: Need help on 98 Seville/Northstar



ss6r
01-18-08, 05:45 PM
Does anyone know if using a JB weld type of hardening adhesive instead of the 277 loctite on first installaion timeserts is recommended. It was recommended to me by a GM dealer mechanic that has worked on N* timesert repairs before. He said do my self a favor and put a lite film of JB weld on the each timesert before their installed,use it instead of the 277 Loctite. I dont want to doubt his judgment but I don't want to cause any further issues either that he may not know about. Any thoughts?

Ranger
01-18-08, 06:19 PM
If you read up on Loctite, you will find that it is an anaerobic action that is created when between two metals (male & female threads) and hardens and locks to two together. DISCLAIMER: I may not be explaining this exactly correct. JB Weld is a great product and it has saved me several times, but it meeds air to cure. Not sure how much air will be available in the threads once the Timesert is installed. I don't know, sounds feasible, but I would probably stick with what the manufacturer recommends. Just my $0.02. Who am I to argue with an experienced tech.

ss6r
01-18-08, 08:43 PM
Thanks Ranger, you make a good point about the amount of air to the threads. I think I will use the recommended loctite since it has been tested by GM . Do know any statistics on the lifespan of timeserted N* engines after being repaired?

Ranger
01-18-08, 09:53 PM
Our old Guru (GM powertrain engineer) used to say that they'd pull 'em down after 250K and there was no ridge in the cylinder and you could still see the factory crosshatch hone pattern, so I say after you fix the weak link, it should run for a long long time.

Destroyer
01-20-08, 11:28 PM
Our old Guru (GM powertrain engineer) used to say that they'd pull 'em down after 250K and there was no ridge in the cylinder and you could still see the factory crosshatch hone pattern, so I say after you fix the weak link, it should run for a long long time............and there are those on here who have had the timeserts done and claim its just a bandaid fix and will go out real fast. There is usually more than one side to every story. When my h/g's blew I got rid of the POS and didn't timesert so I cannot attest to the longetivity of a timeserted N* and obviously neither can Ranger, but for some reason.........................he does. :confused:

Ranger
01-20-08, 11:39 PM
I don't think I have ever heard of a properly Timeserted block fail again. Have you?

Destroyer
01-20-08, 11:59 PM
I don't think I have ever heard of a properly Timeserted block fail again. Have you?Yeah, there were definately some posts about timeserts failing. I'm not gonna look for the posts but they weren' that long ago. Having the block timeserted "properly" is another story. Nobody knows if its going to be "properly" done till after its done. It is another risk.

Ranger
01-21-08, 12:11 AM
I guess that could be said for any repair on any car.

Destroyer
01-21-08, 07:22 AM
I guess that could be said for any repair on any car.Very true but this is a high buck repair so its a little different than a head gasket on an old Chevy for instance. Plus, the block itself can get screwed up in the process. Doesn't Cadillac recommend changing the motor out vs repairing the heads?.

flyinlow
01-21-08, 02:28 PM
If you read up on Loctite, you will find that it is an anaerobic action that is created when between two metals (male & female threads) and hardens and locks to two together. DISCLAIMER: I may not be explaining this exactly correct. JB Weld is a great product and it has saved me several times, but it meeds air to cure. Not sure how much air will be available in the threads once the Timesert is installed. I don't know, sounds feasible, but I would probably stick with what the manufacturer recommends. Just my $0.02. Who am I to argue with an experienced tech.

Actually JB Weld is an epoxy and cures due to the chemical reaction between the two parts and doesnt require air to cure
My only concern with JB Weld is that it is hard and the steel insert and aluminum block expand at diff. rates
It may or may not matter but is something to consider.

CadillacSTS42005
01-21-08, 05:09 PM
...........and there are those on here who have had the timeserts done and claim its just a bandaid fix and will go out real fast. There is usually more than one side to every story. When my h/g's blew I got rid of the POS and didn't timesert so I cannot attest to the longetivity of a timeserted N* and obviously neither can Ranger, but for some reason.........................he does. :confused:

I have had a hg fail and i HAVE had it timeserted and its 15k later no problem
and id STILL buy a cadillac..

AJxtcman
01-21-08, 05:44 PM
I don't think I have ever heard of a properly Timeserted block fail again. Have you?

If the block is PROPERLY inspected and is able to have a TimeSert install it should last as long as the bolt would. If the block is inspected and it is found to have pitting in the bolt hole and when drilled out the pits are still present the TimeSert will not hold up most of the time. How many people inspect the block Proberly?:yawn:

Ranger
01-21-08, 06:03 PM
Very true but this is a high buck repair so its a little different than a head gasket on an old Chevy for instance. Plus, the block itself can get screwed up in the process. Doesn't Cadillac recommend changing the motor out vs repairing the heads?.
No (assuming as AJ said that there is no pitting). The thread repair procedure is in the FSM. Now an unscrupulous dealer wanting to sell you a new engine may tell you otherwise.

ss6r
01-22-08, 09:08 PM
Thanks! for the info to everybody who responded, does anyone recommend replacing frt. rear main seals if there is just some seepage on the bottom of the engine since the engine and cradle are out? Everything sounds easy to replace, but I am not sure if it is worth the risk changing them and of making things worse. Are you familiar with replacing them and the difficulties involved?

tateos
01-23-08, 01:51 PM
My rear main seal and oil pan gasket were leaking, so I yanked the engine out of the cradle and changed them and also the front main seal. The front seal calls for a special tool to install, but I was able to use a hammer and a block of wood. The original rear main seal design was leak prone, so they have come out with a new design on newer models - I think it was '99 and up. Anyway, the new design seal is a press fit in the block AND onto the crankshaft flange, so a special tool must be used - around $300 with shipping direct from SPX/OTC.

RM