Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?
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Cadillac ATS Technical Discussion Forum Discussion, Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs? in Cadillac ATS Discussion Forums; Who knows the RPMs-shift points relationship when in sport mode?...
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    Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Who knows the RPMs-shift points relationship when in sport mode?

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    1-2 shift at 30 mph 6,600 rpm
    2-3 shift at 55 mph 6,600 rpm
    3-4 shift at 92 mph 6,600 rpm

    2-1 downshift 25 mph
    3-2 downshift 50 mph
    4-3 downshift 87 mph

    All shift points and mph are same for all modes! I believe the firmness is only difference! I will look

    ----------

    Those are WOT

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ihuntv8 View Post
    1-2 shift at 30 mph 6,600 rpm
    2-3 shift at 55 mph 6,600 rpm
    3-4 shift at 92 mph 6,600 rpm

    2-1 downshift 25 mph
    3-2 downshift 50 mph
    4-3 downshift 87 mph

    All shift points and mph are same for all modes! I believe the firmness is only difference! I will look

    ----------

    Those are WOT
    Are those for the car on a flat road with WOT? What about if the engine is under a heavy load (like going up a mountain)?

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ihuntv8 View Post
    1-2 shift at 30 mph 6,600 rpm
    2-3 shift at 55 mph 6,600 rpm
    3-4 shift at 92 mph 6,600 rpm

    2-1 downshift 25 mph
    3-2 downshift 50 mph
    4-3 downshift 87 mph

    All shift points and mph are same for all modes! I believe the firmness is only difference! I will look

    ----------

    Those are WOT
    Sorry, I am a little naive about understanding these shift points and need a little more explanation. For example, are you saying that in order to reach 30mph, one has to rev up to 6000 rpm and then keep it there (foot on the pedal) to go through gears 2-4 while achieving 92mph? Also, where are gears 4-5, 5-6? My car is an automatic tranny.

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    His numbers are for WOT (wide open throttle) which is essentially the accelerator pegged to the floor. This would be the high end of the range for some particular engine loading (I think). To find the low end of the range, one would need to "baby" the car (give it the most gentle throttle).

    Also, those downshift MPH numbers are extremely high, it seems. I have spent quite a bit of time "training" my car to downshift at higher speeds to keep it from running away on the many hills here. It did learn. On one big hill near home, when I first got the car I had to ride the break all the way down. I spent some months just using the manual shifting option on my automatic transmission to teach the car to hold a lower gear when going down hills. Now I can go down that hill (and many other ones, too) in automatic without having to touch the break.

    Nevertheless, even my newly-trained car still does not downshift as high as what Ihuntv8 indicates. The RPMs required to go to second at 50 mph and go to first at 25 mph are astronomical.

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Sorry give me a second and I will try and explain better, javagirl is correct, those are wide open throttle shift points when car is left in any mode (sport,touring,snow)and car is NOT in tap to shift mode! Obviously you can over ride those numbers by being in DoD mode-(tap to shift or driver on demand)

    ----------

    I will take pictures and show exactly the shift points vs throttle position vs rpm vs load

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Here is a picture of upshift and downshift vs tps vs shift for normal mode!
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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    This is pattern A-which is sport mode, as u can see the MPH from Normal(touring mode) vs sport mode (pattern a) there is no difference, I will dig into this more later And figure out if there is a timing difference, or if maybe shift inertia changes between modes

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    those are downshift I believe are PAL related when im driving hard and use heavy braking cornering i achieve those downshift levels
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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Hey Ihuntv8 those are great tables! How did you get them?

    I am having trouble imagining a scenario where the car would downshift 3->2 @ high throttle position %. All I can come up with is the car is essentially coasting on a flat area in a certain gear, and then you floor the accelerator and the car starts downshifting.

    By the way, those numbers were probably true for my car at one time, but no longer are after I have "trained" it to not run away when going downhill. At 0% throttle, my car now will hold first to somewhere 10-15 MPH, second to 20-25 MPH, third to about 35-40 MPH, and fourth to I don't know how high because now my car will not shift to 5th at 0% throttle for any of the hills around here.

    So, I know from experience that the car can be taught over a period of several months using DoD mode to change what it does, and it later remembers this new training when you go back to fully automatic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Siren05 View Post
    those are downshift I believe are PAL related when im driving hard and use heavy braking cornering i achieve those downshift levels
    Oh yeah, that could be it! They do seem high to me...

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Generally the changes for sport mode as far as shifting is concerned is as mentioned, slightly increased firmness and decreased shift times. RPM based shift points don't generally change at WOT, but part throttle patterns are often altered quite a bit.

    Javagirl, those appear to be hptuners screenshots. There is lots of cool stuff to see in there
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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Yes there are several more tables to take into factor with load on decel and accel

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ihuntv8 View Post
    Yes there are several more tables to take into factor with load on decel and accel
    Okay, that makes sense based on differences I think I have felt driving around including up hills (more engine loading).

    I think the bottom line to answer flycaster's question is, "It is VERY complicated." Right?
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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaGirl View Post
    Okay, that makes sense based on differences I think I have felt driving around including up hills (more engine loading).

    I think the bottom line to answer flycaster's question is, "It is VERY complicated." Right?
    Agreed. Here's what I'm trying to get at: Car is in manual shift mode, I step on the gas, and as I accelerate, at what rpms do I optimally manually shift from 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6?

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    Re: Sport mode: Shift points' RPMs?

    Quote Originally Posted by flycaster View Post
    Agreed. Here's what I'm trying to get at: Car is in manual shift mode, I step on the gas, and as I accelerate, at what rpms do I optimally manually shift from 1-2, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6?
    Since you are in FL you can assume the car is on a flat road. In that case, it will only depend on how far down you push the accelerator (assuming your car has not adaptively learned new shift points, and that PAL has not recently engaged in the last 10 seconds or so). In this case, you can use the awesome up-shift table provided by Ihuntv8 above.

    ----------

    For example, if you push the accelerator half of the way down, you will be at 50% throttle. Read across the table to the column for 50%. Then read down that 50% column to see the shift points are at 14 MPH for 1-2 shift, 26 MPH for 2-3 shift, et cetera.

    ----------

    Oh, wait... Are you asking about manually shifting the car yourself? In that case, do whatever you like. If you shift at lower RPMs (let's say no more than 2000 or so) you will save gas. If you shift at higher RPMs, you will accelerate much faster.

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