: Torque Converter Stall for STS



dloch
03-20-04, 08:44 PM
Who out there has changed there torque converter? If so what stall did you use?? Did you see and adverse effects?

I will be swaping motors in the future and I am also going to change my torque converter as well as I believe this is going to give me the best bang for the buck with regards to performance increases.

My concern is getting too high of a stall and having the computer think think the trans is slipping. Anyone have any problems in that area?

Anthony Cipriano.... any ideas to pass along????

Dennis

Anthony Cipriano
03-21-04, 12:32 AM
Who out there has changed there torque converter? If so what stall did you use?? Did you see and adverse effects?

I will be swaping motors in the future and I am also going to change my torque converter as well as I believe this is going to give me the best bang for the buck with regards to performance increases.

My concern is getting too high of a stall and having the computer think think the trans is slipping. Anyone have any problems in that area?

Anthony Cipriano.... any ideas to pass along????

Dennis

I would want a 3000 to 3500 stall speed converter. The downside is the extra slippage when the torque converter clutch is not applying which adds heat to the system. It'll be fine in normal driving as long as you don't drive it so as to hold it in the stall speed a lot or continuously ie. keep the RPM up when pulling long hills and you won't be able to tow anything. Gas mileage will suffer some but the performance gain off the line is amazing you'll find - which will help offset the frown. The PCM will not notice any problem with the extra stall speed. It only looks at "slippage" when the torque converter clutch is applied. Make sure the converter that you have made retains the torque converter clutch and if you really want to make it HD have them put a TCC in instead of the VCC unit.

dloch
03-21-04, 06:52 PM
I would want a 3000 to 3500 stall speed converter. The downside is the extra slippage when the torque converter clutch is not applying which adds heat to the system. It'll be fine in normal driving as long as you don't drive it so as to hold it in the stall speed a lot or continuously ie. keep the RPM up when pulling long hills and you won't be able to tow anything. Gas mileage will suffer some but the performance gain off the line is amazing you'll find - which will help offset the frown. The PCM will not notice any problem with the extra stall speed. It only looks at "slippage" when the torque converter clutch is applied. Make sure the converter that you have made retains the torque converter clutch and if you really want to make it HD have them put a TCC in instead of the VCC unit.
I am going to do this myself when I have the engine out and my intention was to retain the torque converter clutch. What is the difference between TCC and VCC? I have seen where you have recommended a Yank, are they still high on your list? As for the additional heat generated, I won't be towing anything and I can add an addtional trans cooler after the Rad cooler.

Thanks

Anthony Cipriano
03-21-04, 09:45 PM
I am going to do this myself when I have the engine out and my intention was to retain the torque converter clutch. What is the difference between TCC and VCC? I have seen where you have recommended a Yank, are they still high on your list? As for the additional heat generated, I won't be towing anything and I can add an addtional trans cooler after the Rad cooler.

Thanks


Yank is an excellent source. They're very familiar with GM and Cadillac torque converters for the 4T80E. Yank actually made a lot of the torque converters for the Hydramatic Motorsports program with drag racing and off road truck racing support so they are well connected.

TCC is the mechanical torque converter clutch that locks up the torque converter. VCC is basically the same but substitutes a viscous coupling instead of the solid clutch disc of the TCC. The VCC is good for driveability as it constantly creeps/slips and thus eliminates the chuggle normally associated with lock up converters in FWD cars. The TCC will not generate any heat when it is locked and has more torque capacity. For a hot rod application it would be more desireable.

The auxilary air-to-oil transmission cooler would be a good idea. It would also be a good idea to change the trans fluid occasionally with the high stall converter. The converter will generate higher temps locally inside the torque converter when it slips more so the transmission fluid will see some higher local temps and will oxidize a little quicker. Nothing to be too alarmed about - just keep it in mind and don't expect it to go 100,00 miles like normal.

DarrellM
03-22-04, 07:10 PM
How does one get in contact with yank? Do they have a website?
I know of another source for converters. There name is Protorqe. I have used there 125C converters. They seem to be pretty knowlagable, At least to a dummy like me :D Thanks for the great info on the differences in the converter clutches, Darrell Morse (Northstar in Fiero project)

Aurora40
03-22-04, 07:25 PM
How does one get in contact with yank? Do they have a website?
I know of another source for converters. There name is Protorqe. I have used there 125C converters. They seem to be pretty knowlagable, At least to a dummy like me :D Thanks for the great info on the differences in the converter clutches, Darrell Morse (Northstar in Fiero project)
I think this is their website: http://members.aol.com/yankconvt/home.htm

Anthony Cipriano
03-22-04, 08:03 PM
You can get ahold of Yank Converters at 501-632-6355

Another good source for a higher stall torque converter is SAE - Stoney Automotive Engineering 517-655-5114 Gordon Stoney is a retired Hydramatic engineer that builds specialty transmissions and torque converters and is the manager/owner of SAE.

dloch
03-23-04, 04:33 PM
You can get ahold of Yank Converters at 501-632-6355

Another good source for a higher stall torque converter is SAE - Stoney Automotive Engineering 517-655-5114 Gordon Stoney is a retired Hydramatic engineer that builds specialty transmissions and torque converters and is the manager/owner of SAE.
So Gordon can make the same converter, or a 3000 - 3500 TCC converter locally then?

Anthony Cipriano
03-23-04, 11:05 PM
So Gordon can make the same converter, or a 3000 - 3500 TCC converter locally then?

Yes, he can or can recommend a shop that does converters to his specs. He works with Coan Converters a lot I think so he may have them do it. You'll have to talk to him about it. The main thing is his personal knowlege of what needs to be done to get the stall speed up and keep the converter efficient. There are a lot of hack high stall converters that the shops just bend the fins inside the converter or even weld in flow restrictor plates and such. Bad news. Stoney can put the correct pump/turbine/startor parts together to get the stall speeds desired so the conveter is still reasonably efficient - so can Yank. At one time I know Yank did all their converters in-house and had a torque converter dyno to test each converter. I know if I needed a torque converter I would trust either one of them to make one.

dloch
03-24-04, 10:07 AM
Yes, he can or can recommend a shop that does converters to his specs. He works with Coan Converters a lot I think so he may have them do it. You'll have to talk to him about it. The main thing is his personal knowlege of what needs to be done to get the stall speed up and keep the converter efficient. There are a lot of hack high stall converters that the shops just bend the fins inside the converter or even weld in flow restrictor plates and such. Bad news. Stoney can put the correct pump/turbine/startor parts together to get the stall speeds desired so the conveter is still reasonably efficient - so can Yank. At one time I know Yank did all their converters in-house and had a torque converter dyno to test each converter. I know if I needed a torque converter I would trust either one of them to make one.

I will give Stoney a call when I get to that part of this project. I may even know him from the converter and PWM R & D work I did with powertrain years ago.

Anthony Cipriano
03-24-04, 10:41 AM
I will give Stoney a call when I get to that part of this project. I may even know him from the converter and PWM R & D work I did with powertrain years ago.

Yes. He's very knowlegeable to say the least! If he can't make the converter he can certainly tell you exactly what you want.

dloch
04-06-04, 05:17 PM
The correct phone number for Yank is 479-632-6355. Still trying to get through..... they are obviously quite busy.