is gets old fast.

ylwjacket
04-14-08, 09:18 PM
I'll say this - in the absence of any real info yet, it seems to me that this subsection of the board has become a constant attack on the V2 by the fans of just about all other car brands.

I wish Cadillac would release info, and maybe some of this would abate. In the meantime, the V2 has been trashed and thrashed by about every other brand fan on these boards. Someone from Mars reading these threads would go buy just about anything else first, which is fine with me.

Unlike Tony, my livelihood does not depend on Cadillac's success, so I'd just as soon have the only V2 on the West Coast of Florida (sorry Tony - don't sell one to anyone south of Gainesville).

But, reading this forum has become a steady drumbeat of one thing after another. I can see where Tony would get a little defensive.

Which brings me back to my other point - there are plenty of great cars out there, so get what you want. Personally, I can appreciate them all, and don't feel compelled to hate on any of them.

I pine for the good old days of this forum, where most of us were excited about the V. Even after a few grenading rears, we still liked it. Even when the bolts holding my front suspension on broke and my diff exploded, I still liked it.

And, maybe unlike most, I've had great dealer experiences. I came to this car FROM a BMW (about 15 years worth of them actually), exactly because of the miserable dealer experience I had with the BMW. I don't harp on it, I just moved on.

StealthV
04-14-08, 11:15 PM
Since this is my thread; I hereby declare all Cadillac vs. brand X discussions over. Agree to disagree if you must. :)

And now BACK ON TOPIC - Something new.


http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=41179&stc=1&d=1208229265

Back to the Wild vs. Avalanche...

M5eatr
04-14-08, 11:43 PM
I have to be honest. I have owned GM cars in the past. Mad a bit of scratch, then thought I'd try the "imports" MB and BMW. Back to GM and the V. The imports are no better. Issues all the same. Only slightly better build quality than a comprable GM car, but the price is over 1/3rd premium, so you should expect a slight build difference. But the fact still remains....Do you wish to support our own economy and jobs or cry later when you can't afford anything but a tricycle? The imports are no better than American cars period. The liberal media and car rags would have you believe otherwise, as they have a different agenda than presenting the truth. You like the M5, fine. Look at their websites, they have a host of problems also and their dealers are looking to bend you over just as bad as the others, if not worse.
This is a Cadillac site. You guys like BMW's, then go to their sites and suck up to those guys. Don't expect us to be all fuzzy and warm to you. If I wanted, I could afford to have an AMG and M in my garage as well as the V. Instead, I am looking to add a Viper or ZO6, and a vintage muscle car, 69-70 442 or GNX. We are all big boys here. Get thicker skin.

v84life
04-15-08, 12:23 AM
Had a M3 dinner a few late afternoons ago. Had three courses.... Last years model but still a fine tasting treat. Love the current car and can't fu#@ing wait for the 09 V:thumbsup:

StealthV
04-15-08, 01:07 AM
Time to lock this thread since no one is in the spirit.

ylwjacket
04-15-08, 11:38 AM
Just anxious for more info......

urbanski
04-15-08, 12:20 PM
Time to lock this thread since no one is in the spirit.

ok..