| 2004-2007 Cadillac CTS-V Performance Mods Discuss all Cadillac CTS-V performance modifications here. Engine tunes, exhaust, intake, suspension and more. | Cadillac Forums: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP? 
07-15-08, 02:35 AM
| | Cadillac Owners Fanatic Cadillac(s): 2006 CTS-V  | | Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Kings Point, NY Age: 23 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
I was leaning toward N/A, and now I definitely think that is the route I want to go. Thanks for the info, I am gonna give Vengeance a call sometime this week and see what we can work out.
__________________
2006 Cadillac CTS-V
Borla exhaust, Lingenfelter CAI, Shaner S3 ported TB, BMR pinion brace, trailing arms and anti-wheelhop kit, H&R lowering springs, Dyno Tune, UUC flywheel, STT and SS brake lines, MP3 hookup, Two 12" subs w/ Pioneer amp, Trueforged 20" 3-piece Speed-6, Laast doorlocks, EC cowl hood, 8000k fogs and lowbeams |
07-15-08, 08:44 AM
|  | Mods on hold till diff gets fixed. Cadillac(s): 2005 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: South Lyon, MI Age: 60 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
The stresses on the bottom end of the motor are in direct relation to the power output. To push a CTS-V down the road as a DD takes no more or no less power whether it's NA or FI. Only if one is pushed faster than the other do the stresses on the bottom end become higher.
IMHO, staying NA and attempting to get similar power with FI (assuming an LS6 application), means you have to get pretty exotic with the valvetrain, and because you shift the torque curve higher you sacrifice too much power in the lower RPMs. Also, both approaches have their issues (e.g. broken valve springs vs grounding problems with the Magnavolt, etc, etc), and the harder you push the car the more issues you'll have regardless of which way you go.
Just my $0.02.
__________________
'05 CTS-V, Stealth Gray, Sunroof, 3M Clear Bra, B&M Shifter w/UUC Bushings, Specter Werkes Bushings, V Headrests, Wheel To Wheel Powertrain Tune, Corsa, Kooks w/Hi-Flo Cats, Ultimate Grid Pedals, Hotchkis Anti-Sways, STS-V Fogs, Ground Control 650R/600F, WW Clear Sidemarkers, Full-Size Spare, Magnuson SC Polished, CTS Console, FG2, Aggressive Street Alignment, MOMO Shift Knob, DSS/Hendrix Engrg Axles, UUC Flywheel. Soon: UUC MMs. 472 RWHP/411 RWTQ (Mustang dyno). |
07-15-08, 02:32 PM
|  | Cadillac Owners Connoisseur Cadillac(s): BANK OWNED!! CTSV & EXT | | Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Asheboro, NC Age: 28 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rand49er  The stresses on the bottom end of the motor are in direct relation to the power output. To push a CTS-V down the road as a DD takes no more or no less power whether it's NA or FI. Only if one is pushed faster than the other do the stresses on the bottom end become higher.
IMHO, staying NA and attempting to get similar power with FI (assuming an LS6 application), means you have to get pretty exotic with the valvetrain, and because you shift the torque curve higher you sacrifice too much power in the lower RPMs. Also, both approaches have their issues (e.g. broken valve springs vs grounding problems with the Magnavolt, etc, etc), and the harder you push the car the more issues you'll have regardless of which way you go.
Just my $0.02. | Making big power on any combo can be hard on the bottom end, but you have to think that with a supercharger your making big power but your also putting a little more stress on the crank turning the blower pulley. Plus if lean conditions occur then the chances of failure go up more with power adders.
Like you said though, pluses and minuses either way.
Jon |
07-15-08, 03:34 PM
|  | <10 poasts, CF newbie Cadillac(s): 2007 CTS-V Thunder Gray w/ Lt Gray interior | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Sunny CA. Age: 43 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
I want to see the Dyno charts for both configs, come on guys, step up and post those pics.
I like the low end torque and that's what pushed me into the FI route. You can get it with a Head/Cam swap but I'm afraid I will need to go a little too far with the cam to get the numbers I'm looking for.
I still need to get this car to pass smog in the next couple of years. Don't want to need to change too much or the car will sit for a while during the conversion.
__________________
Friendship is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it, but only you can feel it's true warmth. |
07-15-08, 03:44 PM
|  | Cadillac Owners Connoisseur Cadillac(s): '05 CTS-V, '00 SLS, 98 SLS, 89 Eldo, '80 Eldo | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: NYC Age: 38 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
WOW,,,did this turn into a Maggie thread or what?
Doesn't sound like the N/A guys have too much going for them 
__________________ '05 Platinum l LPE CAI l Magnaflow l V1 (hardwired), w/ custom mount l UUC shifter w/Lindsay bushings l UUC leather shift knob l K9 GEAR rear seat cover l CruiseCam l HID fogs l Falken RT-615s l Hotchkis sways W/Z06 end links l Billet A/C vent knobs l Hawk HP+/HPS l CG-Lock l Specter Werkes Bushings l Noah Custom cover l FG2s l Ground control 550/600 l MAGGIE 436RWHP/ 412RWTQ (Dynojet) l Heavys fire extinguisher bracket l Intercepter scan-gauge l Billet pedals l Meth l NO HEADERS  |
07-15-08, 05:18 PM
| | <10 poasts, CF newbie Cadillac(s): 2007 CTS-V Thunder Gray w/ Lt Gray interior | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Sunny CA. Age: 43 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
trukk is the bad a$$ now and he will stand up for the NA crowd.
I would be happy with either but you need to decide which trade off's you can live with and which one's you cannot. Kind of like being married.  |
07-15-08, 05:56 PM
| | Mods on hold till diff gets fixed. Cadillac(s): 2005 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: South Lyon, MI Age: 60 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSV_Rob trukk is the bad a$$ now and he will stand up for the NA crowd. ... | Chris has a great setup and great sound, too. No taking away anything from him at all.
Depending on your situation, one route may make sense over the other. Since I'm a DIY-kinda guy and didn't want to get too deeply into the motor, I preferred the bolt on route which, btw, ties into the title of this thread. Plus, I was always told that if you didn't have to crack open a motor (e.g. to repair a bearing), then it's best to leave it alone.
Finally, you can always get bigger power going FI compared to NA in a given application. However, you must stay within the strength limitations of the motor or the argument is moot. The consensus of opinion on this forum here in the past has usually been that a maggie running below about 8 psi was about at that maximum allowable stress level for an LS6 bottom end. |
07-15-08, 07:03 PM
|  | Cadillac Owners Master Cadillac(s): '05 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Elkridge, MD Age: 37 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSV_Rob I want to see the Dyno charts for both configs, come on guys, step up and post those pics. | I'm not sure who that was directed at. Here is my dyno graph:  Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSV_Rob trukk is the bad a$$ now and he will stand up for the NA crowd. | BAH, I just have a cam, not even heads and cam. The OP's recipe trounces mine.
As everyone has said, each way has it's pros and cons. Either way you pick, you win!
-Chris
__________________
2005 CTS-V:No Roof|FG2|Corsa|UUC Shifter, B-Lines, Motor/Tran Mounts, Diff Bushings|LPE CAI|FFV IntakeTube|Hawk HP+ |Hotchkis Sways|Kooks 1.75 Coated LTs + cats|KARS III |Mamofied Fast90 + NW90|224/228 111+0 XFI/XE-R .609/.588|ATI 25% UD Pulley|YT 1.7" UltraLites|Melling HiFlow Oil Pump|Comp Chromeoly 7.425" PR's|Cloyes Hex Adjust Timing Set|Lucas 42# Flow Matched Injectors|Patriot Gold Xtreme Springs, Ti retainers, Super 7 locks|All ARP Fasteners|Mustang Dyno Tuned (SAE): 412rwhp / 380 rwtq |
07-15-08, 07:18 PM
| | <10 poasts, CF newbie Cadillac(s): 2007 CTS-V Thunder Gray w/ Lt Gray interior | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Sunny CA. Age: 43 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
It was pointed at anyone that would post a graph. Like the Torque numbers, used to seeing the initial torque drop off when a new Cam is selected, I like your choice. Still a flat torque curve and that's what I was going for. Nice trukk.
When you going to go with the new heads? (Don't tell me your not thinking about it ) |
07-15-08, 07:50 PM
| | Cadillac Owners Master Cadillac(s): '05 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Elkridge, MD Age: 37 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSV_Rob It was pointed at anyone that would post a graph. Like the Torque numbers, used to seeing the initial torque drop off when a new Cam is selected, I like your choice. Still a flat torque curve and that's what I was going for. Nice trukk.
When you going to go with the new heads? (Don't tell me your not thinking about it ) | Of course I'm thinking about it
My issue is that the Heads would make it a better street car, however it is starting to near it's end of life as a street car, thus I might put money more towards the track mods.
-Chris |
07-15-08, 07:53 PM
|  | Cadillac Owners Enthusiast Cadillac(s): 2007 CTS-V | | | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Here's mine prior to larger injectors, ZO6 clutch and flywheel, and additional tuning. N/A also.
Last edited by PISNUOFF; 09-26-08 at 04:46 PM.
|
07-15-08, 08:44 PM
| | <10 poasts, CF newbie Cadillac(s): 2007 CTS-V Thunder Gray w/ Lt Gray interior | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Sunny CA. Age: 43 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by trukk Of course I'm thinking about it
My issue is that the Heads would make it a better street car, however it is starting to near it's end of life as a street car, thus I might put money more towards the track mods.
-Chris | I would think the heads would help you on the track as well. Are leaning more toward suspension mods now? |
07-15-08, 09:26 PM
| | Mods on hold till diff gets fixed. Cadillac(s): 2005 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: South Lyon, MI Age: 60 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by trukk ... it is starting to near it's end of life as a street car ... | Chris, you're not thinking of going the Chef route, are you?
Track jones ... Chris has track jones.  |
07-15-08, 11:30 PM
| | Cadillac Owners Member Cadillac(s): Cadillac | | | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
I do not have the capability of scanning and posting my graph, however I can just post it in a spread sheet type format from the dyno sheet if you guys want to know. I know I had 380+ ft/lbs of torque at 3000 Rpm and around 367 ft/lbs at 6500 rpm. I can post it in that type format with the hp and torque at every 500 rpms from 3000 to 6500 rpms if you guys want me to do that. I do not have a scanner. |
07-16-08, 12:05 PM
| | Mods on hold till diff gets fixed. Cadillac(s): 2005 CTS-V | | Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: South Lyon, MI Age: 60 | | | Re: Bolton Mods and cam only RWHP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTSV_Rob I want to see the Dyno charts for both configs, come on guys, step up and post those pics. ... | With no scanner, this is pretty crude. Note flat torque "curve" ... | | Cadillac Discussion Tools | | | 
Cadillac Posting Rules
| You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
Censor is OFF | | | |
|
