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Cadillac DeVille 1985 to 2005 including:
1985-1992 Fleetwood, 1993 Sixty Special, All FWD Forum Discussion, Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS in Past Cadillac Vehicle Discussion; CD I'm saying that the booster is leaking vacuum air. Inside the big round canister is a rubber diaphragm, engine ...
  1. #76
    Manic Mechanic is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    CD I'm saying that the booster is leaking vacuum air. Inside the big round canister is a rubber diaphragm, engine vacuum is maintained on the front side and when you push the pedal rod a mechanism applies the force of the vacuum pulling on the diaphragm to increase the pressure against the master cylinder hydraulic piston, hence "power brakes". The linkage or push-rod goes through the center of the diaphragm with a seal to keep the vacuum from escaping. This seal has failed, it may be leaking all the time but when you push on the brake pedal the seal is shifted to a point where it really leaks. This is when you hear the noise of air pushing through this defective seal. They can whistle, howl, whine, roar, etc. at random. Having a stiffer than normal pedal in another symptom as the amount of power assisting vacuum is constantly being bled off through the leak. The vacuum is plumbed from the intake manifold itself, it's the large rubber hose just above and behind the throttle body. The check valve is located in the plastic fitting on the booster the hose is on, it holds vacuum when the pressure in the intake is high. There is normally enough vacuum stored in the booster for 3 stops without being replenished by intake vacuum. Air is removed from the booster and it stays that way. Vacuum itself is used for assist and air is not, so there is no significant air flow into the intake without a leak. The fuel injection will set a lean code when in closed loop the leak is bad enough for enough time, like hot engine at a long light or at a drive through window with the car in gear.

    As for the fluid leak, see if you can dry it with brake clean then go for a drive or hold the pedal hard for a while. Watched points never boil and drives seem to work better than hold and wait on slow leaks If it's leaking you'll have to attempt to replace the bleeder. New ones are available at the parts store. If you can't get it out without destroying the threads in the caliper just replace the whole caliper. After the repair bleed the air out at that wheel.

    Vernon

  2. #77
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Good morning, a little update: I bled the system according to the procedure on alldatadiy. Rear was just perfect but front was horrible. After fiddling the broken bleeder screw out, the liquid shooting in my pan was jet black, oily, and had dirt/metal particles in it. After 5 cycles, it cleared up. I also cleaned and lubricated all caliper slide bolts and the non-braking surface tips of the pads (where they touch the metal spring inlets). He has an ACDelco Advantage rotor and pad set in the back and Raybestos Pro in the front but I don't think that can cause uneven braking or problems.

    The test drive was just right, at the first hard stop from 45 to 5 mph, we almost hit the dash. The pedal travel is now reduced to one third of its way, no whining at all, and the fluid system is tight now. I will, however, definitely have that brake booster checked out by a pro at the next service - the whine was there and noticeable enough to be captured on my crappy phone.

    Edit: Manic: I also ran a set of your procedure with MAF, etc. Regardless of being hot or almost cold, the car does not run anywhere close to smooth when I disconnect the MAF. You mentioned a cleaning procedure for the other sensor (MAP) but I was unable to locate it in the Deville or Tech section.

  3. #78
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    Re: sporadic SES light and exotic codes

    This is a heads-up for anyone driving these FWD (and any other type) of vehicle: Brake fluid simply LOVES moisture. It is highly recommended to perform a complete brake fluid exchange every 5 years or so. A simple pressure bleed rig is not expensive and 2 people can do the job in the driveway in an hour or so. Or, you can take advantage of a (in our case) GM dealer "Fluids exchange special" in which they hit you for ~$400 and completely change all P/S, transmission, coolant and brake fluids. You get the latest and greatest GM fluids as well as a written invoice in case of problems later. It's all normal preventive maintenance anyway.

  4. #79
    Manic Mechanic is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Cd cleaning the MAP would simply be pulling it out of it's hole in the coolant bridge and spraying some throttle cleaner into it's vacuum port. It's small so not much is needed.

    Vernon

  5. #80
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    The Deville is totally turning Cadillac on me: with every piece repaired, two others fail. When checking for new codes, this showed up:

    PCM 1811 H - Maximum Adapt and Long Shift

    I was asking whether he had issues shifting gears and, indeed, there was one day when switching from first to second was not smooth but noticeable. Is there anything I need/should/can do besides checking the fluid level and consistency?

    On the front driver control bars, there is flaky green/blue goo that seems to be coming from one big rubber booth (I miss out on the correct English term here, maybe "pressure sleeve?") just over it.

    On a side note: I have performed some more routine maintenance such as changing the air filter to WIX. The car sounds much more throaty now (like a chain smoker) when stepping on the gas. Is that normal?

  6. #81
    Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Quote Originally Posted by c_d View Post
    On the front driver control bars, there is flaky green/blue goo that seems to be coming from one big rubber booth (I miss out on the correct English term here, maybe "pressure sleeve?") just over it.
    That sounds like CV joint grease which means a ripped CV joint boot.


    On a side note: I have performed some more routine maintenance such as changing the air filter to WIX. The car sounds much more throaty now (like a chain smoker) when stepping on the gas. Is that normal?
    I would not expect that to change the exhaust note.

  7. #82
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger View Post
    That sounds like CV joint grease which means a ripped CV joint boot.
    I have consulted the alikes of Eric the Car Guy at youtube (don't laugh) and the take away was an axle only being priced around $50 so it's actually cheaper and less problematic to swap the whole part.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranger View Post
    I would not expect that to change the exhaust note.
    It's not the exhaust sounding throaty, it is coming from the left driver's side engine compartment when stepping on the gas.

    Additionally, I would like to seek input about the PCM 1811 H - Maximum Adapt and Long Shift because this Caddi requires a lot of maintenance and it's adding up bit by bit. I am always concerned of letting him replace something just to uncover that something is catastrophically wrong and that the parts money could have funded a well-maintained pre-owned.

    In 2013 alone, this car got a new master cylinder, outrageously expensive repair for something called a coolant crossover (new gaskets and pipe), new pads and rotors, new filters, new shocks, new vacuum lines, and it's still in need of the full plenum repair (instead of the quick fix), probably at least one new axle, the transmission code, and just yesterday night, the front passengers side started to rattle when going through pot holes/speed bumps. Some things are left undiagnosed yet, such as the liquid bubbleling sound at strong accelerations: it's like someone gurgeling listerine while simultaneously having a full fish tank in the engine compartment.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by c_d

    I have consulted the alikes of Eric the Car Guy at youtube (don't laugh) and the take away was an axle only being priced around $50 so it's actually cheaper and less problematic to swap the whole part.
    Good luck finding a $50 axel, and good luck having it last more than 6 months.

    It's not the exhaust sounding throaty, it is coming from the left driver's side engine compartment when stepping on the gas.
    Induction noise from your vacuum leak.


    outrageously expensive repair for something called a coolant crossover
    Long, tedious, PITA of a job. Over $1,000 at a dealer.

    it's still in need of the full plenum repair (instead of the quick fix)
    There is no quick fix for a torn plenum, it has to be replaced.

    the front passengers side started to rattle when going through pot holes/speed bumps.
    Possibly sway bar links/bushings.

    Some things are left undiagnosed yet, such as the liquid bubbleling sound at strong accelerations: it's like someone gurgeling listerine while simultaneously having a full fish tank in the engine compartment.
    Air in the cooling system. Potentially a very bad sign. Is it running hot?

  9. #84
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    Good luck finding a $50 axel, and good luck having it last more than 6 months.
    I only have access to O'reilleys, Autozone, etc. Rockauto is quoting between $44 for a "CARDONE Select Constant Velocity Drive Axle" and $600 for ACDELCO 20984613; with the specific part number mentioned by alldatadyi being in wholesale closeout.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    Induction noise from your vacuum leak.
    I'll check for that, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    Possibly sway bar links/bushings.
    Thanks, Moist. I educate myself and check.

    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    Long, tedious, PITA of a job. Over $1,000 at a dealer.
    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCabbage View Post
    Air in the cooling system. Potentially a very bad sign. Is it running hot?
    He had it done in February, for $640 in labour and roughly $210 in parts. We were told the coolant was changed at this point. Sometimes (maybe once a month) the temp needle is a millimeter higher than usual but usually its glued to the 12 o'clock position. I discounted that to the car being operated at >95F ambient temperature.

    The shop we go to is usually very good (we finally found something close to trustworthy in SA, TX) but they have bad days - I found a rogue screwdriver once. Can it be that the coolant was not filled properly?

  10. #85
    Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    have consulted the alikes of Eric the Car Guy at youtube (don't laugh) and the take away was an axle only being priced around $50 so it's actually cheaper and less problematic to swap the whole part.
    I can vouch for that.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by c_d
    Can it be that the coolant was not filled properly?
    The system is self purging, but the purge line can become clogged. Check your coolant level, and do a search for checking the purge line for flow, it's been discussed many, MANY times.

  12. #87
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Is this the purge line referenced in the pictures?

    http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...ml#post3259340

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    Yes.

  14. #89
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Moist, you jinxed it - all your fault! We took the Deville to go to downtown again. While we were discussing what I have read on these boards, a thunderstorm came by. During some heavy rain and just after passing through a huge puddle, the temperature rose from 12:00 o'clock to 1p in about 30 seconds. After that at idling or low speed, the temp was rising up until a tad after 1p but going down rapidly (10 seconds) to 12p at highway speeds. The car stood in a parking lot for about 2 hours, the temperature did not rise beyond 12 at back roads and interstate until ... we hit the rain. Same game, quick increases and decreases.

    I will check the purge line tomorrow. Anything else that comes into mind (beyond checking coolant level)?

  15. #90
    c_d
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    Re: Sporadic SES light and exotic codes - friend's 2004 DTS

    Ok, bad news as usual. I disconnected the purge line - some previous owner used stop leak and I had a lot if red coppery flaky stuff in there. The purge line was not entirely blocked but just had a little resistance. I cleaned it anyway but what I found during the process was a deliberately cut coolant level sensor wire with the part to the computer being shortened. I'll replace the coolant in a little bit and see how it's performing.

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