My friend and I have a bit of a 'situation'. Hopefully your vigilance can help.

He bought a nice 1979 triple yellow Cadillac Coupe de Ville via the classifieds here in the Cadillac Forums and the owner seems to have potentially absconded with the money, title, keys, car, everything.

The seller was a Mr James (Jamie) Cox from Williamsburg MI 49690. His email is/ was toolshark1@aol (We should have known!)

We haven't been able to get hold of the seller to collect the car since mid/ late January after sending the final instalments of the money over before Christmas.

Getting worried we involved the local Police who tell us that becuase of the level and type of snow piled up in the driveway no one has been in or out of the property where the car is supposed to be. Further enquiries led to the phone line being discontinued, a mortgage foreclosure on the property and a neighbour reporting Mr Cox last seen leaving town with a U Haul trailer and a car transporter.

Not that we are saying that he has skipped with the money and the car - but it doesn't look too good. The car may actually still be in the garage, you never know!

His last communication was that the car can be accessed via a neighbour for collection but we, or the local Police, can't find that neighbour.

If you have seen a yellow 1979 Coupe de Ville being moved about in Michigan or down to Florida, probably on a trailer, or heard of one for sale, went to see one advertised for sale between late November treat it with suspiscion.

Please get in touch with me as soon as possible. I can give you the name of the Police officer in Traverse City, Michigan who is dealing with the case.

Mr Cox apparently has connections down in Florida so it is possible the car may have gone down there, but it is a long way to go. If any of you are from Florida please look out for it. The car will possibly have evidence of Michigan tags or emissions stickers.

One distinguishing feature is that the car has an 8 track unit in it, with some tapes in the trunk. Aditionally the power antenna doesn't work very well [don't they all!] and a new plastic centre was offered with the car. Also the bumper filler is cracked round the gas filler. There was a new GM one offered with the car.

Details are:
VIN: 6D47S99244606
Title #: 341V3340352 T issued on 12/03/2007 State of Michigan title

Name on title: Shannon Marie Cox & James Edward Cox

Address: 4076 Williamston Ct, Williamsburg MI 49690
Jamie Cox's phone number is/ was 1-231 392 1546.

A work number I found for Shannon Cox is 1-231 938 3227 for a company listed as BC Drywall & Texture. At the same address. This has a phone company announcement on it saying it is under maintenance.

A fax number is 1-231-421-1127, which rings but does't answer. Or at least did when I tried it at 9.20am and 10.25am Eastern on the 29th Jan 2008.

The title has been checked to be bona fide, although stragely issued part way through the purchase process and a set of photos.

If anybody is able to find the car and it does fit the description we would like access to it as soon as possible to get it trucked to its now rightful owner.

Many thanks, Nick

Nick -
Would you care to divulge the amount of money involved at this point?

hello nick i know where the listing on that cadillac you have the situation with.. i spoke to that guy jaime on the phone..... get in touch with me.... 917 295 0620

i seen that car advertised somewhere..

What a scummer... i hope you get this resolved.

Hi Guys,

Thansk for the messages and goodwill. Old Fleetwood, the cost isn't huge - he was asking in the order of $3800 for the car which is top money for it's price.
Caddycpedeville - thanks - I'll call you as soon as the time zone permits. I see you are in the New York Area. Who should I ask for when I phone please?

lets keep the profile on this and find the car.

thanks all, Nick

Man, oh man. I feel for you.

I was iinvolved in a dealer scam on a 79 Coupe de Ville back in 1998. Like yours, Beautiful car. White outside, blue leather inside, blue quarter top. Only 78K miles on the clock and it still smelled new. Basically, it was cherry and only $1,700. Back then, nice ones like this went for about $3,999.

Long story short, I bought the car from a dealer working from his home who I originally thought was a private party as advertised in the local swapper. It was at the point of sale when he wrote it up using dealer letter head and such. It should raised a flag with me but it didn't at the time, youth and inexperience and all - heh. He claimed to be the owner of the dealership and I believed him. It later turned out he wasn't the owner or even an employee but was rather someone working off the dealers license instead. The Cadillac wasn't even his but was the part of the dealerships inventory that was "borrowing" to use as his daily.

I was scammed.

As best as I can tell, he was fishing. Selling cars and frustrating the buyers into returning them at a discount. By never processing the paperwork and through excuse of confusion, serial mistakes, heart attack, etc. he hoped to frustrate me (and others, I learned) into short selling back. In my case, he offered to buy the Cadillac back for $800 or trade it for a shoddy beaten up 83 Seville.

Temp tag after temp tag, 100 + days and two tickets with court dates later, I had enough.

I talked with the DMV who put pressure on the dealership for me to get the title and some money back for my trouble. As luck would have it, and the DMV explained, I had some leverage because the existing backlog of complaints against the dealership was short by one complaint to prompt an investigation and temporary loss of their dealers license.

In the end it, I got the car, got the title and even some cash to help me out with my tickets and stuff. It all worked out but I went through some serious loops and hard times because of it.

I sure hope this works out for you. Good luck.

Tenmark,
Hi sorry to hear of your story. I'm glad it worked out well for you in the end. Still, better not to have to go through it! Thanks for your good wishes.
Wish us luck!
nick

Nick -
Rest assured you have a bunch of people on this side of the pond pulling for you.
Anything we can do for you, give a loud holler.
If the scammer can be nailed, GREAT
Good luck, friend.

Well that sucks. Hopefully it will work out in your favor. You seem to have a lot of info on the car, so that should help matters somewhat. Maybe we need to start a Cadillac Detective agency here!

I have an attorney friend in Traverse City who represents banks in foreclosures. I will see if he might have access to info beyond what you posted. That stinks for your buddy. If it was closer to me, I would send one of my associates out to talk to some neigbors etc. However, TC is about 3.5 hours away.

Thanks guys - got a good few leads already. If you see any ads for a Yellow Coupe de Ville would you mind calling/ mailing the owners and asking the VIN, mileage (should be 63,000) and the number of previous owners - should be one! Apparently this car has the original sale paperwork, window sticker etc etc and was bought from the original owner who used to drive it down to Florida.

Suspiscion is that the owner could be in delaware. So if you are in the Delaware region could you look out for it too please?

Thanks, Nick

TSS - I sent you a PM, thanks, Nick

Good luck, Nick. It seems you have a great bunch of people helping you out here. This just may work out in the end...

Sal,

Thanks - if you are still in Florida please look out for it for me.

thanks, Nick

Guys,

We';ve found the car. It was listed on Craig's List - on the 10th and 24th January under posting numbers 549954204 and 534778750.

1979 COUPE DEVILLE 64K ORIGINAL MILES , % 100 ORIGINAL , ALMOST NEW CONDITION,
ASHTRAYS NEVER USED , SHOW OR DRIVE , ALSO HAVE ORIGINAL WINDOW STICKER AND ALL NEW CAR DOCUMENTS , NO DISAPOINTMENTS , DRIVES AWSOME ,I CAN E MAIL PICTURES ,

$3500 then $2900.

An anoymous person replied to the ad and got a reply from the email address toolshark1@aol.com. The same guy, Jamie Cox who sold my buddy the car.
Now presumably in N Carolina. So the car was presumably in the back of the car transporter.

It is also the same listing as advertised in the Charlotte Observer I mentionned a few posts ago.

The Traverse City police in Michigan have been alerted and are on to the trail.

So, N Carolina people, if you know anyone who was interested in a triple yellow immaculate '79 CDV with good history, tell them to ask for their money back from Jamie Cox as the DMV will not change the title to their name as it is listed as a suspicious title.

Please forward all further leads to me and I will pass them on. If anyone can get a confirmation by replying to the ad and asking what colour the car is, asking for pics and if it is sold or not that woudl really really help the case for my buddy to get his $3800 back.

The anonymous person was told that the car has been sold 'last night' makking it the 7th of February or thereabouts, by a guy who came up with the money. Please see if you can get the same story.

And to think it was first seen and sold here in our classifieds ....

Thanks all, Nick

And to think it was first seen and sold here in our classifieds ....

Thanks all, Nick

true but we dont check the validity of any ad, buyer beware just like ebay. but ol toolshark1@aol.com wont be posting classifieds here again.

Yes, thanks for that Urbanski. Whilst I'm aware of the fact it makes me feel a whole lot better to be reminded of the fact.

Let's concentrate on finding the car and stopping some poor sod in Charlotte being lumped with a car he can't title.

regards, Nick

yup, best of luck

This is not surprising to me. I have sold items on ebay for 6 years, bought and sold 1500 items. I have only been ripped of 4 times on ebay, 2 from Michigan and 2 times from PA. I still sell to them but never buy from MI or PA again. ebay removed the rip offs address when they were kicked off and I had no recourse to them. Good luck and hope you get your money back. TexasCadillac

Sounds like you may be getting closer nick. Again Best of luck. I wish i was in North Carolina.... id call him up and plan to look at it, and bring a large blunt object with me. :)

Thanks TexasCadillac and 1990CaddyBrougham,

Sorry to hear your story TexasCadillac,

Yup blunt instruments, dark parking lot ....

Here's hoping we find the car too and stop someone else being suckered into buying a car they cannot title.

regards, Nick

id call him up and plan to look at it, and bring a large blunt. fire it up. LOL

Hi there! Anyone have any luck over the weekend?

thanks, Nick

Hi there! Anyone see a triple yellow, 63000 mile '79 coupe on their travels this weekend in the Carolinas or the Charlotte area?

Just trying to keep this thread alive!
thanks! Nick

Hi all!

Well apparrently the car is still in Charlotte. The owner has surfaced over the weekend and wants to give it back to us. Annonymously I guess, which is fair enough, or partially understandable - we only want the car, the keys, the title and the history file anyway - basically what we paid for.

If anyone has any reccommendations for how to safely hand over such a vehicle, with keys, history & title, anonymously in Charlotte I'm all ears!

Please gents, give us your thoughts!

thanks all, Nick

Anonymously? I'm happy to hear you've found the owner.. That's a great move in the right direction. How did that come about?

Hi Sal,

Thanks - he just sent us an email out of the blue with a hard luck story. If it's true I sympathise.
Maybe he's been reading these posts [hello if you are!], maybe it's the fact that the Michigan police are tracking him and his movements down and he has realised he's not going to get away with reselling the car, keeping hold of it and he's realised it is becoming a liablility to him and he doesn't want to make the situation worse.

Either way he's offered to leave it for us in a car park which isn't the best but better than nothing. The danger of this is he's unlikely to want to meet us and without the original genuine title that exists with the car, and the keys, the car itself isn't worth a lot.

Instead of leaving it in a car park, I can think of 4 options:

1. Ask him to take it to a pre-agreed police station and hand over the keys and title.

2. Ask him to take it to a pre-agreed responsible owner - say someone in the local Cadillac LaSalle club of which there are a few in Charlotte , someone on the board here or a classic car dealer in Charlotte with whom my buddy has been corresponding [mainly becuase she's female!] and hand over the keys and title.

3. Ask him to take it to a pre-agreed port office - Charleston or Jacksonville look the closest - and hand over the keys and title so it can be shipped straight to the UK.

4. Agree to pick it up from the specified parking lot and have a truck waiting.


I like 3 best of all since it gets it to a port and saves us some $400 trucking charges - some small compensation for all this mess - but I don't know if he'll make the 300 or so mile trip. Hopefully he might if he wants to make things right.

1 is probably a non starter. I can't see him walking into a Police station somehow. He may think he is going to get arrested.

2 is a possible but he may still perceive some risk.

4 is my least favourite becuase we don't get a chance to check the car and documentation and it's the highest risk for all sorts of reasons. The location is also very close to the freeway! Figure that one out!


So, what would you all advise us to do please?


thanks, Nick

I may have lost track, but... He doesn't have the original title?

Sal,

He did have the original title and we checked it to be genuine. The local Police checked it through the local DMV and all seemed to be in order. The local DMV are aware of the situaiton with the car and will inform the local police detective lieutenant of any 'movement' in the title and block it, unless it is to my buddy, Neil, of course.

I just don't know with the story if he has the title on him or where it is. Obviously we need the whole package together; car, keys, title, parts in the trunk, history file, to be handed over securely so someone we can trust in; like someone in Charlotte or an official 3rd party, like a dock receiving agent.

regards, Nick

SO WHAT HAPPENED OR WHAT'S THE STATUS?:hmm:

hey nick you can have him drop the car off at a das location .. or another shipping location and leave the paperwork in the glove box and send the car 2 u ........you can also have him drop it off at a car lot and you can send them a few buck to hold the car unitl it gets picked up by the truck ....to protect you from someone messing with the title have him print your friends name on the title so you are not leaving the title open ......

You'll also need his signature on the title.

If The Seller Prints Your Friends Name (make Sure Its Spelled Correctly ) You Are Not Leaving The Title Open .. The Title Must Be Signed By The Seller, But In The Buyers Section Have Him Print Your Friends Name So If You Ship The Car With The Title You Dont Have To Worry Someone Can Sign It To Themselves..

Thanks guys - good food for thought. A good idea that DAS location one.

We've given him 'til 48 hours to hand the car over otherwise we are going to list it as officially stolen. That way they'll be a formal federal felony.

The Michigan police are already treating it this way and then when we formally report it stolen to the people in the Charlotte Police Department we have already been dealing with they will search for him and bring him and the car in.

It's his last chance to hadn it over. He's still not replying to emails but we now know wheere he is.

Bad situation all round and it's a shame we have to do this but we'll hunt him down until he hands the car over. he can't retitle the car and it would be much easier for him if he just gave us it back.

have fun all.

hey nick give me a call .. i gave u my number some time ago ..

Good going, Nick.
Keep the pressure on.:annoyed:
That piece of flotsam thought he had an easy mark from across the pond and could weasel out of the deal and walk away with many dollars.
I guess he never figured on the loyalty and willingness to help of decent Cadillac owners like those on this Bulletin Board in addition to normal law enforcement methods.:yup:

Thanks Old Fleetwood and all!

We're now waiting for him to deliver the car, wherever we can best arrange it - he doesn't even have to deliver it himself, he could get someone to do it for him I guess.
We'll keep the pressure on, both personally and via the relevent authorities but really all he has to do is anonymously give us the car and that's all we're interested in.

cheers Nick

Nick -
Keep us posted.
Especially if that POS gets his butt in a sling with the Michigan law enforcement people.:want:
Good luck.
Hope you finally get YOUR CADILLAC.

Let us know how this all work out.

Hi all,

I'll keep you posted. Buy seriously wew just want the car, intact, with all its parts and papers.

It's looking postive today!

regards, Nick

Nick - Just for sheer nosy, What's the shipping cost to take a full-size Cadillac across the pond?:hmm:

Nick - Just for sheer nosy, What's the shipping cost to take a full-size Cadillac across the pond?:hmm:

$1700, give or take a few hundred. (Dallas to Germany.)

Yup! $1500 containerised LA to London. However there are container unloading fees of $600!!!!

Old Bird - do you know any good shippers going to Germany? A work colleague confessed to a potential liking for a WWII Willys Jeep and I said I woudl investigate the options for him.

I'd love to see him drive that thing from Hamburg to Munich. It'll take about 3 days!

regards, Nick

Considering I popped for $975.00 to have my FWB shipped from Plano, TX to West Hartford, CT in late spring 2006, that isn't all that bad! :cool:

Wow that isnt bad at all! Nothings too bad when its for the love of the Cadillac.... :)

600 unloading fee though, is that to take it off the boat or drive it out of the container? lol... ill drive it out for free....

I think the unloading fees reflect fees the harbormaster has to charge to stay in business (locke/crane use, legal fees, international inspection, etc.). You don't think he's gonna support international trade for free do ya? ;)

Yes old Fleetwood trucking at betwen $1 and $2 a mile is a bit of a kilelr when you have to do a big distance. one of the reasons we don't buy cars in the middle fo the country!

The container unlaoding fee is to take the container off the ship, put it on a truck, take it to a warehouse and unload the container.

Well I have to say we got the car!! Yes it all worked out. The truck picked it up at the weekend and it is now at the port.
So good news all round and I hope nobody started to lose the faith!

A big big thank you to all involved for helping out here. Mucho appreciated

regards Nick

I am really glad you got your car and I hope it is still in good condition. TexasCadillac

Congratulations on getting the car, it better be driven well in Ireland!!

hey nick give me a call when you get a chance...

Glad thinks worked out Nick. Seems to be a nice car.

hey nick post some pics ... id love to see it

Most Excellent!! Things are looking up for you and that's GREAT!

Nick - There's a really good possibility I'll be moving to Britain on a three year contract beginning in June or July. And I'm thinking of taking my 95 FWB. I figured shipping costs were anywhere between $1,500 and $2,000 but what all will I have to do to be able to legally drive it in Britain? Registration, taxes, repairs/modifications, etc.

My wife thinks I'm nuts and we should just buy a used right-hand-drive Seville when we get there but I'm still thinking I want to take my FWB. I'd love to drive it in Britain despite the narrow roads, tight parking, and one pound per liter petrol (that's about $7.00 USD per gallon!!).

Any help is greatly appreciated.

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd251/tenmark262/DSCN7134.jpg

That's wonderful. A happy ending. Too bad you had to go through all that frustration.:banana:

Yup! $1500 containerised LA to London. However there are container unloading fees of $600!!!!

Old Bird - do you know any good shippers going to Germany? A work colleague confessed to a potential liking for a WWII Willys Jeep and I said I woudl investigate the options for him.

I'd love to see him drive that thing from Hamburg to Munich. It'll take about 3 days!

regards, Nick


A ton of GIs have used this company, and I have talked with them regularly about possibly shipping a car over there. They are honest, down to earth, and very knowledgeable. I have been talking to Mary Scott who knows her business. There are also a couple of people above her who are also very decent.

Personally, after hearing good news from GIs, I would not use anyone else.


Trans Global Auto Logistics

2454 NW Dallas Street

Grand Prairie, TX 75050

Tel: 972 602 1670

Telefax: 972-602-0072

Nick -
This is GREAT news.
And just in time for SAINT PATRICK'S DAY !:bouncy:
:alchi:
I'll down a pint to your good fortune !:thumbsup:

Thanks all ! Actually this one is staying in the UK. And yes we think it is still in the expeceted condition when we agreed to buy it.

regards, Nick