: clutch warranty



Albertan
11-09-07, 12:14 AM
Does anyone have a shop manual describing different clutch issues? I have a clutch that won't properly release. As a result I have a hard time getting the car into gear. It won't go into reverse unless I shut off the motor. The service manager at the dealership has seen this clutch out before and the pressure plate is not flat. They are saying that the clutch is worn out! I keep telling them if it was worn out I would have burning clutch smell and car wouldn't move!
Is there any specs on clutch disk original thickness, runout on the flywheel and pressure plate etc. I'm thinking that if I allow them to pull it apart again, they will say the clutch is worn out and I'll be stuck paying for it. They do not seem to have any idea how a clutch operates!
Oh, the clutch fluid is up and is turning brown. I suspect that just recently, the release bearing is not traveling as far as it should because my shifting problem has gotten much worse to the point of it not being drivable. The dealership has had the car for 4 days and still don't know how to diagnose this!

darkman
11-09-07, 08:37 AM
Does anyone have a shop manual describing different clutch issues? I have a clutch that won't properly release. As a result I have a hard time getting the car into gear. It won't go into reverse unless I shut off the motor. The service manager at the dealership has seen this clutch out before and the pressure plate is not flat. They are saying that the clutch is worn out! I keep telling them if it was worn out I would have burning clutch smell and car wouldn't move!
Is there any specs on clutch disk original thickness, runout on the flywheel and pressure plate etc. I'm thinking that if I allow them to pull it apart again, they will say the clutch is worn out and I'll be stuck paying for it. They do not seem to have any idea how a clutch operates!
Oh, the clutch fluid is up and is turning brown. I suspect that just recently, the release bearing is not traveling as far as it should because my shifting problem has gotten much worse to the point of it not being drivable. The dealership has had the car for 4 days and still don't know how to diagnose this!

The checklist in the service manual for Clutch Drag is as follows:
1. Pedal blocked from full travel.
2. Too much travel between pedal and clutch master cylinder.
3. Clutch pedal mounting loose.
4. Linkage at pedal worn or damaged.
5. Clutch master cylinder seized or binding.
6. Air in clutch hydraulic system.
7. Clutch actuator cylinder seized or binding.
8. Clutch master cylinder leaking internally.
9. Damage clutch assembly components. This includes damaged clutch disc hub splines, bent clutch disc, bent drive straps, broken or warped pressure plate. [I did not find any thickness specs for the clutch disc.]
10. Excessive side loading on the release bearing.
11. Faulty pilot bearing.
12. Transmission input shaft splines worn or damaged.
13. Tight or contaminated clutch disc splines.
14. Flywheel housing, engine block to clutch housing, or transmission front case excessively misaligned.
15, Grease or oil contamination on the clutch disc facing.

In addition to this list, the list for "Clutch Grabbing" also includes broken motor mounts.

Also, the color of the clutch fluid darkens fairly quickly in these cars even in mild street use.

Finally, you did not indicate the miles on the clutch, but there is always the possiblility that the dealer is correct and you simply need a new clutch kit. (Flywheel, clutch disc, and pressure plate). Older clutches can "warp" before they actually begin to slip.

Albertan
11-09-07, 12:32 PM
Darkman
This problem existed when I bought the car and it had 125 miles.
I'm going to try to see the district service manager to see if I can get something going.
I was in Spring Texas a couple of weeks ago didn't see your car or any V's all over Houston.

darkman
11-09-07, 02:18 PM
Well obviously the clutch should not malfunction at 125 miles. Good luck.

dqw1
01-13-08, 11:54 AM
The checklist in the service manual for Clutch Drag is as follows:
1. Pedal blocked from full travel.
2. Too much travel between pedal and clutch master cylinder.
3. Clutch pedal mounting loose.
4. Linkage at pedal worn or damaged.
5. Clutch master cylinder seized or binding.
6. Air in clutch hydraulic system.
7. Clutch actuator cylinder seized or binding.
8. Clutch master cylinder leaking internally.
9. Damage clutch assembly components. This includes damaged clutch disc hub splines, bent clutch disc, bent drive straps, broken or warped pressure plate. [I did not find any thickness specs for the clutch disc.]
10. Excessive side loading on the release bearing.
11. Faulty pilot bearing.
12. Transmission input shaft splines worn or damaged.
13. Tight or contaminated clutch disc splines.
14. Flywheel housing, engine block to clutch housing, or transmission front case excessively misaligned.
15, Grease or oil contamination on the clutch disc facing.

In addition to this list, the list for "Clutch Grabbing" also includes broken motor mounts.

Also, the color of the clutch fluid darkens fairly quickly in these cars even in mild street use.

Finally, you did not indicate the miles on the clutch, but there is always the possiblility that the dealer is correct and you simply need a new clutch kit. (Flywheel, clutch disc, and pressure plate). Older clutches can "warp" before they actually begin to slip.
Mine went out Friday morning with 51k miles and needs a clutch kit. Not covered under warranty due to wear and tear. 2100 bucks- so you know I'm sad. I decided not to upgrade anything but the service guys offered to install an upgraded kit of my choice if I decided I wanted it but, because I plan on an 09 if the price is right there's no way I'm adding anymore mod's.:annoyed:
Just wondering what could cause a complete failure? Fluid was barely below the line but not dry and there the only indication of something not right before it failed was I had a little trouble getting into reverse a few days ago but that's pretty normal.

50 4Ever
01-13-08, 01:49 PM
I had a very similar problem, if not the same problem. One day at the grocery store I could not get it into reverse and I noticed that when I put it into 1st the car would just barely move. At the time I did not think to shut it off and put it into reverse, that would have worked. Took it to the dealer and they were playing with it in the service drive and found it shifted like butter when the engine was off. But start it and it would not go into reverse and getting it into other gears was difficult. Here's what was said on the workorder when I picked it up 3 weeks later:



Shifting Problem

07/17/06

17,782 Miles

My concern:
Hard to shift into forward gears, will not shift into reverse.

Tech’s response:
Evaluate shifting with customer & found that trans won’t shift into any gear while engine is running, but will if engine is shut off. Inspect clutch operation & pedal feel – found pedal feels OK, suspect that disc is either sticking on shaft or slave cylinder is not fully disengaging. Remove trans for repair. Inspect clutch and pressure plate – found clutch disc looks OK, but pressure plate has a smooth ring around the outer edge as is it could have been dragging. Customer was also commenting on excessive clutch chatter. Considering the nature of concern & prior repairs we are replacing all clutch related components in trans & advise to inspect internal trans components for damage. Disassemble trans. To check for hard shifting checked all blocker rings, all looked to specs. Reverse syncro hub and blocker rings damaged. Replaced damaged parts. Reassembled trans. Replace clutch disc, pressure plate & slave cylinder. Road test & found that trans will shift into all gears now except reverse. Verify reverse lockout actuator is not malfunctioning. Call TAC & discuss case #XXXXXXX. Advised to remove trans and recheck internal components. Removed trans for inspection. Disassemble trans & re-check reverse components, shift forks & rails – all look OK. Call TAC & discuss case – advised to replace flywheel & perform clutch pressure plate adjustment per doc ID #1413557 & clutch bleed per Doc ID #1550985. Inspect flywheel step depth – found old flywheel depth is 0.020” deeper than the new one. Installed S/O new flywheel. Performed adjustment on clutch pressure plate and reinstalled. Reinstalled trans. Engine won’t start; battery is dead – replaced battery. Road test & verify shifting is now OK in all gears. Perform bleed procedure as directed by Doc ID #1550985.


The V now has over 39,000 miles and have had no problems with the tranny..

Show this to the service department, ask them if it could be the same problem.

Good luck

fscarce1
01-13-08, 01:54 PM
Does anyone have a shop manual describing different clutch issues? I have a clutch that won't properly release. As a result I have a hard time getting the car into gear. It won't go into reverse unless I shut off the motor. The service manager at the dealership has seen this clutch out before and the pressure plate is not flat. They are saying that the clutch is worn out! I keep telling them if it was worn out I would have burning clutch smell and car wouldn't move!
Is there any specs on clutch disk original thickness, runout on the flywheel and pressure plate etc. I'm thinking that if I allow them to pull it apart again, they will say the clutch is worn out and I'll be stuck paying for it. They do not seem to have any idea how a clutch operates!
Oh, the clutch fluid is up and is turning brown. I suspect that just recently, the release bearing is not traveling as far as it should because my shifting problem has gotten much worse to the point of it not being drivable. The dealership has had the car for 4 days and still don't know how to diagnose this!


I'm having the same problem, on my 2006. It has 18000 miles. Very hard to get into any gear initially, especially 1st and reverse. Usually I have to pull back on the shifter and try again and it goes right in. Cadillac says it's fine.

Albertan
01-13-08, 04:57 PM
Mine is shifting fine again. Everytime I thing about bringing it in it gets better. Seems to work well if I drive it only a couple of times a week. I'm going to try the clutch fluid flush described here a few weeks ago-when it gets warm enough so I don't freeze outside.
No wonder they will offer the 2009 in auto. Who needs the aggravation of
the manual: shifting problems, rear problems, warranty fighting etc. I just want a fast car that I can get into and drive and have a reasonable expectation of being able to get there and back and not worry if I'll be able to put it into gear.

dqw1
01-13-08, 05:38 PM
50, like your description, mine would only go into gear with the engine off (that was only after pumping the clutch about 60-70 times). Once the engine was started, the damn thing hauled ass up my drive way and almost thru the bedroom wall. Scared me real good. I don't know how I stopped the car in time. Same thing happened when the tow driver came and at the dealership. Damn thing almost took a fence out in reverse. I really don't want to get into a warranty fight because they always treat me good, but $2100 (labor, parts) not counting the rental.

50 4Ever
01-13-08, 06:15 PM
50, like your description, mine would only go into gear with the engine off (that was only after pumping the clutch about 60-70 times). Once the engine was started, the damn thing hauled ass up my drive way and almost thru the bedroom wall. Scared me real good. I don't know how I stopped the car in time. Same thing happened when the tow driver came and at the dealership. Damn thing almost took a fence out in reverse. I really don't want to get into a warranty fight because they always treat me good, but $2100 (labor, parts) not counting the rental.

Mine was never that bad, when I put into 1st you could feel the car just barely move forward. If the clutch fluid is brown, especially dark brown, it needs to be flushed. Also, read the following ---> Click here. (http://www.rangeracceleration.com/Clutch_Care.html)

dqw1
01-13-08, 06:52 PM
Thanks 50, that's a good read. My fluid was very dirty imo and I should have insisted on having all fluids changed when I had the pinion seal replaced right before X-mas. I need to look at my records to see if the clutch fluid was changed during the 30k service. Somethings not right.
Also, hope your doing well!
Albertan, you make a strong case for considering an auto trans 09. Never thought I'd say those words, "auto trans".

50 4Ever
01-13-08, 09:36 PM
Thanks 50, that's a good read. My fluid was very dirty imo and I should have insisted on having all fluids changed when I had the pinion seal replaced right before X-mas. I need to look at my records to see if the clutch fluid was changed during the 30k service. Somethings not right.
Also, hope your doing well!
Albertan, you make a strong case for considering an auto trans 09. Never thought I'd say those words, "auto trans".

Doing fine, you going to Road Atlanta this year? I will probably be there again since the Corvettes have decided to do ALMS in 2008.

dqw1
01-14-08, 09:07 AM
I enjoyed it last year and plan on going again.