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Cadillac Forums: amsoil VS royal purple
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Old 05-15-08, 12:48 AM
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amsoil VS royal purple

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ok first off i know this is probly going to create some controversy but witch is better for cadillac's amsoil or royal purple i ask cause i want to switch my car over to synthetic engien oil and synthetic atf now i know thires a chance that it might hurt my seals but i dont think so they are all new as of 1 year ago so i dont think it would hurt them .its for a daily driver a 1990 deville so let me know what you all think
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Old 05-15-08, 07:31 AM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

Search these pages. The oil wars are legend and have no final answer other than pick what you like from Dino to full syn, use the correct weight and follow the recommended service interval. This topic is the ultimate
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Old 05-17-08, 07:46 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

As an AMSOIL Direct Dealer (and forum vendor), I'm clearly biased, but I went through the same thought process in late 2003 after losing a motor (LS6) in my first season of running my relatively stock 2002 Corvette Z06 in the SCCA T1 class.

I originally sought to compare Royal Purple and Red Line vs Mobil 1. I discovered AMSOIL in the process and chose it over the others. I started using it, was happy with the results and started selling about halfway through 2004. Been using it in all my vehicles since.

Here's what I learned. Feel free to take this with a grain of salt.

All synthetics are not equal. The API has not come out and defined what is "synthetic", but rather, classified oils into five major groups.

Group I base oils are the least refined of all of the groups. They are usually a mix of different hydrocarbon chains with little or no uniformity. While some automotive oils use these stocks, they are generally used in less demanding applications.

Group II base oils are common in mineral based motor oils. They have fair to good performance in the areas of volatility, oxidation stability, wear prevention and flash/fire points. They have only fair performance in areas such as pour point and cold crank viscosity. Group II base stocks are what the majority of engine oils are made from. 3000 mile oil changes are the norm.

Group III base oils are subjected to the highest level of refining of all the mineral oil stocks. Although not chemically engineered, they offer improved performance in a wide range of areas as well as good molecular uniformity and stability. By definition they are considered a synthesized material and can be used in the production of synthetic and semi-synthetic lubricants. Group III is used in the vast majority of full synthetics or synthetic blends. They are superior to group I and II oils but still have limitations. Some formulations are designed for extended oil changes. AMSOIL XL Motor Oils, Castrol Syntec and many others fall into this category.

Group IV are polyalphaolefins (PAO) which are a chemically engineered synthesized basestocks. PAOs offer excellent stability, molecular uniformity and performance over a wide range of lubricating properties. AMSOIL SAE Synthetic Motor Oils and Mobil 1 primarily use group IV basestocks (though recent info posted on the oil forum indicates that Mobil 1 is also now using a significant proportion of Group III basestock). PAO is a much more expensive basestock than the highly refined petroleum oil basestock of Group III.

Group V base oils are also chemically engineered stocks that do not fall into any of the categories previously mentioned. Typical examples of group V stocks are Esters, polyglycols and silicone. Red Line uses an ester basestock.

In the 90s, Mobil filed suit against Castrol for falsely advertising Syntec oil as synthetic, when in fact it contained a Group III, highly hydroprocessed mineral (Dino) oil, instead of a chemically synthesized (group IV or V) basestock. Due to the amount that the mineral oil had been chemically changed, the judge decided in Castrol's favor. As a result, any oil containing this highly hydroprocessed mineral (Dino) oil (currently called Group III basestock by the American Petroleum Institute) can be marketed as a synthetic oil. Since the original synthetic basestock (polyalphaolefin or PAO) is much more expensive than the Group III basestock, most of the oil blenders switched to the Group III basestock, which significantly increased their profit margins. Interesting that Mobil 1 may now have gone the way of most other synthetic oil manufacturers.

AMSOIL clearly indicates that their XL line is Group III and the rest of their synthetics are Group IV. Red Line clearly states that they use a Group V, Polyol Ester, basestock. Royal Purple doesn't state what they use. Mobil 1 now doesn't state what they use either. I'd ask why not and wonder if they are both using a large amount of Group III basestock.

Next consideration is additives. I reviewed hundreds of used oil analysis reports on the oil forums and came to my own conclusion that AMSOIL uses higher levels of anti-wear and detergent additives. The result is a clear improvement in wear numbers in the used oil analysis reports I reviewed.

I next considered High Temp High Shear rating. The High Temperature/High Shear Test measures a lubricant’s viscosity under severe high temperature and shear conditions that are similar to severe service applications in an engine. The below HTHS ratings were pulled straight of the corporate websites of the various companies.

Amsoil Signature Series 0w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 10w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 10w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil XL 5w30 (API SM) – 3.2 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Pennzoil Platinum 10w30 (API SM) – 3.15 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 10w30 (API SM) – 3.14 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 EP 10w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Mobil 1 EP 5w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 (API SM) – 3.1 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 10w30 (API SM) – 3.1
Mobil 1 5w30 (API SM) – 3.09 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Mobil 1 Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 3.09
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 3.0
Mobil 1 0w30 (API SM) – 2.99 (meets GM Standard 4718M)
Amsoil SAE 0w20 (API SM) – 2.8
Amsoil XL 5w20 (API SM) – 2.7
Mobil 1 EP 5w20 (API SM) – 2.7
Mobil 1 5w20 (API SM) – 2.62
Mobil 1 0w20 (API SM) – 2.61
Pennzoil Platinum 5w20 (API SM) – 2.6
Pennzoil Truck/SUV 5w30 (API SM) – 2.6
Pennzoil Platinum 0w20 (API SM) – 2.6

I did not list Red Line's HTHS rating as they use a different ASTM method and I'm not sure direct comparison is valid, but their numbers are good. I did not list Royal Purple's HTHS ratings because they don't report them. Again, made me uneasy as to why not.

Finally, AMSOIL has done some very comprehensive motorcycle oil and gear lube tests and Royal Purple did not fair well at all - their oils tend to shear out of grade fairly quickly. The full reports if you are interested:

AMSOIL Motorcycle Oil “White Paper” (1 MB pdf file)
AMSOIL Gear Lube “White Paper” (2 MB pdf file)

Here is an example of how AMSOIL's best oil performs in my 06 CTS-V:
Cadillac CTS-V Used Oil Analysis – Mobil 1 5w30 vs AMSOIL 0w30

I'd offer you more info on the AMSOIL Preferred Customer Program which allows purchase at dealer wholesale pricing, about 25% under retail., but I see your location as Italy and unfortunately, I can't sell outside the United States and Canada. Sorry.
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AMSOIL Ordering Information (Retail sales using reference #1206638 benefit the forum.)
AMSOIL Preferred Customer Program Members buy at Wholesale - a savings of about 25%

C66 Racing
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Old 05-18-08, 01:53 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

well first off ide like to say think c66 for that info on the oils .it looks like my best bet is to go with amsoil .Second i dont live in italy i live right hear in the good old USA i know the town of milan sounds italin but is in IL sorry for the confusion i will change my pro so thire is no more futher confusion .Btut again thanks for the info
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Old 05-18-08, 02:43 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

DO NOT USED ROYAL PURPLE i will kill your car the stuff is crap
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Old 05-18-08, 05:34 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

One day after Preakness and the familiar cry rings from the Clubhouse once again: ".....and they're offfff !!!"

kiss, would you please elaborate on your profound knowledge and findings in the field of modern lubricants?
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Old 05-18-08, 06:09 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

I have always followed the philosophy if "It ain't broke, don't fix it." Although I am not a mechanic, scientist, chemist, and I do not have extensive knowledge about engine oils, I can share this with you...

When an oil company tells you not to use their own product, don't use it. Quin, since your info block says you have a '90 Deville, I'd assume that's the car you are wanting to use the synthetic oil on.

This site claims to be an authorized amsoil dealer: http://www.worldlube.com/flush.html
Take a look at this, from that site:

"NOTE: If your vehicle has over 80 or 90,000 miles on it or is more than 10 years old, and you are not currently using another synthetic oil, you may not wish to switch over to AMSOIL. Vehicles with such high mileage may have dry, cracked seals and gaskets. Having used conventional oils for so long (even with 3,000 mile oil changes), the sludge and deposits from oil burn-off may have caused a build-up to occur which is plugging the gaps around these seals and gaskets and preventing leaks."

That dealer has no reason to put a notice like that on his site if it doesn't have some element of truth to it. After all, he's in the business to make money, right?
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Old 05-18-08, 11:08 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

yeah its 90 deville but if i had to guess i dont even have more then about 25000 -30000 miles on the engien that was put in and acording to the guy that put it in for me he said he put in all new seals and gaskets so i think i should be ok with switching and not haveing any leaks .i was just intrested in switching over to sin because i had heared that it makes the motor last longer and i would get a little more hp out of doing it . so i put this post up just to see what every one said and i found out some things i didint know before so i guess you learn some thing new every day
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Old 05-18-08, 11:16 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

Quote:
Originally Posted by quins90lac View Post
well first off ide like to say think c66 for that info on the oils .it looks like my best bet is to go with amsoil .Second i dont live in italy i live right hear in the good old USA i know the town of milan sounds italin but is in IL sorry for the confusion i will change my pro so thire is no more futher confusion .Btut again thanks for the info

That's funny. Totally took the IL out of context with Milan in front of it. Okay... now I'm sending you info on the Preferred Customer Program I mentioned above.
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Old 05-18-08, 11:20 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

Another way to add fuel to the oil wars is to pose a question: If you are not the original owner of a particular car, do you honestly know exactly what lubricants it has grown up on ?

If you knew, how would that affect your lubricant decisions now and in the future?
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Old 05-18-08, 11:26 PM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

Somehow I knew this would happen...
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Old 05-20-08, 10:29 AM
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Re: amsoil VS royal purple

Quote:
Originally Posted by submariner409 View Post
Another way to add fuel to the oil wars is to pose a question: If you are not the original owner of a particular car, do you honestly know exactly what lubricants it has grown up on ?

If you knew, how would that affect your lubricant decisions now and in the future?
A good point... and one of the reasons I usually prefer to buy new.
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