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5K views 34 replies 16 participants last post by  jerrycecco 
#1 ·
Ok guys I am new to the forums, I know I am not a supporting member yet but working on it. I have a 2004 v with 44k miles, STOCK, I just bought the
1 7/8 kooks off the classifieds and have a few question. I know the car needs to be tuned after putting the headers on. I was wondering if I should bring it to a dyno shop here in MN and get it dyno tuned or if I should get a w4m tune instead? The dyno shop said about $500 to get it dynoed and a wait for me tune is $160.
1.Can I just put the w4m in and be good?
2. Would it make sense to have it dyno tuned?

Hoping you guys could shed some light on this for me?
 
#2 ·
I would prolly say w4m tune. $160 for a tune from a guy that owns the same car and is active on this site is a good deal. Majority of HP from headers and tune comes from the headers themselves as the tune just cleans things up. $500 for a dyno tune seems a lil salty to me.

What lead you to the 1 7/8 tubes? You planning some FI? If so, please spill the deets. :)
 
#3 ·
I would say W4M tune. You may want to visit a dyno after you put the new tune in. I wish I would have gone the W4M. I do like having a local guy that can tweak my car whenever I want. That would be the only downside to the W4M tune. You have to take the ECU out and mail it to him if you need anything done.

I vote W4M.
 
#5 ·
Welcome, were in Minnesota are you located? FI stands for Forced Induction (Maggie).
 
#7 ·
Forced Induction (Maggie).
The word "Maggie" is used all over the place here. I struggled with this one being a Ford guy and only knowing Eaton, Whipple & Kenny Brown.

Anyway Maggie is short for Magnuson Supercharger.
 
#6 ·
This security token sh*t is getting annoying.

Anyway

Dyno tune is usually better, if the tuner knows what they're doing.
Wait4me seems to know what he's doing, and just headers shouldn't be too difficult. You might gain a couple HP with the dyno tune.
If Jesse did Maggies, I'd have his tune right now.

Tony
 
#8 ·
FI = Forced Induction such as supercharger, procharger, or turbo.
NA = Naturally Aspirated how the engine is stock.

The Kooks 1 7/8 headers are commonly used on FI cars because they are a lil bigger and let more air escape the engine as it is being blasted in by a supercharger (most common, Maggie on the V). Some folks say that you will lose torque going with bigger headers and not adjusting the intake side of the engine. Our car's engines are all about complementary mods (in and out).
 
#9 ·
I am from St. Cloud,MN. Thanks on the FI, yeah I have decided to keep this car for as long as I can. I would like to take it and just make a monster out of it. I know it will never be a corvette but why not have a 800+hp cadillac. I think you would get more respect with a 800hp sedan. No offense to vet guys cuz they are sick. I do know I haven't chosen the best chassis platform for my quest. But god I love this car. With the price of a V2 out of the budget at this time. I would like to just take this one to mod hell. I do know this will take me a good 3 years+ to achieve this goal. But I am hoping someday I can run with the big boys. I went with the 1 7/8 because I didn't want to limit myself when it came down to maggie time.
 
#20 ·
Hey, if your looking for BIG power, don't go with a Maggie 112. That's what most of us have. It's GREAT for us, but probly won't get you too much over 500hp. As far as I know, non of the other superchargers are available as a complete kit for our cars. EPP has a procharger kit for us. But you they have to do the install. Look around first.

This almsot guy seems to need more fiber in his diet. Nobody is doubting a dyno tune. We're talking about this particular situation. It's just headers, not a worked 784ci motor running 63# of boost. Lost of tuners charge $500 and up. Doesn't mean they know what they're doing. We don't know how good his guy is.
Its friday night. Go have a beer :alchi:
 
#11 ·
you guys are crazy.....dyno tune all the way ftw. Dont even consider anything else. Cutting corners when looking for performance just ends up costing you more in the long run. Form a relationship with a good tuner with an inhouse dyno and your money.

anyone that says get a w4m tune.......

is uninformed, or getting paid by the vendor for advertising :cheers:
 
#13 ·
Moot point here. You're comparing apples to oranges.

I don't think anyone would blink an eye and get a proper a/f dyno tune vs. something that comes in a can BUT when you've done a bolton mod or two and plan on going I would consider putting off the dyno until you dump something in that really needs a proper road tune i.e. maggie.

Or at least hold off until you're done with all your bolt-ons and save some money.

$500 vs $160 is also a consideration.
 
#16 ·
my tune was 300. I dont know where everyone gets this 500 dollar flat fee from. But one of the best tuners in the country doesnt even get 500 for his tune.

And should you decide to add mods, usually the tuner makes minor adjustments for free, or for a small fee. With w4m anything you change you gotta send your pcm.

and the point is reliability - with a dyno tune - ALL the variables are constructed to meet MY motors specific needs. The temperature/density of the air, the contents of the gasoline thats sold in my area, among other things....spark plugs etc......

A canned tune, like w4m, while it was developed on an ls6....it doesnt accomodate for the differences in the climate say here in south florida vs las vegas....the air in the two places is completely different, and would need different tunes to maximize efficiency, performance, and reliability....

same thing goes for the gas contents.....

and same thing goes for slight differences between motors....not every ls6 is the same.....not every ls6 gets max efficiency using
the same variable ranges ie they dont all respond to the same timing, spark tables etc...they are all slightly different and need tweaking in different areas on different tables.

ie.....dont get a canned tune...while they work....they dont accomodate each vehicles specific needs.
 
#17 ·
don't think anyone would blink an eye and get a proper a/f dyno tune vs. something that comes in a can BUT when you've done a bolton mod or two and plan on going I would consider putting off the dyno until you dump something in that really needs a proper road tune i.e. maggie.

Or at least hold off until you're done with all your bolt-ons and save some money.

$500 vs $160 is also a consideration.
500 for a dyno tune is a ridiculous price. second if your saying hell need a dyno tune anyway a few months down the road...just get one. Be 100% sure your cars running like it should. why spend 660 (using your numbers) when he could spend 500 (using your numbers)

Now in my case, using my tuner.....its 300 out the door (less than half of 660)

if the question here revolves around money. my 2 cents is stay on the stock factory tune until you can afford a dyno tune. no need to pay for two tunes.
 
#19 ·
Yeah the money is kind of a factory. I thought $500 was allot to. He said they have never done a V before either something to shy away from? Also was thinking from the mixed emotions on here, possibly go with the w4m tune until get some more money and then have the w4m tuned again to see if we could get more power by adjusting it. Then I could sell the stock pcm or keep it for a rainy day untill one of you guys needed it and just give it to you. If I would just put the headers on no tune at all, would I hurt anything?
 
#22 ·
Go with the W4M tune. If you get your car dynoed and send him the graphs, he'll adjust your tune for you.
 
#25 ·
Thanks guys for all the info, im not sure yet but think im gunna lean twards the w4m untill I get more mods and need to really dial it in. Don't worry a shifter is def in the future and no 22's for this cadi. Dropping the stock wheels of this morning at the powder coater. Taking them to the DARKSIDE.
 
#27 ·
Sign up to be a supporting member. It was the best decision I ever made, besides buying the V.
 
#26 ·
:thumbsup: to W4M tune. I asked around about the cutom tune and everyone was right around 400. I'm extremely happy with the tune I got from Jesse. We put it in this saturday and I could tell the car just ran much better after I plugged that baby up. I'm headin to a dyno shop this saturday just to see what my numbers will be and have him check the tune.
 
#28 ·
SUPPORTING MEMBER WHO HOOO,Yeah I will be ordering the w4m next week. My brother told me the headers showed up today, so I will prob wait a couple weeks to throw it all in. I am bidding on the bmr wheel hop kit on ebay. if i dont get that i am ordering one next week. Wanna try not to tear the rear end out,no warranty and im sure a new rear is not cheap. : ( I also go hooked up with a new automotive company my brother has just started. If you guys need any i-pod hook ups,subs,amps stuff along those lines let me know and I will see what kind of a deal I can get for you.
 
#31 ·
I am bidding on the bmr wheel hop kit on ebay. if i dont get that i am ordering one next week.
I have a BMR bar for sale if you want it. I don't have the bushings that came with it, but you could go with some specter.
 
#30 ·
Hi guys, thanks for the kind words.

I dont charge for retunes ever. So any time you go to a dyno, or even have logs from a scan tool, i can make ANY adjustments needed at any time to make up for your "Local" fuels.

I love doing updates and modifying the ecms when they get sent back in. I ship them back out the same day even. The $160 price includes a ecm that you get to keep so there is never any down time.

On the cars, if they are stock, and i send you out a tune, Vs a dyno tune, i dont see them gaining much more hp over my tuned ecm. So you have to figure out horsepower per cost..

My tune WITH ecm that you can resell for 100 bucks on ebay, makes it about $60 bucks for the tune.. Vs lets say 300 bucks with is LOW for a dyno tune. I am pretty confident that i will be within 2 hp of the dyno tune if they are good. So, $240 more dollars for the dyno tune and 2hp doesnt seem like a valid deal....

I set the air fuel to exactly where it needs to be and timing to exactly what it needs to be.. All the rest is just fine tuning like a dyno shop would do..
But if you send me the feedback and i tweek it, you are getting the Identical thing for free..
 
#33 ·
:werd:

What he said.

P.S. Then you can do foolish things like buy EFI from Jess and cry for help. :)
 
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