: changing N* oil w/o lift



fpmesiIII
06-17-07, 09:36 PM
I was wondering if it is possible to change the oil without a lift? if so what are the best options without getting too expensive?

fubar569
06-17-07, 09:46 PM
I was wondering if it is possible to change the oil without a lift? if so what are the best options without getting too expensive?


uuummmmmmm....get a jack? it works for me!

fpmesiIII
06-17-07, 09:47 PM
do you use two jacks or one?

codewize
06-17-07, 09:58 PM
Ummm yeah, whats the question here, a jack works fine. One jack on the drivers side is what I do. I never tried the other side but I've never had a problem either. I access the car from the front when I crawl under BTW.

fubar569
06-17-07, 10:06 PM
do you use two jacks or one?

one - under center usually, but can be done from either side

fpmesiIII
06-17-07, 10:10 PM
are rollers a good idea?

danbuc
06-17-07, 10:23 PM
If your not man enough to get you shirt and pants covered in dirt and crap...then yes, a creeper works just fine. I have a creeper at my house and at work. The one at work folds into a chair, and has pretty much stayed like that since I bought it. The one at home sits in the corner and collects dust. Wear some old junky jeans and a beat up t-shit so you don't have to worry about destroying nice clothes....cause they will get obliterated.



edit: Haha...it says t-shit instead of shirt........I'm not changing it. But yeah, even with a creeper, your still gonna get dirty. To be honest, your really not gonna have enough room under the car to use one anyway, and you'll have more room to work just shimmying under the car on your back....again, the reason for wearing old, crappy stuff you don't care about. Good luck.

Submariner409
06-17-07, 10:26 PM
:tisk: Go to your local auto parts outlet. Get a hydraulic floor jack with a 14"+ lift for about $39.95. If you're lucky, you'll score the companion jackstands for cheap. Lay out an old bedspread. Position the floor jack under the center of the front of the engine cradle and lift until you can position the jackstands under the two pads just outboard of the front of each side of the cradle. Carefully lower the car onto the jackstands. Remove jack. Work. NEVER WORK UNDER A CAR HELD BY ONLY A JACK !!! (Your skull is softer than GM steel) Buy a couple of pairs of Playtex general purpose gloves, a decent sized dishpan, a big funnel, several junk gallon jugs or a 16 quart oil container for trips to the recycle vat, paper towels. The above-mentioned junk clothes. Learn by doing. Yes, lube the filter gasket, prefill the filter, and screw it on just past strong hand tight. Beware of Fram.

codewize
06-17-07, 10:26 PM
:thumbsup: Yeah That ^^^^^^ Crap I was to slow. I was referring to Danbuc's GET DIRTY

danbuc
06-17-07, 10:32 PM
I second that....

I had one of my floor jacks fail on me once, the pressure release valve for the hydraulic cylinder took a crap on itself. I had some cinder blocks under the front cause I could find my jack stand. Scared the crap outa me when I saw that jack drop out of the corner of my eye. This was while changing the oil on my mother's Triumph. I had to life that car about 1 and a half feet in the air (the front end that is) just to get under it enough to have room to work. Without those makeshift cinder block jack stands under the front, my day would have been ruined.

Ranger
06-17-07, 10:35 PM
Believe it or not, I frequently do mine with no jack (when I am too lazy to get it out). It is a little tight (and I have long arms) but it is doable.

Ranger
06-17-07, 10:37 PM
Danbuc, you are lucky indeed. Cinder blocks should NEVER be used as they will frequently crumble under the weight alone, much less the shock of the car coming down on them.

danbuc
06-17-07, 10:38 PM
You can drive on front wheel up onto a curb to get room as well.

Onalaska
06-17-07, 10:39 PM
If you try to jack the vehicle in the wrong place you can damage the underbody or frame. Forget the jacks, buy as set of drive on ramps. The ones I bought are called Rhino ramps and they are made of a heavy duty plastic, lightweight but very tough, enough to support a 1 ton truck. Makes life a lot simpler and safer when you need to get underneath the vehicle for anything.

Submariner409
06-17-07, 10:42 PM
:confused: Onalaska...........Ramps are the best way to go, BUT, my STS and probably others, is/are too low in front to allow their use......PITA (BTW...dial-up sux)

Onalaska
06-17-07, 10:48 PM
These Rhino ramps are low enough to drive my 05 STS on without a problem. Acutally bought them for my 95 Trans Am which was lower to the ground than the STS. They are very wide for the big tires and rubbed the flexible part of the air dam on the Trans Am a little, but not enough to cause any problem at all. I did have a set of metal ones before and they are useless with the wider tires and lowered front ends. Got mine at AutoZone I think, but it's been 12 years ago now.

fpmesiIII
06-17-07, 10:51 PM
thanks for the info guys.

danbuc
06-17-07, 11:08 PM
Danbuc, you are lucky indeed. Cinder blocks should NEVER be used as they will frequently crumble under the weight alone, much less the shock of the car coming down on them.


They weren't "cinder blocks" per say, they were those bricks they use to make walkways and stuff. We had a bunch left over in the garage. They were made out of cement, but were solid. Plus, the Triumph doesn't really weigh a whole lot. But yeah, on a big heavy car, I wouldn't use traditional cinder blocks with holes in them.

Ranger
06-17-07, 11:41 PM
:confused: Onalaska...........Ramps are the best way to go, BUT, my STS and probably others, is/are too low in front to allow their use......PITA (BTW...dial-up sux)
Funny you should mention this Submariner. I had the same problem and just fixed it. I took a 2X12 (2X8 would work) and cut two lengths. One 4' and one 3'. Put a 60 degree bevel on one end of each and screwed one on top of the other with the square cut ends lined up. What you end up with is a step up from the ground to one 2X12 and 12" later another step up to the second 2X12. With the ramps at the end of this additional ramp you now have the clearance you need to clear the front fascia. I now am able to use my ramps again for the first time in many years.

Ollie8974
06-17-07, 11:57 PM
I always take my car to an oil change garage.

danbuc
06-18-07, 01:01 AM
If you try to jack the vehicle in the wrong place you can damage the underbody or frame.


The last two times my car was in a shop and I wasn't working on it myself, the people who were put the lift arms under the pinch weld where the front fenders bolt to the unibody structure just below the leading edge of the front door. This cause the section of of the r/f fender that runs along the front edge of the passenger door to bulge out a half an inch, due to the pinch weld being crushed flat causing the bottom of the fender to move upwards. The first time was at a Cadillac dealer no less. Second time was at a trans shop that put my new tranny in. I see a lot of '98-'04 Seville that seemed to have suffered this fate. It's sad when the dealer doesn't even know where to jack the vehicle up from. I always put the jack on the sub frame to lift it. Pinch welds are fine on a Camry or Civic that weighs 3200lbs, but not on a 4000lb Cadillac. I don't trust them, and I never will. Even when I pull my car into the shop after work to mess with it, I always position the end of the lift arms under the front and rear sub frame. Not doing so is like trying to lift a pickup truck via the floor pan.....it's just wrong.

Submariner409
06-18-07, 10:28 AM
:bigroll: Ollie8974, unless you know and trust the folks at your oil change store, I wouldn't let one touch my car or trucks. Too many horror stories of loose/incorrect filters, missing drain plugs, and oil filler caps bouncing down the highway at 65........
Ranger........ESP !! 'Twas my weekend saw project. Works like a champ, but my wife is mad as a hornet that I displaced some gardening tools to create storage space.........can't win :rolleyes: . (The 99-03 series has 4 pads, 2 behind the front tires, 2 in front of the rears, plus a couple of points on the engine cradle. Anyone who misses them doesn't give a hoot...)

mortison
06-18-07, 11:29 AM
No doubt! The inadequacies of jiffy-lube type technicians are what drove me to doing all of my own work. Besides, the more I work on my Deville the more amazed I am with the engineering/design of the thing. Reading the service manual is actually fairly entertaining!

wsolman
06-18-07, 04:55 PM
I have a pair of the 12000 lb gray Rhino Ramps and they work fine with my 95 STS. It doesn't rub at all driving up on them. Just make sure you throw a couple of jack stands under the subframe before you crawl under to start. They may say the ramps hold 12000 lbs., but they are made of plastic. Better safe than sorry!

codewize
06-18-07, 08:31 PM
That's even more dangerous than the cinder block idea


I always take my car to an oil change garage.

JimHare
06-18-07, 10:31 PM
I've used the plastic A/zone ramps for both cars to change oil and coolant. They work fine. And yeah, I second the notion of never working under a car held only by a jack or jack stands - they're for external work like changing tires and such, never for underneath work.

Mountie
06-19-07, 02:03 AM
Cardboard....... floor jack..... jack stands......an oil pan......a wrench...... wash your hands when you are done.

Or.....

Go to Jiffy Lube

JohnnyO
06-22-07, 12:06 PM
Ramps and a creeper, been doing it that way for 30 years...except on my 4x4's where I just need the creeper.
Don't do it like this guy:

http://paulaoffutt.com/pics/redneck/wood_jack.jpg