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2004-2007 Cadillac CTS-V General Discussion Discussion, Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues in Cadillac CTS-V Series Forum - 2004 - 2007; I'm getting to really like my 245 / 275 setup... 1) Car understeers a *little* more... but it is completely ...
  1. #16
    Dreamin is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    I'm getting to really like my 245 / 275 setup...

    1) Car understeers a *little* more... but it is completely correctable with throttle. If the understeer was a little worse... applying throttle would simply make the front plow more... NOT SO with this setup... understeer is totally manageable. It's not as bad as I thought it would be... I wouldn't touch the suspension.

    Where applying throttle isn't wise... i.e. narrow freeway onramp... yes the fronts start to squeal... but you can jump on the throttle much earlier at the the end of the onramp...

    2) And the car is SO MUCH more confidence inspiring now... i dont know if this is the tires and their feedback / predictability... or the 275s in the back... or if its all in my head... but much less pucker-factor powering around corners.

    3) I haven't tracked the car yet... but i'm positive it's faster thru the corners with the 275s (better lap times) I have tested on remote streets... with 275s in the back... and then threw on 245s in back (extra wheels i have with F1s)... and there is no comparision... i am completely sideways, powering around the same corner, at the same speed with the 245s in the rear... the 245s really scare me now. The 275s help with power-oversteer more than i thought they would.

    ...a glowing review... let me contradict myself a little... the car is NOT as balanced as with 245s all the way around... in 7/10-8/10 driving... the fronts start squealling first and rears stay planted... which is irritating. But at 8/10-9/10 and a little more work... the car is faster and more fun with the 275s. Does this make sense?

    At this point... i'm VERY happy with this setup.

  2. #17
    Dreamin is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    P.S. Mallett has a setup which fits 275s all the way around... this requires his custom-made front spindles.

    This would be an UNBELIEVABLE setup... but it costs $6000.

  3. #18
    globed70 is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Unfortunately, bench racing is harder for handling than it is for acceleration. Adding lateral grip to the rear will of course create understeer (or less oversteer, however you want to discuss it)... the question if how much and whether it is noticeable to YOU. If you spend alot of time on road courses or auto-X, then my opinion is that you will notice. If you drive very hard through the twisties - you may notice, as the car is set up more neutral than some others (like my last M5, which had the sort of staggering you mention). I also believe that you will be running under the minimum reccommended wheel width... something where a quick call to the tire maker tech line may provide useful advice.

  4. #19
    JEM
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Quote Originally Posted by trukk
    Sounds right. Dunno what I was thinking. Reversed my terms.
    Would upgrading the front tie rods to something stiffer help compensate for the understeer? Or would this just chew up the tires? I'm new to all this, so be gentle.
    Personally, I think if you're new to all this then the first thing you need to do is just drive the wheels off the car stone-stock.

    Go do a couple track schools and once you've had a chance to work up some real speed and get a feel for how the car behaves at the limit you can decide whether you and the car will be happy with more rear grip.

    I'll just note that one of the CTS-V's advantages over a stock M5 is its relatively neutral chassis balance. The M5 is a pretty devoted understeerer in stock form.

    The following comments are general remarks, not based on specific experience with the CTS-V:

    a) Typically, more rear tire needs to be balanced out with a little more rear anti-roll bar to get the same relative front-to-rear balance. This is where something like the Dinan stage-3 package comes in for the M5.

    b) The problem with putting big-ass front tires on a car is that they numb the steering a lot and vastly increase the car's tendency to 'tramline' or 'nibble' - that is, try to follow every little groove or imperfection in the pavement. You then become part of the landscape at your favorite chassis shop as you try out different combinations of toe, camber, and tire pressure to minimize it.

    c) The only way you're going to rotate tires with a staggered setup and directional tires is to pop the tires off the rim, flip them around, and mount the wheel on the other side of the car. Unless you've got a tire guy working for you, it's significant effort, expense, and the risk of having your rims scraped up.

  5. #20
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamin
    P.S. Mallett has a setup which fits 275s all the way around... this requires his custom-made front spindles.

    This would be an UNBELIEVABLE setup... but it costs $6000.
    There is another option. When I was speaking to Chuck about this setup, he mentioned that if you go with 265's (19 inch rims) all around - the front suspension (knuckle/spindle) doesn't have to be replaced!

  6. #21
    CVP33's Avatar
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    I'm in the process of burning off the 245/45 GSD3's now. I will skip the required rotation to ensure their early demise. Ready for 275's now.

  7. #22
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Remember, 275's will NOT fit in the front with stock rims, even with a 1/8+" spacer!

  8. #23
    dannystang is offline Cadillac Owners Enthusiast
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Umm ok so I am going 245/275

    What do you guys suggest then...

    245 45 18 G3D3
    275 40 18 G3D3

    Is that right?
    I think Dunlop Maxx come in those sizes too.

  9. #24
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    That's correct.

  10. #25
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Thanks...!

  11. #26
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Quote Originally Posted by wildwhl
    There is another option. When I was speaking to Chuck about this setup, he mentioned that if you go with 265's (19 inch rims) all around - the front suspension (knuckle/spindle) doesn't have to be replaced!
    Already called and asked... $5000

  12. #27
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Yep, Dreamin, $5K. Still quite a bit in my book ($1,250 a corner, yikes!). I'm just not into $1,000 wheels...but I guess you could argue that my widened stockers will be approaching that

  13. #28
    urbanski is offline Cadillac Owners 10000+ Posts
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    Quote Originally Posted by wildwhl
    Yep, Dreamin, $5K. Still quite a bit in my book ($1,250 a corner, yikes!). I'm just not into $1,000 wheels...but I guess you could argue that my widened stockers will be approaching that
    john at CCW can hook you up for 4K, tires included

  14. #29
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    yo fella's i gota chime in here. I want to get rims very bad, but im very confussed. If im going to put out 6000, I want it to be right. what do i get. All i know is i want it alittle wider in the rear. if u go to www.autoaddictions.com and check out the infinity with the avus rims, thats what i want to do. when u get to the web page goto wheels, then avus forged and check out the infinity. How do i do that...

  15. #30
    Dreamin is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Tires: uni-direction tread + 245f - 275r + rotation issues

    This one?



    As far as what to do... WIDER IS BETTER...ask your wheels guys what is the widest they make the Avus wheel for the V... tell them you know guys are running 9" is front and 10" in the rear... so you dont want to settle for 8.5s!
    I'd "settle" for 8.5" front and 9.5" rear... not smaller.

    Get these in 18s, 19s, or 20s... depending on how much you want

    And then get tires as close to stock HEIGHT as possible, matched for the rims.

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