: Tim Allens 400HP naturally asp. N*



msta293412
08-10-07, 09:25 AM
Did anyone see this report on Tim Allens DTS-I? It was a specially made Northstar with a 3 angle valve job, bigger throttlebody, exhaust, and a few other thing...nice breaks, wheels, etc. I think its awesome getting 398 hp, out of a naturally asperated N*. We can all get a few pointers from that set up....what do ya think?www.caranddriver.com/specialtyfiles/3639/specialty-file-tim-allen-design-cadillac-deville-dtsi.html?al=164 - 72k

CadillacSTS42005
08-10-07, 09:40 AM
been posted several times
all attempts to contact him or anyone else about what exactly was done has been futile

msta293412
08-10-07, 10:00 AM
I would love to see what that PCM program contains....among other things. I did notice in the article it posts some performance times, stating that one would expect more, but mentions the car has some serious torque management goin on. Why would you want to limit that healthy NORTHSTAR?

CadillacSTS42005
08-10-07, 10:13 AM
so you dont end up throwing a head....

msta293412
08-10-07, 11:11 AM
Uhhh......RRRRight....

danbuc
08-10-07, 12:33 PM
Why would you want to limit that healthy NORTHSTAR?

The 4T80E may be a strong tranny, but it's no TH400...

There's a limit on what it can handle, just like any other factory trans. Any more, and you run the risk of damage, hence the need for torque management. Especially on a vehicle making a lot more power than stock.

CadillacSTS42005
08-10-07, 12:37 PM
lol
and read the article
somewhere in it, it says something along the lines of, a transmission fault hindered a top speed run.

msta293412
08-11-07, 09:31 AM
If you noticed in the article it said most of the HP came from high compression pistons. I have a 2001 sts, can run on 87 octane, if I just shave my heads alittle and increase compression, I could run 93 octane, and gain maybe 30-40 HP. C'mon you know its true........ ;-)

Maxb49
08-12-07, 10:40 AM
Then why don't you mill the heads and tell us how it worked?

msta293412
08-12-07, 11:26 AM
I may consider it.......if your good. :-)

Maxb49
08-12-07, 03:56 PM
It's no secret. The equation for building horsepower = PLAN/33,000. That's Mean Effective Pressure X Length of Stroke in Feet X Area of the bore X Number of Power Strokes per minute. Increase one or more of the PLAN and you will yield more horsepower regardless size or vintage of the engine you are working with. The reason most people chose a select number of engines for high performance (Chevy Big Block/Small Block, Ford FE, Ford Modular, Chrysler Small Block) is due to the wide range of parts available and relatively low cost of maintenance.

Submariner409
08-12-07, 06:45 PM
Given the deck height, quench area relief, and piston-to-valve clearances in a post-'99 N*, I would be very leery of "shaving the heads". As is, if using 93 octane fuel, the PCM will adjust for lessened WOT detonation tendency by slightly advancing the timing, resulting in a minimal performance increase. If a simple .010" -.015" head mill resulted in a "30 - 40" horsepower increase, every N* in this forum would be in a machine shop tomorrow morning. Nice pipe dream..........

Totty
08-13-07, 09:38 PM
you could definatly get more that 400 out of a NA N*. some head cleanup, CHRFab rods and pistons, CHRFab cams and springs, a good exhaust to let that thing breathe. you are looking at close to 450. of course that is running aftermarket engine managment. i am running the Holley and pushing close to 385hp with cams and very minor head cleanup.

Submariner409
08-13-07, 10:01 PM
:eek: Bat crap ! If your post is true and verifiable, you're presently pulling 1.4 hp/ci out of a sidewinder N*. 400 hp would be about 1.44 hp/ci. Where have you been for the last 2 1/3 years ??? You're speaking of a 21-25% hp increase in a daily driver ?

AJxtcman
08-13-07, 10:21 PM
you could definatly get more that 400 out of a NA N*. some head cleanup, CHRFab rods and pistons, CHRFab cams and springs, a good exhaust to let that thing breathe. you are looking at close to 450. of course that is running aftermarket engine managment. i am running the Holley and pushing close to 385hp with cams and very minor head cleanup.

4.6L = 400 hp. Hmmmm ok.---100 hp gain is a lot without a compressor
4.4L is 445 hp now.
.
.
.
I am not sure what CHRFab has other than valve covers that is worth any thing.
.
.
.
submariner409 What do you think about the high dollar crap?
I have seen nothing that I could not get or have made some where else better and cheaper.
.
.
BTW submariner409 how do you say this. N-O-S or NAUSSS. I have always said NOS. How about that down pipe thing. Dam video games make new words up.

msta293412
08-14-07, 09:00 AM
Hey guys, Totty, mentioned the HP, and performance of his Northstar, He never said it was in a daily driver....could be in a sand rail, or even an MR2, with a piggy back.....lets listen to all comers , maybe we can get ideas. I understand we have to sift through the riff raff but.........

Totty
08-14-07, 05:43 PM
you are correct, it isn't in a daily driver and i stated, that is also running stand alone engine management. my northstar is running a holley commander and the 4t80e is running the PCS tranny controller. i haven't had it running that well for that long because the guy that did my cam's (i didn't have the tool to replace the springs) f'd them up. that is another story. i hope to have it all back together at the end of this weekend and get some dyno time in the next couple of weeks.

i have pretty close contact w/ alan and chrfab and have for the last couple of years. i recently paid him a visit and was pleasantly surprised at his abilities and ingenuity. some of his stuff just blew my mind. i also spent some time w/ him in alabama when they were dynoing a turbo northstar to put in a stretched xlr for Bonneville of which is this week. if anyone would like to see a 1400hp northstar running alcohol at 7500rpm on an engine dyno i can post it up. pretty sweet sight that is for sure.

anyhow, when i upgraded from the 272 cams to the 288 cams alan and i were discussing what kind of power this engine would legitimately put out and he felt around 385 would be a good estimate. he said the only other thing i could do is port and polish the heads and upgrade the pistons and rods and i would be pumping out about 450hp. i believe it to, the man knows his stuff. i am very impressed, he is like a "northstar god" he knows what these motors will take and what they won't.

AJxtcman: i understand you have been around these engines quite a bit and i envy that, these motors are not your everyday typical repair. to stay at them like you have is impressive to say the least. but careful not knock a business that you haven't had any dealings w/. i'm not by anymeans trying to start something, if anything you and i have the most in common here, both owning northstar fieros and such (somewhat of a rare breed). i have followed your build on the fiero forum and i am very impresed in your detail and research, i hope to see your car and exchange a little info sometime soon. where are you located? up north right?

AJxtcman
08-14-07, 07:09 PM
AJxtcman: i understand you have been around these engines quite a bit and i envy that, these motors are not your everyday typical repair. to stay at them like you have is impressive to say the least. but careful not knock a business that you haven't had any dealings w/. i'm not by anymeans trying to start something, if anything you and i have the most in common here, both owning northstar fieros and such (somewhat of a rare breed). i have followed your build on the fiero forum and i am very impresed in your detail and research, i hope to see your car and exchange a little info sometime soon. where are you located? up north right?

I had a customer that had his heads done at BPE Racing Heads and the CHRFab helped out on the project. BPE said they do head work for CHRFab. I am not sure if that is true or not. The CHRFab was on the phone when the car did not perform like we thought.

eldorado1
08-14-07, 07:54 PM
You have to know what you're doing to touch the N* heads. You can really screw things up very easily.

Submariner409
08-14-07, 08:21 PM
:) NOS = New Old Stock? NO = Nitrous Oxide? ....NAUSS = something I do on too much bourbon. I'll pull in my horns when it comes to a money-no-object N* project for a very few people. Sure, give me enough bucks and I'll work up an 850 hp "Olds 455" boat engine. But don't expect the work to be applicable to anything else in this forum. Horsepower, torque, mods, parts, speed, alcohol, nitrous, methanol, blowers, chrome.....all well and good and well worth learning (if it doesn't break, it's too heavy...), but IN THESE FORUMS, if you can't put it on the street or under the hood of your '01 Widget, it's useless. Is anyone ready to clone and market an engine management system for ......'99 - '03 N*'s? So there. (Otherwise, I have no opinion....) Gotta lighten up...(some of the "high dollar crap" is made by dedicated people catering to a very small market. Think what your '03 STS would have cost if there were only 10 of them....???)

AJxtcman
08-14-07, 08:50 PM
You have to know what you're doing to touch the N* heads. You can really screw things up very easily.

I have the bill some place $1200
They had flow sheets sent back with them.
The heads had very very little porting and I mean little. They were just scuffed. The exhaust side had a little more than the intake. The casting marks were still present.
The flow sheet that they sent did not go to his heads. The date on the sheet did not match.
http://www.bpeheads.com/index.html
http://www.bpeheads.com/northstar.htm

You need a program to work with the increase in air flow

Totty
08-15-07, 07:36 PM
I have seen the heads that come out of CHRFab and they by no means have been scuffed. these heads get the full treatment. I can only speak for what i have seen. I would have a set but it would be pointless for me because i am running a factory downpipes for lack of room to build headers.

He has a blown n* 4 seat sandrail car that would absolutly blow your mind. this thing is trick.

AJxtcman
08-15-07, 08:23 PM
I have seen the heads that come out of CHRFab and they by no means have been scuffed. these heads get the full treatment. I can only speak for what i have seen. I would have a set but it would be pointless for me because i am running a factory downpipes for lack of room to build headers.

He has a blown n* 4 seat sandrail car that would absolutly blow your mind. this thing is trick.

I posted a picture of a engine from a rail. It was a CHRFAB setup. It was way back in the begining

lbwd
08-15-07, 08:34 PM
He Needs To Be A Frickin' Member Here.