Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results
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Cadillac or competing brand model ? Why ? Discussion, Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results in Item Specific Cadillac Discussion; On our way to Cancun I stopped and picked up all the car mags and Motortrend did a comparison between ...
  1. #1
    Blackout's Avatar
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    Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    On our way to Cancun I stopped and picked up all the car mags and Motortrend did a comparison between the CTS-V and the RS-4 and these were the results.

    0-60 mph:
    CTS-V: 4.9 seconds
    RS4: 4.5 seconds

    1/4:
    CTS-V: 13.4 @ 109.2mph
    RS4: 13.0 @ 102.1 mph

    Braking, 60-0 mph:
    CTS-V: 123 ft.
    RS4: 112 ft.

    600 ft. Slalom:
    CTS-V: 64.3 mph
    RS4: 67.5 mph

    They declared the RS4 the winner in the shootout and this is what they said.

    1st Place: Audi RS4

    Fast, well balanced, attractive pit bull of a sport sedan that does everything well and shows that Audi can build a car with teeth. Big price, but high content.

    2md Place: Cadillac CTS-V

    Just the fact that GM sells a machine like this shows there's hope. Big-hearted powertrain, honest chasis. Just a few cost cutting niggles short of greatness.

    But the CTS-V does have some perks from going over their information. In the 1/4 the CTS-V traps better then the RS4 (which is understandable since AWD's generally aren't the best for higher speeds) and the price as tested numbers were:

    CTS-V: $52,815
    RS4: $73,870

    But they started the article off pretty good by giving you a rundown of stuff you can get with the RS4 that isn't even available for the CTS-V and the list includes full time AWD, direct fuel injection, Dynamic Ride Control, bi-Xenon headlamps with automatic leveling, steering tracking, retractable washers, 19" wheels, rear and rear side privacy shades, driver adjustable throttle-tip-in programming and exhaust system, aluminum hood and front fenders, cooled front seats and heated rear seats, and a lap timer. And after that list they then go on and say, and here's a list of what you get with the CTS-V: a mini cooper. No, a CTS-V doesn't come with one but you could buy a loaded one for $22,380 in the difference in the as price as tested difference between our two cars. So before you guys knock the RS4's price just take a look at that list of features that you can get with the car versus the CTS-V.

    On a side note I also got Automobile magazine and they also did a super sedan shootout between the BMW M5, Audi S6, and MB E63 AMG and the results were quite surprising to say the least. These were the rankings

    3rd place: BMW M5
    2nd place: Audi S6
    1st place: MB E63 AMG

    This is what they said at the end of the article:

    At an expected $85,000 the Benz digs deepest into the budget, but it is owrth every penny --against the stopwatch and in smiles-per-miles currency. It wins on merit and appeal, even though it surpasses the S6 only by a whisker.
    (this is when it gets good) The fact that the M5 has fallen so far so fast tells you three things. That this is an extremely fast moving business. That even a wellfounded status quo can be eroded by clever evolution. And thatthe big engine in a mid size car game is more competitive then ever.

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  3. #2
    thebigjimsho's Avatar
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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    Motor Trend at least confessed that the V they were running had the RSAs and that handicapped the numbers a bit. And since I got my V with F1s, as many of us did, you should post the numbers MT gave in parentheses. Braking in 114ft and the slalom at 66.7mph. Plus, I'm sure the acceleration numbers are also affected.

    As for the aluminum hood and fenders, the V has an aluminum hood as well. That's one reason why I did not get into the GB fiberglass hood many V owners got into.

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    CVP33's Avatar
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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    Testing the V with RSA's was total bullshit. The RS4 is a fine car and I must confess after seeing one in person and the yellow one on the cover of C&D (if I remember) they are nice. BUT NOT $25,000 (or in reality $30,000) MORE NICE! And for those that say money shouldn't be used a decision maker, they obviously aren't stroking those monthly checks! One more thing, of course our cars are less refined! We're God Damned Americans for crying out loud! EVERYTHING WE DO IS UNREFINED! Amen. SRT-Chris out.

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    Blackout's Avatar
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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout resul

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho
    Motor Trend at least confessed that the V they were running had the RSAs and that handicapped the numbers a bit. And since I got my V with F1s, as many of us did, you should post the numbers MT gave in parentheses. Braking in 114ft and the slalom at 66.7mph. Plus, I'm sure the acceleration numbers are also affected.
    Hmmm.....i edited that part in after I made the post and realized I didn't put it in but yes that is what they said in the article and they also stated that you can still get the F1's instead of the RSA's for no additional cost. But either way the RS4 still beat the CTS-V with their numbers they recorded with the F1's

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    Did we really need yet another one of these threads?

    Yes, the new RS4 has better performance than the V (which is due for a redesign). It has to at that price. It's not really a CTS-V competitor, but a limited production race-ready street car along the lines of the M3 CSL.

    Ignoring the size difference (the CTS is more 5-series sized than 3-series and really isn't anywhere near as small as the A/S/RS4) the logical comparison would be:
    Base model.............................CTS - A4
    Performance/Sport model..........CTS-V - S4
    Limited Production/Race model....N/A - RS4

    Cadillac doesn't make a race-ready version of the CTS. The closest you'll find is Mallett or Lingenfelter, but it would be unfair to compare as they aren't "in-house".

    Cadillac also doesn't make a 3-series or A/S/RS4 sized car in the US.

    Quit trying to compare two cars that aren't in the same class (they aren't anywhere close in price, or size for that matter).

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    The RS4 is an awesome vehicle and does best the CTS-V in several areas. And to think it only took the Germans $30,000 more American dollars to do it is frankly amazing. Now remember the 2004 CTS-V bested the last generation M3, M5, S4, Jaguars, C32's, countless Porsches and so on. Can't wait to see what the General does with the next generation.

    I'll make three predictions. First is a minimum of 450HP. Second is it will best the posted RS4 numbers. Lastly it won't cost $74,000.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout resul

    Quote Originally Posted by gothicaleigh
    Quit trying to compare two cars that aren't in the same class (they aren't anywhere close in price, or size for that matter).
    So according to you because you don't think they are in the same class I guess that is how it is then huh? Well then I guess you should write a letter to Motortrend and tell them to stop wasting our time as well as their money on comparing these two luxury performance sedans because according to you they aren't in the same class and I guess that is how the whole automotive world should see it as well.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    No need to make excuses for the Caddy. It is doing a fine job for $30K less and is a generation behind in it's evolution. The next one is on the way and the Americans will no doubt blow away the Germans again, just like we did with the Z06 and the last generation CTS-V. We're just out of cycle right now. All will be right in the world again in late 2007.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout resul

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackout
    So according to you because you don't think they are in the same class I guess that is how it is then huh?
    Well, since you asked... Yes.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout resul

    Quote Originally Posted by CVP33
    Now remember the 2004 CTS-V bested the last generation M3, M5, S4, Jaguars, C32's, countless Porsches and so on. Can't wait to see what the General does with the next generation.
    Sums it up pretty good. First V rolls out, it's faster. New M5 rolls out, it's faster. New S4 rolls out, it's faster. Next V to come to production will be faster than any of these current Euro-rockets because they'll all be a generation behind the new V.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    1/4:
    CTS-V: 13.4 @ 109.2mph
    RS4: 13.0 @ 102.1 mph
    Whats up with those traps? 109 might be plausible for the V but does the RS4 really only trap 102??

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout resul

    Quote Originally Posted by davesdeville
    Whats up with those traps? 109 might be plausible for the V but does the RS4 really only trap 102??
    AWD eats up a lot of power up top so I wasn't really surprised by that.

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    Re: Can we finally put this to rest....RS4 > CTS-V and M5, S6, E63 AMG shootout results

    I was thinking about buying an RS4. Then I heard how bad the build quality and service was. I think I'll pass.

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