***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!
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Cadillac ATS General Discussion Forum Discussion, ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!! in Cadillac ATS Discussion Forums; I am officially welcoming myself to this forum. It has come to my attention that this is one of the ...
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    optimus prime is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    I am officially welcoming myself to this forum. It has come to my attention that this is one of the (better) Cadillac forums, but that is not saying much. Now, this website is missing something, something big that Mr. Schafer at bimmerfest has that this website doesn't. DEALER COMMENTARY. I'm not a dealer and we don't need dealers here, we just need info. I will be in the market to trade in my CTS for an ATS in the near future, and I don't want to get screwed on the deal.

    Now, you minions seem to think it is customary to go on cadillac.com and find the "lease deals" of the month. IT DOESN'T work that way. We need money factors and residuals. We need solid offers over invoice (i.e.: 500 over), and for that we need invoice pricing. There is an independent website that allows you to build bmw's and find their invoice online, why isn't there one for Cadillac??? Come-on if you are going to compete with BMW you need to start acting that way. Some one needs to help out and find out if there is hold back on these deals (when we deal with BMW we typically blackmail them for CSI points).

    So, how is this going to work? Well when you go to Jim-Bob dealership and he tries to sell you the car at MSRP, you tell him you want to see the invoice sheet. We deal not at MSRP minus but at invoice plus. We must, must, must find the TRUE invoice on these cars (edmunds, et al. suck balls for this). Next, we must find the incentives that Cadillac is offering (is there a loyalty program?). Next, we need to post monthly money factors and residuals. For those that buy, we need finance rates. Dealers will try to screw you, we need to squeeze every penny out of them and find the good dealers in each region. We will always refuse to pay DOC fees over $200 and tell dealers with "dealer fees' to go f' themselves.

    Let's get the ball rolling. We need numbers, informed buyers are happy buyers. I don't want to get screwed and either should you. We can be a communty, we can lead the charge and let everyone else get screwed on their purchase, but we can only do this if we work together. Who's with me?
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    optimus prime is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Ok, first data point:

    24 month / 10k per on a ATS 3.6 is .0013 and 70%

    36 month / 10k per is .0017 and 62%

    Some one may need to confirm or deny these numbers.
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    bmw2caddy is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    I agree with you, I spent a good year and half probably on the 1addicts board before purchasing my 2009 bmw 135 at $100 over invoice. I was able to do that mostly because of all the information on the board with invoice prices etc. It was a huge asset to me to have that forum. Would be great to have that here as well.
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    JSATS is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    There are plenty of sites to build your own Caddy that will show you MSRP along with invoice pricing. Edmunds .com is a good one to start with. I don't need any dealer to tell me what I should be paying for a car I know that price before I even walk into the dealership.
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    idmd is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    I agree knowledge is power but will throw one caveat out there. Just like customers don't like being screwed neither do sales people. There is a "fair" price that can be negotiated - fair for everyone involved.

    I have some family and friends who sell cars and most aren't out to screw people. Most freely admit that with the Internet telling all their secrets even their first offer is pretty good, not much above invoice, especially if they're a "volume" dealership.

    A couple have also said they ignore the super aggressive buyers who at the end of the day are going to argue over $25 when they are already legitimately getting a good deal.

    None of these people are wealthy and they too need to make a living so as I said the goal should be a fair price for everyone involved.
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    The Tony Show's Avatar
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by optimus prime View Post
    I am officially welcoming myself to this forum. It has come to my attention that this is one of the (better) Cadillac forums, but that is not saying much. Now, this website is missing something, something big that Mr. Schafer at bimmerfest has that this website doesn't. DEALER COMMENTARY. I'm not a dealer and we don't need dealers here, we just need info.

    Now, you minions seem to think it is customary to go on cadillac.com and find the "lease deals" of the month. IT DOESN'T work that way. Some one needs to help out and find out if there is hold back on these deals (when we deal with BMW we typically black male them for CSI points).

    Dealers will try to screw you, we need to squeeze every penny out of them and find the good dealers in each region. We will always refuse to pay DOC fees over $200 and tell dealers with "dealer fees' to go f' themselves.
    So with just your second post on the forums, you manage to insult the forum itself, our members AND the dealers we have here providing helpful information.

    Gee, welcome aboard. I can't wait to see what other insightful commentary you have waiting in the wings.
    C&C and C&C like this.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)
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    Atswatcher is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Quote Originally Posted by optimus prime
    Ok, first data point:

    24 month / 10k per on a ATS 3.6 is .0013 and 70%

    36 month / 10k per is .0017 and 62%

    Some one may need to confirm or deny these numbers.
    Why knock everyone? Edmunds was the first to provide the above numbers. I found Edmunds forums very helpful.
    cdp and cdp like this.
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    C&C
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Brand new member (comes in with 'both guns a blazing'); not too impressed. If the dealer lets the car go (for the negotiated price) and the buyer is willing to pay the negotiated price, then, that's what they call a deal; no, fair this/fair that. If no price is negotiable, then there are other vehicles/deals about.
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    optimus prime is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Tony,

    There is no need to get hostile. I'm merely trying to make this forum a better place. These car forums serve three purposes on the web: distributing the best info on new car pricing, talking about the cars and mods, and discussing future models. You are doing the latter two quite well, but the first one is severely lacking. I just clicked on another post about "leasing" and do you know what they were discussing? The $350 lease "special" on the cadillac website. Give me a break, a 2 year old could do that. That is not how you lease a car!

    Now, we need the following (in addition to the other stuff I mentioned previously):

    1) List of volume dealers who have invoice plus structures in each region of the US. (if there are dealers on this website, who are they?, and do they offer this?)

    2) Are there MACO fees or training fees on Cadillacs?

    3) What is the buy rate on the current lease acquisition and money factor (townhalltalks over at edmunds is a good source to begin with).

    4) Is there a performance center delivery like BMW? This is not only awesome but allows people to buy out of market and get better deals than the schmucks around the corner will offer.

    There are many other questions we can and need to address. Walking into a dealership uniformed is likely to cost you $$$$$. Do you want that happening to your forum members? It takes me 45 minutes to buy a bummer and it is completely stress free thanks to the big BMW forums, buying a Cadillac should be the same if you want to held to the same standards. And to the poster who thinks Edmunds has the right invoice, it's not the same for BMWs so why would it be the same for Cadillac?
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    go buy your new ATS and pay what is fair to you. Find a dealer willing to play the game. Done. Enough with the rant - we've heard it before.

    F
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    investor74 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Optimus, not commenting on your post, but just wanted to let you know that the word "blackmail" is spelled like I have it here, not like you have it in the second paragraph of your first post. Someday that will be important to you.
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    optimus prime is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    And to the dealers on this website, here's a food for thought. A certain BMW salesman in California sells 40-50 cars a month in the most saturated auto market in the US. Wrap your head around that 40-50 cars a month, every month in southern California (where there are more BMW dealerships than Mcdonalds). Would you like to know why? Forums like these. Offer the best pricing in the region, advertise yourself here, and be transparent with the customers. That gets you very far in the auto business. And yes, Edmunds is a very good primary source, but when it comes straight from the pig's mouth per se, it's even better.

    Ok, I'm off my rant and back to work. Everyone can say all they want about me, but I'm speaking the truth and hopefully you will all come to your senses.
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    optimus prime is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by investor74 View Post
    Optimus, not commenting on your post, but just wanted to let you know that the word "blackmail" is spelled like I have it here, not like you have it in the second paragraph of your first post. Someday that will be important to you.
    Yes, my bad. It's fixed. Thank Apple for that.
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    The Tony Show's Avatar
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by optimus prime View Post
    Tony,

    There is no need to get hostile. I'm merely trying to make this forum a better place.
    I'm not the one who came in here and proclaimed "You guys are the best Cadillac forum, but that's not saying much", then called our members "minions" and suggested that dealers are scumbags who aren't entitled to a profit and should be blackmailed out of their profit ( <- your words).

    We have awesome dealers here like Rippy Cadillac and Linsday Cadillac who assist our members with technical knowledge and plain answers regarding pricing of parts and services. Any information we need can be obtained by simply asking, without the need to blackmail them and call them names like "schmucks" or telling them to "f themselves". That kind of acrimony might fly at your BMW forum, but not here.

    Try getting to know your fellow forum members and dealers before you come in here announcing you have a better way of running things.

    Quote Originally Posted by Optimus Prime
    ...It takes me 45 minutes to buy a bummer ...
    Best typo ever.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)
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    The Tony Show's Avatar
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    Re: ***Official ATS Monetary Matters*****!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by investor74 View Post
    Optimus, not commenting on your post, but just wanted to let you know that the word "blackmail" is spelled like I have it here, not like you have it in the second paragraph of your first post. Someday that will be important to you.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)
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