Inquiry for Elvin315 Regarding Rotors

[moerome]

I was reading the salvo of the debate between slotted rotors and stock ones you had on another thread (which thread subject escapes me at the moment).

Once I get the $$$$ to afford to do so (I'm doing a lot of reconning on parts), I have experienced that when I was going in for brakes, I was always told that the rotors had to be replaced as well. Later found this to be false once I found to aftermarket stock ones.

I remember reading your mentioning of rebuilding the Pontiac GTO rotors. I'm not brake system savvy, but I'm looking ahead at what would be the best options for me to go with as far as doing the work myself. I do have a brother-in-law who works on cars in general, so I won't be doing it totally solo (unless he can't make the 60 mile trip to my house).

[elvin315]

I haven't actually done the swap yet so take this for what it's worth. The calipers you want are from the 2003-2004 GTO. The guys at the Yahoo Catera Forum have assured me that it's a simple swap. I have performed brake service on my motorcycles and they're identical to car systems except smaller so I'm confident I can do this. It's a dirty, filthy job so wear gloves, eye protection, and a mouth/nose filter (I use the disposable ones).

WARNING: Brake fluid will damage the paint so be careful.

It boils down to removing the banjo bolts for the brake lines, and 2 bolts for each calipers. Remove the Catera caliper. Thoroughly clean the GTO caliper, especially the pistons and the area around their bores. Install one brake pad (the one that sits against the pistons) into the GTO caliper and, using a C-Clamp, push against the pad so the pistons slide back into their bores. This is just so the new pads can clear the thickness of the rotor so you don't have to push them all the way in. Remove the clamp and install the second pad. Slide the caliper assembly over the rotor and bolt it down using the proper torque. Connect the brake hose using new crush washers, add new brake fluid (I suggest a complete flush), and bleed. Done.

Good Luck.

[moerome]

Thanks big guy!!

Once I get the time, $$$$$, and added nerve, I just may delve into this venture. In the interim, I may try my hand at with the slotted rotors. After tax time, hopefully I won't owe as much this year.

Thanks again (and for the tip on the body kits).

[elvin315]

I found my GTO calipers on a GTO forum. Many owners have converted to a big brake upgrade and sell the old brakes to recoup the cost. Very cheap too. I bought mine for $100. The shipping is expensive though. Luckily the seller lived about an hour away so we met halfway. He included the rotors too but since they won't fit on a Catera without other mods I told him to keep them. Shop around and you might find a similar situation.

Elvin

[Warez]

Is the offset on the GTO calipers identical to the Catera calipers and the only difference being the different bolt pattern?

[CateraMV6]

so what is the difference between the Catera and the GTO caliper. I was looking at some pictures and I cant find any difference except I guess the catera seems to have a solid locked caliper with two pistons on either side and the GTO seems to have the single Piston floating caliper design. Someone please explain.

[elvin315]

Originally Posted by Warez

Is the offset on the GTO calipers identical to the Catera calipers and the only difference being the different bolt pattern?

Not sure what you mean by offset but I've been told the GTO calipers just slip right on. The bolt pattern pertains to the discs. The Catera has a 5x110 pattern. The GTO has a 5x120 pattern.

Originally Posted by CateraMV6

so what is the difference between the Catera and the GTO caliper. I was looking at some pictures and I cant find any difference except I guess the catera seems to have a solid locked caliper with two pistons on either side and the GTO seems to have the single Piston floating caliper design. Someone please explain.

According to my brand new Catera shop manual the front calipers are single piston. It's the GTO calipers that are dual piston. The GTO pads are larger for a bigger contact area. Both cars' rotors are 296 mm (11.65 in.).

Elvin

[Warez]

Originally Posted by elvin315

Not sure what you mean by offset but I've been told the GTO calipers just slip right on. The bolt pattern pertains to the discs. The Catera has a 5x110 pattern. The GTO has a 5x120 pattern.

Typo on my part, I meant offset of the rotors no the calipers.

[elvin315]

Originally Posted by Warez

Typo on my part, I meant offset of the rotors no the calipers.

Gotcha. Since the GTO discs have a different bolt pattern you can't use them. You use the Catera discs so the offset stays the same. The GTO calipers will fit over them. It doesn't get simpler. The only question is whether you need a GTO mastercylinder to get the full benefit from the bigger calipers. I don't think it's necessary so I'm not pursuing it but others are. I'm sure they'll report when they have an answer.

Elvin

[CateraMV6]

So what about the front ones are they going to fit or not. IF the rears fit I dont see why we wouldnt be able to swap the front ones or maybe swap the hubs and then the front brakes. The suspension geometry should be the same or at least very coomon... What do you guys think?

[Marks DTM Calib]

Must be talking fronts as the rears are already twin pots......

Interesting upgrade though........we in eurpoe unfortunately dont have a ready supply of the calipers.....

[elvin315]

Originally Posted by CateraMV6

So what about the front ones are they going to fit or not. IF the rears fit I dont see why we wouldnt be able to swap the front ones or maybe swap the hubs and then the front brakes. The suspension geometry should be the same or at least very coomon... What do you guys think?

Let's backtrack. I've never once mentioned the rear brakes. I'm not aware of anyone fitting rear GTO brakes on a Catera. The brakes I'm talking about are the fronts. Since the front brakes of any car do most of the stopping I concentrate on them.

Now, the front brakes we need are from the 2003 - 2004 GTO. Just the front calipers and their mounts. I'm told the later brakes won't fit the Catera. The '03-'04 calipers will mount to the bosses of the Catera's OEM calipers with no modifications. Since the GTO is an Americanized Holden Monaro from Australia, and the Monaro is an Australianized Opel Omega of which the Catera is a clone, the GTO calipers should be an easy swap. A round about way to end up with better brakes but it's all good.

I don't know of any upgrade for the rear brakes other than performance pads and/or the much debated slotted/drilled discs (no drilled/slotted rear discs for the 2001 Sport which have vented rear discs where the base Catera has solid discs). Any disc upgrade front or rear must be for the Catera. The GTO uses a 5x120 lug pattern versus the Catera's 5x110 so even if you could fit them you'd need new 5x120 wheels.

It might be possible to fit GTO suspension parts to allow use of GTO discs fore and aft but since the discs on both Catera and GTO are the same diameter there would be no gain. Any larger discs would have to be from an aftermarket GTO Big Brake upgrade kit. Then you might run into clearance problems between the wheels and calipers. It might be possible but it sounds like an expensive project with no guarantee of sucess.

Elvin

[elvin315]

Originally Posted by Marks DTM Calib

Interesting upgrade though........we in eurpoe unfortunately dont have a ready supply of the calipers.....

Hmmm........you guys get the 5-speed, no 125 MPH limiter, the Sat-Nav, 3.2L engine, and easy access to all the performance goodies and body kits. I don't think our having a supply of bigger calipers is a fair trade but I'll take what we can get.

Elvin