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2009-2014 Cadillac CTS-V Performance Mods Discussion, Modified V2 vs. GTR question in Cadillac CTS-V Series Forum - 2009-2014; You don't need 650 to 700 hp to beat a GTR in a straight line. I beat my friends GTR ...
  1. #16
    vetkila is offline Cadillac Owner
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    You don't need 650 to 700 hp to beat a GTR in a straight line. I beat my friends GTR with a Lingenfelter pulley upgrade and ported snout. They claim 530 whp but I don't think so from a mail order tune. We started at 25 mph I was in second " it was to cold to get traction in first" and he was in first I pulled on him about half a car right away until 90 then his small turbos loose steam and it was a wrap.

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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    I dont know but V will pull GTR after 250 km

    look at V kicking ass of GTR


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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    By the way , both GTR and cts-v modded in the video ... cts-v
    Dyno 580hp

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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Hmmm...

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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    With an M5?
    LOL, you very funny guy! I'm staying away from that one!


    Quote Originally Posted by v4meinsandiego
    Check the most recent Road and Track Magazine that pits the ZR1, Porsche 911 Turbo, and Nissan GTR. Its faster than all of them and its a current year.
    This is also interesting, as I was fried on this forum for comparing the GTR/911 Turbo with the ZR1, which apparently is in a different class altogether (I was told those cars compete w/the Z06), although the ZR1 finished last in this comparo. Yes I understand the performance differences and I respect the ZR1's power & performance, so don't go there.

    A couple of things. It is completely unfair to compare the performance of a stock cars to a modified car's performance. A GT-R can easily be modified with a tune and exhaust. On the other hand, a GT-R does not have "real" backseats.

    Also, too much is made of 0-60 times. The AWD is very helpful at launch, but above 100mph becomes a liability when it comes to straight line speed.

    Tom
    This.


    I said "apples & oranges" because the GTR and CTS-V, modified or not, are completely different cars, in every single way. As a performance car, the GTR has almost unlimited potential and is much faster stock or modified, plus the handling differences...let's not go there. As a cruiser, quarter mile blaster and family car capable of carrying 4+ adults, the CTS-V is excellent. Both are incredible vehicles, and they couldn't be any LESS alike. Neither competes with the other in any market.

    And yes this topic was worth my time & the quotes

  6. #21
    Luna. is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    tehehe


    I did 3.3 0-60, once. Once...
    Johnny Dangerously (Joe Piscapo) lives on...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nutz View Post
    There is a CTSV vs. GTR youtube video out in the last 48 hrs. that's interesting. It could be street racing which is dangerous so I won't show it here.
    BAH. You should have posted it, but it looks like someone else did (thanks!). A quick search of Youtube and I wasn't able to find it...DOH!

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigjimsho View Post
    Off the line, sure. Other than that, a V with 650-700hp will win. The GT-R doesn't run on a flux capacitor, OK?
    Amen...

    Nissan GTR is awesome, especially for the price, but let's not kid ourselves about what ~485hp is in a ~3,800 lb car. A lot of why that car rocks 60' and 1/4 mile times is because of its all-wheel drive; it puts all that power down on the road very impressively.

  7. #22
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna. View Post
    Johnny Dangerously (Joe Piscapo) lives on...

    I'm glad somebody caught that...

  8. #23
    v4meinsandiego is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    I started watching all the videos of the GTR I could find and I must say, more than before I started this thread, that car kicks some serious ass. I can't imagine what upgrading the turbos would do to that car in terms of speed just like a larger crank pulley does for ours.

  9. #24
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by v4meinsandiego View Post
    I started watching all the videos of the GTR I could find and I must say, more than before I started this thread, that car kicks some serious ass. I can't imagine what upgrading the turbos would do to that car in terms of speed just like a larger crank pulley does for ours.
    The turbos don't need upgrading. You can add a downpipe, Cobb tuner, basic ECU flash and be in the 600WHP+ range almost instantly for VERY cheap. The turbos are capable of considerably more boost as is; the stock car is under tuned for reliability & warranty reasons.

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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna. View Post

    Nissan GTR is awesome, especially for the price, but let's not kid ourselves about what ~485hp is in a ~3,800 lb car. A lot of why that car rocks 60' and 1/4 mile times is because of its all-wheel drive; it puts all that power down on the road very impressively.
    Let's not kid ourselves into believing the GTR only has 485HP either. It's under rated from the factory, and that AWD w/600-700HP will always pull on 700HP to rear driven wheels.

  11. #26
    mannyz is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    It will from a dig and get a jump on the roll. But top end it won't pull on a same hp car with same weight.

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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    It's a totally different type of performance. If you want a straight up answer if a modded Caddy V vs a bone stock GT-R were to race on a highway roll, I would give it to the Caddy maybe. The Caddy has instant torque and monstrous horsepower and it is a very stout car. From a dig on the streets in the 1/4 mile, I'd give it to the GT-R since you can go WOT right from the beginning and you get every unit of horsepower to the ground.

    But straightline speed is only one form of measurement. I was always a straightline guy anyway and I'm more of a street racer. But this car has SO much more than that. You can take a turn at speeds that would be suicidal in the Caddy. A couple of degrees of a turn on the steering wheel and you just switched 3 lanes. The car is connected to the road in a way that Cadillac could never be. The transmission is just insane. The shifts are instantaneous and the downshifts are raw but smooth. I went out for a run the other day with a friend who owns a nicely modded GT-R and we were cruising the highway around bends at 110. I was talking to a buddy on bluetooth, then playing with the multi-function display. Laughing with my girl. Videoing the other car. This was all at 110mph which felt like I was doing 60. Remember, I'm not coming from a Toyota Corolla. I'm coming from an M5 and a CTS-V where you can cruise at whatever speeds and feel confident. The GT-R is MUCH more solid than those cars. The GT-R is an experience to drive. The CTS-V is a luxury sedan that you can have a blast with when your right foot is in the mood.

    The tradeoff? Practicality. The GT-R is actually very drivable and liveable. If you can live with a Porsche 911 or a Corvette, I think the GT-R would be just fine. I have used the back seats before when having 2 girls in the car. I've even fit 2 of my dude friends too and it's a tight squeeze but nobody complained for the short trip. The trunk isn't bad either (especially compared to the laughable 911's). The suspension is much stiffer than the V. This results in bumping on uneven roads. But in Comfort mode, the GT-R is definitely liveable and I don't complain about it. On the open highway, it's just a monster though and maybe the only downfall of it is that it is too much fun. You always want to go blasting through the streets and dipping all over the roads so you have to be responsible and keep the car tamed. It does a good job as a cruiser though.

    Another negative in some people's eyes is the attention. Almost every day I find somebody getting pictures or taking videos of my car. It's fun to me since I'm a young guy but I'm sure for some of you it can be a PITA.

    So short answer is that obviously a CTS-V can be modded to beat the GT-R in straightline speed. It cannot be modded to outhandle or match the all around performance though. They are 2 different cars and I knew that getting into the GT-R I'd lose the refinement, class, and luxury of the Caddy, which was fine to me at this point in my life.

    One more point to add. The GT-R with $2,000 in mods will run sub 11's and trap around 130mph on street tires.

    You really need to test drive one first or at least watch a lot of videos and talk to owners to get their impression because these are 2 completely different cars.

  13. #28
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by mugatu22 View Post
    Let's not kid ourselves into believing the GTR only has 485HP either. It's under rated from the factory, and that AWD w/600-700HP will always pull on 700HP to rear driven wheels.
    You're not dealing with the discussion at hand...

  14. #29
    Z06ified is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by mugatu22 View Post
    As a performance car, the GTR has almost unlimited potential and is much faster stock or modified, plus the handling differences...let's not go there.
    You keep bringing stuff up and then say "let's not go there" What, are you 5 years old or something?

    Unlimited potential? EVERY car has limits and weak points that when you bring power up, things will break, requiring further upgrade and more MONEY. The GT-R is no different than most other performance cars that are well designed. There is a lot of potential to mod, but you get to a point where things get very expensive very quickly. I like to look at how much money it takes to get to a performance level. I'll say this confidently: It will cost a lot less to upgrade a CTS-V to produce 1,000 hp than it would a GT-R.

    Much faster? Faster, yes. But not much faster. 90% of what makes the GT-R faster around a track is its AWD system. Not the engine or its power.
    Simply put, the GT-R's AWD allows it to get all of its power to the ground quickly and effectively, and allows the driver to apply more power coming out of a turn sooner than a RWD car like the CTS-V.

    The handling capabilities of the two cars isn't all that different. The GT-R is a slalom champ, with a 74 mph slalom speed, but the CTS-V posts an astonishing 71.1 mph slalom. I say astonishing, because it's a 4,200 lbs. luxury sedan, and it out handles some true sports cars in the slalom, while offering a much better ride than the GT-R. The CTS-V actually has about the same to more lateral grip, pulling 0.95g on the skidpad, versus the GT-R at 0.91g. Credit the magnetic ride control suspension of the CTS-V for that, as it helps the car corner very flat, maximizing the tire's contact patches. Braking power is also about the same, with both cars stopping in the 105-108 ft. range from 60 mph. No surprise I guess, as both cars use similar braking hardware, from the same manufacturer too.

    I just mention these facts, because you make it sound like the CTS-V is some sort of boat that is only fast in a straight line and can't handle at all. Nothing could be further from the truth.

    Let's not kid ourselves into believing the GTR only has 485HP either. It's under rated from the factory
    B.S. The GT-R has been dyno'd many times, and it produces close to its stated horsepower. Trap speeds don't lie either: Edmund's GT-R ran the 1/4 mile at 12.0 @ 114.7 mph. That's a 480hp, 3,800 lbs. car. If it had more than 485 hp, it would be trapping higher in the 1/4 It doesn't. The fastest trap speed I've seen on a stock GT-R was around 121 mph. Most trap 115-117 mph though.

    Most stock CTS-V's trap 117-119 mph. What this means is a CTS-V will pull on a GT-R in the triple digits. As it should: it's got significantly more horsepower and torque, with 350 lbs. more weight. A CTS-V will get smoked by a GT-R 0-60, and in the 1/4 though, stock versus stock. No question. When you start getting in the 400hp+ club, you can't compete with the traction of AWD for launching. But from a roll race say 60-150 mph, I'd put my money on the CTS-V.

    But again, as you mentioned, these two cars really do not compete with each other. The CTS-V offers luxury, 4-doors, and an awesome traditional manual transmission that the GT-R will never have, and the GT-R offers AWD and an awesome DSG transmission that the CTS-V will never have. Both have slight compromises in what they deliver: the GT-R isn't the greatest luxury car, and the CTS-V isn't the greatest track car.

    What are your priorities and desires? That answers which is the better car for you.

  15. #30
    Luna. is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Modified V2 vs. GTR question

    Quote Originally Posted by mugatu22 View Post
    Let's not kid ourselves into believing the GTR only has 485HP either. It's under rated from the factory, and that AWD w/600-700HP will always pull on 700HP to rear driven wheels.
    Oh God...you again? I'd respond, but several people have taken care of that already, including the one quoted below.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gotham CTS-V View Post
    It's a totally different type of performance. If you want a straight up answer if a modded Caddy V vs a bone stock GT-R were to race on a highway roll, I would give it to the Caddy maybe. The Caddy has instant torque and monstrous horsepower and it is a very stout car. From a dig on the streets in the 1/4 mile, I'd give it to the GT-R since you can go WOT right from the beginning and you get every unit of horsepower to the ground.

    But straightline speed is only one form of measurement. I was always a straightline guy anyway and I'm more of a street racer. But this car has SO much more than that. You can take a turn at speeds that would be suicidal in the Caddy. A couple of degrees of a turn on the steering wheel and you just switched 3 lanes. The car is connected to the road in a way that Cadillac could never be. The transmission is just insane. The shifts are instantaneous and the downshifts are raw but smooth. I went out for a run the other day with a friend who owns a nicely modded GT-R and we were cruising the highway around bends at 110. I was talking to a buddy on bluetooth, then playing with the multi-function display. Laughing with my girl. Videoing the other car. This was all at 110mph which felt like I was doing 60. Remember, I'm not coming from a Toyota Corolla. I'm coming from an M5 and a CTS-V where you can cruise at whatever speeds and feel confident. The GT-R is MUCH more solid than those cars. The GT-R is an experience to drive. The CTS-V is a luxury sedan that you can have a blast with when your right foot is in the mood.

    The tradeoff? Practicality. The GT-R is actually very drivable and liveable. If you can live with a Porsche 911 or a Corvette, I think the GT-R would be just fine. I have used the back seats before when having 2 girls in the car. I've even fit 2 of my dude friends too and it's a tight squeeze but nobody complained for the short trip. The trunk isn't bad either (especially compared to the laughable 911's). The suspension is much stiffer than the V. This results in bumping on uneven roads. But in Comfort mode, the GT-R is definitely liveable and I don't complain about it. On the open highway, it's just a monster though and maybe the only downfall of it is that it is too much fun. You always want to go blasting through the streets and dipping all over the roads so you have to be responsible and keep the car tamed. It does a good job as a cruiser though.

    Another negative in some people's eyes is the attention. Almost every day I find somebody getting pictures or taking videos of my car. It's fun to me since I'm a young guy but I'm sure for some of you it can be a PITA.

    So short answer is that obviously a CTS-V can be modded to beat the GT-R in straightline speed. It cannot be modded to outhandle or match the all around performance though. They are 2 different cars and I knew that getting into the GT-R I'd lose the refinement, class, and luxury of the Caddy, which was fine to me at this point in my life.

    One more point to add. The GT-R with $2,000 in mods will run sub 11's and trap around 130mph on street tires.

    You really need to test drive one first or at least watch a lot of videos and talk to owners to get their impression because these are 2 completely different cars.
    You actually had 2 girls in your car with you?? Really? At the same time? Really? Wow, I guess the idea that a car can't get chicks is dead wrong...

    The Nissan GTR is awesome and easily makes me double take purchasing any other car, including the CTS-V. I'm trying to stay American, but sheesh--this is another car that is pushing me to go foreign.

    There's one advantage that the CTS-V has over the GTR though and that's the sweet sound of a rumbling V-8...

    Quote Originally Posted by Z06ified View Post
    You keep bringing stuff up and then say "let's not go there" What, are you 5 years old or something?

    Unlimited potential? EVERY car has limits and weak points that when you bring power up, things will break, requiring further upgrade and more MONEY. The GT-R is no different than most other performance cars that are well designed. There is a lot of potential to mod, but you get to a point where things get very expensive very quickly. I like to look at how much money it takes to get to a performance level. I'll say this confidently: It will cost a lot less to upgrade a CTS-V to produce 1,000 hp than it would a GT-R.

    Much faster? Faster, yes. But not much faster. 90% of what makes the GT-R faster around a track is its AWD system. Not the engine or its power.
    Simply put, the GT-R's AWD allows it to get all of its power to the ground quickly and effectively, and allows the driver to apply more power coming out of a turn sooner than a RWD car like the CTS-V.

    The handling capabilities of the two cars isn't all that different. The GT-R is a slalom champ, with a 74 mph slalom speed, but the CTS-V posts an astonishing 71.1 mph slalom. I say astonishing, because it's a 4,200 lbs. luxury sedan, and it out handles some true sports cars in the slalom, while offering a much better ride than the GT-R. The CTS-V actually has about the same to more lateral grip, pulling 0.95g on the skidpad, versus the GT-R at 0.91g. Credit the magnetic ride control suspension of the CTS-V for that, as it helps the car corner very flat, maximizing the tire's contact patches. Braking power is also about the same, with both cars stopping in the 105-108 ft. range from 60 mph. No surprise I guess, as both cars use similar braking hardware, from the same manufacturer too.

    I just mention these facts, because you make it sound like the CTS-V is some sort of boat that is only fast in a straight line and can't handle at all. Nothing could be further from the truth.



    B.S. The GT-R has been dyno'd many times, and it produces close to its stated horsepower. Trap speeds don't lie either: Edmund's GT-R ran the 1/4 mile at 12.0 @ 114.7 mph. That's a 480hp, 3,800 lbs. car. If it had more than 485 hp, it would be trapping higher in the 1/4 It doesn't. The fastest trap speed I've seen on a stock GT-R was around 121 mph. Most trap 115-117 mph though.

    Most stock CTS-V's trap 117-119 mph. What this means is a CTS-V will pull on a GT-R in the triple digits. As it should: it's got significantly more horsepower and torque, with 350 lbs. more weight. A CTS-V will get smoked by a GT-R 0-60, and in the 1/4 though, stock versus stock. No question. When you start getting in the 400hp+ club, you can't compete with the traction of AWD for launching. But from a roll race say 60-150 mph, I'd put my money on the CTS-V.

    But again, as you mentioned, these two cars really do not compete with each other. The CTS-V offers luxury, 4-doors, and an awesome traditional manual transmission that the GT-R will never have, and the GT-R offers AWD and an awesome DSG transmission that the CTS-V will never have. Both have slight compromises in what they deliver: the GT-R isn't the greatest luxury car, and the CTS-V isn't the greatest track car.

    What are your priorities and desires? That answers which is the better car for you.
    Well said

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