Dealing with complaint

[shakushinnen]

Hi,
I'm hoping that someone can advise me on how to get satisfaction re a problem I have with a dealer/mechanic.
I use an independent mechanic near where I live to service my '99 Catera. Recently I had a problem with the car's idleing. In neutral, it would increase to about 2000, then drop down, then rev up again. People on this site told me that it was probable a vacuum leak or the MAF. I took it to my mechanic. He said that he could not figure it out, and took it to a nearby dealership (near Toronto). The following is quoted from 'my' mechanics bill.
Scan test $79.95
renew mass air senor (no entry)
renew pressure tps switch $339.80
fuel pressure test $60.00
labour $524.70
Part of the above labour charge was undoubtedly my mechanic's.
After picking up the car it ran very roughly and was much less responsive, PLUS it had the same idleing problem.
I complained. My mechanic took it to the dealership.
His bill:
renew mass air sensor $266.64

I don't know what's going on here. It appears that the MAF was the problem all along, and I paid for a TPS switch, and labour, for nothing. I compained to my mechanic. He said he could do nothing.
How should I proceed with this. My hope is to recover some of the funds from the first bill, since it appears that the TPS switch was replaced for nothing.
Thanks,
John

[Kcryan]

Talk to the managers at both, complain, fill out forms, then go to the better buiness bereau, although i dont think what your saying is all that uncommon, sometimes you sort of have to guess and check when fixing strange stuff like this, and i dont think there was any intentional wrong doing on either end. when he starts telling you you need new blinker fluid, and 4 new johnosn rods, as well as a set of muffler bearings, then i would start complaining

[guardian]

I do not know Canadian law, so things could be very different there. Here in the USA anyone, any person, can open a business and represent him or herself as an automobile mechanic. There is not, for example, a government sponsored test one must pass to qualify and open such a business here.

Bearing in mind the above, Catera service (again in the USA) can be problematic even at many CADDY dealers. It is a car very different from most of those they service. Special training is needed to service a Catera properly, competently, and promptly. Cat service experience is also valuable, and there are not THAT many Cateras out there compared with other Caddys, as a percentage of the Caddy population I mean.

But while taking a Cat in for service to "just any" Caddy dealer can be concerning, taking one in to an independent shop can easily be a leap of faith too far. If the independent specializes in Cats, or even in German cars, you might be OK or have a chance. But using as a guide the independent's proven ability to service OTHER marques is wrong, at least in MHO.

Dealer or independent, service providers are human beings and behave as such. They most likely are not, ARE NOT, going to tell you in advance they lack Cat service training, ability, and/or experience. Instead, they will learn Cat service by trial and error on your time and at your expense, while saying nothing beforehand. You end up paying for their education.

Suppose you needed a heart valve operation. Would you more readily trust a doctor who performs one such procedure every few months, or another doctor who does several each week? Well, I would choose the latter.

But how do you know in advance? And how do you know in advance whether a particular mechanic is Cat competent and has worked on many Cats prior to working on yours?

You must ask. And more than that, you must INTERROGATE the mechanic (or doctor) in advance of turning over your Cat and placing it into his or her hands. If you expect them to volunteer their inexperience with Cats, well, God bless you for being such a trusting person. In my view it ain't gonna happen.

All of that having been said, it is too late now and you are where you are, displeased and facing a mini-nightmare. Here in the USA there are small claims courts wherein you might have a chance. Do not know if such things exist north of the border. But you might have to hire another mechanic to provide expert testimony. After all, few judges are Cat service experts. How is the judge to know what has gone on, from a technical standpoint I mean.

Your best arguement in court, it seems to me, is that the mechanic knew in advance he lacked the ability to solve your problem, but took the job anyway. You could ask in court all the questions you should have asked in advance, re Cat experience, etc.. Of course who is to say the mechanic will respond truthfully.

You are in a difficult and frustrating situation. I wish you well as you try to deal with it.

[bengsxr]

hey don't feel to bad when mine started to act up I took it to three different caddy dealers for a total of $2500 bucks and still had the problem so finally I started to work on the car myself and I will tell you I know more about how to fix the catera then any dealer does as does most people on this forum. So the only thing I can say is live and learn meaning go and buy the obd2 code reader and get the books and then with the help of the people of the forum you should be able to tackel any job on the catera and saved alot of money. Ben

[lakesidepark]

You may not be able to get satisfaction. If you do not have the skills and knowledge to diagnose the problem you have to depend on their judgement. A little technical mumbo-jumbo from the mechanic and suddenly this was the proper procedure to diagnose the problem and you have no arguement unless you find someone that knows the Cat, can prove it to the judge, and will testify against the other mechanic (good luck!!). More money. Ain't worth it unless you like litigation and satisfaction is more important than stopping the cash flow.

Get service manuals and learn this car...it is not a car suitable for both the economically-challenged and mechanically-challenged individuals. You need money or skills or a different car.

[shakushinnen]

Thank you all for your replys. I really wasn't looking for support for my contention that someone has screwed up here. That's very clear from the fact that, when I recieved the car, the first time "after it had been repaired", it was doing EXACTLY what it had been doing when I took it in; and after the second "repair", when ONLY the 'mass air flow sensor' had been renewed, did the problem disappear. Common guys, this isn't rocket science. Fixing the car might be, but following the bread crumbs is not.
No, what I was hoping, when I posted on the forum, was that someone could give me some guidance as to what would be the most fruitful avenue to launch a complaint, given that both the mechanic, and the dealership are going to do nothing. Any suggestions?
John

[CadillacSTS2003]

always pay with a credit card...
if they dont fix it and still charge you you call the card company up and denie payment

[Cat-a-Tonic]

Hey Shak'
Seems to me that you've got everything you need to lodge a legal complaint.
The 2nd garage invoice indicated "renew mass air sensor" but the work was not done. Hence no charge. Even though the mechanic knew this procedure was required before proceeding to the second procedure "renew pressure tps switch", which was done and charged for. It's kind of like saying ya have a shimmy at 80 kph and the fix is to balance the tires and torque the nuts. But you just torqued the nuts. BTW what is a TPS switch? Are they saying that the throttle position sensor was defective?? I donno! What is "pressure TPS"?
INCOMPETENCE!!
Did you mean to say you had the Cat at a Cadillac dealer? IF so you can complain to GM canada. Otherwise if the garages are not members of an umbrella automechanic association you'll have to go to small claims court. A lot of garages will back down at the mention of court as it'll cost them more in time and job loss especially if you make the owner and mechanic appear. Go get em.
But I'm no lawyer. Then again I'm not a mechanic either.