: 2/14 NIU Shooting



CadillacGurl
02-15-08, 11:59 AM
Hey I felt like I should get this out. I have a bunch of friends that go there and it kinda scares you. All of them are fine by the way. Just wondering if anybody had anything to share.

One of my friends is freaked out that it might happen at DePaul, so I've been calming her down and reassuring her it's gonna be ok.

My thoughts and prayers are with the families of the NIU Student Body.

http://profile.ak.facebook.com/profile5/868/7/s30822694_564.jpg

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/15/university.shooting/index.html

RunningOnEMT
02-15-08, 12:04 PM
That sucks, i know exactly what its like, went down to blacksburg after the VT shootings to see some friends ...

urbanski
02-15-08, 12:16 PM
a high school buddy went there in the 80s, played football. this recent rash of horrible shootings is so sad

CadillacGurl
02-15-08, 12:34 PM
this recent rash of horrible shootings is so sad

I agree... it sad because I knew people at both of those shootings... when will it end??

dkozloski
02-15-08, 01:27 PM
The originator of the whole thing was a guy by the name of Howard Unurh who randomly shot thirteen people in Camden, New Jersey in 1949. It'll always be with us. You can't depend on anyone else to protect you so the only answer is to carry heat yourself. If the nut doesn't have a gun it'll be a machette or a baseball bat. You can choose to stand like a sheep and get zapped or be prepared to fight for your life. The real tragedy is the idiotic idea that somehow we can disarm everybody and we'll all be safe. As long as you can beat somebody's head in with a chair leg that idea'll never fly. At the last place I worked before I retired, the female employees formed a club, brought in a firearms instructor to give them training, and bought personal firearms for their own protection. Before that there were constant complaints about women being accosted in the parking lot by panhandlers and drunks. As soon as the first incident occurred where one of the ladies produced a gun and shoved it in the face of the attacker all the nonsense stopped. Alaska has a carry law that requires no permit. If you are legally able to buy a firearm you can carry it concealed. Random shootings are now almost unheard of. The anti-gun nuts have no conception of reality.

gary88
02-15-08, 02:47 PM
Pretty shocking and very unfortunate. I have some friends there and luckily they're all fine.

The really sad thing is I'm starting to become desensitized in a way to all these reports of shootings just because of how many have happened recently. Unfortunatley these kinds of things are becoming all too common.

CadillacGurl
02-15-08, 03:27 PM
Hell, I'd feel better if I had a gun. I used to have a pocket knife but I don't carry it with me anymore b/c of air travel. The only protection I have now are keys...

RunningOnEMT
02-15-08, 03:30 PM
people who carry weapons are 10 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime

carrying a gun or a knife or whatever gives you a false sense of security....

do you think you could actually shoot someone in the heat of the moment, or stab someone... i mean really truly think you could do it?

i carry a gun, but i've also been shooting for years and have had classes in firearms defense, but i still don't carry in a situation where i feel nervous about having it

dkozloski
02-15-08, 03:54 PM
people who carry weapons are 10 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime

carrying a gun or a knife or whatever gives you a false sense of security....

do you think you could actually shoot someone in the heat of the moment, or stab someone... i mean really truly think you could do it?

i carry a gun, but i've also been shooting for years and have had classes in firearms defense, but i still don't carry in a situation where i feel nervous about having it
The local experience is exactly the opposite. Muggings and strong arm robberies are nearly extinct. Just the thought that your intended victim may be packing heat has discouraged all but the most stupid of criminals. The highest percentage of assaults now involve people that know each other and have been fighting among themselves since Cain and Abel. Muggers and thieves look for the vulnerable among us. When the weakest among us can have deadly force at their fingertips it evens the scales. Even idiot criiminals have that figured out.

NOT ON MY WATCH
02-15-08, 04:01 PM
i carry a gun, but i've also been shooting for years and have had classes in firearms defense, but i still don't carry in a situation where i feel nervous about having it

Not sure what you mean about feeling nervous while carrying. If your state has an open carry policy or you have a legal permit to carry, and there are situations where you feel nervous carrying, why would you carry it? Not trying to make a put-down here, I'm trying to understand what you're saying - please elaborate.

Some people will never be comfortable carrying lethal weapons, regardless of experience and quality of training. Bottom line is people who aren't comfortable carrying lethal weapons shouldn't carry them. Just like people who aren't comfortable having to shoot at someone shouldn't join the military.

SvB4EvA
02-15-08, 04:34 PM
Not sure what you mean about feeling nervous while carrying. If your state has an open carry policy or you have a legal permit to carry, and there are situations where you feel nervous carrying, why would you carry it? Not trying to make a put-down here, I'm trying to understand what you're saying - please elaborate.

Some people will never be comfortable carrying lethal weapons, regardless of experience and quality of training. Bottom line is people who aren't comfortable carrying lethal weapons shouldn't carry them. Just like people who aren't comfortable having to shoot at someone shouldn't join the military.

Maybe he means not being comfortable/nervous carrying as in... when he goes out drinking.

I leave my pistol at home when I go out to drink and party.

One might argue, that may be a time when you would want it most, and might end up in a situation where you would wish you had it with you. But if you have ever gotten drunk, you know why someone might want to leave the gun locked up at home.

HushH
02-15-08, 05:09 PM
people who carry weapons are 10 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime

Got a source for that stat? I don't doubt that you've seen that figure somewhere Corey, and it doesn't really matter because anti and pro-gun groups have both skewed stats, polls, etc. to further their own cause.


carrying a gun or a knife or whatever gives you a false sense of security....

If an individual has had proper training and fully understands what carrying is all about, then I wouldn't consider it a false sense of security. If anything, those who carry are generally more alert and aware of their surroundings.


do you think you could actually shoot someone in the heat of the moment, or stab someone... i mean really truly think you could do it?

If it was necessary to protect my life, or more importantly, the lives of my family, you better believe I could and would shoot someone.

HushH
02-15-08, 05:10 PM
SvB, alcohol and guns don't go well together. Good choice on leaving them at home if you plan on drinking.

dkozloski
02-15-08, 05:17 PM
Around here, carrying concealed or not, with a blood alcohol content over the legal limit for driving will get you arrested for weapons misconduct.

dirt_cheap_fleetwood
02-15-08, 05:26 PM
Hell, I'd feel better if I had a gun. I used to have a pocket knife but I don't carry it with me anymore b/c of air travel. The only protection I have now are keys...

Here's a trick I learned from my aunt who used to work late shift at a department store and wanted a little reassurance on her way out to the car after work. Take four key rings and hook them together. Then take a few keys and spread them out easily across all four rings. You can then out them on your fingers with the keys facing out and they are like brass knuckles on steroids. She still has her keys like that, even though she rarely goes out at night anymore.

Ranger
02-15-08, 06:23 PM
Unfortunately, Illinois does not have a concealed carry law and likely never will. They prefer that we die praying rather than fighting.

I suspect the source for "people who carry weapons are 10 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime" is one of Sarah Brady's cronies. It is about the most ridiculous statement I have ever heard. If only one person in that hall (or the Lane Bryant store recently) had a weapon, several lives could have been saved. It is a shame that they will never learn.

Submariner409
02-15-08, 07:43 PM
Maryland is the same way ^^. They would rather pass laws and hope that someone obeys them. I mean, if it's the law, you won't do it right? Sarah Brady is a pathetic, sick example of twisted logic. Too bad about Jim Brady, but she has carried that incident to great extremes. She's also not the only female prominent political figure who is a rabid anti-gun nut..........

My take on the freaks who decide to attempt to kill as many as possible, then kill themselves is: 1. They want instant fame. 2. They want to impress someone. , and 3. It's like the movies and TeeVee: they'll wake up tomorrow morning and everything will be OK.

My Dad had a sign on the front porch wall next to the mail slot. There was a picture of the muzzle end of a S&W .357 and under it were the words "Forget the dog; Beware of Owner". Never had a problem in 64 years in the same home. My sisters and I were brought up to respect firearms, and were taught to shoot rifle, pistol, and shotgun. My Mom had her own Winchester .22 Short gallery pump gun. I, personally, would have no qualms about defending myself, family or home against attack or intrusion. (I now have the sign......)

DDS rollin a CTS
02-15-08, 08:23 PM
Like many on these forums, I too have made the decision to exercise my 2nd ammendment right ever since having a close call at a car wash last year (Less than an hour after I was at said car wash, two men walked up to some guy washing his truck and demanded money. When the guy replied that he didnt have any, one of the men pulled out a gun and shot him in the face.). My only problem is that most of my time is spent at, or on the way to or from school. I have had mixed responses on the legality of carrying on a college campus, but legal or not, its stated in the schools rules that getting caught with a weapon would be grounds for automatic dismissal. I've spent too long getting to this point to jeopardize things now. Therefore I drive directly to and from school every day and always go home and put on my gun before going out and running any errands no matter how minor they may be.

DILLIGAF
02-15-08, 08:42 PM
43,have had handguns since I was 16.Never had an accident,accidental discharge ,ext.Have pointed a gun at another human 1 time,and 1 time only at a rest stop.

Crown Vic Owner
02-15-08, 08:43 PM
my brother saw all this go down. Not fun.

Ranger
02-15-08, 09:01 PM
Was he in the hall at the time of the shooting?

Crown Vic Owner
02-15-08, 10:23 PM
Yes, but i shouldnt even be saying that at this point.


He is technically my half brother, so noone will know who he is, but yeah, he was scared crapless.

DILLIGAF
02-15-08, 10:37 PM
Everytime crap like this happens,you always have to wonder how the crowd reacts.The news never really tells you if most of the bullets struck people in the back or anything like that.Most peoples instinct would be run but you would think others would charge the shooter,jump on the grenade so to speak.

Ranger
02-15-08, 10:52 PM
NO ONE will charge a man with a gun when he is shooting from a stage (presumably 30' - 40' away). That is suicidal, like jumping on the grenade.

Crown Vic Owner
02-15-08, 11:36 PM
NO ONE will charge a man with a gun when he is shooting from a stage (presumably 30' - 40' away). That is suicidal, like jumping on the grenade.

True, than again, there ARE 1 or 2 students that are allowed to pack IIRC

Ranger
02-15-08, 11:42 PM
Not in Ill.

Crown Vic Owner
02-15-08, 11:46 PM
Not in Ill.

my bro mentioned something about the equivalent of air marshals that go around the campus. Not sure about this.

Rolex
02-16-08, 12:42 AM
people who carry weapons are 10 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime


Where did you get this statistic and who are "these people." The people I know that have had real training (as you say you have) are trained to use situational awareness in all circumstances. These people don't ever live life in condition white. At their most relaxed these people exist in condition yellow, are difficult to surprise, and difficult to harm.




carrying a gun or a knife or whatever gives you a false sense of security....



Both give me a heightened sense of security. I go out of my way to avoid those situations that make my hair stand on end. Avoiding them keeps me, my family, and even the dirtbags safe.



do you think you could actually shoot someone in the heat of the moment, or stab someone... i mean really truly think you could do it?

i carry a gun

If you carry a weapon without the ability to use it you are truly asking for trouble.



i carry a gun, but i've also been shooting for years and have had classes in firearms defense, but i still don't carry in a situation where i feel nervous about having it

You'll have to explain this to me. When does carrying a weapon make you nervous? Does this mean you won't carry into a place where you think you may need the weapon? If so then what's the point of carrying it at all? I suspect very few of the people licensed to carry a weapon actually carry it. Their weapons spend more time in the glove box, or center console of their vehicle, or on the night stand then they do on their person. That weapon is like a seatbelt. Wear it without exception because you never know when you need it. The one time you don't will cost you your life.

I don't mean to offend, but IMO if you're still "nervous" about carrying a weapon after training and years of experience, maybe you should leave carrying weapons to whose who are comfortable. Just my thoughts.

JMHO





I feel a little awkward pushing my agenda here. I'm saddened by these regular "gun free zone" shootings. It makes my position as a responsible gun owner and sportsman almost uncomfortable to defend to my friends. I don't believe the solution to prevent these shootings in "gun free" zones is to keep them gun free.

I'm astonished Newsweek published this kind of sensible article. Here are a couple of snips from it:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/112174



W. Scott Lewis is a board member and spokesman for Students for Concealed Carry on Campus. Lewis argues that states with the most relaxed concealed-carry laws also happen to be among the safest. He points to Colorado State University, which has allowed concealed weapons on campus for 10 semesters without incident; the same is true for nine state universities in Utah's system, where concealed weapons have been allowed in university classroom buildings since 2006, Lewis said. NEWSWEEK's Suzanne Smalley spoke to Lewis about the bill, the tragedy at Northern Illinois University—and his fears that it could happen again.


There's a lot of statistics out there that show that concealed handgun license holders are five times less likely than nonlicensed holders to commit violent crimes. You can look at the 40 right-to-carry states with liberal concealed-carry laws, where they have not seen any escalation in gun violence, gun accidents, etc. as a result of allowing concealed carry. There are currently 11 U.S. universities that have for a combined total of 60 semesters allowed concealed carry on campus without an incident. You haven't seen an incident of gun violence, an incident of gun theft, no gun accidents … Although you can't say in any particular situation whether or not concealed carry might have prevented or mitigated a school shooting or a sexual assault or anything of that nature, you can say that allowing concealed carry would even the odds. And that's what this is really about: evening the odds and taking the advantage away from these dangerous criminals.

CadillacGurl
02-16-08, 09:13 PM
Here's a trick I learned from my aunt who used to work late shift at a department store and wanted a little reassurance on her way out to the car after work. Take four key rings and hook them together. Then take a few keys and spread them out easily across all four rings. You can then out them on your fingers with the keys facing out and they are like brass knuckles on steroids. She still has her keys like that, even though she rarely goes out at night anymore.

That's what I do.... kinda what I meant

Red_October_7000
02-16-08, 09:34 PM
That's what I do.... kinda what I meant

Unfortunately it's been proven that car keys aren't good weapons. Don't even try to use anything but good quality brass knuckles or big rings as a knuckleduster, poor quality knuckles or improvised knuckles will break your fingers. Unfortunately for some reason in MA you can't carry them, or a number of other good self-defense weapons. (you can't own any electrical discharge weapon at all!) At least the eased up a bit on Concealed Carry, they didn't used to issue permits for "all lawful purposes" but people said that it violated their second ammendment rights, so now it is up to the chief of police in your town. According to my buddy who is lisenced (but doesn't carry his pistol that often, silly bugger) they should give it to you so long as they have no compelling reason not to.

Brett
02-16-08, 09:37 PM
My brother is an alum...class of '90 or something like that. I wish these people would just kill themselves first instead of after.

CadillacGurl
02-16-08, 10:45 PM
My brother is an alum...class of '90 or something like that. I wish these people would just kill themselves first instead of after.

AMEN! Go ahead and take your life, don't bring other people down with you.