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Cadillac ATS General Discussion Forum Discussion, Prices Added to ATS Configurator in Cadillac ATS Discussion Forums; Originally Posted by CaddyFanFL Well, you claimed before that they would be sharing "everything". I don't see that - especially ...
  1. #31
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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by CaddyFanFL View Post
    Well, you claimed before that they would be sharing "everything". I don't see that - especially no V6 on the Fusion.

    I still don't see a reason why an ATS should cost as much as a CTS or an XTS. It is a small car with limited features and options. Just bumping up the price-level to match that of a 3-series but ignoring the fact that you can get an XTS for the same amount of money is going to cause some problems. I certainly don't see a reason why a small sport-sedan should cost as much as a better equipped luxury-sedan (XTS).

    BMW or Mercedes aren't selling their 3- or C-series at 5- or E-series prices, either..
    So I guess you just get in a car and ride it? Why not compare the options list between an Escalade Platinum and a CTS-V? The XTS is on a LaCrosse platform. If you think the ATS will drive anything like it, go buy a Lexus and continue to never know what a driver's car is...

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by CaddyFanFL View Post
    Just to be perfectly clear: I think the ATS is a great car and it was on my list as well - it might still be because I don't know as of today what the 2014 CTS is going to deliver. Even when I used the configurator and came up with the relatively high price, I also said to myself "well, at BMW, you wouldn't pay less, either - and the rebates/incentives on the ATS are probably higher, too."

    Then - just for fun, I decided to build an XTS Premium AWD - and found out that it was just about the same price. I couldn't believe it. I mean, the XTS Premium is certainly well equipped...

    So I decided to wait for the new CTS. that will probably deliver the best of both worlds.
    The days of the undercutting competitors by a huge margin are gone.

    Cadillac's renaissance started with the '03 CTS. It was targeted to steal sales from the Germans midsize and entry levels...for an entry level price. Then, many improvements were made with the '08.

    Now that Cadillac has made dents in the market, bringing in a true entry level, 3 series fighter with a larger CTS it's time to price accordingly.

    The ATS is a no compromise car. That's why it's priced higher. The new CTS will be an evolution of the Gen2. Without compromise, it will also be priced higher. If you think the 2014 CTS will be priced the same as the current one, dream on.

    It's also why when they come out with the Omega chassised car, it will be well above DTS and current XTS pricing.
    concorso and concorso like this.

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    concorso is offline Cadillac Owners Master
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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    I dont understand why this is so difficult to understand. The reason BMW and Mercedes dont have this pricing problem is due to those brands having 3 properly spec'd and defined levels of car. The reason the CTS and ATS are so close in price is due to the CTS being a straddler at present, great car, but underspec'd compared to regular 5-series. The ATS looks to be a dead-on competitor to the 3. It demands a higher price. Just for fun, add Brembos/MRC/and CUE and a few other options to a package, and watch the price of the CTS jump 7-10k.

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    Thank you- someone gets it. A loaded ATS has WAY more than a loaded CTS.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tony Show View Post
    Thank you- someone gets it. A loaded ATS has WAY more than a loaded CTS.
    More than a CTS? Maybe. More than a loaded XTS? Nope.

    Magnetic Ride Control? Not available on the ATS AWD. The XTS AWD, however, has it. Brembo Brakes? XTS has it, too.

    At the same price, the ATS lacks: 14-Speaker Bose-system, ventilated seats, heated rear-seats, the "real" CUE, 3-zone A/C, sunshades, power steering-column and electric glovebox door.

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    So I guess you just get in a car and ride it? Why not compare the options list between an Escalade Platinum and a CTS-V? The XTS is on a LaCrosse platform. If you think the ATS will drive anything like it, go buy a Lexus and continue to never know what a driver's car is...
    I owned a 2006 BMW M5 in the past - so I guess I know what a "driver's car" is. However, BMW never went crazy on their pricing WITHIN THE BRAND. $55K on the ATS would be appropriate for the V-series - but not for the standard V6 (unless Cadillac would adjust their prices within the brand). And neither BMW, Mercedes nor Audi price their 3-series, C-Class or A4 at a level that you can get a better equipped 5-series, E-Class or A6 for the same amount of money (UNLESS we are talking about M, AMG or S). And I'm talking about the comparison between the ATS and XTS. The XTS is not an old car that will be replaced any time soon like the CTS - so that argument doesn't fly.

    What makes things worse is that the XTS is Caddy's entry into the luxury-segment. Right now, it's their biggest sedan. At a size of more than 200", you can almost make the case that it is Cadillac's 7-series, S-Class or A8. Now, imagine a 3-series at a price of a better equipped 7-series. Or a C-Class priced like the S-Class. Rather funny...

    You see, I needn't look at the prices of the European competition. There is something wrong within the brand itself. And once the new CTS launches, I certainly expect a higher price than the current one. But IMO, Cadillac doesn't have much room on that one. The CTS will be smaller than the XTS so an equally equipped CTS mustn't cost more than the XTS. The V-series, of course, is on a different level.

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    Is a fully loaded Regal GS more than a 2013 MKZ? Because you pay less for a gussied up Fusion. Your post shows how uninformed you are on this car...
    An individual who thinks it's smart to price an entry sports sedan as high as the brand's luxury sedan shouldn't judge others in the first place.

    I can already smell the high incentives they have to give on this car once the new car excitement has worn off.

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by caddyfanFL
    The CTS will be smaller than the XTS so an equally equipped CTS mustn't cost more than the XTS. The V-series, of course, is on a different level.
    A Z4 Sdrive35i can get up to $65,000, but you don't hear people moaning that it should be less than a 535i because "it's smaller". Size has nothing to do with it, but rather cost to build. That cost can go into luxury, performance, or a mix of the two. Sometimes the exotic materials that go into a proper small car can take the price up near or equal to larger vehicles.

    Cadillac's technology has moved so fast, the V isn't really on "another level" anymore. Outside of the supercharged truck engine (and that's what it is), everything that makes the CTS-V special is on the ATS- Magnetic ride, Brembos, leather wrapped dash, sport seats, etc. The ATS trumps even the V with its CUE system (compared to the now outdated Nav in the CTS-V), heads up display and more.

    Comparing the ATS to the XTS based on price is folly. One is a purpose built RWD sports sedan on a clean sheet chassis with extensive weight saving measures through expensive materials, while the other is a FWD luxury cruiser built off an existing GM platform whose R&D costs have already been recouped by other models.

    As Jim pointed out, just because the CTS-V and the Escalade are both $75,000 doesn't mean one is better or one is priced wrong. ATS and XTS are polar opposites that happen to have overlapping price points if you equip each one in a certain way. Plenty of other brands have overlapping price points inside their own line simply because that's how much it costs to build the cars- it's not like they just pull these MSRPs out of a hat, you know.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tony Show View Post
    A Z4 Sdrive35i can get up to $65,000, but you don't hear people moaning that it should be less than a 535i because "it's smaller". Size has nothing to do with it, but rather cost to build.
    On the Z4, it's not just cost to build. It's rather the cost to build divided by the low volume of this car. Now IF Cadillac is planning on selling less of the ATS compared to the XTS, I'm with you - but if they want this car to be a success, I'm guessing they want to sell quite a few of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tony Show View Post
    Sometimes the exotic materials that go into a proper small car can take the price up near or equal to larger vehicles.
    And what materials would that be on the ATS?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Tony Show View Post
    Comparing the ATS to the XTS based on price is folly. One is a purpose built RWD sports sedan on a clean sheet chassis with extensive weight saving measures through expensive materials, while the other is a FWD luxury cruiser built off an existing GM platform whose R&D costs have already been recouped by other models.
    So on the ATS, I need to pay for the development while others already did that for me on the XTS? I guess that answers the question which car has the better value. And BTW, that's what I'm talking about the whole time.

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    Okay then, how about the Miata? Mazda sells a metric ton of those, yet it still costs more than the larger and fancier Mazda3. Reason? Lightweight materials cost money, especially when they're custom made for a specific car.

    Look, we can go round and round all day. ATS will be offered in a Turbo Manual for under $40k, a tremendous value in its class. If you don't find value in a RWD car that's lighter and more powerful than the 3 series with AVAILABLE (key word) luxury items like CUE and HUD, then by all means buy an XTS. Value is a relative term, and if you feel like the bigger trunk, softer ride and fancier interior justify a $55k sticker more than 3400lbs, magnesium paddle shifters and an all new world class chassis with magnesium and structural adhesives, then ATS isn't your car.
    Rest in Peace, J.D. (aka Dirt_Cheap_Fleetwood)

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    It's not that I don't like the ATS - just check out the initial reaction of some other users on page 1 of this thread. One user stated that the ATS should've topped out at 45K. I'd even OK a fully loaded one at $50K but $55K?..

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Is the ATS coming with the IPad like the XTS/

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    Quote Originally Posted by CaddyFanFL
    It's not that I don't like the ATS - just check out the initial reaction of some other users on page 1 of this thread. One user stated that the ATS should've topped out at 45K. I'd even OK a fully loaded one at $50K but $55K?..
    Because you're used to cost cutting. This car looks to be as good, or better than, the C class/3 series.

    Sorry you don't understand what it takes to actually build a car. The XTS is on an affordable LaCrosse platform that has been out for years. That's why you can pack it full of gadgets for that price.

    But, hey, you've owned a 2006 M5 so you "know" what a driver's car is. lol

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    Besides, a 3 series is not entry level. It has prestige as THE sports sedan. People don't cross shop it with the 5 and 7s.

    No one is going to cross shop an ATS and XTS.

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    Re: Prices Added to ATS Configurator

    Quote Originally Posted by CaddyFanFL View Post
    It's not that I don't like the ATS - just check out the initial reaction of some other users on page 1 of this thread. One user stated that the ATS should've topped out at 45K. I'd even OK a fully loaded one at $50K but $55K?..
    Having trouble understanding the logic here. If ATS did not offer the Driver Assistance Package, for example, it would top out at $52K, not $55K, so that is better, right? The ATS should offer fewer options so that the fully loaded price is lower?

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