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Cadillac ATS-V Series Forum Discussion, ATS V Introduction Date in Cadillac V-Series Forums; Originally Posted by OldRoadDawg While we are all speculating on the if/when/what engine in the ATS-V, here's a teaser from ...
  1. #46
    M5eater's Avatar
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by OldRoadDawg View Post
    While we are all speculating on the if/when/what engine in the ATS-V, here's a teaser from the May 2014 edition of Motor Trend:

    MT CONFIDENTIAL....
    .... "Speaking of engines we like, GM is playing with our hearts. The wonderful LS-7 V-8 of Corvette Z06 and Camaro Z/28 fame is scheduled to be put down when the limited-run Z/28 goes out, but sources at GM say that's not a done deal and the engine could survive. Where? We're hoping it's the ATS-V+"

    Doncha just love the "coulds" and "hoping" and belief that there will actually be an ATS-V+
    An ATS-V+ isn't really wishful thinking for a Cadillac ready to completly take on zeh germans.

    Enter;
    C63 507
    E90/E92 M3 Competition package
    C63 P31 performance pack
    Audi RS+(although admittedly they normal only do this to the 6 or above)

  2. #47
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by rand49er View Post
    Agreed. But, at that price, it will no doubt come with the LF3 (and not, for example, a boosted LT1). Then, the flaw in that argument, however, is what the heck would power the ATS Vsport assuming there will be one?
    If GM wants to keep the price of the ATS-V as low as possible while putting power over 420hp, the LT1 is much cheaper than the LF3. Cost wise, the OHV V8 is superior to the OHC TT V6. That said when you talk about total weight, center of mass, accessibility/maintenance schedules, expected warranty costs and MTTF you have to start really splitting hairs on a few of those. Add in perceived quality, NVH, and stigmas against pushrod engines, and it gets more obnoxious.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldRoadDawg View Post
    MT CONFIDENTIAL
    .... "Speaking of engines we like, GM is playing with our hearts. The wonderful LS-7 V-8 of Corvette Z06 and Camaro Z/28 fame is scheduled to be put down when the limited-run Z/28 goes out, but sources at GM say that's not a done deal and the engine could survive. Where? We're hoping it's the ATS-V+"
    The LS7 is a lame duck and was when it went into the Z28. If GM wants a 500hp+ N/A engine now they'd just tweak the LT1. It carries a fraction of the price and has better mpg and emissions. The LS7 had its day and it is an amazing engine, but hand building an engine with exotic materials is NOT an easy pill to swallow when most people would never know the difference anyway.
    M5eater likes this.

  3. #48
    Bushidopupil is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    I have been drooling at the mouth for the ATS-V to make it's debut. I want either the TT 3.6 to turn up the boost with or if they by some miracle go with the LT1 that would be golden also. My 11" CTS-V went bye bye and I'm rockin a 13' Altima 2.5 SL LOL..... BUT the money savings has been tremendous ha ha. About 1 year from now I plan to have an ATS-V in my garage.

  4. #49
    Stevo Supremo's Avatar
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Cadillacs too busy coddling there favorite overpriced baby the CTS to give a flying @#$ about the ATS anymore.

  5. #50
    ATSwannabe is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by Bushidopupil View Post
    I have been drooling at the mouth for the ATS-V to make it's debut. I want either the TT 3.6 to turn up the boost with or if they by some miracle go with the LT1 that would be golden also. My 11" CTS-V went bye bye and I'm rockin a 13' Altima 2.5 SL LOL..... BUT the money savings has been tremendous ha ha. About 1 year from now I plan to have an ATS-V in my garage.
    How about both engines.An ATS Vsport with the tt3.6,and an ATS V with the LT1.The Vsport priced at about 57K,and the V priced at about 65K.The Vsport would be a good dailey driver with good acceleration and decent gas mileage.The V would be all out road racer with brutal acceleration and not worry about gas mileage.
    Guy.Seminerio likes this.

  6. #51
    myATS is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    ...and a tuned 3.6TT coud be both.

  7. #52
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    I think people are getting out there with expectations.

    1) As these ATS variants will be in Coupe and Sedan form, the coupes WILL go against Camaro as 2+2. Sure they won't be in the same class or segment - but it's food for thought - as GM is going to price them accordingly... as the ATS has a better interior and more toys than the Camaro, we should expect a realistically similar (or worse!) sliding price scale.

    2) A Camaro SS carries a $10,000 premium over the Camaro V6 - and the V6 in the ATS is the same as the SS. Food for thought.

    3) A Camaro ZL1, which is a counter to the GT500, starts at $55,000 - a $20,000 premium over the N/A V8. Anyone expecting a 470hp ATS to cost "only a few grand more" than a ZL1 may be a little off base. Food for thought.

    4) The "all out road racer" Camaro Z28 starts at $72,000. $17,000 more than the ZL1 with less horsepower. $38,000 more than the Camaro SS. $48,000 more than a Camaro V6 - the same as an ATS V6. Food for thought.

    5) An ATS V6 Starts at $42,000. If we say the "ATS V6" is sorta like the "ATS SS" then a TTV6 ATS would start at $62,000. And the "ATS-V+ All out road racer" with an LT1 would start at $80,000. I'd wager those were both low-ball numbers but more in-line. With Carbon Ceramic brakes and a magnetic suspension that might actually be realistic.

    6) In a few years an ATS Coupe and Camaro Coupe will be on the same line but must be differentiated in terms of pricing, options, and content. GM wants to make sure the two can target different customers and don't cannibalize too many of the other one's sales.

  8. #53
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    I reckon not a lot of cross shopping between the ats and camaro.

    Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

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    ATSwannabe is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by ATSwannabe View Post
    How about both engines.An ATS Vsport with the tt3.6,and an ATS V with the LT1.The Vsport priced at about 57K,and the V priced at about 65K.The Vsport would be a good dailey driver with good acceleration and decent gas mileage.The V would be all out road racer with brutal acceleration and not worry about gas mileage.
    The point I was trying to make here is that Cadillac is already doing this with the CTS Vsport & the CTS V.With the introduction of the ATS as the sporty,performance oriented model it makes sense to put the performance drivetrains in the ATS.The CTS is more the luxury end of the Cadillac line.

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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by ATSwannabe View Post
    The point I was trying to make here is that Cadillac is already doing this with the CTS Vsport & the CTS V.With the introduction of the ATS as the sporty,performance oriented model it makes sense to put the performance drivetrains in the ATS.The CTS is more the luxury end of the Cadillac line.
    If you put an LF3 and an LT1 in the same car, you'd struggle to be able to calculate a measurable difference. Actually the LF3 would probably be the faster car to 60(more available torque in the lower band). There has to be a larger performance delta than 30hp and 20ft/lb of torque. No reasonable or sane person is going to pick the $10K more expensive LT1 simply because it has 2 extra cylinders. That's not how the world works.

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by M5eater
    If you put an LF3 and an LT1 in the same car, you'd struggle to be able to calculate a measurable difference. Actually the LF3 would probably be the faster car to 60(more available torque in the lower band). There has to be a larger performance delta than 30hp and 20ft/lb of torque. No reasonable or sane person is going to pick the $10K more expensive LT1 simply because it has 2 extra cylinders. That's not how the world works.
    Straight line acceleration means little on a challenging track. Look at the recent tests of the Z /28, turbo Porsche and GTR on a track. The V2 was designed as a road racer, not a drag queen. I would imagine that a proper ATS-V would be the same type of animal. Anyone desiring a drag queen could do it cheaper. That is not Cadillac's market. I'll leave it to the engineers to determine if a stressed V6 is better than an optimized n /a V8, with equal or lesser weight and lower center of gravity, for road racing. There are a lot of enthusiasts that don't want to drive an expensive high performance car that sounds like a bumblebee, me included.
    Jud

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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by M5eater View Post
    If you put an LF3 and an LT1 in the same car, you'd struggle to be able to calculate a measurable difference. Actually the LF3 would probably be the faster car to 60(more available torque in the lower band). There has to be a larger performance delta than 30hp and 20ft/lb of torque. No reasonable or sane person is going to pick the $10K more expensive LT1 simply because it has 2 extra cylinders. That's not how the world works.
    I am talking about the 420 hp tt3.6 and the 556 hp cts.There is a big difference in the performance of the cts v and the cts vsport.If you put the 556hp(or more than 600hp)supercharged engine in the ats it would be brutally fast,wheras the 420hp ats would be tame in comparison.

  13. #58
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by ATSwannabe View Post
    I am talking about the 420 hp tt3.6 and the 556 hp cts.There is a big difference in the performance of the cts v and the cts vsport.If you put the 556hp(or more than 600hp)supercharged engine in the ats it would be brutally fast,wheras the 420hp ats would be tame in comparison.
    The CTS-V manages 0-60 in the 3.8-3.9 second range, where the CTS VSport is in the 4.1-4.4 second range - and some have broken 4 seconds. Hardly a massive difference - one is hardly "brutal" and one is hardly "tame. I've driven both and realistically they are both VERY fast cars that are traction limited over anything else. Heck, the hardest part of launching the CTS-V is that it's rear rubber isn't capable of any hard launches or it just breaks loose and spins into oblivion.

    Besides, it's already been shown the LF3's 420hp is underrated.
    2014_cadillac_cts_ill_fe_1028132_600.jpg

    The new LT4 would be straight up overpowered for the ATS-V and would throw the car out of balance. Any rear rubber (335s or 355s) capable of putting that much power down would be so fat they'd make the car ride terribly and it'd handle worse due to the smaller dimensions. Even BMW isn't putting anywhere NEAR that much power in the M3 - and notice the rubber and brakes they're putting on it to keep it under control.

  14. #59
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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by roadpie4u View Post
    The CTS-V manages 0-60 in the 3.8-3.9 second range, where the CTS VSport is in the 4.1-4.4 second range - and some have broken 4 seconds. Hardly a massive difference - one is hardly "brutal" and one is hardly "tame. I've driven both and realistically they are both VERY fast cars that are traction limited over anything else. Heck, the hardest part of launching the CTS-V is that it's rear rubber isn't capable of any hard launches or it just breaks loose and spins into oblivi

    Besides, it's already been shown the LF3's 420hp is underrated.
    Attachment 201497

    The new LT4 would be straight up overpowered for the ATS-V and would throw the car out of balance. Any rear rubber (335s or 355s) capable of putting that much power down would be so fat they'd make the car ride terribly and it'd handle worse due to the smaller dimensions. Even BMW isn't putting anywhere NEAR that much power in the M3 - and notice the rubber and brakes they're putting on it to keep it under control.
    after 60 mph the cts v demolishes the vsport.It turns the 1/4 at about 120mph in low 12 secs.

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    Re: ATS V Introduction Date

    Quote Originally Posted by ATSwannabe View Post
    I am talking about the 420 hp tt3.6 and the 556 hp cts.There is a big difference in the performance of the cts v and the cts vsport.If you put the 556hp(or more than 600hp)supercharged engine in the ats it would be brutally fast,wheras the 420hp ats would be tame in comparison.
    if you put the bugatti W16 in an ATS-V it would be brutally fast too.

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