Will the BLS Hurt Cadillac in Europe?

Ralph · #1 (**permalink**) 05-16-05, 06:19 AM

http://www.forbes.com/columnists/col...0308flint.html

"Mercedes-Benz has a problem with its American business because the cost of importing cars from Germany is so expensive due to the strong euro currency. So it goes to its associate Mitsubishi, which builds the Galant sedan in Illinois. Mercedes and Mitsubishi cobble together a modified Galant, with new sheet metal and a nicer interior and with the Mercedes ornament on the hood. They call this car the Mercedes-Benz D 280. They only sell this " MitsubishiBenz" in the U.S. They never ship one to Europe.

"Would you buy this phony-balcony Mercedes? What do you think Car and Driver magazine would say about it?

What do you think the Europeans will think? I'll tell you this for sure: The European auto press, which doesn't like American products anyway, will dump on it. I understand GM's overall logic for pushing Cadillac in Europe. Despite its size, GM doesn't have a worldwide luxury brand. Cadillac is just an American brand, and Opel in Europe is kept out of the luxury segment by Poppa GM. So GM's new short-term goal is to sell 10,000 Cadillacs a year outside of North America. A few years down the line, GM wants to boost that number by several orders of magnitude."

If a BLS sent to America would end up being priced near the CTS, then the CTS sent to Europe should end up being priced near the BLS. Better yet, even if you lowball the development costs and figure it would cost only $100 million to create the BLS, the cost works out to $5,000 per car over 20,000 cars. That would cover a few years' sales. To me, it would make more sense spending that $100 million by knocking $5,000 off the price of the American-built Cadillac CTS to make it more attractive to Europe."

Another benefit of using that $100 million to push the CTS in Europe: GM would be sending a real, made-in-Michigan rear-wheel-drive Cadillac to Europe. I think the CTS would have a lot more appeal than the BLS, which is a worked-over Saab with front-wheel drive. And I see no reason why GM couldn't adopt a good diesel for the CTS in Europe."

Eric2203 · #2 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 03:12 AM

Well I have to say I completely agree with this article. Seems it would have been a lot wiser to export an existing model, even with some work to adapt to different markets. To begin with, it's got to be cheaper than making an entirely new car, even based on an existing platform. That article has a good point when saying that spending the same amount of money on the CTS to make it viable for Europe would give GM a lot more options. Or am I missing something ?

Ralph · #3 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 03:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric2203

Well I have to say I completely agree with this article. Seems it would have been a lot wiser to export an existing model, even with some work to adapt to different markets. To begin with, it's got to be cheaper than making an entirely new car, even based on an existing platform.

We are having a similar discussion in this thread regarding Holden, feel free to offer opinions..............

http://cadillacforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43975

I think this is a good statement by the author......

"I'm troubled by this plan. For starters, the one thing that makes Cadillac special in Europe is that it is Detroit iron. Today's successful Cadillacs are not conservative or known for "understated elegance."

I think "more options" means money saved by offering an existing model, thefore Detroit making the extra sales, and what they could use that money for, etc.

**Playdrv4me** · #4 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 03:37 AM

That BLS was a strange situation altogether... Im really not sure what all came together for it to happen but I agree that the CTS should have gone over there.

In fact, the two vehicles which I feel SHOULD be the anchors for Cadillac in Europe are the CTS and SRX. The Escalade is far too large for most roads in Europe so the SRX is really well positioned to take the market over there.

Eric2203 · #5 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 03:38 AM

Will check that other thread out.

Yes they'd save money. But in the article, they compared the 2 by using the same amount of money the BLS costs to fictionally promote the CTS. Gives interesting results. 100 millions on an existing car makes for a lot of possible improvements, although they merely suggested to reduce the price.

Ralph · #6 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playdrv4me

That BLS was a strange situation altogether... Im really not sure what all came together for it to happen but I agree that the CTS should have gone over there.

In fact, the two vehicles which I feel SHOULD be the anchors for Cadillac in Europe are the CTS and SRX. The Escalade is far too large for most roads in Europe so the SRX is really well positioned to take the market over there.

I agree about the Escalade. For Europe the SRX and CTS are just fine, except they have "wrong hand drive" if they buy one in the UK, and Cadillac could accomodate this issue......

I'm thinking for the likes of Japan, ANY Cadillac is too big??

They are too expensive in Europe for many to consider Cadillacs.

**Playdrv4me** · #7 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralph

I agree about the Escalade. For Europe the SRX and CTS are just fine, except they have "wrong hand drive" if they buy one in the UK, and Cadillac could accomodate this issue......

I'm thinking for the likes of Japan, ANY Cadillac is too big??

They are too expensive in Europe for many to consider Cadillacs.

The Japanese have a ton of big cars, they really like their cars over there. Id say most Cadillacs would be at home on alot of the streets in Japan.

davesdeville · #8 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 02:04 PM

I don't know if $100 million is a good estimate on how much the BLS has cost to develop...

I'll say this about rebadged Cadillacs... the Cimmaron failed not because it was rebadged but because it was a POS. The Catera didn't go over all that well not because it was rebadged but because it wasn't all that spectacular of a car, its design was far from inspired and it couldn't pull off "high perfomance Euro style sedan" either (the high performanc was the hold back there.) We will wait and see if the BLS takes a dive or sells well - it is a pretty spectacular car.

Ralph · #9 (**permalink**) 06-27-05, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davesdeville

the Cimmaron failed not because it was rebadged but because it was a POS.

I completely disagree. I still see dozens of early 1980's Cav's running around and some still w/o rust of any kind!

People were not fooled by an inflated price and a Cadillac badge. Car enthusiasts KNEW it was a Cavalier and NOT a Cadillac!

Cadillacfanatic · #10 (**permalink**) 08-24-05, 05:02 AM

I dont see why the BLS wouldnt do well in Europe,Its related to the Saab 9-3 sports sedan which seems to be a decent seller there,If it was available here in the states id buy one in a second,it would be a great car to drive around in New York City,Im hoping the car does well in Europe and i have faith that it will.

mccombie_5 · #11 (**permalink**) 08-24-05, 06:04 AM

Hmmmm, i will be placing my order for one.

The Saab 9-3 is a dynamic platform shared with the 2002 Vauxhall Vectra a few other cars, so it would be a good choice for the BLS

However, you seem to be overlooking one thing with this thread.....
What does a CTS get to the gallon? I know the Saab 9-3 gets about 30+ and this is also suited to European prices of fuel.
AND as much as I love my STS it certainly doesnt drive like a european car, even though it is a sports model, i cannot feel any tough suspension, a BMW 5 series competed with the STS when it was out new here, and the STS has a floaty ride, its emphisis is on cruising and floating around..... the five series allows you to feel the road...

Thisis what Cadillacs are known for in the EU. If they make a European car into a Cadillac they know it will handle like a European car....

I doubt that Europeans would even like the CTS because it is an attempt at a sporting model, and most American sporting models flop here.....

Will the European press really crap on their own car rebadged???

davesdeville · #12 (**permalink**) 08-24-05, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralph

I completely disagree. I still see dozens of early 1980's Cav's running around and some still w/o rust of any kind!

People were not fooled by an inflated price and a Cadillac badge. Car enthusiasts KNEW it was a Cavalier and NOT a Cadillac!

OK then have I got a deal for you on a 89 Cavalier 4cyl, New Mexico car, no rust, still runs somehow, $2500 USD. You pick it up.

Seriously though the BLS reminds me of the Jag S type 3.0. Its got a Taurus motor in it for crying out loud, but I still see plenty of them on the road.

mccombie_5 · #13 (**permalink**) 08-24-05, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davesdeville

Seriously though the BLS reminds me of the Jag S type 3.0. Its got a Taurus motor in it for crying out loud, but I still see plenty of them on the road.

Exactly! That works but Jaguar was already a well established brand everywhere

It might not sell because its a Cadillac though. Eurpopeans dont like them.....

I could be the only one buying one

Ralph · #14 (**permalink**) 08-25-05, 05:05 AM

The British do tend to be more critical and tough on American cars, so I'm not so sure "enthusiasts" in Britian will welcome a Saab with a Cadillac badge, except you MC.

But I do admit they look ok.

mccombie_5 · #15 (**permalink**) 08-25-05, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ralph

The British do tend to be more critical and tough on American cars, so I'm not so sure "enthusiasts" in Britian will welcome a Saab with a Cadillac badge, except you MC.

But I do admit they look ok.

Haha! Im just snapping at my chance to buy a new RHD cadillac, the 93 Platform is very dynamic, so it will be a very sharp handling car