: Test drive review....02 Regal GS. AND, my worst dealership experience ever.



I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-02-07, 05:00 PM
For those who don't know, I was trying to narrow down my choices for my next car, between the '97-04 Regal GS, 98-02 Accord EX-V6, 00-03 Maxima and the 96-98 Tahoe two door/ Silverado. Anyways, I test drove a '02 GS today, liked the car, *hated* the dealership.


First, the car.

Exterior Design: 8/10:
http://images.autotrader.com/images/2007/3/27/219/849/1812105542.219849098.IM1.MAIN.565x421_A.562x421.jp g
http://images.autotrader.com/images/2007/3/27/219/849/1812105543.219849098.IM1.02.565x421_A.562x421.jpg

Regals are a handsome, if somewhat bland sedan. I really like the two tone paint scheme, and body color grille. But they look too much like the Century. Greater model differentiation would have been a huge help to the Reg's sales.



Interior Design: 7.5/10.
http://images.autotrader.com/images/2007/3/27/219/849/1812105546.219849098.IM1.05.565x421_A.562x421.jpg
The interior again, is somewhat bland, but unoffensive. Nothing that'll push people away because it's too "far out", but nothing that'll draw people in because it's just amazing. Pretty typical mid '90s GM design here.

It was very airy and open, I liked that. Loads of headroom and great visibility, pretty good amount of legroom in the front, mediocre legroom in the back. The guages are nothing exciting to look at, but easy to read. A quick glance is all that's needed to get the vitals. Otherwise, controls for the radio and HVAC are easy to reach and simple to use, but that's probably because I'm used to the way GM does things. Overall, build quality was decent, not as good as any of the Caddies I've driven, but better than my Roadmaster. There was abundant storage space too, at the bottom of the console; in front of the shifter and below the HVAC controls, loads of space in there, along with a cavernous space inside the floor console between the seats. Two cupholders in the center console up front, and two in the rear armrest. Very good.


Seating: 9.5/10.
http://images.autotrader.com/images/2007/3/27/219/849/1812105544.219849098.IM1.03.565x421_A.562x421.jpg

This is what I like in a seat. Cushy, comfy, conforming. Much like the older Caddy seats, you sink into them, not just sit on top of them, they conform to your body pretty well and hold you in pretty snugly. They were six way power and heated too, and although it was about 49* when I test drove it, I could feel it get hot on the higher setting, but not so much on the lower setting. I'm sure if I drove it when it was about twenty degrees cooler I could have felt it on L. The leather was of a very nice quality also, similar in feel and durability to Cadillac's Nuance leather, and far superior than the leather in my Roadmaster.


Engine: 9/10.

What hasn't been said about the 3800's reliability. It's unbeatable. No need to go into further depth there. The power is where I wanna delve into. It wasn't as fast as I'd expected. I was expecting it to be as fast as an L67 on the freeway. I was wrong. From a 60mph roll, I punched it twice, and it was quite a bit faster than my 4.9L, but that's to be expected. It felt like 9/10s of that '93 STS from a 60 mph roll. The main difference is with the L37, the power comes out of nowhere and comes at you hard and fast. It's startling actually. With the L67, the power is more linear, and the prime torque band is much wider. It never has the flat out acclerative rush that the L37 does, but it's got a much wider powerband and pulls much better at lower RPMs. That being said, I wish I brought my digital camera with me to videotape, but I forgot it in my car. :( Also, the engine was very quiet at speed, almost zero supercharger whine was heard at any speed, at any RPM.


Tranny: 9.5/10.
Great as always. I love GM's 4 speed trannys!

Steering: 8.5/10.
The steering was direct, but I wish it had the feel that the '93 STS's did, that steering was to die for. Anyways, the steering was tighter and more direct than my deVilles, but for some odd reason, it felt kinda fake and rubbery.


Suspension: 8.5/10.
Good suspension setup, luxury car smooth, but still gave good feedback as to what was happenin' below. It's nothing too sporty or harsh, like a Maxima or Grand Prix, where bumps are readily apparent, but not vague and floaty like that ETC I drove. I felt comfortable and confident driving this car aggressively.


Radio: 9/10.
Easy to use, came with an in dash CD player, great sounding, clear, Monsoon speakers.


Electronic Goodies: 8/10.
Had all of the stuff I have in my Cadillac, plus heated seats and a boost guage (loved that!). Although I kinda wish the trip computer had more information, it's just got the essentials, such as range, AVG MPG and boost PSI. Otherwise, this had a sunroof (really want one of those), automatic dimming inside and drivers side mirror, dual vanity mirrors, dual zone automatic climate control, etc etc. Like I said earlier, all of the luxury car features without the luxury car price.

Overall: 86/100.

I'd rock one of these anyday. All of the things I like about Cadillacs, plus a hell of a drivetrain inside a deceptively bland looking body. Awesome!

Highs:
-Drivetrain
-Power
-Luxury features
-Great seats

Lows:
-Somewhat bland interior/exterior design.
-Cheap interior materials

Verdict: 97% sure I'll be buying one of these next.




Part II: The dealer. Valley Buick Pontiac GMC in Hastings MN.


So I get to the dealer, drive around the lot to find the GS, park my car up front in a sport, walk around a bit then finally two of the younger salesguys greet me. I tell them I'm there, (just looking now mind you) to look at the '02 GS they have listed on the internet, one of them didn't know they had it, and the other told me where it was and to go look at it. After I walked off a bit, one of the salesguys followed me and introduced himself, then followed me to the car, then offered to let me drive it, by myself. He took my licence (which seems odd to me, usually they just make a copy of it and hand it back to you.

So I take the car out and come back and look at the car for a few minutes, while my sales associate is nowhere to be found. Then I get the idea that maybe he went inside for some reason, and I go in there and he's wandering the showroom with my licence in hand. When I met up with him again, I thanked him for letting me drive it, then told him something like I was just browsing at the time and not willing to buy now. Then he sits me down at his desk (again, I thought it was very odd and pushy) and starts taking down information about me, the deVille and has me fill out an application for GMAC credit!?!? (Hello! I told you I'm just browsing!) While I'm filling out the application, he takes my car keys and he and his manager appraise my car (ok???) Afterwords, he comes back with an appraisal of $1000, which is what I was expecting, but he won't give me back my keys!! It's like I'm imprisoned at a B/P/GMC dealer!? So now I'm getting uncomfortable, and frankly, pretty damn mad. I've never been treated like this at ANY dealership I've ever been to, and I've been to 15-20, doing the same thing, just browsing.

So he goes off somewhere, and I call my dad, telling him that they're trying to sell me the damn GS I just came in to check out. Dad gets angry, tells me to grab my keys and leave ASAP. As soon as the salesguy came back, I asked for my keys back, (he reluctantly gave 'em back a few minutes later), then remind him that I'm just browsing and not ready to buy for a few months. He says that's ok and makes small talk. He kept holding me around so I could talk to the finance guy about what my payments would look like. So FINALLY (after about 45 minutes of hanging around there) I get to talk to the finance guy. I tell him how I'm just browsing around and not ready to buy for a few months. He then said there's really no point to running my numbers because the car won't be there when I'm ready to buy. Then he left for a second (probably to have a talk with the salesguy) and came back and politely told me that it's not in my best interest to look at cars until I'm actually ready to buy. I agreed and left VERY quickly. I walked out of the showroom fairly fast, ripped open the door to my car, jumped in faster than I've ever done before, threw the car into Reverse (actually, in my rush I threw it into Neutral!) and peeled out in reverse! lol! I left thru the back entrance (to avoid the sales department) and probably did 10-15 over the speed limit my entire way home! lol! Well, atleast the drive home was exciting!


Does that experience with the sales department seem a little odd to anyone else? I mean I've been to 15-20 dealers just browsing at cars, and every other time, they'll let me drive it, then give me a business card and tell me to keep in touch.

Basically I learned to stay the hell away from the Valley Group of dealers, and not to look at cars until I'm ready to buy! After this whole debacle, I'm even second guessing buying from a dealer when the time comes!

Spyder
04-02-07, 05:23 PM
That sounds about like ANY dealer I've ever been to, with very few exceptions. :)

Jesda
04-02-07, 05:29 PM
LOL, what a tard.

As far as the GS, I wish the suspension was better able to prevent dive and squat. A car that quick should have stronger braking and sharper handling, otherwise I wouldnt mind having one at all.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-02-07, 05:44 PM
LOL, what a tard.

Yeah, what bugged me the most was the fact he didn't even ask if I was ready to go sit down and get serious, he just forced me into it, and it's not like I could have left, as he took my licence, than my keys and insurance info.



As far as the GS, I wish the suspension was better able to prevent dive and squat. A car that quick should have stronger braking and sharper handling, otherwise I wouldnt mind having one at all.

True, that suspension was a bit "Buicky" for all that power, it should have been firmer like that '93 STS, but then again, that would probably be too close to the GTP. Either way, it can be stiffened up with aftermarket parts.

Jonas McFeely
04-02-07, 05:59 PM
Sounds like any major dealer ive ever heard of or been to.The smaller lots wont do that to you.

RightTurn
04-02-07, 06:00 PM
That key thing happened to me in a Nissan dealer once. I showed my butt so bad on the showroom floor that they REALLY regretted pulling that "take the keys" trick, lol. I'm not exaggerating when I say I was SCREAMING "GIVE ME MY EFFING KEYS NOW!!"

Still pisses me off just remembering. :grrrrrr:

gdwriter
04-02-07, 06:29 PM
That key thing happened to me in a Nissan dealer once. I showed my butt so bad on the showroom floor that they REALLY regretted pulling that "take the keys" trick, lol. I'm not exaggerating when I say I was SCREAMING "GIVE ME MY EFFING KEYS NOW!!"So, does this mean you mooned the place, RT?

But you're right. I've found that making a scene in a car dealership—which I once had to do, yelling "your salesman is a liar!" at the top of my voice—will do the trick. And I'm loud. Very loud.

gdwriter
04-02-07, 06:29 PM
Whoops. Double post.

RightTurn
04-02-07, 06:40 PM
So, does this mean you mooned the place, RT?


No, but I did lose my ladylike demeanor. :lol: Didn't buy a damn Nissan either. :thepan:

gary88
04-02-07, 07:20 PM
When I test drove that G35 the salesman did basically everything you just explained. Except he was nice and polite in general, and asked for my keys, so it wasn't too bad. Talked about financing and everything. He was only 20 so he wasn't really an ass. The only thing on a car salesman's mind is "Gotta make the sale, gotta make the sale, commission commission commission commi$$ion."

Though if I did choose to buy it right there they would have taken my car for $14k :eek:

c5 rv
04-02-07, 08:01 PM
Yep, that's very common at most dealerships. You need to take control of the transaction. As far as I'm concerned, the sales person and dealership are there to provide me a service: provide me with a vehicle I want at the price I want to pay. (Yeah, I know, they have another view of their job - sell me a car for the maximum amount I will accept.) Some suggestions:

- Expect them to want your name, address, phone number, and a copy of your license. Do not leave for a test drive until they have returned your license.

- If you are interested in having the dealer appraise your trade in, ask if they can do it while you are on a test drive - 20 minutes, because you are tight on time. If they can't meet your time constraint, keep your keys in your pocket or ask for them back as soon as you return from the test drive.

- If you don't want them to appraise your car, say so and keep your keys in your pocket.

- If the sales person wants to go along on the test drive, let them. It's no big deal. Some dealerships like to do this to try to build a relationship and find out what you like. They do this less and less for security reasons. Someone stealing a car on a test drive is a lot less bad press and problems than a sales person being carjacked.

- Be friendly to the salesperson. Be open to their suggestions of other vehicles, but remember, the decision is yours. A good relationship with a honest sales person is worthwhile. Recently my Caddy salesperson called me when they had a nice STS demo they wanted to sell.

- If they want to take a routine finance app, say no thank you, you are a credit union member and prefer to use that financing. I've heard that a number of dealers running a credit check can cost you a few points on your credit score. When you are ready to buy, go ahead and put in a credit app along with applying at your credit union. Sometimes they find cheaper financing - but be very careful to understand the loan / lease they offer.

There are a lot of dealers. Find a few that will work with you the way you want to and give them your business. Ignore the others.

mharker
04-02-07, 09:45 PM
Ha... that brings back memories. When I was 20 I worked at a VW dealer for about six months.

They used to insist we get the keys to the trade-in so the manager could "appraise" it and they would send me back downstairs time after time with counter offers... and saying "oops I forgot your keys". Truth was all we did on the trade-ins was check the black book. Nobody ever really appraised the cars!

My advice on that scam... when they ask for they keys tell them "keys are in the ignition. go help yourself!". In the unlikely event they actually check then YOU can say sorry gee I forgot to leave them in.

I've only ever bought two brand-new vehicles. Both times I faxed in a friendly letter with a reasonable offer, with a 24 hour deadline. Both times first dealer accepted and I never went into the dealership until it was time to pick up the car.

Act like a businessman and they will treat you with more respect.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-02-07, 10:09 PM
Well first of all, thanks for the advice, it'll really come in handy when I'm actually ready to buy!

Secondly, this "high pressure" sales approach I encountered today still seems odd to me. I've test driven cars at many, many dealers before, new car lots, used car lots, from many different families of dealers and never have encountered this before. Maybe this system is on it's way out in MN??

Sandy
04-02-07, 11:27 PM
As someone who sold cars for 29 years, here are my comments.

What the salesman did worng:
Taking your driver's license & sending you out w/out it. BIG BIG WRONG
Running a credit check on you, that early in the game.

Everything else he did was correct.

Further explanation.

You stated that you were "just looking" and were not ready to buy.
They at the dealership KNOW that there's a better than 90% chance
that when you are ready, that Buick will be looong gone. So, why then even send you out in it ?? That's like looking in a bakery for cookies that you'll be buying next month!

If you are not ready to get serious, look on Sunday, when they are closed. IF by chance you see something that make your hot with passion, then come back when they are open.

When you are "ready" to buy, you tell your salesperson that you are ready to buy, if they give you a bonafide good deal. It's the crap or got off the pot, exercise.

Never let them take a credit check on you. You'll ALWAYS do better at a bank, a savings & loan, BTW. Buy your car at the dealer and buy your money at the bank ! More better 4-U.

All day long people come in and do zactly what you did, for lack for understanding.

"I am not ready to buy - but I'd like to drive that Buick"

Salesman thinks, that car is going to auction in 7 days, & he's allready told me he's "Not rready to buy" ~ Why the H should I expose that car to danger when he's allready told me he's not ready, and the car's had its 22 days on the lot & is on 3rd base to the auction. So, don't say that.

Never give up YOUR keys at the first visit. Never let them keep your license, but if if if you are going out on a demo ride (ALONE OR NOT) it's the law that they photocopy your license.

Visit a bank, this week. Sit down with a rep of the bank. Talk turkey over your finances. SEE if you can comfortably afford that car. If so, and If you want it, return and make an offer (reasonable) and if accepted, give a credit card deposit (never $$ or check) and go fetch the loan.
Understand that there will be a Doc Fee on the sales order. More than $90.00 & you'll have to say no, and stand firm. There should be no ther charges other than sales tax & Doc.

Getting nasty, abusive will make you look "cheap" and is not a plan. When people got nasty / abusive with me, I walked from them. Later I came back & told them that they need to treat me as they do their Dentist or their accountant, or they can leave ! (and ) meant it. You cannot buy a car once every 5 years, and beat the guy that sells 5 every 2 days. Be nice, and in return - recognize siht and walk. The door is ALWAYS your best pal.
Good luck. PS/ Write on the order that it is pending your securing your loan at the institution of YOUR choice.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-02-07, 11:35 PM
Thanks Sandy, I was waiting for your input on this situation, I knew it would be good!

I was getting quite angry there, but instead of making a big scene and demanding my keys back I just waited it out until I got the numbers (which I never did) then left the showfloor quietly and calmly. All hell broke loose though when I got into the car. I was rippin' thru that parking lot like an F-5 thru Witchita! Haha! I can honestly say that when I'm ready to buy, which won't be for quite a while, I hope they do not have anything I like in stock there. I do not want to have any reason to return.

mharker
04-03-07, 10:02 AM
Hey Sandy that's some great advice.

As an insider, what do you think of my method of faxing in a nice letter with a reasonable offer? Basically I tell them you are my favorite dealer in the area and I'm willing to pay $xxx for a certain model. And if I don't hear back by tomorrow end of day I'll move on to my 2nd favorite dealer.

I make sure the offer is reasonable... not too much of a low ball. To me there is no sense hammering a guy down to the last penny and make him accept just so the next dealer doesn't get the deal. You need to have at least some rapport in case there are problems with your car!

On both my 2002 MPV and 2006 Sienna it worked very well. Got a decent price and I saved tons of time. They called back immediately, faxed me the bill of sale, and I never had to go in until it was time to pick up the car.

So do dealers like customers like me or do they see me as an arrogant SOB?

Destroyer
04-03-07, 12:45 PM
Not trying to knock you Chad but they are there to sell cars, its how they feed their families. Now you've been test driving cars for years and not buying, so in reality you are wasting their time. You are a car guy and you like to just drive the cars and have no intent of buying at this time. I only go car shopping if I have the intent to buy, otherwise I just browse the internet. As car guys we have a pretty good idea what most cars drive like, so whats the point?. You get set on 1 or 2 cars then a few months later you are set on totally different cars. GTA or Lightning?, Accord/Maxima?, Cadillac or??????. You know what I mean, I'm the same way too. When you have the cash you will drive a few cars and make the deal at that time.

Jesda
04-03-07, 12:57 PM
A professional salesperson presents the product and treats the customer with respect. A sleaze swipes keys and drags people into uncomfortable situations.

Big difference when you deal with a Lexus salesperson and a Buick salesperson. The Buick guy acts desperate and pushy.


Doc fees are BS. NEVER ACCEPT DOC FEES. NOT EVEN A DOLLAR.

Caddy Man
04-03-07, 01:09 PM
Not trying to knock you Chad but they are there to sell cars, its how they feed their families. Now you've been test driving cars for years and not buying, so in reality you are wasting their time. You are a car guy and you like to just drive the cars and have no intent of buying at this time. I only go car shopping if I have the intent to buy, otherwise I just browse the internet. As car guys we have a pretty good idea what most cars drive like, so whats the point?. You get set on 1 or 2 cars then a few months later you are set on totally different cars. GTA or Lightning?, Accord/Maxima?, Cadillac or??????. You know what I mean, I'm the same way too. When you have the cash you will drive a few cars and make the deal at that time.

I dont post much...but I do read every post here, and I agree with the above statement.

Jonas McFeely
04-03-07, 01:34 PM
I dont post much...but I do read every post here, and I agree with the above statement.

I second that.

mharker
04-03-07, 01:36 PM
I dont post much...but I do read every post here, and I agree with the above statement.

Hey Caddy Man I love that line. Gives your statement lots of extra weight!

Another tip: if you're a car guy and you want to try cars, just rent 'em from time to time. It doesn't really cost that much.

One time we thought it would be cool to own a Volvo wagon instead of our minivan. Rented it for 10 days on a vacation, had fun, and it's out of my system now. A lot cheaper than buying one!

Also rented a Hemi Dodge Magnum in Florida. Used to think it would be fun to get a Hemi 300 but now I've experienced one like it so I'm good. BTW those things use a ton of fuel... and that's coming from a gas guzzler owner.

Caddy Man
04-03-07, 03:03 PM
Hey Caddy Man I love that line. Gives your statement lots of extra weight!

Another tip: if you're a car guy and you want to try cars, just rent 'em from time to time. It doesn't really cost that much.

One time we thought it would be cool to own a Volvo wagon instead of our minivan. Rented it for 10 days on a vacation, had fun, and it's out of my system now. A lot cheaper than buying one!

Also rented a Hemi Dodge Magnum in Florida. Used to think it would be fun to get a Hemi 300 but now I've experienced one like it so I'm good. BTW those things use a ton of fuel... and that's coming from a gas guzzler owner.

That is a good option. One of the Caddy dealers here who give loaners, allow on certain days and certain weekends heavily discounted rates for peopel who just want to ''test drive'' a differnt vehicle. They carry Escalades, SRXs, CTSs, STS, and DTS. The rental idea dosnt seem too bad, although I realize many of the cars you do look at are not available as rent.

I personally just hate going to dealerships and wasting their time. In that time they help me look at something I wont buy, they could have lost a sale.

Wiseguy2
04-03-07, 04:25 PM
Chad,

Do not buy a car from them if they aren't going to treat you with respect. As someone who was/is/etc a dealer, nobody hates this kind of crap more than I do.

By doing business with them you are rewarding that behavior, don't do it.

Bill

Jesda
04-03-07, 04:43 PM
When I go to a dealership, I tell them I'm really just looking, because I really am just looking. [I almost never, ever buy from dealerships.] They grab the keys for me anyway. "Its nice out. Just drive it and tell me what you think."

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-03-07, 06:58 PM
When I go to a dealership, I tell them I'm really just looking, because I really am just looking. [I almost never, ever buy from dealerships.] They grab the keys for me anyway. "Its nice out. Just drive it and tell me what you think."

Except for yesterday, that's the experience I've gotten every time.


Not trying to knock you Chad but they are there to sell cars, its how they feed their families. Now you've been test driving cars for years and not buying, so in reality you are wasting their time. You are a car guy and you like to just drive the cars and have no intent of buying at this time. I only go car shopping if I have the intent to buy, otherwise I just browse the internet. As car guys we have a pretty good idea what most cars drive like, so whats the point?. You get set on 1 or 2 cars then a few months later you are set on totally different cars. GTA or Lightning?, Accord/Maxima?, Cadillac or??????. You know what I mean, I'm the same way too. When you have the cash you will drive a few cars and make the deal at that time.

This treatment isn't normal to me. Like I've said before, I've been to all sorts of different dealers before (big new car lots, small used car lots, family owned lots, lots that are part of a big group, etc etc) and have never been treated like this. And it's not like I'm the only one who goes and just browses, a lot of people do it. It's their job to be of help to people looking for cars, and if that person buys, great! Because at least, if they leave a good impression when you're just browsing, the chances of you coming back and looking there when you're ready to buy is improved. Now I was so pissed off by this experience, I will not go back to that dealer, nor any of the other dealers in the Valley group.

gdwriter
04-03-07, 11:59 PM
By doing business with them you are rewarding that behavior, don't do it.I second that.

illumina
04-04-07, 12:43 AM
Yeah man, I'd leave them in a heartbeat. The place I bought my Buick from was ran by a bunch of guys that I would watch football with. I'm not real sure if that was their strategy or not, but the point is, I felt comfortable with the people I was dealing with.

pabstcadillac
04-04-07, 12:55 AM
Not trying to knock you Chad but they are there to sell cars, its how they feed their families. Now you've been test driving cars for years and not buying, so in reality you are wasting their time. You are a car guy and you like to just drive the cars and have no intent of buying at this time. I only go car shopping if I have the intent to buy, otherwise I just browse the internet. As car guys we have a pretty good idea what most cars drive like, so whats the point?. You get set on 1 or 2 cars then a few months later you are set on totally different cars. GTA or Lightning?, Accord/Maxima?, Cadillac or??????. You know what I mean, I'm the same way too. When you have the cash you will drive a few cars and make the deal at that time.

QFT. :alchi:

Keep in mind you also went on to their lot, not yours. They didn't bring the car to you. Their house their rules. It's no different than when I go into Nordstroms to buy suits & I'm only allowed three in the room at a time. Their store, their rules. Could this have been handled better? Most certainly, but at the same time if you would have never gone there to kill time it wouldn't have happened in the first place. :2cents: :alchi:

97DevilleBeige
04-04-07, 01:09 AM
Working in sales, I've noticed about 70% of the sales I close start off as "just looking." Customers just say that because they don't want to be bothered and want to look around to get an idea of what they want. The hardest part is breaking the initial coldness from a customer and finding out if they are serious or not. Once I find out their intentions, I know whether to hover over them or back off and stand within an earshot.

If the customers said "I'm just getting ideas today, I'm going to come back with my wife" or "I'm getting my brakes done down the street, I'm just killing time", or "Let me look around, I'll grab you when I'm ready", right when they are first approached by a salesperson, the salesperson knows what the deal is, backs off the customer, and the customer has some breathing room and isn't harrassed to try and get help they don't want/need.

When we hear "just looking," we think that this is going to be a sale, and won't back off till a customer says what their intentions are. Even though we are told the words "just looking," we act like you are definitely going to buy today until we get some sort of dose of reality.

BTW, anybody need appliances in long island? hehe.


My mom once bought a car from a jeep dealership and DAMN did they seriously try to rip her off. They agreed to a price on the car, then the "business manager" said that she had to "buy down" her interest rate by purchasing almost $10,000 of aftermarket alarms, lojacks, vin etchings, etc. "so the banks know you will take car of your car." I was with her when we were picking it up and discovered all those charges so before signing the financing I asked that they remove it. We went back into the "business managers" office and he actually yelled at us at the top of his lungs for questioning him. I was like wtf? are you serious? This may work on some people, but not on us, and walked out. Then the real manager came out and did his whole thing. He actually used a trick that I was impressed with. Everytime we were telling him all the bad stuff that he tried on us, he just held his finger out like "wait a minute" and pretended that he was going to sneeze. It was better than interupting us and telling us to "shut up I'm trying to fix the problem". We ended up buying the car, but I regret it to this day because of what they tried. The first thing we did when we got home was remove their license plate advertising frames as not to support them beyond the purchase. When I was buying my Cadillac from a Cadillac dealership, boy was I surprised. I was expecting all of these games and I got NONE of it. It was a great experience from begining to end.

Destroyer
04-04-07, 05:47 AM
Once they sat him down, took his keys and had him fill out a credit app, they thought they baited him in. Little did they know.:bouncy:

Sandy
04-04-07, 07:18 AM
People will almost always have a better experience, be treated as they want to be treated, have better service after the purchase and an all around better experience at a small dealership, preferably THE smallest dealership they can find, selling the brand of car they THINK they want.

You see those mega, full page ads in the newspaper, day in & day out? You see the 100 employees working there? You see the 200 new cars on the ground? You see the 200 used cars out there? You see their insurance & liability costs?

Do you have even the slightest idea what THAT all costs ?? NO, you don't have a clue !! Who pays for all of that ? The Red Cross ? The Better Business Bureau ? NOPE - - THE customers do !

Stay the heck off the highways, and out of the MEGA stores, stay "in town" at the local family owned since 1952 type of dealership.

How do they stay in business against the big guns on the highway ?
They do it with friendly service, good service, good public relations, fair & proper sales in the showroom and by not ripping people off.

Now, where DO YOU wanna spend your money ?

Don't waste a saleman's turn, by going in to "kill time"

I had that happen to me weekly, bit this one time, this one time, I was so wicked mad, that I really went overboard and really got even + 110%.

Remember, it's a store, NOT a library. Browse on Sunday, buy on Monday.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-04-07, 09:08 AM
Well either way, I'm done test driving cars until I'm ready to buy. And I'm in no rush what so ever to buy a new car, as I still like mine a lot, heck, I might even fix up my front end!

pabstcadillac
04-04-07, 06:53 PM
Remember, it's a store, NOT a library. Browse on Sunday, buy on Monday.

Well said, simple & to the point.


Well either way, I'm done test driving cars until I'm ready to buy. And I'm in no rush what so ever to buy a new car, as I still like mine a lot, heck, I might even fix up my front end!

I'm glad you've given up stroking sales people, but in the minds of a lot of sales people, in any field, you just justified the sales persons actions with this post. She/he didn't lose a sale or even the chance at one so no love lost on his/her end.

As Sandy touched on, treat others as you want to be treated. Plain and simple. I've been in several fields of sales over the last 7 years & ALL of my bosses will tell you the same thing, they have never had more calls, letters & e-mails about any 1 sales person. My clients (People who have bought or had the intention of buying) love me. People who were wasting my time I have no tolerance for & I let them know it, having said that I also deal with the repercussions. :alchi:

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-04-07, 07:03 PM
I sure hope I can buy what I want from a private seller and bypass all the dealership bullshit. Funny words coming from someone who works in one, but in the good side...service!

Jesda
04-04-07, 07:39 PM
You're supposed to thoroughly show the customer the product, regardless of whether you're making a sale. It reflects poorly on GM or whomever the franchise is if you treat both paying and browsing customers like drooling opportunities.

The salesman has NO RIGHT to get aggressive or upset. When you walk into a commission-paid store, you can browse and demo the product without buying. How the hell do you know whether or not you like a car if you can't farking drive it?

GM sends brochures to people knowing that they won't be making a purchase for another 4-6 months. They even encourage folks to take test drives immediately. Doesn't mean anyone will be making a purchase TODAY.

Thats the other problem with car salesmen. They're in stuck in the "what can I do to get you into this car now?" mentality. Makes the entire field look bad, and its why Saturn buyers are so intensely loyal to otherwise crappy cars.

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-04-07, 07:44 PM
Thats the other problem with car salesmen. They're in stuck in the "what can I do to get you into this car now?" mentality. Makes the entire field look bad, and its why Saturn buyers are so intensely loyal to otherwise crappy cars.


LMAO!!!!




Car salespeople: does it piss you off when people come in just to grab brochures and nothing more? I used to do that a TON!

pabstcadillac
04-04-07, 07:57 PM
You're supposed to thoroughly show the customer the product, regardless of whether you're making a sale. It reflects poorly on GM or whomever the franchise is if you treat both paying and browsing customers like drooling opportunities.

The salesman has NO RIGHT to get aggressive or upset. When you walk into a commission-paid store, you can browse and demo the product without buying. How the hell do you know whether or not you like a car if you can't farking drive it?

GM sends brochures to people knowing that they won't be making a purchase for another 4-6 months. They even encourage folks to take test drives immediately. Doesn't mean anyone will be making a purchase TODAY.

Thats the other problem with car salesmen. They're in stuck in the "what can I do to get you into this car now?" mentality. Makes the entire field look bad, and its why Saturn buyers are so intensely loyal to otherwise crappy cars.

I whole heartedly disagree with a lot of what is in this post, but do agree with parts. I do think that if we went back to the original post, the sales person was wrong in this case, but there are times where I can see calling people out.

A quick example goes back to when I was in medical in Minnesota & I was at $3 & change per PT test. A hospital said they had a quote for $1 & change from Florida. I flat out said "Take it, that's a great deal." Well long story short that company had a 6mo. back order & the client came back to me wanting to know if I'd match their price. I said "No, the price is now $5." They kicked & screamed over this. I responded "When I'm on b.o. I'll sell them to you for $.75." Ultimately it's all business, GM does know this. Service is a part of business, but so is making money. With first keeping the books in the black you can't keep the lights on, the employees paid & most importantly provide quality service. FREE FREE FREE, EVERYBODY WANTS SOMETHING FOR FREE! Well there is no such thing a free lunch.

Having said that you are entitled to your opinion & I respect that. I know we won't end up agreeing on this & that is fine. (Again this goes for sales in any field, not just cars.):alchi:

Sandy
04-04-07, 08:43 PM
somebody mentioned Saturn. Let me tell you about Saturn.

Saturns require NO price dickering. Saturns sell AT MSRLP.
The price on the window IS the price the consumer pays, so....
there is NO "price selling". When a Saturn is sold, the Gross prifit is
around $ 1,800 PROFIT. The people pay it. Other brands such as
Buick, Chevy, Ford, Dodge, Chrysler, etc struggle to get a $ 400 profit
on a car that sometimes costs twice as much, as that Saturn.

At a minimum of $ 1,800 per car PROFIT, the Saturn dealership
has a relaxed atmosphere, with no "funny business. You buy it as you
would a men's shirt at Target.

So, my point is, that Saturn is an item that cannot be compared.

For all the rest, jump into a showroom and grab a brouchure on the car
you think you want. Do it at 8AM before the staff arrives. Take it home.
LEARN ABOUT THE CAR, make a list of the options YOU want, and
then PRICE IT OUT on http://www.kbb.com and see what dealer's cost is.
Add $500.00 profit & go in with check book in hand. Present your offer, and stat that you are ready to buy. If they don't accept your offer...LEAVE, and leave behind your Tele #. This is called "Cut to the chase"
It's really easier than you think - as I said find that small dealership, stay off the hiighway and outta the MEGA stores, and you'll have a painless experience. Really....We salesman want an easy sale, we do not want arguments. The business is hard enough.

pabstcadillac
04-04-07, 08:59 PM
somebody mentioned Saturn. Let me tell you about Saturn.

Saturns require NO price dickering. Saturns sell AT MSRLP.
The price on the window IS the price the consumer pays, so....
there is NO "price selling". When a Saturn is sold, the Gross prifit is
around $ 1,800 PROFIT. The people pay it. Other brands such as
Buick, Chevy, Ford, Dodge, Chrysler, etc struggle to get a $ 400 profit
on a car that sometimes costs twice as much, as that Saturn.

At a minimum of $ 1,800 per car PROFIT, the Saturn dealership
has a relaxed atmosphere, with no "funny business. You buy it as you
would a men's shirt at Target.

So, my point is, that Saturn is an item that cannot be compared.

For all the rest, jump into a showroom and grab a brouchure on the car
you think you want. Do it at 8AM before the staff arrives. Take it home.
LEARN ABOUT THE CAR, make a list of the options YOU want, and
then PRICE IT OUT on http://www.kbb.com and see what dealer's cost is.
Add $500.00 profit & go in with check book in hand. Present your offer, and stat that you are ready to buy. If they don't accept your offer...LEAVE, and leave behind your Tele #. This is called "Cut to the chase"
It's really easier than you think - as I said find that small dealership, stay off the hiighway and outta the MEGA stores, and you'll have a painless experience. Really....We salesman want an easy sale, we do not want arguments. The business is hard enough.

Sooooo loving you right now for so many reasons. I think I might order a pizza tonight & when it gets here gets here offer $9 instead of the $14 that I have a coupon for. Or tomorrow I'm going to call a travel agent & ask about a 3 week tour of Fiji & the South Pacific, when the reality is I'm going to end up seeing Mount Rushmore. Better yet, I'm going to have a real estate agent take me to multi-million dollar homes on my day off so I can see how the truly wealthy live. I think that would be neat.

It's not just car sales, how do you think any person would act in any of these circumstances. They would be less than thrilled to deal with you. :2cents: :alchi:

I~LUV~Caddys8792
04-04-07, 09:18 PM
Sandy, I got another question for you regarding Saturn:

How come you never see "So and so's Saturn" It's always Saturn of a city. For example, Saturn of St. Paul, or Saturn of Inver Grove Heights, never "Lupient Saturn" or "Denny Hecker's Saturn"?

Spyder
04-05-07, 12:14 AM
Excellent question that I've never noticed till now...Hmmmm...

Sandy
04-05-07, 08:09 AM
Sandy, I got another question for you regarding Saturn:

How come you never see "So and so's Saturn" It's always Saturn of a city. For example, Saturn of St. Paul, or Saturn of Inver Grove Heights, never "Lupient Saturn" or "Denny Hecker's Saturn"?

CHAD, I WOULD TEND TO BELIEVE THAT IS SPELLED OUT IN THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, FOR MANY REASONS. THERE IS ALOT OF BIGOTRY IN THIS COUNTRY. NAMES LIKE CUSAMANO'S SATURN, O'CONNELL'S SATURN, LEFKOWITZ SATURN, LU CHEN'S SATURN COULD TURN BIGOTS OFF. BY NAMING THE DEALERSHIP AFTER THE TOWN IT IS LOCATED IN, IT ALSO TELLS THE PERSON WHERE IT'S AT. SATURN OF ANYTOWN, SATURN OF YOUR CITY, ... SEE ? ACTAULLY, IT'S A VERY GOOD IDEA. IT CAN'T HURT AND IT CAN ONLY HELP, PIN POINT THE LOCATION FOR THE TIRE KICKER....oops, PERSPECTIVE CLIENT, (I am learning how to be "politically correct" .....)

Saturn of Center City
>>>>> VS <<<<<
Naming it Irving Schwartstein's Saturn ......

Sure, Irving Schwartstein is the owner, but
does he really want HIS name "out there" ~

Sandy
04-05-07, 08:33 AM
Following up, on a personal story.
THE Dodge dealership that I was associated with for "only" 18 years was jointly owned by a Roman Catholic Italian man and a Jewish man. Somtimes, a buyer would be interested in who owns the dealership. Since we were located in an area that was heavily populated with both Jewish & Italian citizens, when a customer asked, I'd go into the back office (bowels of the beast) and seek out the Italian Owner or the Jewish owner and bring forth the "Correct" one, that matched the buyer ! Somehow, folks like to "deal with" one of their own, so that was beneficial and both had very good personalties and could really turn ON the charm. It closed many a deal for me. (Of course, had I been the owner, they would ONLY have had to meet ME, as I am BOTH! Italian by nationality and Jewish by religion.)
Pizza on Matzoh, anyone ?