Clutch Grabbing
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2009-2014 Cadillac CTS-V General Discussion Discussion, Clutch Grabbing in Cadillac CTS-V Series Forum - 2009-2014; All you manual guys, please weigh in on this. When I start from a complete stop, I notice a lot ...
  1. #1
    spearfish25 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Clutch Grabbing

    All you manual guys, please weigh in on this.

    When I start from a complete stop, I notice a lot of clutch grabbing/chattering. So pulling away from a stop I can feel jerking throughout the car and hear some chatter from the center console. The slower I start off, the more noticeable it is. If I jump off the line there's no issue because the clutch is rapidly engaged. I've had three manual cars before this and never a clutch issue. The service manager said this was typical of Vs but he'd 'adjust it'. Looking at my Helm service manual, they need to pull the trans and inspect the clutch disc.

    Thoughts? Any of you guys have clutch grab/chatter on take off? No problems whatsoever once I'm rolling.

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    VMoose's Avatar
    VMoose is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    To get a smooth start on level ground, I use no throttle and just let the clutch out slowly. I get smooth acceleration like this. Moderate hills, I add a little gas.

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    JFJr's Avatar
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    I can make mine do that if I'm a little lazy with the throttle. If I lead clutch engagement in 1st with a little rpm, everything is smooth.

    Jud
    Jud

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    Random84's Avatar
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    Quote Originally Posted by JFJr View Post
    I can make mine do that if I'm a little lazy with the throttle. If I lead clutch engagement in 1st with a little rpm, everything is smooth.

    Jud
    +1

    You need to give it more gas - the engine RPM will drop as the clutch engages, so you want to give it more than you think it needs.

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    spearfish25 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    It just seems like she needs a LOT of throttle to get rolling. My previous cars would just need 1000 to 1500 rpm for a nice smooth engagement from a stop. I'm getting the chatter if I'm under 2k rpm and still can't be slow with releasing the clutch.

    It's not engine bogging either. It's a chatter sound from the transmission tunnel under the nav, so clearly at the clutch/flywheel interface.

    F'ing annoying. Starting off at 2k rpm feels like I'm going to be wearing the clutch prematurely.

  7. #6
    JFJr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spearfish25
    It just seems like she needs a LOT of throttle to get rolling. My previous cars would just need 1000 to 1500 rpm for a nice smooth engagement from a stop. I'm getting the chatter if I'm under 2k rpm and still can't be slow with releasing the clutch.

    It's not engine bogging either. It's a chatter sound from the transmission tunnel under the nav, so clearly at the clutch/flywheel interface.

    F'ing annoying. Starting off at 2k rpm feels like I'm going to be wearing the clutch prematurely.
    Next time I'm in the car, I'll check the tach to see how much throttle I actually use to smooth out the launches. It's a feel thing with me and I usually don't pay any attention to that when starting in 1st. BTW, I've even launched it in 3rd (the other 1st) by mistake, but it needed a lot more rpm. Ha haa!

    Jud
    Jud

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    spearfish25 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    Quote Originally Posted by JFJr View Post
    Next time I'm in the car, I'll check the tach to see how much throttle I actually use to smooth out the launches. It's a feel thing with me and I usually don't pay any attention to that when starting in 1st.
    Thanks, I'd appreciate it. The only reason I looked at my RPM is because it was shuddering when I'd start off with my normal 'feel' from my previous manual cars. None of them took over 1500 rpm to get a smooth start. But then again, none of them were 556hp with heavy clutches.

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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    I just came back - I go anywhere from 1500 to 1800 RPM for a "normal" engagement, during a typical start, with RPM's dropping to an even 1,000 once the clutch fully engages; no chatter. Anything less than that and I tend to get chatter.


    It may have something to do with getting 4400 pounds moving.

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    spearfish25 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    The weight could definitely be part of it. Guess I can't complain if the car WANTS me to drive it like I stole it .

  11. #10
    JFJr's Avatar
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    It appears that between 900 and 1200 rpm is what I use a fraction of a second before I start to release the clutch pedal. Idle is around 650. What is really excellent is the harmony of the shifter, clutch and throttle, and the butter smoothness of the downshifts when revs are matched, even going from 6th directly to 4th. I don't heel and toe but I plan to teach myself just for the fun of it.

    Jud
    Jud

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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    Well, perhaps the rate of acceleration (from a dead stop) will vary for each of us, as well as the actual length of time it takes to "feather" the clutch in to full engagement... which may also effect the RPM preferred?

    I'm right around 1500+ as stated, but I'm no Stig either and I have zero regard for the riding comfort of my passengers.

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    spearfish25 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    I was going to say, this car is a gem for rev-match and heel-toe downshifting. Initially I thought the pedals (brake and accel) were poorly positioned but under mod-hard braking they're nicely aligned. The engine revs nice and freely and it's a pleasure to heel-toe rev match downshift. Just these god damn standing starts are pissing me off. Guess I'll try some extra throttle when I get the car back.

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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Random84 View Post
    It may have something to do with getting 4400 pounds moving.
    Ding ding ding! You get clutch chatter when using mild throttle input while engaging the clutch because it's trying to break 4400 lbs worth of inertia. There's not a lot that can be done about that. I've found there are two solutions, both of which have already been mentioned here.

    1. Use more throttle, like 1500 RPM.
    2. Don't use the throttle at all, and simply let the clutch out slowly. This takes a little more time but there's no chatter this way either, and it is easier on your clutch disc.

  15. #14
    cdog533's Avatar
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    More throttle, and slip the piss out of it! Smooth as silk.
    Club Malibu likes this.

  16. #15
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    Re: Clutch Grabbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
    2. Don't use the throttle at all, and simply let the clutch out slowly. This takes a little more time but there's no chatter this way either, and it is easier on your clutch disc.
    How is a long engagement (intentional slip) better for the clutch? If anything, a shorter engagement time/less slip is "better" for the clutch, but results in a more abrupt gear change and that lurching feel for your passengers.

    Also, when you don't use the throttle for this intentional slipping - in reality you're really just letting the ECM accommodate for additional engine load over by opening up the throttle for you; you just don't see a rise in RPM on the guage. However, there is still more air/fuel/timing coming in to actually get enough power to move the car. The only difference is you're doing it at 800 RPM with a much longer engagement, and giving the ECM enough time to do the adjustments for you.

    Smooth, perhaps - but I am skeptical of it actually being better for the clutch. Honestly, when I do get chatter, it's usually because I'm trying (and failing) to get 1st gear under 1200RPM due to lack of power.

    My vote remains "1500 RPM."

    Now, who's with me on complaining about the rather stiff return spring on the third pedal? Holy cow, my left calf muscle has never had so much definition!

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