: What is the different between suspension in regular cat and the cat sport?



cateraowner
02-14-08, 04:12 PM
I know the sport is a stiffer and handles a lot better. but I just wonder hardware wise whats the difference.

I'm gonna be dealing with the suspension and the steering linkage soon and would like to know if I wanted to get something close to what a sport suspension is like what would I have to do.

I'm still contemplating about keeping the air ride suspesion or going with the GTO shocks that would get rid of it. (I'm kinda leaning towards staying with the air ride)

I have a 98 cat btw with 211,000 km on it.

PEETYZ
02-14-08, 05:35 PM
I would go GTO i did better handling and less money new rear shock pair from rockauto is like 52 plus shipping (an airride pair is like 80 plus shipping) i got a used set from local 05 GTO with like 10,000 miles on them for $40 You can get them from members at ls1gto.com the rear are the same from 04-06 The front struts are in the works for me but you need the gto front springs too i hear im waitin for R-Caddy to tell whats all needed. you can have a similar set up with monroe sensatracs up front for catera with stock catera springs if u dont want to get GTO struts and springs You will need to take out Leveling light behind the dash and its very easy to do if you go GTO rear shocks

cateraowner
02-14-08, 05:47 PM
I would go GTO i did better handling and less money new rear shock pair from rockauto is like 52 plus shipping (an airride pair is like 80 plus shipping) i got a used set from local 05 GTO with like 10,000 miles on them for $40 You can get them from members at ls1gto.com the rear are the same from 04-06 The front struts are in the works for me but you need the gto front springs too i hear im waitin for R-Caddy to tell whats all needed. you can have a similar set up with monroe sensatracs up front for catera with stock catera springs if u dont want to get GTO struts and springs You will need to take out Leveling light behind the dash and its very easy to do if you go GTO rear shocks


That sounds like a good option. cheaper for better handling sound good to me.

did you end up removing the compressor? I assume if you get rid of the air ride you can romove the compressor right? unless it's used for anything else.

I'm getting ready to make a big purchase from rock auto (hood supports, bushing, outter tie rods and shocks)
and I'll wait for confirmation on the fronts before I start anything up there.

PEETYZ
02-14-08, 06:29 PM
The Dash comes out easier than it looks http://www.angelfire.com/tx2/mannyyy/ipwriteup.html Follow that link for step by step instructions with pics I have done it a few times and taken out the brake pad wear sensor light, and leveling light(new brakes and new no air ride suspension in rear) I have not taken out compressor yet but eyed it and seems easy its right behind front passenger wheel you could sell yours on ebay if its in good shape This post will update when R-Caddy is finished
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-catera-cimarron-forum/121726-suspension-conversion-kit-catera.html

The monroe senstracs for catera will be really good and you still use stock springs prolly as good at GTO monroe sensatracs with gto springs (what i want) oh by the way you can leave your stock rear springs in catera I did with no problem like i said in above post PM Me or R-Caddy with questions during installation click link it says process we did

elvin315
02-14-08, 06:30 PM
I know the sport is a stiffer and handles a lot better. but I just wonder hardware wise whats the difference.

I'm gonna be dealing with the suspension and the steering linkage soon and would like to know if I wanted to get something close to what a sport suspension is like what would I have to do.

I'm still contemplating about keeping the air ride suspesion or going with the GTO shocks that would get rid of it. (I'm kinda leaning towards staying with the air ride)

I have a 98 cat btw with 211,000 km on it.The only base Catera I had the opportunity to compare my Sport against is CateraKid's. Unfortunately, he had already changed over to Eibach lowering springs. He also had 17 inch Sport wheels. I decided to measure the ride heights anyway. His Cat was about a half inch lower all around than mine. Since we had the same wheels and I was still on the original Sport springs I had to do some guessing. Now Eibachs lower the car 30mm (1.2 inches) and his car was only .5 inch lower than mine so I guess that the Sport is .5 lower than stock. Since I don't know the difference, if any, between the stock wheel/tire diameter and the Sport combo I can't be sure if my assumption is correct.

I have the factory manuals and they don't mention the Sport as a separate model at all. From the specs I've found from GM Media there is no difference between the two other than wheel size. Not even the sway bars and ride height are listed as different. I know that can't be right. I test drove a couple of base Cateras before finding my 2001 Sport. Regardless of what GM Media says (PR types never get the facts right), they sure as hell don't ride the same. I know the struts & shocks must be different, as well as the springs. I would assume the sway bars on a Sport are thicker but without documentation, who knows?

http://media.gm.com/division/cadillac/products/00cadillac/catera/00specs.htm
http://media.gm.com:8221/division/cadillac/products/01cadillac/catera/sport_specs.html

The rear air shocks level the rear ride height when you carry passengers or anvils in the trunk. Otherwise they contribute little to comfort or handling. My suggestion is to pull the air shocks, along with the compressor, and install the GTO or any good sport shocks. I was planning to replace my stock components with KYB or Koni but if anyone ever confirms that the GTO's struts will fit the Catera (and there's a good report) I might try them.

PEETYZ
02-15-08, 12:36 AM
well Elvin were waitin on R-Caddy lol The rear shocks are Great! I think GTO struts will work with GTO springs The strut mount is the same part number for each car
The GTO comes standard with Monroe Sensatracs Now Monroe does make Sensatracs for the Catera and im wondering the difference between Catera springs with Catera Sensatracs and GTO springs with GTO Sensatracs hmm... any advantage of getting GTO Springs and GTO Senstracs?

elvin315
02-15-08, 01:14 AM
well Elvin were waitin on R-Caddy lol The rear shocks are Great! I think GTO struts will work with GTO springs The strut mount is the same part number for each car
The GTO comes standard with Monroe Sensatracs Now Monroe does make Sensatracs for the Catera and im wondering the difference between Catera springs with Catera Sensatracs and GTO springs with GTO Sensatracs hmm... any advantage of getting GTO Springs and GTO Senstracs?

If you compare specs, the Catera is marginally heavier than the GTO (3770 lb vs. 3725 lb) so either spring should be fine. It's the spring length I'm worried about. Until someone measures them we can't know if the GTO springs will lift, lower, or maintain the height. Myself, I'm not concerned about the springs because I intend to use Eibach springs to lower the car anyway. But about the struts, are Sensatracs as good as KYBs or Konis? I want the same firm ride and superb handling as before. Maybe even firmer.

Elvin

cateraowner
02-15-08, 12:02 PM
just wanna make sure before i order it.

is this the shock from the GTO that will fit in the cat?

--------------------------------

2005 PONTIAC GTO 6.0L 364cid V8 FI (U) : Suspension : Shock Absorber Related Parts

Item Price Core Total
MONROE Part # 5786 {SENSA-TRAC PASSENGER CAR SHOCK ABSORBER}
Rear

$26.79 $0.00 $26.79
--------------------------

and would there be a lot of difference between these monroe shock and soemthing like koni or kyb?

and how much do koni or kyb shocks run?

PEETYZ
02-15-08, 02:32 PM
Koni and Kyb much more its amazing how much stiffer the gto shocks are compaired to the stock catera air shocks remeber you need 2 of those so your total should be 53 something plus shipping around 60 id bet after shipping from www.rockauto.com

you could look for used set from a GTO 04-06 like i said i got the pair gently used for $40 but yes thats the correct part to order just put 2 in the shopping cart i don't think you want one catera shock and one GTO shock lol

Here you go for KyB struts vs monroe struts price is for one strut

MONROE Part # 71503 {SENSA-TRAC STRUT}
Front $64.79

KYB Part # 334903 {Suspension Strut Assembly}
exc. SPORT; GR-2 FRONT $122.79


Here is your rear shocks option
Go Gto for like $64

MONROE Part # MA825 {Max Air Shock Absorbers / Packed in pairs / Includes air line, air fittings, and air fill kit where applicable.}
REAR; For Towing and Hauling; This part is pair packed/priced. $80.79

ACDELCO Part # 560227 {#72119084}
ABSORBER,RR SHK w/o SPORT APPEARANCE PKG(TV5)$203.79

cateraowner
02-15-08, 04:12 PM
sweet ordered...

shipping is a bit more since I'm in canada and duty is a biatch..

but I ended up getting 2 rear gto shocks.. hood support... (mine died on me) and front and rear control arm bushings...

can't wait to get them.

all came to $217 including GST duty and shipping.. best part is it's in amerian cash.. heheh

MyOpel
02-15-08, 11:00 PM
I have the factory manuals and they don't mention the Sport as a separate model at all. From the specs I've found from GM Media there is no difference between the two other than wheel size. Not even the sway bars and ride height are listed as different. I know that can't be right. I test drove a couple of base Cateras before finding my 2001 Sport. Regardless of what GM Media says (PR types never get the facts right), they sure as hell don't ride the same. I know the struts & shocks must be different, as well as the springs. I would assume the sway bars on a Sport are thicker but without documentation, who knows?

http://media.gm.com/division/cadillac/products/00cadillac/catera/00specs.htm
http://media.gm.com:8221/division/cadillac/products/01cadillac/catera/sport_specs.html


The Sport is not a separate model, it's just an options package. It is true that the swaybars are the same, but the springs and coils are different. in the specs you linked to, it only indicates the style of shocks/coils not the specs of them. If you compare you will find that the sport had re-valved shocks and stiffer springs (thicker and fewer coils)
http://media.gm.com/division/cadillac/products/01cadillac/catera/overview.html (http://media.gm.com/division/cadillac/products/01cadillac/catera/overview.html)


Catera Sport Makes Modifications
The Sport package for '01 remains the same, offering 17-inch aluminum wheels, high-intensity discharge (HID) headlights, matte-silver chrome grille and brushed-silver aluminum interior trim, ZJ1 suspension, heated seats, rear deck spoiler, theft deterrent system and universal garage door opener

Here is a scan of my 01 Canadian brochure
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e294/75Stingray/My%20Catera/1.jpg

elvin315
02-16-08, 01:25 AM
The Sport is not a separate model, it's just an options package. It is true that the swaybars are the same, but the springs and coils are different. in the specs you linked to, it only indicates the style of shocks/coils not the specs of them. If you compare you will find that the sport had re-valved shocks and stiffer springs (thicker and fewer coils)

http://media.gm.com/division/cadillac/products/01cadillac/catera/overview.html



You're right. Option Package is a better description. The problem is identifying which parts are which. According to your link above the Sport package was first available with the '99. I read somewhere that suspension ('99/ZJ1) became the Base suspension for '00-'01. The '00-'01 Sport suspension was made even firmer (RPO unknown). So when shopping for GM replacement Sport parts remember that. If you have a '99 Sport you can use the Base '00-'99 parts, but a '00-'01 Sport can only use '00-'01 Sport parts. I checked a few part suppliers.

RockAuto sells Monroe Sensatracs and KYB GR2s for the Catera but don't say whether they're for the Sport or not. They also sell ACDelco struts and specify they are for the Catera w/o Sport pack.

GM Parts Cheap sell ACDelco struts. This is what I found.
Strut, catera, right, w/o sport pkg. 00-01
Strut, catera, right, w/sport pkg. 99-01
Strut, catera, left, w/o sport pkg. 00-01
Strut, catera, left, w/sport pkg. 99-01

Note that they sell left/right '99-'01 Sport struts but we know they're different for '99 and '00-'01. So what are they actually selling? I've done many searches to find out what specific parts make up the ZJ1 RPO but no luck.

Damned GM. They never make it easy. We know the Sport suspension is different so why make it so hard to order the right replacements? You definitely can't trust a dealer to order the right parts. They hate this car and don't care enough to guarantee you'll get the right parts. They will tell you what you want to hear and take your money with a smile.

Elvin

elvin315
05-03-08, 04:23 AM
I found the following while searching for suspension upgrades. Besides the appearance features, like the exterior paint, satin silver grille, HID headlights, 17 inch wheels, rear wing, silver interior trim, yadda yadda yadda, what makes the Catera a sport version is the suspension. Of that, the only differences between the two are the front struts and rear shocks. For Sport owners needing replacement parts, or standard Catera owners wanting a sport suspension, these are the specific GM replacement parts for both the standard Catera and the (TV5) Sport Package. There are aftermarket components that are less expensive and more sport than AC DELCO available but speaking as a Sport owner, these ain't bad. Rock Auto Parts (http://www.rockauto.com/) supplied the part numbers and descriptions. They've changed the parts listings since last time I checked.

STRUTS, FRONT:

ACDELCO Part # 506591 {#09192249}
STRUT,FRT SUSP LEFT HAND; w/4-SPD A/TRANS(ML4)
ACDELCO Part # 506592 {#09192250}
STRUT,FRT SUSP RIGHT HAND; w/4-SPD A/TRANS(ML4)
ACDELCO Part # 506593 {#09192291}
STRUT,FRT SUSP LEFT HAND; w/4-SPD A/TRANS(ML4) & SPORT APPEARANCE PKG(TV5)
ACDELCO Part # 506594 {#09192292}
STRUT,FRT SUSP RIGHT HAND; w/4-SPD A/TRANS(ML4) & SPORT APPEARANCE PKG(TV5)

SHOCK ABSORBERS, REAR:

ACDELCO Part # 560227 {#72119084}
ABSORBER,RR SHK
ACDELCO Part # 560228 {#72119087}
ABSORBER,RR SHK w/SPORT APPEARANCE PKG(TV5)

All the bushings, springs, swaybars, and brakes (front and rear) between the two are the same.

Case closed. Mystery solved.

Elvin

guardian
05-04-08, 03:05 PM
Just for the record:

The MV6 carried the full autobahn suspension. Back in '96 the Caddy engineers softened that considerably for the original Cats and so it remained until:

In 1999 the Cat Sport was the first with a stiffer suspension. This level of stiffness was maintained in 2000 and in 2001 in the _standard_ Cats. However:

The 2000 and 2001 Cat _Sports_ were stiffer still, returning full circle to the full Autobahn suspension, in terms of stiffness.

elvin315
05-04-08, 06:31 PM
Just for the record:

The MV6 carried the full autobahn suspension. Back in '96 the Caddy engineers softened that considerably for the original Cats and so it remained until:

In 1999 the Cat Sport was the first with a stiffer suspension. This level of stiffness was maintained in 2000 and in 2001 in the _standard_ Cats. However:

The 2000 and 2001 Cat _Sports_ were stiffer still, returning full circle to the full Autobahn suspension, in terms of stiffness.

True. GM has the habit of second guessing its engineers and designers. In 1984 Pontiac debuted the Fiero. They planned it as a bargain sports car. GM ordered it be redesigned as an economy commuter. To that end Pontiac installed a Chevette derived front suspension instead of one of their own design (thought to have been copied from Lotus). Also mandated was the old Iron Duke 4 cylinder engine (Pontiac added a V6 in '85).

For the 1988 model year, bolstered by a good sales history, GM approved upgrades including the originally intended front suspension, and new Ferrariesque bodywork. The Fiero finally handled like its designers intended. Like a sports car. With its new styling it looked like an exotic. That's when GM pulled the plug on the Fiero. Pontiac had to wait 18 years before getting another two seater, the Solstice (based on the Opel GT Speedster).

CateraMV6 reported seeing a 2002 Catera (http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-catera-cimarron-forum/127542-considering-catera-purchase-soliciting-advice.html) back in January. A Sport with a manual 5-speed tranny and the 3.2L engine. So GM finally let the Catera be what Opel designed back in 1996 then kills it after only 238 made it here.

Elvin

guardian
05-04-08, 10:13 PM
CateraMV6 reported seeing a 2002 Catera (http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadillac-catera-cimarron-forum/127542-considering-catera-purchase-soliciting-advice.html) back in January. A Sport with a manual 5-speed tranny and the 3.2L engine. So GM finally let the Catera be what Opel designed back in 1996 then kills it after only 238 made it here.

Elvin



I had missed that post and really appreciate your having mentioned this. I am astonished. I have studied heavily on the Cat over the years yet completely missed the 2002 cars.

Also I must now amend my earlier statements within this forum re the 1999 Cat Sports. Clearly, the 1999 Sports are NOT the rarest Cat of all, as I had said. I was wrong.

If I ever saw a 2002 stick shift Cat for sale, it would not be for sale long. Talk about an instantaneous collectors item!! My goodness, on top of its rarity within the Cat family, such a car is a factory stick shift Cadillac. How many of those are out there . . . any model.

We always have known about the ability to convert a USA Cat to stick shift using European parts . . . . . albeit that such parts are extremely tough to obtain. But the stick shift MV6s have always existed in small numbers. I never knew, though, that Caddy imported any in Cat form. It is just amazing.:caddy::)