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Cadillac ELR Forum Discussion, off to bad rep all ready? in Current Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; Looks awesome, but is non-start all ready? General Motors (NYSE: GM) will build a Cadillac fueled by electricity. And it ...
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    smooth_ride is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    off to bad rep all ready?

    Looks awesome, but is non-start all ready?

    General Motors (NYSE: GM) will build a Cadillac fueled by electricity. And it will be added to a long line of new electric-powered models that are unlikely to have many buyers.

    The world’s largest car company announced that “The Cadillac ELR will feature an electric propulsion system made up of a T-shaped lithium ion battery, an electric drive unit, and a four-cylinder engine-generator. It uses electricity as its primary source to drive the car without using gasoline or producing tailpipe emissions. When the battery’s energy is low, the ELR seamlessly switches to extended-range mode to enable driving for hundreds of additional miles.”

    GM’s first electric-powered car — the Chevy Volt — has been a failure. Only 125 were sold in July. Recent research on inventory indicates that most dealers have the car in stock. The electric-powered car market is tiny, primarily because alternative products are more popular and practical.

    Volkswagen has advanced the cause of clean diesel engines in the U.S. These vehicles get nearly 50 MPG and the technology behind them eliminates nearly 90% of the sooty emissions associated with earlier diesel-powered cars.

    Read more http://247wallst.com/2011/08/18/an-e...ne-will-drive/

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    Chief1993 is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Just my opinion, but i dont think america is ready for electric vehicles in this day and age.. I know i would have a difficult time switching from a V8 to an electric engine, car would have no pick up to it...

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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    [First post to forum}
    Hello!

    I own a Caddy CTS and back in Sept purchased a '12 Chevy Volt. The CTS is going up on the selling block now that I'm hooked on the Voltec technology (I was keeping the CTS as a backup if I didn't like the Volt, which I absolutely love btw!). My plan is to purchase a Caddy ELR when available and hand down my Volt to my g/f who currently has a BMW with terrible shift points. Now driving the Volt I cannot deal with any lag in the shift points so yes I'm spoiled beyond any car except what Cadillac can bring me in an ELR on the Voltec platform.

    The public eye in perceiving this car may be down the road a bit but every owner of the Volt (on www.gm-volt.com) where I'm an active member would not give it up his/her Volt for anything. I love the Cadillac ride, image etc. and when I first saw the ELR (now named) I was in awe and wanted one then and still do now.

    One step up drivetrain wise maybe would be to implement the 1.4L in a turbo version (like the Cruise Eco uses).

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    0AT E03 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    The Volt has two problems:

    1. When not in Electric Mode the mileage is poor
    2. It costs $40k but doesn't look $40k, people are not willing to pay a premium for a revolutionary drivetrain.

    The ELR should fix #2, as it will look what it costs. However GM has to do somethign to up the fuel efficeny of the range extended mode. The 4 banger in there right now isn't cutting it.

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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief1993 View Post
    Just my opinion, but i dont think america is ready for electric vehicles in this day and age.. I know i would have a difficult time switching from a V8 to an electric engine, car would have no pick up to it...
    Really? An electric car would have no pick up?


    Do you by chance know how electric motors work? They produce their peak torque instantly - from 0RPM onward. That's BETTER than any gasoline or diesel engine. The trouble is, you, like most Americans, have this concept of electric vehicles being nothing more than really economical commuter cars.

    Look up the Tesla Roadster and tell me that has no pick up to it.

    Sheesh.



    ELR, I am interested in you.

    ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by 0AT E03 View Post
    The Volt has two problems:

    1. When not in Electric Mode the mileage is poor
    2. It costs $40k but doesn't look $40k, people are not willing to pay a premium for a revolutionary drivetrain.

    The ELR should fix #2, as it will look what it costs. However GM has to do somethign to up the fuel efficeny of the range extended mode. The 4 banger in there right now isn't cutting it.
    Agreed. I really hope GM doesn't abandon this due to sales volume. I hope they can find a way to bring costs down.

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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0AT E03 View Post
    The Volt has two problems:

    1. When not in Electric Mode the mileage is poor
    2. It costs $40k but doesn't look $40k, people are not willing to pay a premium for a revolutionary drivetrain.

    The ELR should fix #2, as it will look what it costs. However GM has to do somethign to up the fuel efficeny of the range extended mode. The 4 banger in there right now isn't cutting it.
    1. WOW! UR Clearly uneducated on this subject unless you call over 40mpg in gas mode "poor" ...lmao!
    All stats are uploaded daily on the Volts, in CS mode I'm currently averaging 40.70 mpg. I'm way happy with this My '08 CTS is half of this mileage!
    Top_Speed1's Volt tracking

    2. Actually mine was even more totally loaded and people say the same as you so we'll agree on this BUT when they either drive or ride in it and see all the techies stuff with the totally quiet ride with no shift points (lag) and immediate torque it changes their opinions totally. I've had more "wow factor" on my Volt than any car or powersport toy I've ever owned, actually it's not even close.

    Want to add the ELR to my toy list

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    0AT E03 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    I'm not uneducated my company actually supplies parts for the Volt. So I'm very familiar with the car.

    1. The Volt in range extending mode gets 33 MPG in the city. This is poor. It needs to get much much more. The car has to get 40 MPG city in range extending mode using the EPA cycle. I'm not talking about real world for a simple reason as it doesn't matter because with driving style you can add or subtract 5-10 MPG on a car like this (I can get a Volt to have 25 MPG city if I drive it in range extending mode like a sports car, which I've actually done).

    2. The hard plastic that is on the rear of the doors, and the center console in the rear are unacceptable on a car that costs $40k. Most people don't sit in the back seat and if you never do on a Volt you might actually think the car has some nice features, but you can tell they cut costs on the entire rear interior of the car.

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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Just b/c a company you work with sells a part to GM doesn't mean you know about the car. I do however as I own one. My uncle works for a company that sells ceramic tiles for the NASA space shuttle, he doesn't know diddly about the shuttle.

    Anywho, your opinion is what it is. Your mileage and thinking are quite skewed. Just b/c you can drive a Toyota Prius like a sports car (floor-it mode) doesn't make the actual mileage of that car let's say 30. Yes it would be 50 but I'm sure you could get it down to that figure with your way of thinking (not knocking you, just justifying this conversation)

    So, let's open your mind. My mileage in gas generated power mode is 40.7 combined city/hwy. I never got close to 30 in city and if I did that would mean I'm getting 50+ hwy, which I'm not (it would be nice however but then again I would need a much lighter car like the Prius). Factual, if you viewed the stats site (link above) on my car it's in black and white. The data is sent daily via satellite link from the car.

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    0AT E03 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by Top_Speed1 View Post
    Just b/c a company you work with sells a part to GM doesn't mean you know about the car. I do however as I own one. My uncle works for a company that sells ceramic tiles for the NASA space shuttle, he doesn't know diddly about the shuttle.

    Anywho, your opinion is what it is. Your mileage and thinking are quite skewed. Just b/c you can drive a Toyota Prius like a sports car (floor-it mode) doesn't make the actual mileage of that car let's say 30. Yes it would be 50 but I'm sure you could get it down to that figure with your way of thinking (not knocking you, just justifying this conversation)

    So, let's open your mind. My mileage in gas generated power mode is 40.7 combined city/hwy. I never got close to 30 in city and if I did that would mean I'm getting 50+ hwy, which I'm not (it would be nice however but then again I would need a much lighter car like the Prius). Factual, if you viewed the stats site (link above) on my car it's in black and white. The data is sent daily via satellite link from the car.
    Conversly, you've driven only your Volt. I've driven at least 10 of them. FYI. I like the Volt, but it isn't a miracle and there are many many areas it can (and should) be improved. To think that it's perfect reeks of fanboyism.
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    WVhybrid is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0AT E03 View Post
    The Volt has two problems:

    1. When not in Electric Mode the mileage is poor
    2. It costs $40k but doesn't look $40k, people are not willing to pay a premium for a revolutionary drivetrain.

    The ELR should fix #2, as it will look what it costs. However GM has to do somethign to up the fuel efficeny of the range extended mode. The 4 banger in there right now isn't cutting it.
    Since when is 37 MPG a poor mileage? Especially when most Volt owners use their ICE less than 40% of the time. At Voltstats.net the average Volt owner is getting 114 MPG. That is a fuel efficiency twice as good as the nearest competitor. As for looks, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think my Red Volt is bold and beautiful. Oh, as an aside, the last time I filled up was December 2, 2011, over 1500 miles ago.

    My fuel money stays in America; it does not go to our enemies.

    WVhybrid
    RED Volt #1715 (MY11) "Now averaging 2.012 tablespoons of gasoline / mile (or 0.79 gallons / 100 miles). "
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    0AT E03 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by WVhybrid View Post
    Since when is 37 MPG a poor mileage? Especially when most Volt owners use their ICE less than 40% of the time. At Voltstats.net the average Volt owner is getting 114 MPG. That is a fuel efficiency twice as good as the nearest competitor. As for looks, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think my Red Volt is bold and beautiful. Oh, as an aside, the last time I filled up was December 2, 2011, over 1500 miles ago.

    My fuel money stays in America; it does not go to our enemies.

    WVhybrid
    RED Volt #1715 (MY11) "Now averaging 2.012 tablespoons of gasoline / mile (or 0.79 gallons / 100 miles). "
    37 MPG (combined) isn't bad, but it isn't GOOD either.

    This is the point many Volt fans miss. They get defensive, even against people who think the technology is the future. The point is, unless you also make the range extender portion as fuel efficient as a sub-compact people will keep dinging the car. Marketing isn't about reality, it's about perception, and right now the Volt has an uphill battle when it leaves electric mode.

    Like I said, I like the Volt. I personally wouldn't buy one, but I'd recommend them to my the car is to get from point A to point B friends. That doesn't mean I don't think it can be BETTER.

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    Sharkvolt is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Whatever the opinion you have of the Volt, on economy, on performance, on handling, or on luxury, keep in mind that GM has already stated that the ELR will use Voltec technology version 1.5 when it comes out.

    That probably means it will be slightly upgraded in all or most of those areas, but probably not by large amounts.

    GM also called the ELR a two door, Two plus Two in the same press release. That would seem to indicate very little consideration to the back seat passengers.

    So they will probably increase power/acceleration, cut weight slightly, add more luxury features, (Volt already has higher than normal luxury for a Chevy) and maybe add higher quality shocks for an even better ride/handling. (just guessing here)

    GM is extremely close mouthed about this and every other facet of their Voltec tech evolution.

    I think GM is rushing the ELR, and many other versions of vehicles with Voltec drive to market with as little noise as possible, to increase, or at least, to maintain their considerable advantage/lead in this area. They haven't had this much over the competition in many years, and would be fools to allow it to be lost by inaction.

    The next few years are going to be amazing.

    P.S. I have had my Volt for over a year, and love it, but am looking forward to even better Voltec vehicles like the ELR.
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    WVhybrid is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0AT E03 View Post
    37 MPG (combined) isn't bad, but it isn't GOOD either.

    They get defensive, even against people who think the technology is the future. The point is, unless you also make the range extender portion as fuel efficient as a sub-compact people will keep dinging the car. Marketing isn't about reality, it's about perception, and right now the Volt has an uphill battle when it leaves electric mode.

    I personally wouldn't buy one, but I'd recommend them to my the car is to get from point A to point B friends.
    Thanks for the reply. I'm glad you think the Volt is good for getting from A to B. Why just today I used my Volt to get from A (home) to B (work), and then to C (a UPS store), and D (a Subway sandwich store), then back to B (work) and then at the end of the day, back to A (home), altogether about 20 miles, while using about 60 cents worth of electricity.

    But I disagree with your assessment of fuel efficiency, because I know that a car that gets better than 100 MPG is VERY GOOD. In fact, it is better than any other gasoline power car in the world.

    Agreed that CS mileage alone isn't the best mileage available. But please, name a car that gets, say, as good, or even better fuel efficiency than Volt CS mode and that also performs as well, handles as well, and runs as quietly as the Volt in CD mode.

    The Volt isn't about the CS mileage alone. It is about the CD & CS mileage without the range anxiety. When you are driving CD, soldiers don't have to fight to bring home your oil, sailors don't have to guard the Straits of Hormuz for you, and pilots don't have drop bombs to protect oil production you need. This technology is a game changer that GM has pulled off better than anyone else. Today our country spends more than one billion dollars a day on imported crude oil. Moving away from oil is a matter of national defense and national economy. Avoiding imported oil while listening to BB King on XM radio turned up high and sitting in my leather driver's seat with the heat turned to medium is priceless.

    In summary, I don't believe that to put down a car that averages more than 100 MPG because it ONLY gets 37 MPG for a fraction of usage is a credible argument. A credible argument would look at the entire picture, and not single out a perceived flaw that, when looked at in the whole, is not a flaw.

    WVhybrid
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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    See but, while what you say makes sense, Volt detractors don't care. The auto press doesn't care. The people that review the cars don't care. To them, the fact that the Volt gets 37 MPG from its ICE, and the Hyundai Sonata is capable of 40 is all the difference in the world.

    Does it matter that 3mpg, especially with numbers that high, is almost negligible? No. It's the same reason things are priced at $99.99 instead of $100. It makes us happy to look at smaller numbers (or in the case of MPG, larger numbers). That "4" has a lot more weight than that "3".


    Like 0AT E03 said above: Marketing isn't about reality, it's about perception. I like the Volt. It's the first fuel efficient vehicle that really doesn't look like a rolling turd (but man, I wish the concept were the real thing...).


    Anyway... back to our ELR discussion: I hope that it is a success. I can see it being popular in big cities, and that's a good thing, because things always trickle down to us commoners in the suburbs eventually.

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    Re: off to bad rep all ready?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0AT E03 View Post
    Conversly, you've driven only your Volt. I've driven at least 10 of them. FYI. I like the Volt, but it isn't a miracle and there are many many areas it can (and should) be improved. To think that it's perfect reeks of fanboyism.
    BS, prove it. Let me see your Volt stats. Maybe if your a car wash boy or something then I would believe this crap and then getting in and moving it doesn't count for (green) beans lol. And besides time in the car is what counts. My Volt is no different than the other 10 you claim to have driven as far as base characteristics go. Don't even try to challenge me on this techie vehicle as you will lose so badly.

    The Volt is truely an awesome car. Sure it can be improved. Name ONE car that can't you dimwit. Your conversations have no creditability whatsoever (I like the statement where you claim I think it's a "Miracle") Man are you out there or what?. Where did you come from, Mars? PLEASE Go Back there!

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