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92K views 76 replies 27 participants last post by  Jdrawbaugh 
#1 · (Edited)
OK, the strange thing about this condition is that it happens WHILE DRIVING! (2003 CTS with LS package and Bose NAV)

The MO is strange. the car can be speeding up or keeping a constant speed. The cruise may be active or not... The condition though is always unexpected. You will be driving along and the engine will just shut off and then the NAV screen will display "STARTING DISABLED REMOVE KEY".

Sometimes while coasting to the side of the road, it will magically come back to life and continue like nothing happened. Sometimes you will have to get off the road and then restart it. If the cruise was set, the condition shuts off the cruise and resets all driver presets to a factory default.

I have had OnStar do the remote diagnostics and they have found nothing. Once they do the check however, the cruise control will become active again, at least indicating that the system has been cleared.

Has anyone dealt with anything like this before? I would think that the key check is done only at startup... Is it always checking the key?

The dealer of course has no clue. They have replaced the keys and the Theft deterrent Control Module. It still hapens about 1 or 2 times a month.

Thanks!!!
 
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#4 ·
Fortunately it happened in my garage. Turned out something was draining the battery and when the key was turned into the start possition it would'nt allow you to remove the key!! Caddy Tech had a high powered quick discharge battery jumper and it started. I let it run for a half hour and it was fine. You situation would scare the hell out of me. I'm sure you plan to take it in for service?

B.
 
#5 ·
Service has been a PITA about this... You know the story.... There are no DTC codes showing and we can not duplicate the situation.

I have the service manuals now (Wow 4-1/4" Thick) and they do state that a <9V battery will activate this condition, but it also states that the condition will NOT stop the car while driving.
 
#6 ·
Service has been a PITA about this... You know the story.... There are no DTC codes showing and we can not duplicate the situation.

I have the service manuals now (Wow 4-1/4" Thick) and they do state that a <9V battery will activate this condition, but it also states that the condition will NOT stop the car while driving.
Just noticed you live in Winston Salem, heart of NASCAR Racing!
I'm also a scholar of the Civil War and you're living in the heart of that too!

Do you have an active OnStar? If so you could have them do a satellite diagnostic when it happens!
 
#7 ·
Actually, I live just down the street from Richard Childress... his winery may be my closest liquor store ;)

The last time this happened I immediately called OnStar. On this occasion, the fuel shut off and the message displayed. As I coasted to the right lane, it started back up again... poof! The DIC then displayed "DRIVER 1" instead of the names we have stored and ALL settings were gone. The cruise control would not function, the NAV was at factory view settings, and the stereo was reset also.

OnStar ran the diagnostics and found nothing. Once they finished the diagnostic and I hung up, the cruise was functional again! My service rep recommended an exorcism.
 
#8 ·
Actually, I live just down the street from Richard Childress... his winery may be my closest liquor store ;)

The last time this happened I immediately called OnStar. On this occasion, the fuel shut off and the message displayed. As I coasted to the right lane, it started back up again... poof! The DIC then displayed "DRIVER 1" instead of the names we have stored and ALL settings were gone. The cruise control would not function, the NAV was at factory view settings, and the stereo was reset also.

OnStar ran the diagnostics and found nothing. Once they finished the diagnostic and I hung up, the cruise was functional again! My service rep recommended an exorcism.
You're describing a complete loss of electrical power and system reset. You've got a wire/cable that's loose or the end is improperly crimped; maybe a loose relay. Someday it'll quit alltogether and you'll be able to find it.
 
#10 ·
I HAVE NOW THE SAME PROBLEM: Starting disabled remove key ON MY CTS 2003 WITH 80Miles. now i have problems to restar the engine, when start the engine then go away in few minutes the problem comes back again and nav shows Starting disabled remove key. other times nav show power engine reduced and engine feels very bad. somebody know the reason? :bomb::banghead::cookoo:
 
#12 · (Edited)
My experience with a crank position sensor when they go they really go buy buy, DEAD.
The electrical wiring I think is a start. What starts the ECM and controls the system. The shut down in what you say is "STARTING DISABLED REMOVE KEY" it sound as though at top there is a cut out. Ignition switch or link to ECM power line.
Da! can't tell you anymore than that logic.
Jim
 
#13 ·
The loose wire in the fuse pannel I think was my thread..it was not starting and key was stuck in ignition.
So check all the wires,relays and fuses, make sure they all have a good connection.
I wouldn't rule out a bad ecu, or just a bad ground somewhere.
 
#14 ·
I can confirm that ours is still doing this even after changing the Crank Position Sensor. I will also state that the car was taken to the dealer several times while under warranty and they could not fix it either. They replaced many electrical parts. The most puzzling thing is that when it happens, it is usually on a nice smooth road with the cruise set. Not only is it aggravating but quite dangerous when it cuts off in heavy traffic.
 
#17 ·
This almost sounds like a power moding issue, maybe something wrong inside the ignition switch.
The electrical part.

You say this sets no codes?

Often on a battery disconnect the radio will display "service theft system" after you reconnect it.
How is the battery voltage?

Be sure the connections on the battery are tight, if something is loose it could be losing contact and resetting the whole electrical system.

Otherwise I think I'd need more information.
 
#18 ·
Correct... there are no codes. I have used my scan tool and have also had OnStar run scan immediately after each incident. Here is another clue... If the car shuts off and you get the message "Starting Disabled - Remove Key" and you are NOT using the cruise control, you can lift up gently on the throttle pedal and the car will restart on its own. I will PM the VIN to you so you can see what else has been tried. It looks like others that have seen this are also running 2003 models.
 
#21 ·
How about that, this sounds pretty close to what is going on.
This looks like a KW2000 logic pulse reset.

Subject: Intermittent Stall, Surge, Stumble, or Hesitation DTC P1629


Models: 2003 Cadillac CTS with 3.2L (LA3) Engine




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.

Condition/Concern:
Some On rare occassions, customers may comment the engine will stall intermittently. The concern may also be described as a surge feel (not an accelerator surge), stumble, or hesitation while driving. Careful questioning of the customer, and the Diagnostic System Check, may reveal the following clues:

• The engine stalled at a steady state cruise speed with no driver inputs.


• In all reported cases, the vehicle has restarted.


• The condition is very intermittent and can take 100 miles or more to duplicate.


• The Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC) may reset and the gauges may sweep during or after the stall.


• The Driver Information Center (DIC) may display a starter interrupt message.


• DTC P1629 Theft Deterrent Fuel Enable Signal Not Received, may be stored in the Engine Control Module (ECM).


Note: The transmission can effectively push start the vehicle after the stall occurs at speeds as low as 35 mph. This would give the customer the perception the vehicle stalled and re-started on its own.

Important: This concern will NOT occur when the Tech 2 or Vehicle Data Recorder (VDR) is attached to the vehicle.

Recommendation/Instructions:
The concern may be the result of electrical noise on the Keyword 2000 Data Line (circuit 5043) that causes the ECM to reset. Install a Module Emulator Kit (Part Number 10357869). It will reduce the amount and amplitude of the noise on the circuit.

Components Provided in Kit:
Jumper (Require 1 Per Vehicle)

Terminal Part Number 12129484 (Require 2 Per Vehicle)

Tools Needed:
Crimping Tool

Wire Cutters

Wire Strippers

Soldering Iron

Pick To Remove Terminals

Black Vinyl Tape

Procedure:
•Locate ALDL Connector.
•Locate and Remove Pin 7 From ALDL Housing (Pin 7 Has CKT 5043, WH/BK, Which Is The K-Line.
•Cut Terminal Off Wire As Close To Terminal As Possible.
•Strip Small Portion Of Insulation Off Circuit 5043 and 5043A (One End Of PK Wire In Jumper assembly).
•Twist Wires Together and Double Crimp CKTS 5043 and 5043A With Terminal Part # 12129484.
•Solder Crimp.
•Locate and Remove Pin 5 from ALDL Housing (Pin 5 Has CKT 351E, BK/WH, Which Is Ground).
•Cut Terminal Off Wire As Close To Terminal As Possible.
•Strip Small Portion Of Insulation Off 351E and 5043B (Other End of PK Wire In Jumper assembly).
•Twist Wires Together And Double Crimp CKTS 351E and 5043B With Terminal Part # 12129484.
•Solder Crimp.
•Locate Best Spot To Package Jumper Assembly. (Tape Back To a Harness Bundle if Necessary /Possible Find Cubby Hole To Place it in, Whatever Works Best In Vehicle).
 
#45 ·
Hi nice to meet you. The names Wayne in Jax FL. I just started having this issue on my 03 cts with 95,890 miles on the clock. Have anyone else had any luck with this fix? I am by no means a auto tech, how ever I am a old shcool gear head who is good at following instructions. Can you send me any Pic's of this "FIX"? and any tips please? Thank you,
Wayne
 
#23 ·
Oh Lord no... lol. I'd get so bored. Plus I am already falling apart at my tender age.
I want to push around 80 and then head off to see my family that has gone before me. ;)
Thanks though, that's a nice sentiment.

If any of you brave souls wants to try this fix yourself let me know, I haven't done it but I might be able to give you some tips.
This sounds like a total logic reset issue and I would not be surprised if this was the fix.
The '03 is kind of a unique car.
 
#26 ·
YES. Please have Luke get me a package together with the necessary parts. Everything in this bulletin verifies the condition and makes sense. I especially like how the condition will not happen with the scanner/recorder attached. That was the dead end with the local dealer.
 
#25 ·
I find it amazing that stuff like this doesn't happen more often actually.
You guys might not believe the level of computerization on these things and when one starts acting up... ooooh man.... look out.
 
#27 ·
It is best if you PM Luke directly, tell him to talk to me and I'll show him what this is about or give him the part numbers.
I don't talk to him much actually, we are both really busy and in different parts of the building.
;)
 
#28 ·
OK, Luke sent me the kit. The part #10357869 contains both the jumper wire and the terminals needed. Since the jumper goes from the K-signal terminal to the ground terminal, it almost seems that they are trying to emulate the scan tool being attached. Since the parts in the jumper kit are sealed, it is tough to guess. I hope for $65 it is more complex than a resistor under shrink wrap.

Anyway the kit is installed and the car runs and my scan tool still reads OK from the OBD-II port. I will put it on the road tomorrow and test
 
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