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Cadillac ATS-V Series Forum Discussion, Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6 in Cadillac V-Series Forums; Originally Posted by JFJr I would love the LS7 in the ATS-V and I would be willing to pay extra ...
  1. #241
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Quote Originally Posted by JFJr View Post
    I would love the LS7 in the ATS-V and I would be willing to pay extra since it is a hand-built engine. If it is going in the Z28, it might make business sense, too. And the best part is that it wouldn't have the DOD and stop-engine-off crap. Paired with the TR6070, highway mileage could be in the mid-to-high 20's. Recall that the LS6 went into the first 2 model years of the initial generation of the CTS-V, so there's precedent. Then we wouldn't have to worry with the embarrassment of a buzzy 6 cylinder engine in a true "V."

    Jud
    The LS7 isn't going to remain in production long enough to make it into the 6th Gen Camaro Z28 - the engine will be dead before then. In regards to the LS6 being in the CTS-V equals a "precedent" for the ATS-V, no. The LS6 was in its day GM's "top dog" engine, later the "top dog" LSA in the current gen. The LS7 will not appear in an ATS-V or CTS-V, end of story. The engine is not only not intended for volume applications, its WAY too expensive, way too rough, and (personally) I don't think the engine belongs in a Cadillac. The engine is a back-fisted brawler chock full of brutally raw power and noise - perfect for a Corvette - but lacks the refinement Cadillac (in theory) needs to market. I loved driving the Z06 when I had the opportunity - but having actually driven one - I don't think it'd be a good fit (and I don't know if the ATS could even accommodate the cooling module...).
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyH
    In the end, I will likely just wait for the Buick Grand National. If it's a ~$30k ATS turbo, I'm all in.
    Not going to happen at that price tag. GM wouldn't even put the "Grand National" sticker on a Regal GS, a ~$40k car (soon to be going up, too) - they're not going to put that name on a $30k car, end of story.
    Of course there is alot of talk of a revived GNX. If the ATS-V bows with a TT3.6, and then they bring on the GNX with the same engine, they will have to make sure the ATS-V has more power.
    If the Grand National is a "we don't even know if we'll make it" from GM, the GNX is even less likely - but if they did make a GNX, it wouldn't have to be restricted to less power than the ATS-V. It'd likely be a low volume production trim (like the ZR1/ZL1/Z28) with a pretty crazy pricetag to match its rarity - and I'd expect them to do a run of 547 cars to match the original. In 87' when a Grand National stickered for $18k, the GNX option added $10k to the car - moving it from a $40k car in today's dollars to a $60k car - and that'd be one hard pill to swallow for a Buick.
    Ancient Mariner likes this.

  2. #242
    bruff1977 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Food for thought... Then I'll fall back. Last year of Undergrad for me.

    If the LT1, LS7, V8TT is deemed too heavy for the Alpha chassis and will theoretically unbalance the handling dynamics of the frame, then why isn't there an uproar regarding the CTS-V3 which we ASSUME will have a larger displacement engine than the LF3 on the same platform?

  3. #243
    mikesul is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Leftlanenews.com said the pricing of the XTS-V Sport would be almost $20K above the base price, hope that isn't the case with the ATS-V using the same 3.6TT.

  4. #244
    M5eater's Avatar
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Quote Originally Posted by bruff1977 View Post
    Food for thought... Then I'll fall back. Last year of Undergrad for me.

    If the LT1, LS7, V8TT is deemed too heavy for the Alpha chassis and will theoretically unbalance the handling dynamics of the frame, then why isn't there an uproar regarding the CTS-V3 which we ASSUME will have a larger displacement engine than the LF3 on the same platform?
    I haven't seen any mention of this, however, the CTS is a larger car, and 200-300 lbs heavier. There's also the fact that, midsized super sedans are not supposed to be agile attack monsters, they're more like a GT .

  5. #245
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Quote Originally Posted by bruff1977 View Post
    Food for thought... Then I'll fall back. Last year of Undergrad for me.

    If the LT1, LS7, V8TT is deemed too heavy for the Alpha chassis and will theoretically unbalance the handling dynamics of the frame, then why isn't there an uproar regarding the CTS-V3 which we ASSUME will have a larger displacement engine than the LF3 on the same platform?
    In the case of the ATS, its not the weight of the powertrain - alpha (and the ATS) can handle it - they simply want to be careful of the location of the center of it for handling and dynamics. The CTS is bigger, heavier, and has different goals.

    Alpha, the platform, has been package protected for just about everything GM has in the powertrain group (except a giant diesel). This includes the weight of the powertrain and the sheer strength required to put that power down to the ground.

    Different vehicles on Alpha will be tweaked to suit their own needs/goals.

    The CTS-V gen3 is going to have plenty of power it needs to put to the ground. Don't worry.

  6. #246
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    drove the XTS V-Sport today, and a stick premium ATS, you can feel some good torque in that boat, and the ATS was so fun and lively, can't wait till t
    hey put that car and that engine together
    Ancient Mariner likes this.

  7. #247
    studio caddi is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Quote Originally Posted by bruff1977
    Food for thought... Then I'll fall back. Last year of Undergrad for me. If the LT1, LS7, V8TT is deemed too heavy for the Alpha chassis and will theoretically unbalance the handling dynamics of the frame, then why isn't there an uproar regarding the CTS-V3 which we ASSUME will have a larger displacement engine than the LF3 on the same platform?
    The next Camaro will have a V8 and it is going to be built on Alpha so we already know that Alpha can handle a V8 !

  8. #248
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    Do you guys remember when someone from the car mags heard what was believed to be an ATS-V prototype going by and said that it sounded "aggressive," or words to that effect? Well, that should be a clue that a V8 is probably in the cards. The TTV6 insect isn't in that league. I just wished Cadillac would get on with it. I guess they need to test a real M3 to make sure the ATS-V thoroughly kicks its ass.

    Jud
    Jud

  9. #249
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Quote Originally Posted by JFJr View Post
    Do you guys remember when someone from the car mags heard what was believed to be an ATS-V prototype going by and said that it sounded "aggressive," or words to that effect? Well, that should be a clue that a V8 is probably in the cards. The TTV6 insect isn't in that league. I just wished Cadillac would get on with it. I guess they need to test a real M3 to make sure the ATS-V thoroughly kicks its ass.

    Jud
    An "aggressive" note may not be a V8 - just aggressive. Sound is in the eye of the beholder and based on personal preference. Many people think the new F1 engines sound like vacuume cleaners - too bad unrestricted they happen to be "vacuume cleaners" with a specific horsepower per liter that'd make any production car weep. Not only that, but tuning an engine has an incredible amount of impact on the engine's sound - look up the Ghost Cam tunes.

    And Cadillac tested the ATS-V against an M3. Welcome to June.

    http://rumors.automobilemag.com/2015...#axzz2VB6gevE8

  10. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadpie4u
    An "aggressive" note may not be a V8 - just aggressive. Sound is in the eye of the beholder and based on personal preference. Many people think the new F1 engines sound like vacuume cleaners - too bad unrestricted they happen to be "vacuume cleaners" with a specific horsepower per liter that'd make any production car weep. Not only that, but tuning an engine has an incredible amount of impact on the engine's sound - look up the Ghost Cam tunes. And Cadillac tested the ATS-V against an M3. Welcome to June. http://rumors.automobilemag.com/2015...#axzz2VB6gevE8
    I don't think the last generation M3 is Cadillac's real target, only all they had at the time. You're right that we can have different opinions about what constitutes aggressive engine exhaust sound; and my opinion is that V6's sound like insects. Why else would Cadillac be messing with a variation of the last generation M5's piped-in engine sound? Putting lipstick on a pig is not acceptable for a real "V."

    Jud
    Jud

  11. #251
    roadpie4u is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    Quote Originally Posted by JFJr View Post
    I don't think the last generation M3 is Cadillac's real target, only all they had at the time.
    It's been said Cadillac beat BMW at their own game with the 3 series. Personally, I prefer the "days of yore" 3 series that were stripped down lightweight corner carving machines. With today's safety features and requirements, that's pretty much impossible in a new car - but I think the ATS handles and rides very well. While GM only could use the last 3 series to benchmark, we now know the direction BMW went with the newest 3 series, and we can realistically infer what the new M3 will be capable of based off its chassis design and the 3 series of the past and what improvements they made from the 328i-335i-M3. As GM buys a brand new 3 series (several, in reality) and meticulously takes them apart bolt by bolt to learn anything they can about their designs - as EVERY manufacturer does - I doubt they'll miss anything.

    In terms of "piped-in engine sound" I totally agree - its one seriously tough nut to crack. With people expecting cars to be quieter than ever and modern DI engines having a "diesel" quality to their notes, it's no shock that manufacturers are fighting NVH for performance and cruising on the highway as the two states are in absolute conflict. This is typically solved one of three ways - fancy stereo stereo technology, resonators that try to increase certain frequencies to pass them into the cabin, or an active butterfly valve in the exhaust system that opens under certain conditions when you "give it the beans". Personally, I believe that a valve is the most ideal, and hope that is the direction GM takes with all of their performance vehicles in the future - it provides a genuine "raw mechanical" sound while also effectively requiring the stock exhaust system provide enough flow to make an aftermarket catback virtually unnecessary (which is great when you mod your car). I like having a good catback - but I've yet to have small kids or females that loved that loud drone on the highway. On my grandprix (ZZP downpipe, GMPP catback) it made the backseat effectively unhabitable on the highway due to resonance. I won't dare risk that in my ATS.

  12. #252
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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    IMO there is nothing better sounding than a healthy V8 with an decent exhaust setup, but again I think there's been enough press on the matter of the ATS-V by now to leave little doubt that it'll be a TT V6 powering it - in whatever state of tune. And as already established in the XTS, GM "enhances" the exhaust sound there with piped in speaker enhancement. This DI engine note is definitely distinctive, and not in a good way IMO, and I've no previous experience with such to know if a purely mechanical solution can actually help improve things there.

  13. #253
    JimmyH is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    The G35 sedan has a very aggressive sound. Doesn't make it pleasing or a V8.

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    Well, riding lawnmowers sound aggressive, too, but I don't think that a car mag guy would envision that engine in the top of the line, real "V" model, either; therefore, I don't think that the passing prototype was confused with a TTV6 insect. However, I'm sure that it would be a good subject for Tool Time. Ha haa!

    Jud
    Jud

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    Re: Cadillac ATS-V is probably getting a twin turbo 3.6 liter V6

    This whole insect vs arachnid thing may have already been decided by GM ... we may just be farting in the wind. It reminds me of the discussions on this forum of the '09 CTS-V powerplant ... those were epic.

    I'm reading stuff about the '14 CTS, and it's really good ... REALLY good. We should not be disappointed if the ATS-V comes with the TTV6, because it should exceed the very capable CTS-Vsport, and that would mean the CTS-V is gonna be one very incredible car. This is ALL going to be good ... REALLY good.
    '05 CTS-V, Maggie, Kooks, Hotchkis, Ground Control, Corsa, B&M, DSS/Hendrix, Full 3M Clear Bra, Autovation, V Headrests, CTS Console, STS-V 55w Fogs, Black Vette FRCs, Specter Werkes, Katech LS9 Clutch, SS Brake Lines, Heavymetals U-Turn Fuel Line Eliminator, Momo Combat Evo Shift Knob, Wldwhl Clear Sidemarkers, Linea Corse LC855 Wheels or OEM wheels w/'06-'07 Center Caps, plus a couple more. 472 RWHP/411 RWTQ (Mustang Dyno).

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