Have We Solved The Steering Vibration On The Freeway? - Page 36

Caddue · #**526** (**permalink**) 01-28-09, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimls

Had my 08 CTS performance package in on Friday Jan 23 for an alignment re-do and oil change and I discussed the vibration issue again with my new service advisor. She wrote everything down and said she would call me. To make a long story short, I was called at 4pm to come in and test drive with the shop foreman, unfortunately some of us work so I was not able to do this.
I asked why a test drive as we have done this before and she mentioned that a new TSB just came out that that dealt with the vibration issue but she was not sure if it applied to my circumstance (ie. 1200-1400rpm etc). I was told that it had to do with a computer reprogram. I am sorry for being so vague on this but this was all the info I received as she was even unsure about it because it was so recent. I told her I would reschedule but that will not be for a while.
I was hoping that someone on the forum might have a friend/advisor who would be privy to more information on this update. I will also try to get more info but it might be a while.
Thanks Jim

The reason why your dealer wants to take a test drive with you is probably because the recalibration will result in decreased fuel economy. The recalibration increases the TCC engagement which will result in lower fuel economy. The dealer wants to verify that your vehicle has the condition as described in the bulletin because once it has been recalibrated; you are stuck with the new calibration/decreased fuel economy.

My suggestion to all of you is do not have this done. This is not a fix but just a band aid for the problem.

CadiJ · #**527** (**permalink**) 01-28-09, 01:23 PM

Here is my update:

My Serv. MGR had 2 phone calls with Cadillac technical team. They do not recommend that any fixes be performed on my 2009 CTS. They feel that there is not yet a "official" fix for the drive train shudder that I am feeling on my CTS, and it's not a small vibration...

Here is the kicker. GM Technical Team said, "Tell the owner to contact Cadillac 1-800 and open a case number..." Cadillac 1-800 said, "We are talking to your Service Mgr to see what they can do to fix this..."

Note: Spoke with my Service manager yesterday, they have not called him once... He was told by GM technical NOT to attempt repairs!!!

Unreal, like a dog chasing its tail. I opened my case with Cadillac 1-800 on Dec 9th and as of today 1-28-09 they said, "we are still trying to get in touch with Cadillac's technical support team..."

My dealer and service manager are trying to get through to Cadillac, I am trying to get through to Cadillac - to no avail... GM, try to become a bit more nimble...

NOTE: Service manager said that any "fix" for this problem is not a "fix" and in some cases will leave the customer's CTS worse off... Caddue used the term "band aid" and it's just that...

Can anyone say STALL?!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caddue

The reason why your dealer wants to take a test drive with you is probably because the recalibration will result in decreased fuel economy. The recalibration increases the TCC engagement which will result in lower fuel economy. The dealer wants to verify that your vehicle has the condition as described in the bulletin because once it has been recalibrated; you are stuck with the new calibration/decreased fuel economy.

My suggestion to all of you is do not have this done. This is not a fix but just a band aid for the problem.

Jimls · #**528** (**permalink**) 01-28-09, 02:04 PM

Good advice...thank you.
Dealer will not be touching my vehicle on this issue. CadiJ does your vibration occur when you are applying load (gas).
I do get a small (but it is noticeable if you are looking for it) vibration right at 1400rpm. It feels like it wants to change into a gear or something. If I let go of the gas or if I apply gas to go faster it goes away. It's strange, if I maintain 1400rpm it feels like the car is ready to shift or do something but it doesn't unless you move the gas pedal. When I cruise on the highway at 1800-2000rpm it is not there...only at 1400!!
Someone mentioned prior that it was the TCC and the more I think about it, this may be the case, as it seems like it is stuck between a gear change, but I am not an expert.

CadiJ · #**529** (**permalink**) 01-28-09, 02:23 PM

Jimls,

YES and NO...

I have a vibration through out all RPM ranges - it is getting worse. It is most noticeable above 40mph. YES vibration occurs under load (gas) and it is ALL THE TIME, not now and again.

When the car is HOT (driven for 20+ miles) the car actually shudders significantly and there is a "wobble" felt through out the drive train when you apply a load or set the cruise control AND/OR when you are coasting down to a stop (no load). You can actually feel the car shudder and it feels like the drive shaft is wagging from side to side... It's really a lovely feeling... Because the problem is worse when the car is hot I do not feel that computer programming will help?

I also have the "drone" issue what to me feels like the Tq conv. is locked up and when this occurs I have a lovely "boom" sound -- it is like I have some sort of aftermarket bass module in my trunk...

Cadillac Owners Please Note:
If you have a problem and you need to call into Cadillac's 1-800 number you need to INSIST that you are forwarded to the call center in Newfoundland, Canada NOT, let me repeat this -- DO NOT deal with Cadillac's call center in Argentina, they are absolutely horrific.

Cadillac has some massive work to do on fixing the customer service experience with their call center in Argentina it is far from a world class experience. If I was smart I would have recorded the horrific experiences I have had since Dec 9th and posted it to YouTube!

The contact people in Canada have accomplished more for me in one day than the people at the Argentina call center have done since Dec 9th... Separate post coming on this topic!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimls

Good advice...thank you.
Dealer will not be touching my vehicle on this issue. CadiJ does your vibration occur when you are applying load (gas).
I do get a small (but it is noticeable if you are looking for it) vibration right at 1400rpm. It feels like it wants to change into a gear or something. If I let go of the gas or if I apply gas to go faster it goes away. It's strange, if I maintain 1400rpm it feels like the car is ready to shift or do something but it doesn't unless you move the gas pedal. When I cruise on the highway at 1800-2000rpm it is not there...only at 1400!!
Someone mentioned prior that it was the TCC and the more I think about it, this may be the case, as it seems like it is stuck between a gear change, but I am not an expert.

Jimls · #**530** (**permalink**) 01-28-09, 03:31 PM

Sorry CadiJ, but your symptons appear to be much more severe and your frustration is well justified.
Mine sounds more like the "drone" you have explained. It is manageable to me but that does make it it correct. I recall them doing a TSB on a muffler hanger
or something like that a few months back and it did improve after that. I also have called Cadillac Customer Service but only in Canada and I have received call backs every time and the reps that have contacted me were helpful and asked if I wanted them to contact my dealer etc. I call it as I see it and they were courteous and helpful here ( I believe they were based out of Oshawa Ont.) but I knew that they could not assist me further on this issue. Good luck and keep us posted.
Jim

addams · #**531** (**permalink**) 01-29-09, 12:01 AM

Man, after reading these problems i'm starting to rethink getting a CTS and I really like them.

Caddue · #**532** (**permalink**) 01-29-09, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimls

Sorry CadiJ, but your symptons appear to be much more severe and your frustration is well justified.
Mine sounds more like the "drone" you have explained. It is manageable to me but that does make it it correct. I recall them doing a TSB on a muffler hanger
or something like that a few months back and it did improve after that. I also have called Cadillac Customer Service but only in Canada and I have received call backs every time and the reps that have contacted me were helpful and asked if I wanted them to contact my dealer etc. I call it as I see it and they were courteous and helpful here ( I believe they were based out of Oshawa Ont.) but I knew that they could not assist me further on this issue. Good luck and keep us posted.
Jim

My experiences with Cadillac customer service have been the same as CadiJ....horrific. They NEVER call back and each time you call to speak to the person that is assigned to your case, they just put you into the voice mail of the person that is never calling you back. Honestly, they are useless; Cadillac should close their customer service and use the saved money to fix their products. Their customer service or lack of is just infuriating customers like myself.

CadiJ · #**533** (**permalink**) 01-29-09, 10:01 AM

Though I am NOT happy to hear that an American Luxury Car company is dealing with customer problems in such a horrific way... I am at least feeling like, "I am not the only one..."

Caddue - you and I are on the same track with the call centers.
After eight (8) voice mails left for my my Cadillac rep (at the 1-800 #) I started calling into the general number and speaking with other reps only to be put on hold and thrown into the voice mail of the person who was not calling me back... It was only when I connected up with the call center in Canada that at least someone would speak with me!

**Also please note this really got me wondering, when I called into the Cadillac customer service number, one of the reps said, "Thank you for calling Buick customer service..."

I said, "I don't have a Buick"

They said, "Oh that's ok it's all the same number I can help anyone that owns a Buick, Cadillac or Hummer..."

So I guess GM has really not elevated Cadillac what so ever...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caddue

My experiences with Cadillac customer service have been the same as CadiJ....horrific. They NEVER call back and each time you call to speak to the person that is assigned to your case, they just put you into the voice mail of the person that is never calling you back. Honestly, they are useless; Cadillac should close their customer service and use the saved money to fix their products. Their customer service or lack of is just infuriating customers like myself.

CadiJ · #**534** (**permalink**) 02-08-09, 05:35 PM

Hello everyone.

Providing a update... Though this thread says "steering vibration" I know most of us have posted all "vibration" issues within this thread.

Recap:
2009 CTS 3.6di 18" Polished...
-Starting at 700 miles I had a drive train shudder start (40mph - 80mph)
-Shudder has gotten worse - currently have 3,400k on the car
-Shudder is NOT felt in the steering wheel and all wheels and tires have been RFB'ed and are perfect.
-GM is "awair" of this issue and is working on a fix.. (yeah right...)
-Cadillac customer service thus far has been a complete joke...
-I have received multiple PM's from owners having the same issue
-One of our members provided me with the following link which is to the NHTSA WEB Site and I noticed a complaint about the 2009 CTS vibration issue is posted. NOTE: THIS IS NOT -- let me repeat -- NOT my complaint but I will be posting one as well.

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/complaints/results.cfm

-I would suggust any other owners with this issue to also post a complaint on the NHTSA WEB Page...

C "T" ess · #**535** (**permalink**) 02-09-09, 10:59 AM

Is this problem primarily with 18" tires and wheels. I can't tell from the posts; however, those who have listed this information seem to indicate 18". That would make for more food for thought.

CadiJ · #**536** (**permalink**) 02-09-09, 11:18 AM

The Wheel/tire issue is only 1 part of the CTS vibration issue.

I will agree that many CTS owners with the 18" wheels have/had more problems with vibration that is felt in the steering wheel.

The vibration I am speaking of is felt after the wheels and tires are RFB'ed and found to be true, and there is NO steering wheel shimmy (vibration/shaking).

Some of us have a drive train shudder which I personally feel is not wheel/tire related...

Quote:

Originally Posted by C "T" ess

Is this problem primarily with 18" tires and wheels. I can't tell from the posts; however, those who have listed this information seem to indicate 18". That would make for more food for thought.

Caddue · #**537** (**permalink**) 02-09-09, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadiJ

The Wheel/tire issue is only 1 part of the CTS vibration issue.

I will agree that many CTS owners with the 18" wheels have/had more problems with vibration that is felt in the steering wheel.

The vibration I am speaking of is felt after the wheels and tires are RFB'ed and found to be true, and there is NO steering wheel shimmy (vibration/shaking).

Some of us have a drive train shudder which I personally feel is not wheel/tire related...

My CTS has standard 17" wheels.

The moan/vibration problem has nothing to do with the wheels or tires. It is driveline related, in my opinion from the driveshaft. This would make sense as GM's only current band aid fix is to re-index the driveshaft which DOES NOT solve the problem but just makes it happen more infrequently.

CadiJ · #**538** (**permalink**) 02-09-09, 12:14 PM

I am with you Caddue,

I also have some sort of Shudder as well as a clunk/thump when braking - it actually feels like the drive train is shifting significantly - its actually hard to describe but not something that makes me feel confident in the car...

If you feel compelled, file a notice here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caddue

My CTS has standard 17" wheels.

The moan/vibration problem has nothing to do with the wheels or tires. It is driveline related, in my opinion from the driveshaft. This would make sense as GM's only current band aid fix is to re-index the driveshaft which DOES NOT solve the problem but just makes it happen more infrequently.

JackB · #**539** (**permalink**) 02-09-09, 10:54 PM

After reading all 36 pages of this thread I have decided to postpone my planned purchase of a 2009 CTS and keep my DHS, which has 139K miles, a little longer until these issues are worked out by GM. I can't imagine spending the time some of you have spent dealing with such a frustrating problem.

jdavis12 · #**540** (**permalink**) 02-13-09, 01:51 PM

I picked this up off of the Edmunds forum today:
.....there seems to be a new bulletin out as of yesterday to address the vibration problem. It is #08-07-30-044A: Phasing Drone, Boom, Moan or Vibration at 80 km/h (50 mph) or 1000-1300 RPM with Torque Converter Clutch (TCC) Engaged (Reprogram TCM and Install Insulator Washers [On Vehicles Built Without Washers]) - (Feb 11, 2009). Apparently the insulator washers were part of the later built cars. They have to be added for VIN prior to 90159377