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2008-2013 Cadillac CTS General Discussion Discussion, 2008 CTS Timing chain recall? in Cadillac CTS Second Generation Forum - 2008-2013; Originally Posted by 928S Excellent post, RAB, thanks. Class action attorneys, are you reading/archiving this and other related threads? I ...
  1. #91
    MoFex's Avatar
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Quote Originally Posted by 928S View Post
    Excellent post, RAB, thanks.


    Class action attorneys, are you reading/archiving this and other related threads?
    I have always been against class actions. But in this case I would support it all the way.

    GM should extend the engine warranty to at least 10 years / 120 miles. I would see it as an act of compensation for GM faulty design.

    For me it is bye bye GM. Never again will I buy a GM product. If they cannot stand by their flagship car imagine the support for "lesser" vehicles....

  2. #92
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    there are many instances where GM has extended the warranties (cat converters comes to mind... plus a bunch of saturn parts had special coverages - fuel pumps for one)

    and to RAB:
    1) i guess there must be some measurement internal that the ECM is able to take... that makes sense
    2) good to see you around
    3) i wonder if there's more to the ECM recalibration besides allowing for more stretch... maybe messing w/ the cam actuators and/or making changes that are designed into the 2010 engines?
    4) and yeah, great post - lots of good info and insights
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  3. #93
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Quote Originally Posted by RippyPartsDept View Post
    there are many instances where GM has extended the warranties (cat converters comes to mind... plus a bunch of saturn parts had special coverages - fuel pumps for one)

    and to RAB:
    1) i guess there must be some measurement internal that the ECM is able to take... that makes sense
    Yes - there are several sensors applied to the HFV6 engine (including a crankshaft position sensor and camshaft position sensors), and the ECM monitors / makes comparsions of the geometric angle of the crankshaft and same-moment angle of the camshafts at any given engine rpm. A software routine would compare established baseline (new engine) numbers against the numbers that are generated by the engine being monitored/controlled. As the timing chain stretches the sync relationship (or 'timing') between the crankshaft and the camshafts changes (incrementally & proportionately) as a result.

    2) good to see you around
    Thanks Chris!

    3) i wonder if there's more to the ECM recalibration besides allowing for more stretch... maybe messing w/ the cam actuators and/or making changes that are designed into the 2010 engines?
    Good point - I wonder too! I suspect though the re-calibration of the ECM to allow for more chain stretch is quite involved in itself. GM would have had to include revised and/or additional fuel & ignition timing tables in software to compensate for added chain stretch and have the engine continue to operate within required parameters (hopefully).. relative to matters of performance, fuel economy & emissions.. with chain stretch now permitted to go well beyond the previous/original threshold for triggering the Check Engine light.

    4) and yeah, great post - lots of good info and insights
    Thanks again!!


  4. #94
    smooth_ride is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Is anyone showing the recall on the GM Owner Center?

    http://gmownercenter.yahoo.com

  5. #95
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    I just had the recalibration done today since my car was at the dealer already and it doesn't show at the GM Owner Center - I doubt it would have been updated instantaneously - but it did show up at the dealer went I took my car in.

  6. #96
    JackB is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Ok, so here is a question. [by the way I am scheduled for the Deaer update Monday on my 09 CTS] Is this problem so inherent in these engines that we can expect every engine to eventually experience the timing belt problem or will it be limited to a certain percentage of engines? If the latter is true, what is the difference between those engines that fail and those that don't?

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    Timing chains are only half the problem. Camshafts are walking and may require head replacement. To avoid that expense nylon shims are wedged in place for now.


    Check Engine Light, DTCs P0011, P0014, P0021, P0024, P0341, P0346, P0366 or P0391 Set (Check Camshaft End Play and Perform Action as Outlined) - (Feb 18, 2011)

    Subject: Malfunction Indicator Lamp On -- Check Engine Light, DTCs P0011, P0014, P0021, P0024, P0341, P0346, P0366, or P0391 Set (Check Camshaft End Play and Perform Action as Outlined)
    Models: 2007-2009 Buick LaCrosse, Allure (Canada Only)
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    very few engines have needed the camshaft shims
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    my car has no engine light 35K got it 5K ago so don't know oil change history. it seems to shake at idle sometimes they checked for codes no misfire says its fine??? am i getting the run around

  10. #100
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Just had this done the other week on my 08 DI- though not before my car had a CEL with code P0008 @ 41k miles. Never got anything in the mail from Cadillac regarding the recall, but the dealer service writer knew about it and applied the recall - said he wouldn't have to do any chain work on the car so long as it didn't throw the code after the reflash. No problems yet - and whatever else came in with the new ECM software actually fixed a few minor drivability gripes I had, so there's that plus.

    For what it's worth, my car got the camshaft shims as well around 25k or so. Guess my engine got all the problems! :/ June 2008 build.

  11. #101
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Had the ECU reprogram done last Monday. But a bit of information what happened before. I changed oil on Saturday (Went with Pennzoil Ultra this time and will in the future). After that ran a few errands and drove to the dealer on Monday morning (41 miles traveled on new oil). I think the OLM showed either 100% or 99%. Right now 170 miles later the OLM shows 100%. And it is after the ECU was reprogrammed. I do not think it is normal. Any suggestions apart for another trip to the dealer?

    And how to trust GM…..I know some accused me of being anti-GM but I am stating just facts. Nothing more…

  12. #102
    RippyPartsDept's Avatar
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    Per the bulletin procedures the dealer is supposed to set the OLM back to the value that it was at when you came in. If they don't it will be back at 100%

    I saw one forum member report that their dealer left it back at 100%

    In your case it's not really a big deal though
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  13. #103
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Chris
    what worries me is that after 170 miles the OLM still shows 100%. If it dropped to 99% it would mean the reprogram has extended the oil change interval! I will keep driving for a while and see what happenes.

  14. #104
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    Yes let it go further and let's see what mileage you are at when it gets down to 90%
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  15. #105
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    Re: 2008 CTS Timing chain recall?

    Just took my 08 CTS in for tire rotation and was told there was a recall out for my car to reprogram the ECM(10287). When I asked about it I was told it affects the Oil Life Monitor. End result of the change is to necessitate more oil changes in an effort to deal with the Timing Chain lifespan and problems caused by not changing the oil frequently enough.
    My current oil life went from 71% to 83% after the reprogram. Not sure how to interpret this for my next oil change - go with the newer number as displayed and change oil when percentage is low enough, or to subtract the 12% usage from the displayed value to take into account the original 71% value.
    Whats more important is that no one told me about issues with the timing chain.
    I will have to do some research on this so I understand whats going on. I saw posts on timing chain problems but I thought they were for the DI and/or AWD models. I have the 3.6 LY7 engine.
    The only info I found so far was in a Buick forum. Nothing on ALLDATAdiy or in GM Owner center.

    Excerpt from letter to owner found in Buick forum:
    However, we have determined that under certain driving conditions, and with extended oil
    change intervals, the timing chain could wear prematurely and cause the illumination of the
    Service Engine Soon light. Timing chain wear can be affected by the age of the engine oil and
    driving conditions.

    What We Will Do:
    To ensure that your vehicle will not experience this condition, your GM
    dealer will change the calibration of the engine control module, including the engine oil life
    monitor, which in most cases will recommend more frequent oil changes

    Learn something new everyday. Guess I will wait for the letter from GM as indicated to get more info. Gee maybe I will call them to find out.

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