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Cadillac Audio, Video and Security Systems Discussion, Some navigation questions in Item Specific Cadillac Discussion; ...
  1. #61
    N*Caddy's Avatar
    N*Caddy is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Well … I had high hopes on this highly specialized stereo place I got the contact information from a GM dealer. Well I called the number asked for the guy I was told and turned out to be an aftermarket stereo installer shop (for Cadillac). I actually was more knowledgeable in the field than the guy I spoke with.
    Looks like I am on my own on this…
    So again, anybody can tell me the location of a VCM in a 98 and newer STS, my strategy is to add one on the data bus hoping that’s what the NAV unit looks for.

  2. #62
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    i think the VCM is part of the BCM
    ill check ESI right now

  3. #63
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    wow i was wrong
    it is its own seperate module

    Remove left sound insulator. Refer to Closeout/Insulator Panel Replacement - Instrument Panel (I/P) Lower in Instrument Panel Gauges and Console.
    Remove electrical connector from module.
    Move bottom of module (3) towards brake pedal first and then slide down from bracket (2).

  4. #64
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Quote Originally Posted by CadillacSTS2003 View Post
    wow i was wrong
    it is its own seperate module

    Remove left sound insulator. Refer to Closeout/Insulator Panel Replacement - Instrument Panel (I/P) Lower in Instrument Panel Gauges and Console.
    Remove electrical connector from module.
    Move bottom of module (3) towards brake pedal first and then slide down from bracket (2).
    Do you have a picture/diagram to post for me?

  5. #65
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    sure thing




    info of the specific location according to ESI
    PASS-Key® III Theft Deterrent Module
    Left hand of the instrument panel, right of the steering column

    and heres the pin out for the connector to ensure you have the right one


    Pin
    Wire Color
    Circuit No.
    Function

    A
    ORN
    440
    Fused Output - Battery

    B
    YEL
    1836
    Magnetic Rotation Detection Sensor Signal

    C
    BLK
    1459
    Magnetic Rotation Detection Ignition Key Cylinder Sensor Feed - 12 Volt Reference

    D
    PPL
    1807
    Class 2 Serial Data Line

    E
    PPL
    1807
    Class 2 Serial Data Line

    F
    WHT
    1390
    Ignition Switch Output - Off/Run/Crank

    G
    YEL/BLK
    625
    Starter Enable Control

    H
    BLK/WHT
    451
    Ground

    J
    WHT
    1835
    Magnetic Rotation Detection Sensor Signal

    K
    --
    --
    Not Used

  6. #66
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Some how just by looking to the pin description this VCM does not seem to be it so I am starting with the RIM (the most logical unit). I just borrowed today one ’98 STS RIM from Jake to do the tests. Well I actually tested the NAV unit in one of so many Cadillac he has and connected just to the data port (same way I am testing in my car) fired right up, I got to see for the first time in my life live the NAV unit blue screen with the Cadillac crest in the background. I loaded the firmware and did not beeped (again strange...same like last time in my car) then no image – so far like in my car. Turned the ignition ON and BAM! in 1 second I had the image in the screen. Is funny how with both the original HU and the NAV unit connected to the car bus I was able to control the volume from either one, is actually amusing. But sadly so far in my car still no worky. So in the Adam Savage (Myth Busters) spirit I would say with the ’98 RIM I got 20% chances to turn the NAV unit ON (YAHOOO!), 79% chances no change, 1% chances something that I can not imagine will happen.
    Let’s see…

  7. #67
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Nope the RIM made no difference…
    Back to the VCM, I kind of see what is the problem, if I turn the ignition on it does not receive all the data requested. Say now I realize that all vehicles with NAV have Pass Key III. Can anybody give me more details about this VCM?
    What is the VCM function?
    What is the Magnetic Rotation Detection Sensor Signal?
    Where are these 1459 and 1835 circuits connected?

  8. #68
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Still working on it…
    So back to the VCM, I am unable to locate the darm thing in the car, based on the diagram J posted suppose to be on the center-left side of the dashboard (or at least that’s what I can see in the diagram).
    Anybody knows exactly where the module is and how to get to it?
    Also I need the full electrical diagram of the PassKeyIII circuit witch I assume incorporates the VCM as a central module. Is not like I am planing to get into the “free to me Cadillac business” I am just trying to get this darm NAV unit working.

  9. #69
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Good news, the NAV unit works just fine!
    The bad news it was not in my car, it was eyekandyboats '01 Deville, I just made him the harness (he bought a NAV unit for his car) and since I was there I just tried my unit for the second time. Same conclusion the unit works but not in my car. I got to study the eSI closer to see what I need to put in my car to get it working.
    Also looking for somebody with a '99 and up Eldorado witch happens to have a Denso NAV unit for spare to do a small test for me. Chime in if you can help me on this!

  10. #70
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Talking Re: Some navigation questions

    I GOT IT WORKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Exclusive picture with a WORKING NAV unit outside the car (in fact).



    In the picture you are watching the NAV unit working on bench test.
    All I need to do now is get all this stuff into the car and connect it to the data bus.
    2 years…but is finally working!
    Now the problem is will the RIM be compatible, do I need to change it (along with the speakers again)?

    IS WORKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Not yet in the car but is close enogh.

    Go to minute 2:20 here
    [YOUTUBE]1gjxnxKmaVQ[/YOUTUBE]

  11. #71
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Quote Originally Posted by N*Caddy View Post
    All I need to do now is get all this stuff into the car and connect it to the data bus.


    Now the problem is will the RIM be compatible, do I need to change it (along with the speakers again)?
    Just an educated guess regarding the RIM: I'm thinking since the're Cadillacs with Nav with or without BOSE it will probably work! So is one of those units the VCIM? It'd be cool if it was programmed to receive voice commands, but probably another nightmare in it of itself. Such programming requires the Tech II, letting it know NAV is installed (and thus the voice command subroutine is enabled). The issue would be getting someone to figure out how to tell it what car it's in etc, plus labor.

    So where will you place these items?

  12. #72
    N*Caddy's Avatar
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Well I got the good news part earlier, now I tried it in the car and…
    The 99’ Eldorado RIM is NOT compatible, I need to change with an ’98 and up AMP (I don’t call it RIM cause people will jump on my back).
    Now if I change the RIM…either I keep just the sound processing part of the ’98 and up AMP and disable the actual amplifier so I keep the speakers (the ones with individual amplifiers)…kind of hard to do due to the darm SUB (but not impossible).
    The other solution is to change the whole audio system (again) speakers included with ’98 and up BOSE.
    There is a half a** solution, don’t bother with the AMP disable part just lower the output level (a waste of amplifier) and keep the current speakers (eventually add the SUB – the yaw sensor is in the way but is not a big thing to deal with by no means). Now than I am thinking…I rather disable the amplifier to begin with.
    Having the audio part fixed…with little effort I can get the steering wheel controls working too (just a matter of harness) and have the NAV unit in the car (maybe after 2-3 days of work). There is ONE compromise…I do not get the driver 1 and driver 2 settings. Also the clock will be GPS base (fine by me, is atomic watch precision any way), but not from PCM.
    The driver1 and driver2 is a quite large compromise for me (although I never use driver2 settings is just something that bothers me knowing is not working).
    To overcome this…well involves TechII, I need to solve some communication problems with the RSS module (U1056), the lack of side airbags (expected to be seen on the bus)…basically I would have to completely revamp the electrical system in the car…extensive work to say the least (not impossible though).
    Probably I would get it going first with the Driver1/Driver2 compromise and deal with it as the time will allow me, I need to see the NAV unit in the car, unfortunately this will have to wait 2 months.
    At least at this moment I know everything I need to do witch is a big achievement.
    Also good news for the ’92 and up Cadillac owners I can mount the Denso NAV in ANY Cadillac (including OBDI cars, yes there is no typo, OBDI will work too, BOSE/non-BOSE regardless any way the whole system gets replaced and yes steering wheel controls can be added too as long as the steering wheel is replaced with the one with buttons).
    Now I am in a market for a ’98 and up amplifier…Jake!



    One of the last pictures of the car w/o OEM NAV (in the back is a ’94 STS not related).

  13. #73
    97EldoCoupe is offline Owner of Northstar Performance
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Congratulations Vasi!!!!

    Now I know what I want in my '97 ETC ---- lol

    Vasi - anything you need, it's yours! Would that amp that you brought back to me, work in any way? I have more if that doesn't do the job....

    I'll send you an email regarding my guages in a minute:

  14. #74
    eyekandyboats.inc's Avatar
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    this is fantastic news!.
    see if there is any more stuff you can pull out of the Deville that will work.. But its not BOSE unfortunately.
    Vasi i want to talk with you about a second head unit integration into my deville ( rear seats )

  15. #75
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    Re: Some navigation questions

    Vasi. ODB 1 computer! that gets me excited. because come summer i am going to try to find a low mileage mint 1994 eldorado.... with you help i would like to put nav in it... if i can find another one for roughly 300 bucks!

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