Rubbing with forgestars?
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2004-2007 Cadillac CTS-V General Discussion Discussion, Rubbing with forgestars? in Cadillac CTS-V Series Forum - 2004 - 2007; So it looks like combination of my new forgestars with 275/35 and the eibach lowering springs on my car are ...
  1. #1
    danrob0123's Avatar
    danrob0123 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Rubbing with forgestars?

    So it looks like combination of my new forgestars with 275/35 and the eibach lowering springs on my car are leading to my rear tire rubbing like none other. Anyone else have this problem lowered on the forgestars? This was even after I had rolled the fenders with a borrowed roller. I believe it is due to having a bad shock on the passenger side because it only rubs this bad on one side. last time i had the wheel off i noticed that the shock was covered in oily grime. So I'm assuming that it leaked quite a bit at one point.. Whenever I have two people in the car or loads of stuff in the trunk it makes a horrible grinding sound over large bumps/transitions in the road. Thoughts? I could bring it to a shop and see if they can do a better job than I did on my fender, and the car has 93k miles so if I replace one shock I'll probably replace all 4. Good time to upgrade to the KW's I guess. Ether way I will probably replace this brand new tire because it is chewed up pretty bad. Link to more photos: http://s676.photobucket.com/user/danrob0123/library/


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    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    You're having this problem because you bought Eibach lowering springs. Throw them away and buy something worthwhile.

    The car is riding lower on the passenger side because it's heavier there. Shocks don't hold the car up--springs do. You need an adjustable coilover kit, or strong investments in the rubber trade.

  4. #3
    danrob0123's Avatar
    danrob0123 is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Quote Originally Posted by FuzzyLogic View Post
    You're having this problem because you bought Eibach lowering springs. Throw them away and buy something worthwhile.
    What's wrong with the eibachs specifically? I know they ride higher in the rear than the H&R's do. I know adjustable is the way to go, however, which is why I am leaning towards the KW's.

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    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Quote Originally Posted by danrob0123 View Post
    What's wrong with the eibachs specifically? I know they ride higher in the rear than the H&R's do. I know adjustable is the way to go, however, which is why I am leaning towards the KW's.
    I'm not trying to put you down, but you won't understand the answer right now. Suffice it to say that progressive lowering spring kits are cheap bandaids designed to lower cars at the expense of handling and ride quality. What you need are linear springs with at least single-adjustable shock damping.

    If you just want an adjustable coilover kit at minimum cost, the Ground Control kit costs about $500. If you need new shocks, I would bite the bullet and buy KW Variant 3s, but you could try the K-Sport/D2 coilover kit at half the cost if you don't care about racing.

  6. #5
    seeyouinajif is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Fuzzy I'm sure you know more about these suspensions than I do however a blown shock can mildly affect ride height on a street car, I've seen as much as half an inch. Race suspensions and coilovers can be different but there is some preload on a shock assembly on a street car. Main ride height is set by the spring yes, but a blown shock can have an effect.

    Not saying eibach aren't garbage or they aren't the OP's issue but if the rubbing is in one spot where a blown shock is I would investigate that before dropping 3k on a suspension. Especially if rubbing is occurring over bumps, with no dampening the spring will compress much more quickly than with a functioning shock.


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    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Quote Originally Posted by seeyouinajif View Post
    Fuzzy I'm sure you know more about these suspensions than I do however a blown shock can mildly affect ride height on a street car, I've seen as much as half an inch. Race suspensions and coilovers can be different but there is some preload on a shock assembly on a street car. Main ride height is set by the spring yes, but a blown shock can have an effect.

    Not saying eibach aren't garbage or they aren't the OP's issue but if the rubbing is in one spot where a blown shock is I would investigate that before dropping 3k on a suspension. Especially if rubbing is occurring over bumps, with no dampening the spring will compress much more quickly than with a functioning shock.
    We all have the same exact problem on the passenger side rear. Also, have you seen his ride height? The only way that he's going to be able to keep a set of tires on the car is if he's running 700-800 in-lb springs on the car with a -2.2 degree camber angle.

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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Quote Originally Posted by FuzzyLogic View Post
    I'm not trying to put you down, but you won't understand the answer right now. Suffice it to say that progressive lowering spring kits are cheap bandaids designed to lower cars at the expense of handling and ride quality. What you need are linear springs with at least single-adjustable shock damping.
    What? Since when are progressive lowering springs cheap or bandaids? ? ?

    You do realize that your fancypants KW's are progressive right? The physical springs are a set rate, but when you combine two springs with different rates on the same shock it becomes a progressive unit . . .

    And for somebody that wants to cut some wheelgap on their car doing a simple spring swap is more than adequate and will net you better handling even if the shock isn't tuned specifically for the increased spring rates.



    To the OP.
    The passenger side rear is where the car naturally squats on power take off's. You might want to look into getting those shocks replaced. A blown shock will adversely affect tire wear and handling.

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    seeyouinajif is offline Cadillac Owners Fanatic
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    Gotcha didn't realize we all had issues with right rear.


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  10. #9
    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Quote Originally Posted by barrok69 View Post
    What? Since when are progressive lowering springs cheap or bandaids? ? ?

    You do realize that your fancypants KW's are progressive right? The physical springs are a set rate, but when you combine two springs with different rates on the same shock it becomes a progressive unit . . .

    And for somebody that wants to cut some wheelgap on their car doing a simple spring swap is more than adequate and will net you better handling even if the shock isn't tuned specifically for the increased spring rates.



    To the OP.
    The passenger side rear is where the car naturally squats on power take off's. You might want to look into getting those shocks replaced. A blown shock will adversely affect tire wear and handling.
    Progressive lowering springs have always been one of the riciest things you can do to a nice car. The fact that people still buy them is depressing. With them installed, you've lowered your car to within a hair's breadth of destroying your fenders without adding the rate necessary to keep the wheels from bottoming out. Now you have a car that looks aggressive, but can't actually be driven aggressively.

    Each KW Variant 3 includes a linear main spring and a helper spring. The helper spring has zero rate and doesn't affect the overall rate--it's only purpose is to prevent the main spring from coming unseated, even when the coilover is at full droop. Required in Germany.

    Stiffer springs without adequate shock dampening will not help handling unless the springs are so stiff that the suspension cannot move. You're trading cornering grip for roll stability. I've been there. It's not fun.

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    EnV
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    I'm lowered on H&R springs (without MM spacers) and with a slight fender roll, I have no problems with rubbing.

  12. #11
    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Quote Originally Posted by EnV View Post
    I'm lowered on H&R springs (without MM spacers) and with a slight fender roll, I have no problems with rubbing.
    That's because you've got that monster truck thing going on in the back:



    This requires a minimum of 700 in-lbs of linear spring in the back to avoid rubbing:


  13. #12
    EnV
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    LOL, c'mon it's not THAT bad! No, but my car doesn't always sit/drive that high. Even over big bumps it won't rub.


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    Race Bannon is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    I have the same rim/tire combo and look to be about the same ride height (25.5" front and back from ground to fender lip) no rubbing unless two people in the back seat and even then very rare. I rolled my fenders and had to do a decent pull as well to get the clearance. I'd bet the fender lip at about 3 and 9 o'clock is tearing the tire unless it's rolled flat however with blown shock(s).......well yea you'll rub.


  15. #14
    FuzzyLogic is offline Cadillac Owners Connoisseur
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    That's some pretty extreme rear camber you've got there. Looks like you're a touch above -2.5 degrees.

  16. #15
    Race Bannon is offline Cadillac Owners Member
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    Re: Rubbing with forgestars?

    Good eye sits at -2.7 factory specs if I remember are -2.0 max.... extreme? Maybe? Compared to my M3 not really. It's not my DD so tire wear is a non issue and again no rubbing!
    edit: toe is at factory specs, saves the tire by far the most to have the toe dialed in as I'm sure most people know.

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