Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!
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2004-2007 Cadillac CTS-V Performance Mods Discussion, Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!! in Cadillac CTS-V Series Forum - 2004 - 2007; I am getting a 2004 ctsv that has a bad motor in it next week. The car comes with a ...
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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    I am getting a 2004 ctsv that has a bad motor in it next week. The car comes with a 6.2 out of a denali that had about 15k miles and I am also getting this scat rotating assay with it.

    http://www.race-mart.com/Scat_Manufa...1-41921BI.html

    Needless to say I will not be using the pistons from the kit due to the fact they are 4.125 dia. That being said should I go with stock pistons 4.065 Dia or aftermarket? I will also be picking up a cam for it; L92? The car has 1 7/8 kooks headers cats and corsa exhaust so I am set from that aspect. How many rwhp can I expect to get out of a stroked 427? I want to break 500hp is that doable with the stock heads and the mentioned parts? Oh and did I mention i have a 100 shot on the car also? This is gonna be fun.

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    thebigjimsho's Avatar
    thebigjimsho is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    hmm...

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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Is that hmmm a good hmmm or a bad hmmm?

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    TheLostDriver is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Not trying to offend you but might want to do A LOT more research than I feel you have invested in this.

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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLostDriver View Post
    Not trying to offend you but might want to do A LOT more research than I feel you have invested in this.
    What do you mean? This should be a fairly straight forward swap I would think. My new crank has the needed 24T reluctor, I need to move the knock sensors, different injector harness, MAP sensor, throttle body, clutch, 8.8 diff, etc……. Everything should bolt up; after installation a custom tune is in order and I should be good to go. I know it sounds easy and I know it won’t go as planned but I am not an idiot when it comes to turning a wrench. This will be the first car motor I have ever built but I have built hundreds of motorcycle, jetsk, boati and atv engines and probably 50 or more Continental piston aircraft engines starting from the crank. I understand where you are coming from but that’s why I am asking for recommendations on a cam and other parts. This is not my first CTS-V as I had an 05 with 25k miles ont last year and loved it. She was a real peach; I installed kooks and corsa and had a mild tune only to sell it 5 months later to pay off my house.Now I am looking to have some fun.

  7. #6
    PISNUOFF Guest

    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by TheLostDriver View Post
    Not trying to offend you but might want to do A LOT more research than I feel you have invested in this.
    I think this was said because your first post seems to be scattered all over the place. You say it has a 6.2 (4.065" bore) from a Denali and the scat kit comes with 4.125" pistons, then you ask if you should go with stock pistons or aftermarket (why would you ever want to stick with stock hypereutectic pistons instead of aftermarket forged ones? Especially if you're throwing nitrous at it) then you ask how much power should you expect from a 427 (4.065" bore with 4.125" stroke is not a 427). Asking if the stock clutch will hold up is another selling point of the above statement (short answer is no). All of this not to mention that 4.125" stroke brings a whole other set of issues. I'd get a 4" stroke kit with the proper stroker pistons and be happy with a 416.

    Cam selection will be dependent upon what heads you decide to go with. There are a couple other things that are different between gen4 and gen3 motors. I would suggest buying only the gen 3 parts necessary to run your current stuff. For example, buy an ls6 valley cover and knock sensors and cam position sensor or take them from the blown motor in the car, use the ls6 map sensor and make a grommet to seal it to the larger hole in the L92 intake manifold, buy a cam that can be used with the ls6 style position sensor, etc etc. I went from a gen4 LS2 to a stroked LS3 and some modifications like those still had to be done. Yours will be a little more extensive but still easily doable.

    ------------

    Ricky: I said it with all due respect!
    Mr. Dennit: Just because you say that doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want to say to me!
    Ricky: It sure as hell does!
    Mr. Dennit: No, it doesn't--
    Ricky: It's in the Geneva Conventions, look it up!

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    Bacon V's Avatar
    Bacon V is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Misread your post, ignore my last post

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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by PISNUOFF View Post
    I think this was said because your first post seems to be scattered all over the place. You say it has a 6.2 (4.065" bore) from a Denali and the scat kit comes with 4.125" pistons, then you ask if you should go with stock pistons or aftermarket (why would you ever want to stick with stock hypereutectic pistons instead of aftermarket forged ones? Especially if you're throwing nitrous at it) then you ask how much power should you expect from a 427 (4.065" bore with 4.125" stroke is not a 427). Asking if the stock clutch will hold up is another selling point of the above statement (short answer is no). All of this not to mention that 4.125" stroke brings a whole other set of issues. I'd get a 4" stroke kit with the proper stroker pistons and be happy with a 416.

    Cam selection will be dependent upon what heads you decide to go with. There are a couple other things that are different between gen4 and gen3 motors. I would suggest buying only the gen 3 parts necessary to run your current stuff. For example, buy an ls6 valley cover and knock sensors and cam position sensor or take them from the blown motor in the car, use the ls6 map sensor and make a grommet to seal it to the larger hole in the L92 intake manifold, buy a cam that can be used with the ls6 style position sensor, etc etc. I went from a gen4 LS2 to a stroked LS3 and some modifications like those still had to be done. Yours will be a little more extensive but still easily doable.

    ------------

    Ricky: I said it with all due respect!
    Mr. Dennit: Just because you say that doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want to say to me!
    Ricky: It sure as hell does!
    Mr. Dennit: No, it doesn't--
    Ricky: It's in the Geneva Conventions, look it up!
    Thanks for the reply!!!!!

    I can completely understand, it was long winded and busy. I was in a hurry to get to a meeting and had alot on my mind and wanted to get it on paper before my mind is cluttered with all kinds of useless work related crap. LOL

    Maybe I am mistaken but when I calculate the displacement using pi ÷ 4 (b2) (stroke) (number of cylinders)
    I get 428.06. How is that not a 427? Not trying to question you but just curious. As far as the pistons go, i cant use the 4.125 pistons that comes with the rotating assy due to the fact the bore of the 6.2 LS3 block is only 4.065. I am not going to be able to bore it to a 4.125 so I was going to stay with the stock bore size.

    What kind of issues will the 4.125 stroke cause?

    I will be building the LS6 for a pickup so I will be leaving all sensors / parts and buying all new Gen 3 parts per your recommendation.

    As for a cam, I will be leaving the stock ls3 heads on and I was reading good things about the L92. Would that be a good choice or is there a better couple out there? I want the car to still be easy to drive on the street as my wife will be driving it now and then.

    Thanks in advance for the replies.

  10. #9
    PISNUOFF Guest

    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by av8erdunn View Post
    ......

    Maybe I am mistaken but when I calculate the displacement using pi ÷ 4 (b2) (stroke) (number of cylinders)
    I get 428.06. How is that not a 427? Not trying to question you but just curious. As far as the pistons go, i cant use the 4.125 pistons that comes with the rotating assy due to the fact the bore of the 6.2 LS3 block is only 4.065. I am not going to be able to bore it to a 4.125 so I was going to stay with the stock bore size.
    My bad, I hit a wrong number. Small buttons on this iPhone.

    Quote Originally Posted by av8erdunn View Post
    ......

    What kind of issues will the 4.125 stroke are you referring to?

    ......
    Longer stroke generally brings more wear and tear on cylinder walls, rocking of the pistons. The block needs more clearancing and there may be issues with hitting the reluctor wheel. I've always believed that strokes longer than 4.00 should be left to dedicated race cars.

    Are you married to that stroker kit? I mean is it coming with everything else you bought or have you yet to purchase it? If it comes with the car and motor I would seriously consider selling that kit and buying a 4" one with correct (slightly oversized because you'll want to at least hone the cylinder sleeves to properly seal the new rings). The longer stroke certainly won't help drivability for the lady.

  11. #10
    thebigjimsho's Avatar
    thebigjimsho is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    That's why I said "hmm..."

    I had no clue if you knew what you were talking about, or not...

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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by PISNUOFF View Post
    My bad, I hit a wrong number. Small buttons on this iPhone.



    Longer stroke generally brings more wear and tear on cylinder walls, rocking of the pistons. The block needs more clearancing and there may be issues with hitting the reluctor wheel. I've always believed that strokes longer than 4.00 should be left to dedicated race cars.

    Are you married to that stroker kit? I mean is it coming with everything else you bought or have you yet to purchase it? If it comes with the car and motor I would seriously consider selling that kit and buying a 4" one with correct (slightly oversized because you'll want to at least hone the cylinder sleeves to properly seal the new rings). The longer stroke certainly won't help drivability for the lady.
    Well I am not married to it, its just coming as a package deal with the car. Is there a rotating assy that you would recommend for that setup with a 4.00 stroke? I was basically trying to use what he had bought to build it but I am open and accepting of suggestions. Thanks for the input.

  13. #12
    PISNUOFF Guest

    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    There are all kinds out there. Some people prefer only American made from start to finish and some people don't care about that kind of stuff. My rotating assembly in my 418 consisted of a Compstar crank and rods and Wiseco pistons. It is still good after two years of my beatings, roughly 15-18,000 miles. K1 makes some decent and cheaper cranks and rods. There is also always Lunati and Eagle and diamond.

    Search and read a lot of threads over on tech and elsewhere. Just keep in mind that there is an inflated amount of problems on the Internet.

  14. #13
    RyRidesMotoX is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Quote Originally Posted by av8erdunn View Post

    Well I am not married to it, its just coming as a package deal with the car. Is there a rotating assy that you would recommend for that setup with a 4.00 stroke? I was basically trying to use what he had bought to build it but I am open and accepting of suggestions. Thanks for the input.
    An LS7 uses a 4.0 stroke and a 4.125 bore I think... Its almost 1am and I'm on my phone so I don't want to look it up. The LS7 was designed to run up to like 7000 or 8000 rpm or some ridiculous amount like that. If you stroke a motor, not only will it require extra work like the other guys have said with clearance issues, but it will also limit your top end HP and rpm. Just copy a LS7 bore&stroke and call it a day. The resale value on the stroker kit (crank, rods, pistons which it sounds like you have already from the previous owner) would probably come close to covering a lunati rotating assembly. I like lunati, used it on some other cars and always had pretty rock solid results. It is pretty pricy though and in all honesty you're paying more for the name than extra performance in the case of the lower end. SCAT enterprises makes pretty decent stuff too so check them out as well.

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    av8erdunn is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Getting an 04 v with a bad motor. Going with a 6.2 stroked!!!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by RyRidesMotoX View Post
    An LS7 uses a 4.0 stroke and a 4.125 bore I think... Its almost 1am and I'm on my phone so I don't want to look it up. The LS7 was designed to run up to like 7000 or 8000 rpm or some ridiculous amount like that. If you stroke a motor, not only will it require extra work like the other guys have said with clearance issues, but it will also limit your top end HP and rpm. Just copy a LS7 bore&stroke and call it a day. The resale value on the stroker kit (crank, rods, pistons which it sounds like you have already from the previous owner) would probably come close to covering a lunati rotating assembly. I like lunati, used it on some other cars and always had pretty rock solid results. It is pretty pricy though and in all honesty you're paying more for the name than extra performance in the case of the lower end. SCAT enterprises makes pretty decent stuff too so check them out as well.
    I am really trying to stay with the LS3 block so I cant copy an LS7 bore and stroke. It looks like the best option is going to the 418.

  16. #15
    RyRidesMotoX is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Quote Originally Posted by av8erdunn View Post

    I am really trying to stay with the LS3 block so I cant copy an LS7 bore and stroke. It looks like the best option is going to the 418.
    Well Livernois Motlrsports can. They even sell a bored shortblock for that application. The whole point I was trying to make is... There are better ways of yanking performance out of the motor, and that was the point the rest of the guys were going as well I think. Stroking a motor, in my opinion, is more problematic than boring it, sleeving it, and throwing a balanced rotating assembly to spin it fast. So yea, I'm not trying to be a dick or anything... Here is a link to Livernoi's website with the LS3 429... Its a little bigger than 427 Cruz the bore is 4.130 http://www.livernoismotorsports.com/....7%3A1%29.html

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