Best Allante to buy?

[AJB2323]

Well I am in the market for an Allante for the summertime and was wondering which model year is the best. I'd perfer a 1993, just so my 2 Cadillacs can be the start of a collection of "last model years". I originally wanted a 96-98 Eldorado Convertible cause I fell in love with a white one with blue interior on CarDomain.com. But then realized afterwards that its custom. So then I was looking online and I found the Allante and fell in love with it. And the leg room is comprable to the my Fleetwood and head room is about .7 shorter but thats all good cause its a convertable (got this info from Consumer Guide). I'm about 6'6/6'7, so leg room and head room is my main concern when purchasing a car.

[Sandy]

A 1993 as it has the Northstar V-8, with the hardtop in:-

Mary Kay Pink = 17 made
Pearl Flax = 88 made
Teal Green =151 made
Montana Blue = 149 made

Happy LOOOOOOking !

The rest are all too common for my tastes....black, white red, maroon, silver.

Pearl Flax Below:-
http://www.cadillacforums.com/photop...x_Yellow_a.jpg

Mary Kay Pink Below:-
http://www.cadillacforums.com/photop...llante-med.JPG

[Allante North *]

I personally like the "93" but you will get arguments from all Allante owners on what they like. The 1987 because it was the first year produced. The 1990 1/2 because it got a mid year change in the top latching mechanism and some other goodies. The 1993 because of the Northstar and last year produced.

I would be glad to assist you in your search if you like, as I always like to see whats out there and I really enjoy the hunt. Let me know if I can help you in any way.

[Playdrv4me]

It seems almost like there are two camps with the Allante, those that are on the 87-92 side of the fence, and those that are on the 93 side. Many argue that in typical GM fashion, GM "cheapened" the Allante in its final year of production despite giving the wonderful Northstar engine. For example the pre 93 has the true expensive Recaro seats where the 93 has the standard GM issue softies. Wheel caps on the 93 are plastic where they might be metal on those before... Honestly? I dont think it really matters.

The difference of the Northstar is enough to make up for those small differences IMO. Additionally, the interior and some of the exterior of the 93 just LOOKS more modern and pleasing to the eye in some respects. Those seats for example, despite being regular GM seats, are more modern looking and really the truth is overall its the same great car. My preference (not that it matters), a 1993 in White Diamond with Chrome Wheels. Hell yes.

Another point on Allantes, they seem to be GAINING value rather than losing it like most domestic cars of the same era. Check THIS out, this car may be in tip-top shape, but this guy is asking 34 grand for it, rediculous, but someone just might pay it.

[ckucia]

I own an '89 with the 4.5.

I do like the Northstar. A lot. However, if you check prices, it tends to come at a premium, whether because it is the Northstar, or because '93 was the final year of Allante production.

If I could pick any Allante, I would be torn between a '91/'92 and a '93. By '91/'92, as with most model runs, just about all of the production issues were sorted out, and all the refinements had been integrated into the line. With '93's, you're getting newly revised electrical and other systems, and the first-year run of the powertrain.

The performance differences between the 4.5 and N* really weren't that vast, especially when you consider where the torque peaks are. As the saying goes, HP sells cars, but torque wins races. While the N* had 295HP @ 5600RPM vs the earlier Allante's 200HP @ 4400RPM, the N* torque peak of 290lb-ft occured at 4400RPM, vs the 270lb-ft @ 3200 RPM of the 4.5. When you add it that the '93 Allante weighed 300lbs more than the previous model years', I don't know if the extra $$ you pay for a Northstar is worth it if you're only looking for performance.

I can tell you my 4.5 barely, if ever gets wound up to 5600 RPM. It probably would get up there if I drove at 100MPH, but I don't spend much time up there, even though the Allante can easily do more. I'd easily give up 20 lbft to get my torque peak 1200rpm lower, especially with 300 less pounds to haul around, but I'm an old-school pushrod guy at heart - I want my torque and I want it down low in the RPM band where its usable at a stoplight.

The Recaro seats in the pre-'93s are also pretty darn awesome.

I do like the colored softtops and some of the colors that came on '93's...

[El Dobro]

I did some research before I bought one and the deciding factor for me was the brake system. That's why I bought a '93.

[Stealth]

Originally Posted by AJB2323

Well I am in the market for an Allante for the summertime and was wondering which model year is the best. I'd perfer a 1993, just so my 2 Cadillacs can be the start of a collection of "last model years". I originally wanted a 96-98 Eldorado Convertible cause I fell in love with a white one with blue interior on CarDomain.com. But then realized afterwards that its custom. So then I was looking online and I found the Allante and fell in love with it. And the leg room is comprable to the my Fleetwood and head room is about .7 shorter but thats all good cause its a convertable (got this info from Consumer Guide). I'm about 6'6/6'7, so leg room and head room is my main concern when purchasing a car.

keeping in mind that '93s are plentiful, and the avg life of cars is under 15 years, '87 to '90 are getting hard to find .. so, read up on the differences:


KEY LOCKED COMPARTMENTS - 1987 to 1989? No locks on ‘90 to ‘93?

IGNITION VATS - Introduced in the 1989 model year as an extension of the theft resistant system. A chip / resistor in ignition key.

SALES BROCHURE - The 1997 Cadillac marketing catalogue/brochure shows on it’s first entry, the Allanté as the “New Spirit of Cadillac”. A Silver/Maroon, sporting factory alloy wheels, and RED Accent stripe was photographed topless, in front of the Music Center in Los Angeles California for the catalogue /sales brochure.

1st PRODUCTION UNIT / 1st SALES UNIT - The earliest production Allanté known to have been sold is believed to be VIN# XHU100106. A Silver/Maroon with Black (Repainted) Accent Stripe and Digital Cluster, built in December, 1986 and sold in Florida. However, this was not the first production Allanté built. About 100 production units were not sold as they were used for testing, crashing and various purposes.

ALUMINUM TOP - Model years 1987 to 1989 were sold with both the canvas and aluminum tops. The aluminum top become an option for model years 1990 to 1993. Design of latches changed on Feb 1990 (90 ½ models) and those tops are known as the Phase II and were used until the 1992 model. In 1993, the Phase III top was introduced, the 1993 car now had no faux vent window, and the difference on this top is the weatherstripping only. There is a consensus that for 1993 models, 330 cars were produced as dual-top cars (xPU10xxxx) but a total of 618 Phase III hardtops made in all.

SOFT TOP - Manual latch operation for 1987 to 1990, powered latch from 1990½ to 1993. Equipped with glass rear window and electrical rear window defrost.

MAP LIGHT - With the powered latch design, the MAP light design changed in 1990½.

TELESCOPING STEERING WHEEL - used in 1987 to 1990. In 1990 ½ the air bags made their appearance instead of the telescoping wheel.

FUEL TANK - Baffles inside the fuel tank were removed for model year 1993 creating sloshing sounds behind the occupants on some cars. Probably a cost savings or design flaw.

MINI COVERS - With the Phase II for the 1990½, the shape of the mini-covers changed. In models 1987 to 1990 ½ the mini covers were stored inside the soft cover boot well. On 1990 ½ the storage of the mini-covers was shifted to a pocket behind the seats.

SEAT BACK POCKETS - These were a Phase II introduction on the 1990 ½ Allanté. The pockets were designed to hold the new style mini-covers used to cover exposed hardware of at the boot cover.

COACH WORKS - Corrosion resistant zinc coated treated steel?

CHROME STRIPS - Not true chrome since these are Stainless Steel. These strips are found on the bumpers on all models. On the 1987 to early 1990 models, there is also a strip on the leading edge of the hood and fenders framing the headlights, none on 1990 ½ to ‘93..

WHEELS / RIMS - Early models 1987 & 1988 had 15" alloy rims. The 1989 to 1992 models had 16" alloy rims looking identical to the 1987-1988 wheels except for their size. The 1993 models had the two different 16" rims - an standard alloy and a chrome-over-aluminum alloy. Both had a similar “bullet” design, but the factory chrome units have a ridge around the bullet. Model years 1987 - 1992 had aluminum caps with riveted wreath and screwed on crowns. The 1993 had a cheap plastic cap with imprinted wreath and crown

ALUMINUM PANELS - The aluminum top as well as the other two aluminum body parts, the trunk lid and the hood lid, are said to have been manufactured in Switzerland.

OIL LIFE MONITOR - Installed on model year 1989 to ‘93? This unit determines the frequency of oil changes based on algorithms of usage.

SEATS - The 1987 -1992 were equipped with the outstanding leather, multi-position Keiper-Recaro seats made in Austria. The 1987 - 1988 seats had multiple segmented panels for the bolsters, and the switches top side next to the seat. The 1989 -1992 had single piece panels for the bolsters, switches facing sideways next to the seats. The 1987-1988 models had a seatbelt hoop attached to the headrest, it vanished with the 1989 models. Due to cost reductions, the 1993 models dropped the Keiper-Recaro seats and received economy old-man seats.

BOSE STEREO SOUND - The DELCO-GM / BOSE Symphony Sound System was used in the 1987-1990 models with a 100 Watt system, and in the 1991-1992 with a 200 Watt system. The 1993 model dropped the BOSE in favor of cost reduction and was shipped with an economy sound system that sounds anemic on a nosier car.

QUIET CABIN - A claim in the sales brochures of the early models was that with the top down, the advanced aerodynamics allowed for a normal conversation at 55 mph - with the “FAUX vent window”, model years 1987 to 1992. The FAUX window vanished with the1993 models, cost savings again, more road noise.

HO ENGINES (High Output) - The 4100 (170 hp) was used on 1987 - 1988, the 4500 (200 hp) was used on the 1989 to 1992, and the 1st ever 4600 (270 hp) NorthStar was introduced in the 1993 on the Allanté pace cars. The 4.1 and the 4.5 used the std blocks but had, among other things, unique pistons, crankshafts, manifolds, etc. The NorthStar was the 1st generation and has shown the usual growing pains.

LIGHTING TECHNOLOGY - A technological advance was the Exterior Lighting System. The exterior lighting system in model years 1987-1992 Allanté is one of the truly unique and advanced features. The system allows a bulb that has burned out, or is in failing mode, to be replaced with another available bulb by the BCM. For example, if the LOW headlight on the driver’s side burns out, the fog lamp on that side is turned on and the driver alerted to the failed bulb via the DIC, Redundancy is also applied for rear lights, stop lights, etc. The lighting controls actually serve to program the Body Computer Module (BCM) with your desires for the way things should be, but the BCM actually calls the plays. All of the exterior lights (and inside courtesy lights) are turned ON and OFF by small electronic devices called Output Switch Modules (OSM) by what you desire, understanding that the light unit you expect may or may not be the one turned on by the BCM as it substitutes failed bulbs or filaments to accomplish the job desired. And of course, reports failures (and in some cars failing but still working) of filaments or bulbs to the driver via the DIC.. This technological advance was deemed to extravagant for the 1993 model year and cut in favor of cost reduction..

ABS III, Bosch - Used on 1987 - 1992 Allanté. System employed, among other innovations, a nitrogen charged accumulator to control braking, skidding and stopping. Reliability is dependent on maintenance and it is said to have one of the best stopping records ever. BUT it has to be maintained.

ABS/TCS SENSORS - It is believed that the 1992 Allanté had a change in wheel’s sensors, at least as far as the ABS/TCS speed sensor pickup is concerned.

TAIL LIGHT ARRAYS COLOR - For 1987 - 1992, internal lens colored keyed in a complimentary color to the car’s color. Some of the known are: SILVER for red cars and others for which SILVER would be the best compliment; BLACK for black cars, BEIGE for the beige metallic cars, blue for Blue cars. On 1993 all cars went to the Silver, a cost reduction.
TAIL LIGHT ARRAYS - Displayed the Silver strips for all 1993 models; Black, Silver Gold, Beige, Blue, etc ... for 1987 to 1992 models.

TAIL LIGHT ARRAY BULBS - later

TRACTION CONTROL - Installed on the 1990 ½ to 1992 Allanté models. Traction control is an electro - mechanical enhancement to the basic Bosch III ABS. 1993 not?

STRUTS - Model years 1987 - 1988 had passive struts, 1989 to 1993 had electrical driven variable damping struts. Availability of OEM replacements on the later, terminated. However, the passive struts can be used after disabling the SDD messages on the DIC.

AIR BAGS - Installed on the 1990 ½ to 1993 Allanté models.

EXPRESS WINDOWS - Installed on models years 1989 and on.

DOOR LATCHES - The door latches on all 1987 to 1992 Allanté are identical, with the sturdy tapered pin which locks the door to the body perfectly. The door latch on a 1993 Allanté is identical to the cheap economy 1997 Lumina latch - a cost savings.

EMBLEM-NORTHSTAR - The Northstar fender emblem was placed on the 1993 models. Some units display a sticker, some display the metal emblem.

[Stealth]

Originally Posted by Sandy

A 1993 as it has the Northstar V-8, with the hardtop in:-

Mary Kay Pink = 17 made
Pearl Flax = 88 made
Teal Green =151 made
Montana Blue = 149 made

Happy LOOOOOOking !

The rest are all too common for my tastes....black, white red, maroon, silver.

Pearl Flax Below:-
http://www.cadillacforums.com/photop...x_Yellow_a.jpg

Mary Kay Pink Below:-
http://www.cadillacforums.com/photop...llante-med.JPG

as collectors go, cool to own one of those .. i think ...

as daily or frequent drivers go, there IS a reason why so few of those colors were made ...

as speed demons go, maybe the Teal would be good, but stealthy colors keep the blinking red light from off our behinds .. and speed demons these cars are ...

[AJB2323]

So by reading that really long post a 93 isnt all that its cracked up to be. I'm now thinking 92 is the way to go.

[ckucia]

Here's something else to consider.

While generally '93s are more expensive, its because they are currently holding their value a bit better. That may or may not be the case in the future, but if you think you may be turning the car around a few years from now, then future resale value would be important.

I think '93s will always hold their value to a certain extent because they are the last of the line and many people like the idea of the Northstar. Market price is not necessarily determined by fact, but by perception. The general perception is that the 93's are "Better", and that's going to drive the market price.


Also, and this may be differernt now, it was possible to get a third-party warranty on '93s recently. Now that they're going on 11 years old, that may not be possible. If that's important to you, then the model year would be an important consideration.



Personally, I think the Allante is a great car no matter what year you get. You can pick them up (in running condition) for as little as 5k all the way up to above 20k. To the non-enthusiast, the various years are indistinguishable from the others.



Keep in mind though, with all Allantes, that these cars were very high-tech for their time and have complicated and unique systems. Parts are often hard to come by because GM discontinued them years ago. Don't plan on taking it to the Cadillac dealer for anything other then standard mechanical work unless you know a really good one who is willing to work with used-part suppliers (you can find them on the Allante board). All the guys who were specially trained by Cadillac 18 years ago to work on Allantes have retired from the dealership in all likelihood and the dealership probably chucked out the service manuals years ago.

If you are comfortable doing mechanical work and are patient, then the investment in a service manual will help you keep repair costs down. A lot of the mechanical pieces are shared with other Cadillacs of the era, so those parts (suspension, engine, brakes, etc) are reasonably affordable and obtainable.

Also, most of the parts, if they work, are at minimum 11 years old and max 17 years old. They aren't going to last forever.

There's a great support group over at the AAG board. Lots of guys willing to help, especially if you've previously searched the archives for the answer.

Just know what you're getting into. It wouldn't hurt to have a backup vehicle. My '89 is a daily driver, but I have an old pickup for those times when something breaks and I have to wait a few days for it to be shipped to me so I can fix it.



Lastly, as with any "exotic" vehicle, the Allante requires regular maintenance. The parts are high-tolerance and the materials used are less common than in other cars. Also, keep in mind that in the era this car was designed, fuel economy was still a huge consideration and GM was still struggling to react to the new marketplace. The engine is a mixture of aluminum and cast iron. It needs regular coolant changes and the use of inexpensive supplement tabs to prevent corrosion of the internals and the head gaskets. The brake system requires periodic fluid replacment to prevent corrosion of the aluminum parts. The ABS system was very advanced for its time, but it was never used on any other vehicles, so the parts are very expensive. Don't expect to go to the junkyard and be able to buy a fender or a door and hoods are going for several thousand dollars in good condition.

Keeping an Allante on the road requires a whole different mindset than that of something like an old Chevy sedan. Probably closest to that of a 90's Corvette owner but without the ready availability of parts and no aftermarket.

[Stealth]

Originally Posted by AJB2323

So by reading that really long post a 93 isnt all that its cracked up to be. I'm now thinking 92 is the way to go.

sorry for the long post .. but then, those are FACTS, not opinions ...

u may also want to check this next thread dealing with parts and cost of such:

http://66.34.30.72/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB...8665462;start=

lol






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[Allante North *]

I would base my purchase decision on several things. Year model being down the list quite a ways. Make sure that the vehicle has a documented service history. (much more important for pre-"93" models with the Bosch brake systems. Improper maintence of the brake system in earlier models could cost you some serious money if the brakes fail, and if they do fail you will not be able to stop. Do not drive an Allante with the brake warning light on if you value your life and the life of your passenger. They are a great brake system if maintained properly, and easy to maintain if you purchase a pre 1993 model.

Mileage would be a second concern only if you plan to resale the vehicle, otherwise its not that important to me as long as the care has been maintained and appearence is OK. There are several high mileage Allantes out there that I would be proud to own. Most Allante owners are cultish about there cars and take care of them better than their own childern.

I would suggest that you look at Ebay to gauge the going rate on Allantes. Check current auctions and concluded auctions to determine market value. Many owners try to sell there cars on the Allante specific web sites and are asking a fourtune for them. I would not pay $30,000 for a low mileage Allante when you can pick one up for around $20,000 on Ebay. Maybe less if you are patient. Chris and Stealth were right on target with there comments, however the final decision is up to you.

Whatever you decide, make sure you are happy with your purchase and have done your homework. You can get advice here or the AAG web site, and many owner that might happen to live near a vehicle would be happy to look at it with you to ensure that you get a good one. I am a member of the AAG, and the cost of the membership pays for itself in the knowledge base of the members and their experience. It would pay you join the group and get involved in their organization. I bought my 1993 based on personal preference, but I think I would have been just as happy with a pre 1993 model. I like the "Old Man Seats", but wish I had the Bose Stereo. I like the Northstar, but could live with the 4.1 or 4.5L engine. I encourage you to spend some time on the AAG site and do as much research as possible before you make up your mind to buy. Lots of good advice out there, but remember that many of us might be just a little one sided as to which year model to buy. Just make sure that YOU are happy with whatever you decide upon.

[Stealth]

Originally Posted by Allante North *

I would base my purchase decision on several things. Year model being down the list quite a ways. Make sure that the vehicle has a documented service history. (much more important for pre-"93" models with the Bosch brake systems. Improper maintence of the brake system in earlier models could cost you some serious money if the brakes fail, and if they do fail you will not be able to stop. Do not drive an Allante with the brake warning light on if you value your life and the life of your passenger. They are a great brake system if maintained properly, and easy to maintain if you purchase a pre 1993 model.

.........................

AJB,

do read the thread link above ...
Allante North is partially correct .. partially ...

ABS system needs does maint, and so does the brakes pads and the tires and the trans and the top and the ...... . . .. . . . . . . . .. . . . .

cost?

accumulator: rebuilt about $300, used about $50
Master cyl: rebuilt w/ accumulator: $1000, used $150
high press pumpt: new $250, used $30, rebuilt $ ??

trust me, been there, done that ......

==========

more critical in my opinion, on both the 4.1 & 4.5 engines, is COOLANT maint .. if THAT has been compromised, the seals will fail and now you got MAJOR BUCKS, no IFs, NO buts .. $2,000 is not uncommon here .....

and the '93 NorthStar has its history of seal issues, but u gotta do your homework there, repairs for that can exceed $4,000

in ALL the cases above, if u know what u are doing you can check, test, verify integrity of system BEFORE u buy .. OR buy cheap and assume some of the costs will hit you (that is the way i do it) and budget it in the purchase price ....

lol

[Playdrv4me]

Id still say stick with a 93, and if not a 92, the negatives in that post above really seem to be quite minor quirks and the car overall has a more modern look and feel in some of even the "cheaper" components. Of all the negatives on the 93,the only thing that would be a major consideration for me is the lack of the Bose stereo which is absolutely rediculous to be missing on a car of this level. On the flip-side of the coin, extravagances like that customized Lighting System would actually be something id run from rather than desire, as those are exactly the kind of electronic components than begin to exhibit failure after a number of years and are difficult to find and expensive to repair. Agreed with Allante North* however that if youve got two cars in front of you, and the 91 has a better service history, condition and less owner hand-offs thats a no brainer, also agreed that this kind of car is quite a responsibility to keep running in any form, just like the Buick Regatta and some other semi-unusual GM cars around that time. Definitely need to have patience and dedication to keep these guys in tip-top shape.

Whatever year you get you will love, take your time!

[El Dobro]

Items new for '93 model year.

Road Sensing Suspension
Speed Sensitive Steering
New design rear suspension with dual short/long a-arms
New Bosch ABS brake system with larger front and rear rotors
New 2nd Gen Traction Control
Equal length drive axles to reduce torque steer
Spoiler added to front fascia
Larger fuel tank made of plastic added
Side mirrors moved forward for better rear vision
Auto dim interior mirror
Cup holder added to center armrest
Door latches changed to new design so 93 now meets 97 side impact standard
Seats orthopedically designed to have better lateral support
Seating area wider
Seat controls redesigned to replicate seat position for ease of use


I haven't mentioned the drivetrain because the new engine and transmission are pretty much a given. Oh, and the 93 does have locking compartments.